Brit Faces Two Years In Thai Jail For Being 'rude'.

[TheWalkingMan]

...I think most people understand that the Thai culture revolves around respect. A simple smile smile and a bow will get you a long way in thailand. Some of these arrogant tourists should learn a little about other cultures before travelling...

I love this forum as it provides chuckles 24 hours a day.

Anyway, I do not agree with the quote above. Thai culture, as with all cultures, is interesting. But to say that it revolves around respect is, IMHO, wrong. The person with the most money/connections/guns makes the rules and those who they view as "lessers" need to know their roll, bow and keep their mouth shut. Any deviation from this will allow the lesser to experience the whip, figuratively speaking, but more likely a bullet to the brain. That is not respect. That falls more along the line, kowtow or you will have problems... big problems.

TheWalkingMan

[johna]

I am the only one who thinks that having a voice recording and not a video strange?

"THE ARREST and jailing of Briton Simon Burrowes has created great concern among tourists and expats about Thai laws governing disputes with Immigration officials.

Director General of Immigration at the Phuket International Airport, Suksopon Maneeson, declined today to allow Phuketwan to view the contentious photograph in Mr Burrowes' passport.

He added that the voice tape of Mr Burrowes' conversation at the Immigration counter on January 31 was also likely to be produced as evidence in court.

Arguing with Phuket Immigration: Is It Safe?

By Shanya Phattrasaya and Alan Morison

Wednesday, March 4, 2009

Phuketwan Updating Report

Burrowes will plead guilty and receive a shorter sentence, so the immigration will not have to produce this tape in court.

The question here is, if Thailand wants tourist’s it will have to educate people in how to treat tourist, this does not mean a free get out of jail card for criminal behavior.

If Thailand only wants a certain type of tourist it must make all tourist obtain a visa, and as part of the visa process make all applicants view a 1 hour documentary on how to behave in Thailand.

[Boater]

I am the only one who thinks that having a voice recording and not a video strange?

he was probably playing with his mobile phone a recorded by mistake !

or ' Conspiracy theory ' he was actually set up ?????

[pimfram]

behave in Thailand & respect Immigration at the Phuket International Airport, wear some clothes, end of.

[Jingthing]

i am surprised those that this has not many the UK Press???

The British press, using that term in it's loosest form, is too busy unearthing cheats on University Challenge to worry about trivia like this.

i would have thought The Sun would have picked up on it and ran a page or 2 with an online petion to ' Save our Brit '

Yeah!!!

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=2573833

[Boater]

i am surprised those that this has not many the UK Press???

The British press, using that term in it's loosest form, is too busy unearthing cheats on University Challenge to worry about trivia like this.

i would have thought The Sun would have picked up on it and ran a page or 2 with an online petion to ' Save our Brit '

Yeah!!!

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=...t&p=2573833

missed that post

but totally agree, if he is banged up then the phuket post at least could run ' Free the Phuket One '

could be a good t-shirt seller

[Boater]

quick design

[dumball]

quick design

Something wrong with your post , it says check the thumbnails and the model has his thumbs behind his back , I get like that when I am on my monthly SangSom medication dosage .

[Richard-BKK]

About all things I read this week about Thailand I have my own idea... http://farang.pai-nai.com/article.php/Visi...red_of_Thailand it is possible that for some reasons Thaivisa doesn't want to be responsible for my personal ideas.

[jdrake72]

no surprise . I have been drugged and robbed and when I have been to the police station they told me I am a fuc_king farang and they don t care and I must go out from the police, since they have no time to waste with a farang.

That s despite several witnesses and we know who robbed me and where they work.

Yesterday two cops stopped me on the road and searched me for over half an hour, even inside the pants with all the people watching, they tried to extort me money with the excuse of a change in visa rule and because I have just coming from shopping and I am not entitled to shop in Thailand (!)....

after being threated worse than an animal they went away without saying sorry nor goodbye...

well, what can we pretend from the most racist country in the world ....?

[neverdie]

no surprise . I have been drugged and robbed and when I have been to the police station they told me I am a fuc_king farang and they don t care and I must go out from the police, since they have no time to waste with a farang.

That s despite several witnesses and we know who robbed me and where they work.

