10,000 Police, Soldiers, Security Officials Deployed To Keep Security At Government House

[kurtgruen]

Yes, I watched it a second time, when my wife got home. He looked nervous, but handled himself extremely well. My wife had a few choice words for the woman interviewing PM Abhisit. (I think she would have gone and beat her up, if she was in Thailand) lol... Started talking about foreigners having no respect for Thailand and how rude it was to keep cutting the PM off.

I felt the interviewer was really on the offensive against Abhisit and his government, under the circumstances, PM Abhisit did really well, I think.

The programme is called Hardtalk, geddit?

Actually Abhisit got an easy ride (I have already posted on this) and Zeina Badawi was tough but polite.Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?

But your wife's comment is interesting.Thais of high status aren't used to intense questioning without freaking out.Abhisit was a bit petulant but he knows English intellectual/upper class culture backwards.He know how to play the game.

And yes I'm proud he's Thailand's PM.

Hi Jayboy,

Yeah, I noticed after I posted, that it was HardTalk. I'm not really familiar with BBC's programming. I usally watch Al Jazeera or if I really have to CNN. Never Fox ;-) Sometimes also DW. I usually don't like the repetitivness of BBC, but once in a while, I see something of interest, when I am channel surfing.

Just different cultures and my wife has never seen Hardtalk before or any Western Talk shows such as Jerry Springer or anything like that. ;-)

[thailien8]

"Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?"

On whose part?

[way2muchcoffee]

The words "flee" and "fled" don't appear in the article or the title of the article. The word "flee" only appears in the name that Maejo Man used to refer to the link to the article. The title of the article is "Thaksin's family leave Thailand".

No they don't, but here's a screen capture of the BKK Post online edition. Just click on the image and you will see a full-sized version of the online front page. The headline states: 'Thaksin's Kids, Potjaman Flee'.

Edited April 8, 2009 by way2muchcoffee

[kurtgruen]

"Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?"

On whose part?

Definitely not on my part...I came here to get away from women like that. YUK!

[jayboy]

"Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?"

On whose part?

On her part.Could be just me though.I would love her to put me through my paces, a hard interrogation followed by a spanking.

[TonySoprano]

some are paid, not all are paid.

some yellow shirts were paid, some were not.

is it really that hard to understand?

My guess for tomorrow's attendance at 'The Party @ Prem's Park' is 18,236 ... and the going rate for all partygoers will be:

2000 baht for leaders of the thugs

500 baht for wannabe thugs

300 baht for women

200 baht for grannies

150 baht for teenagers

100 baht for kids

50 baht for babies

20 baht for each dog/buffalo/chicken

It's going to hammer down with rain at 14:37 and the area will be clear by 14:42 as everyone rushes inside the nearest shop to spend their money.

By 10 p.m. everyone will be back home tucked up in bed and looking forward to Songkran next week.

Party over ....

[jayboy]

"Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?"

On whose part?

Definitely not on my part...I came here to get away from women like that. YUK!

From skinny and intelligent Sudanese Oxford graduates? Bit specialised antipathy, surely?

[kurtgruen]

"Did I detect a batsqueak of sexual attraction there by the way?"

On whose part?

Definitely not on my part...I came here to get away from women like that. YUK!

From skinny and intelligent Sudanese Oxford graduates? Bit specialised antipathy, surely?

To each his own ;-)

[kurtgruen]

Anyways, I'm off to bed. Sure hope that people will post more current pictures tomorrow. Some that accurately portray what is going on down there and how many people are down there. That would be nice.

Let's hope it stays peaceful and that everything works out in Thailand's best interest.

Cheers

[donx]

The words "flee" and "fled" don't appear in the article or the title of the article. The word "flee" only appears in the name that Maejo Man used to refer to the link to the article. The title of the article is "Thaksin's family leave Thailand".

No they don't, but here's a screen capture of the BKK Post online edition. Just click on the image and you will see a full-sized version of the online front page. The headline states: 'Thaksin's Kids, Potjaman Flee'.

And that matches the name that Maejo Man used to refer to the link to the article. So he was referring to the article the same way the Bangkok Post's online front page did. Thank you for pointing this out. I guess they feel the word "flee" will gain more attention to readers than the word "leave".

[Steve2UK]

The words "flee" and "fled" don't appear in the article or the title of the article. The word "flee" only appears in the name that Maejo Man used to refer to the link to the article. The title of the article is "Thaksin's family leave Thailand".