Yesterday two cops stopped me on the road and searched me for over half an hour, even inside the pants with all the people watching, they tried to extort me money with the excuse of a change in visa rule and because I have just coming from shopping and I am not entitled to shop in Thailand (!)....

after being threated worse than an animal they went away without saying sorry nor goodbye...

well, what can we pretend from the most racist country in the world ....?

Theres a reason all this type of stuff is happening to you jdrake.

Perhaps you could report back to us with your 'tooth to tatoo ratio', which should help us sum you up nicely.

[neverdie]

quick design

FREE HIM FOR WHAT.....LET HIM ROTT !

Its a pity they did away with public floggings really. You lot need to get over this and let him cut his couple of years in the slammer out quietly

[brahmburgers]

Lessons from One Phuket Tourist's Nightmare

By Alan Morison and Chutima Sidasathian

Thursday, March 5, 2009

Swearing is a no-no in Thailand in any situation.

More than a few times, I've been with a Thai g.f. and she's told me later that one or another Thai man has cussed at me. The times this has happened, the men cussed in a regular sounding voice (not loud) so as to not arouse my ire. The men always cuss in Thai (naturally, it's their native language) but it's also a cowardly way to cuss at someone in order to anger and embarass his Thai g.f./wife while at the same time the man being cussed at (me) doesn't know what's happened until later.

I think most people understand that the Thai culture revolves around respect. A simple smile smile and a bow will get you a long way in thailand. Some of these arrogant tourists should learn a little about other cultures before travelling...

Thai culture is about appearances. It's also stratified llike a bee hive, with all the people (worker bees) outwardly showing unmitigated respect in the manner they've been taught. Beneath that thin skin of doing/saying the right thing at the right times to the right people - there lies a whole different, sometimes ugly/immature/petty/vengeful/mass of rudeness. Am not saying all Thais harbor that two-faced nature, but it's there in many.

I'm not justifying what the traveler did. But just wanted to shed some light on the myth of "Thai culture revolves around respect" and "Thais don't swear" ....sort of nonsense.

[brahmburgers]

sorry, but it's nonsense like this that accounts for this being my 2nd to last post before resigning from the forum.

SJ, dude, don't resign the forum. I like your updates and commentaries.

RE; the topic: THIRTY MINUTES to examine one little photo! That's harrassment to the 5th degree. The officials knew they were screwing his chances of catching the plane. ...and no compensation. Shame on the petty officials!

[chefshane]

Yes I have to agree with you... I think most people understand that the Thai culture revolves around respect. A simple smile smile and a bow will get you a long way in thailand. Some of these arrogant tourists should learn a little about other cultures before travelling...

Did he swear at the woman who told him his nations passport standards are even lower than cambodias and laos - in a country that revolves around respect?

'a simple bow will get you a long way' you say - so you must show your subservience to them to boost their insecurities in order to get by or its off to prison?

Respect is a two way street - the imig peoples comments have shown that lack it.

I guess you don't rely understand the thai people or the culture. Thais will treat you with great respect if you treat them the same way. I have been living in thailand for near on 3 years and come and go on a monthly basis through immigration always found them polite and respectful. I feel this arrogant guy has jacked them up a great deal from the start. If you want to see rude arrogant immigration officials go to Australia the thais are sweet angels compared to those in aussie land

Spot on.

My worst experiences have been in Australia.

In the 15 years I have been in and out of Thailand I have rarely encountered or even witnessed problems, especially with airport immigration.

I had a lot of issues in Australia with burglaries, street crime, PC attitudes and litigation making life unbearable, stupidity being lauded over common sense, arrogant or overly zealous airport officials, corrupt immigration demanding $1500 bribes in Sydney, and more.

As a white guy, working, paying tax and obeying the law I had next to no rights, and almost zero respect accorded to me. I was the lowest of the low.

I decided to leave for greener pastures where one got paid properly, taxed properly, and generally left alone.

As an outsider (not guest) in many countries around the world I try to fit in as a matter of respect.

Not because I "have to" - but because it is the right way to approach and deal with others in order to get the best outcome.

In Australia, not only is respect not ingrained, it is now openly challenged and legislated against.

If I find the country not to my liking, I leave. That seldom happens. Life is too short.

I have to wonder about the number of bitter expats who hate "these corrupt little badge wielding people" etc who supposedly run their lives, steal their money, and take out their frustrations on Farangs.

It is the opposite of my 15 years in and out.

Contrary to the experiences of most people I have spoken to also.

If you hate the Thailand that much, why are you still here as expats? Go back to your perfect beloved West.

I'll quite happily and bluntly give you the same advice that Brits and Aussies so arrogantly give their whingeing immigrants at the drop of a hat:

There's the airport. Use it. And don't come back.

Go and live somewhere you like, and have positive feelings about.

Yes, there are problems here.

But to my mind, a lot less than in 170 other nations I choose not to live and work in.

Off topic, as are about 300 other posts, but very relevant response to some of the pure vitriol I've amusingly witnessed on this thread.

Jesus folks, chill out. It's a forum, not a fight to the death.

[Oberkommando]

More than a few times, I've been with a Thai g.f. and she's told me later that one or another Thai man has cussed at me. The times this has happened, the men cussed in a regular sounding voice (not loud) so as to not arouse my ire. The men always cuss in Thai (naturally, it's their native language) but it's also a cowardly way to cuss at someone in order to anger and embarass his Thai g.f./wife while at the same time the man being cussed at (me) doesn't know what's happened until later.

Happens all the time mate.

They think they are being clever. Watch the shock and cowardice on their faces when you pull them up on it.

I usually retaliate by telling them they have small penises. They really have a complex about that. Wonder why?

[old wanderer]

Last week a Canadian that lives in Canada, and works in the USA, was crossing the border. A US customs official asked him to turn his car off and step out of the vehicle. He replied, "Say please". The officer repeated his request 3 times and got the same response from the driver. After the 3rd time he hit him with pepper spray, drug him out of the car, handcuffed him and put him in a cell.

The driver wants to sue, but his chances of prevailing are zip and none.....

A phony looking passport will always delay a person. (I was denied boarding an international flight a few years ago because the main page of my passport was starting to de-laminated, it had had pages added 2 times, and was pretty dog eared.) Being profane about a person doing there job, will usually not work out for your best interest...

This must just be a good example of the eduction level of our younger generation today.

[PhilHarries]

This must just be a good example of the eduction level of our younger generation today.

You may have a good point there. A lot of youth culture revolves around "street cred" witch is mainly about the interactions between gang members. Once they are taken out of that "gang" environment they are a little like a fish out of water and that's within their own national cultural surroundings. Add into that a totally different set of cultural values and the individual could quickly lose the plot.

[jasperblubber2005]

man did this make my day, wish i could have caught this from the beginning, a week doesn't go by here in the states when a black athlete doesn't put down a white player or coach, some where in time blacks have this gotten this idea that putting down people of other races is ok, its to bad when some one from another race returns the favor its always called racism.

we must always remember that only blacks have a right to use the term racism, for those of use who aren't black, well, we just need to find another term.

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?, when you read of snoop dogg and his posse in a london airport causing a distubance because his friends broke some whiskey bottles in the duty free shop and then some of his cheap friends who flew economy tried to get into the vip lounge, are you surprised, not me.

its my hope that burrows spends the whole two years in jail, i'm sure he thought the garbage he pulls in london would work in thailand, i have had my issues in thailand but one thing i never forget is that i am a GUEST IN ANOTHER COUNTRY, if i don't like thailand i don't have to come back, for those of you who defend this person, its just pathetic

[grantbkk]

We should feel nothing but pity for poor Mr. Burrows. After a shortened tour of England's comprehensive schools he excelled at the gym and made his shirtless way into the world. Even his Facebook photograph is sans shirt. Unfortunately selling chips or cleaning offices has not prepared him to interact rationally with other cultures in the civilized world.

Sometimes when traveling to foreign lands I too feel that I could be persecuted for the color of my skin. So in fact I feel his pain. First thing out of my mouth in an airport confrontation will be those immortal words, "Don't taze me bro!". I hope he learns from his mistakes but somehow I feel this will be an uphill battle for him.

[stevenl]

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?

Maybe because 99% of the athtletes are black?

[grantbkk]

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?

Maybe because 99% of the athtletes are black?

Actually 99% of athletes are not Black. It's hard to believe but golf and chess are considered a sport. Baseball, created as an excuse do drink beer, is also considered a sport.

You have to look at the social and economic backgrounds of the athletes. From being fairly poor to super rich without the maturity and knowledge necessary to manage self control is a prescription for disaster.

It would appear that Simon Burrows would be a perfect case study except he is still poor and acts like he's rich.

[dumball]

man did this make my day, wish i could have caught this from the beginning, a week doesn't go by here in the states when a black athlete doesn't put down a white player or coach, some where in time blacks have this gotten this idea that putting down people of other races is ok, its to bad when some one from another race returns the favor its always called racism.

we must always remember that only blacks have a right to use the term racism, for those of use who aren't black, well, we just need to find another term.

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?, when you read of snoop dogg and his posse in a london airport causing a distubance because his friends broke some whiskey bottles in the duty free shop and then some of his cheap friends who flew economy tried to get into the vip lounge, are you surprised, not me.

its my hope that burrows spends the whole two years in jail, i'm sure he thought the garbage he pulls in london would work in thailand, i have had my issues in thailand but one thing i never forget is that i am a GUEST IN ANOTHER COUNTRY, if i don't like thailand i don't have to come back, for those of you who defend this person, its just pathetic

Very good post , got your point across to perfection , YOU do not like black people , but your "Guest in another country " is not correct . A traveller purchases a ticket with his own money , obtains the visa for his acceptance into said country , rents accomodation with his own money , travels around said country and spends his own money to do so , eats , drinks or whatever with his own money , in no way does that come across as a guest . There is little tolerance shown in Thailand when it comes down the thier egotistical FACE , face and money give the impression of being the two main factors that drive Thailand , I am glad I moved out of there to a more tolerant , happier country .

[grantbkk]

man did this make my day, wish i could have caught this from the beginning, a week doesn't go by here in the states when a black athlete doesn't put down a white player or coach, some where in time blacks have this gotten this idea that putting down people of other races is ok, its to bad when some one from another race returns the favor its always called racism.

we must always remember that only blacks have a right to use the term racism, for those of use who aren't black, well, we just need to find another term.

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?, when you read of snoop dogg and his posse in a london airport causing a distubance because his friends broke some whiskey bottles in the duty free shop and then some of his cheap friends who flew economy tried to get into the vip lounge, are you surprised, not me.

its my hope that burrows spends the whole two years in jail, i'm sure he thought the garbage he pulls in london would work in thailand, i have had my issues in thailand but one thing i never forget is that i am a GUEST IN ANOTHER COUNTRY, if i don't like thailand i don't have to come back, for those of you who defend this person, its just pathetic

Very good post , got your point across to perfection , YOU do not like black people , but your "Guest in another country " is not correct . A traveller purchases a ticket with his own money , obtains the visa for his acceptance into said country , rents accomodation with his own money , travels around said country and spends his own money to do so , eats , drinks or whatever with his own money , in no way does that come across as a guest . There is little tolerance shown in Thailand when it comes down the thier egotistical FACE , face and money give the impression of being the two main factors that drive Thailand , I am glad I moved out of there to a more tolerant , happier country .

While it is true that your adopted country is more tolerant of personal drug use, Cambodia is not a happier place. When I return to Thailand from my adventures in Cambodia it is with a sense of relief and makes me appreciate this country all the more. Your rant makes you sound like a very unhappy person and some of us are happy you made the change. Cheers!

Edited March 7, 2009 by grantbkk

[jackspratt]

This must just be a good example of the eduction level of our younger generation today.

You may have a good point there. A lot of youth culture revolves around "street cred" witch is mainly about the interactions between gang members. Once they are taken out of that "gang" environment they are a little like a fish out of water and that's within their own national cultural surroundings. Add into that a totally different set of cultural values and the individual could quickly lose the plot.

Surely you overlooked the smiley at the end of your post.

Otherwise, unless you wish to be more specific about what country and culture you are talking about, it is absolute nonsense

[Patsycat]

I'm surprised there's not been a "I am Simon's best friend in London...." first post yet.

[dumball]

man did this make my day, wish i could have caught this from the beginning, a week doesn't go by here in the states when a black athlete doesn't put down a white player or coach, some where in time blacks have this gotten this idea that putting down people of other races is ok, its to bad when some one from another race returns the favor its always called racism.

we must always remember that only blacks have a right to use the term racism, for those of use who aren't black, well, we just need to find another term.

when ever theres an article in sports about an athlete going to jail, 99% of the time, they are what color?, when you read of snoop dogg and his posse in a london airport causing a distubance because his friends broke some whiskey bottles in the duty free shop and then some of his cheap friends who flew economy tried to get into the vip lounge, are you surprised, not me.

its my hope that burrows spends the whole two years in jail, i'm sure he thought the garbage he pulls in london would work in thailand, i have had my issues in thailand but one thing i never forget is that i am a GUEST IN ANOTHER COUNTRY, if i don't like thailand i don't have to come back, for those of you who defend this person, its just pathetic

Very good post , got your point across to perfection , YOU do not like black people , but your "Guest in another country " is not correct . A traveller purchases a ticket with his own money , obtains the visa for his acceptance into said country , rents accomodation with his own money , travels around said country and spends his own money to do so , eats , drinks or whatever with his own money , in no way does that come across as a guest . There is little tolerance shown in Thailand when it comes down the thier egotistical FACE , face and money give the impression of being the two main factors that drive Thailand , I am glad I moved out of there to a more tolerant , happier country .

While it is true that your adopted country is more tolerant of personal drug use, Cambodia is not a happier place. When I return to Thailand from my adventures in Cambodia it is with a sense of relief and makes me appreciate this country all the more. Your rant makes you sound like a very unhappy person and some of us are happy you made the change. Cheers!

I was not on a rant , with your response I can only guess you are on some of those easy (?) to get drugs , maybe even the reason you take 'Adventure trips ' over here as many do . I have a considerably happier way of life than I experienced in your beloved country , every day , not the occasional day , I imagine you have the need to feel happy for some-one , even a stranger is better than not a soul .

[Pakeha]

sorry, but it's nonsense like this that accounts for this being my 2nd to last post before resigning from the forum.

Don't leave us SJ. You are one of the few posters that actually puts forward worthwhile posts.

Unlike myself of course

[BboyRusty]

This is all so funny, ha ha ha, but this man may be heading to jail, and people die in Thai jail. I am disgusted this man was jailed for nothing (even if all the charges are true which is very hard to believe) and disgusted by the reaction here to this.

It is nice to see that there are a couple of people on here who have some compassion! and can also accept there is a larger picture and not relying soley on subjectivity. I have noticed this far too much on this forum, although there is some great infoormation and helpfull people many are quick to condemn (in words on here) with knowing so little information or it coming from maybe one source; most of the time hearsay.

I agree that swearing at any individual wether they be an 'official' or not is unnecessary and helpfull to none. But in the real world sometimes the majority of us can become overwhelmed with our emotions and express ourselves in a negative way! Maybe he had not had a great time on his visit, had to get home for a funeral of a relative ect ect who knows the full story really, but as usual so many are quick to jump in, before you know it the 'bad man' is hung drawn and quartered. It all seems over the top for me but I refrain from commenting as it would be pointless speculation. Have fun

Edited March 7, 2009 by BboyRusty

[kjhbigv]

i was once saying goodbye to my mother at samui airport with my newly born twins in the car , i was told to move my car from departures very rudely and aggresively by the police ( this was not normal behaviour as you always parked their to drop off bags ) i explained politely i was just saying good bye to my mother I gave her a quick hug and jumped back in the car with the police guy waving and screaming I turned to my wife and said that guys is a fk..g nutter as i turned the corner to leave the airport a more senior policeman leaned into the moving car and throught he open window snatched the keys . He looked at me and started to scream i know what you said i know whhat you said . I leapt out of the car and in front of two plane load of passengers at the airport screamed dont shoot me dont shoot me while putting my hands in the air !!! The policeman ( very senior from bangkok) froze and then handed my keys amd told me to go .

That is absolutely quality...top man!!