Calm down, folks. The heading quoted by Maejo Man does appear on the contents page of the Post website - and not in the headline or body of the article itself. That's not the point. It seems fair to assume that had Sriracha John been aware of that when first posting "Conflicting reports on the banned from politics former First Lady Yaowapha... fled the country or at the Red stage?", it would have been a simple matter for him to specify the source of the "report" (quite valid if he had) when I asked for one. He didn't - but instead went in for a rather lengthy and convoluted justification of why he thought their leaving could 'fairly be described as "fled."' Draw your own conclusions.

I actually have no problem whatever with any member cherry-picking media items to present in promotion of their chosen opinion/bias - and I already said that it was wrong to expect otherwise in a post responding to jayboy's comment on that very point. But, for myself, I find it impossible to label that patently lop-sided one-dimensional exercise as "news" in any accepted sense of the term. At least there have been no very recent examples of editing out the "inconvenient" bits when posting the quoted article (none that I have spotted, anyway) - and that is progress. See these posts - particularly what's selected to post and what's not - for what they are: presented to persuade and not to inform. It's PR aka propaganda.

My point here (the same as I have made in other contexts) is that I strongly believe there should be some responsibility in what's supposed to be an adult forum to keep verifiable fact distinct from speculation and comment. To quote CP Scott, the greatly respected former editor of the UK's Guardian newspaper: "Comment is free, but facts are sacred".

Now - back to the topic............

[Wolfie]

So did anything actually happen today or was it just a load of red hot air?

I thought today was D-Day, what was accomplished other than a (large) group of pissed off people making a noise outside of the Privvy councilors house and government house?

Seems Thaksin has lost this one, perhaps now maybe he will just slip off quietly and let Thailand deal with more important issues... fat chance!

[eldar1]

Thaksin give up??? nah, he's got too much money invested into this business deal, i don't think he wants or can take the loss.

[sriracha john]

PS I think fled is a fair assessment

Thanks. It seems that reasonableness has "fled" the forum. It's sad really to see a minor, yet totally legitimate, characterization of an event based upon a compilation of the news is incessantly assailed, but then, such is the state of Thaivisa in 2009.

It seems fair to assume that had Sriracha John been aware of that when first posting "Conflicting reports on the banned from politics former First Lady Yaowapha... fled the country or at the Red stage?", it would have been a simple matter for him to specify the source of the "report" (quite valid if he had) when I asked for one. He didn't - but instead went in for a rather lengthy and convoluted justification of why he thought their leaving could 'fairly be described as "fled."'

Actually I don't use that indexing page on Bangkok Post. I review the headlines. I can actually think of my own terminology to describe events. That is what I attempted to explain to in the earlier post as to how I arrived at the particular term. The legitimacy of using that particular terminology being verified by subsequent use of the same terminology by the media just legitimizes it further.

presented to persuade and not to inform. It's PR aka propaganda.

It's an expression of an opinion. Do you have one? on the Shinawatras' fleeing?

My point here (the same as I have made in other contexts) is that I strongly believe there should be some responsibility in what's supposed to be an adult forum to keep verifiable fact distinct from speculation and comment.

I expressed my opinion of the event. I used "fled" as a matter of characterizing the several articles posted to that point. In my short, one line post there there were no articles attached. Should we restrict all of our comments to the vocabulary that's specifically utilized in news articles? Should we not make any personal assessments based upon published reports?

Good grief.

Edited April 8, 2009 by sriracha john

[haroldc]

Maybe it has something to do with the fact that contrary to the PAD crowd, vastly composed of old ladies, middle class housewives coming with their kids (and their self-indulgence) at the sittings and other wanke_rs who don't actually need to work to make a living and therefore can afford to come clap their little clappers ad eternum, the reds are mostly working class peoples who, as crazy as it sounds for a Bangkok hiso, have to work in order to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Then how can they afford to take time off to come to Bangkok?

You don't get it do, you? They aren't taking time off from work, because the vast majority don't work regular jobs. My sister-in-law in Udonthani was offered 1,000 baht for 3 days in Bangkok, plus free food, and a guarantee that the hired buses would get her back home in time for the weekend. She sells Issan sausages from a cart and her average income after expenses is about 150 baht per day.

[jbowman1993]

So did anything actually happen today or was it just a load of red hot air?

I thought today was D-Day, what was accomplished other than a (large) group of pissed off people making a noise outside of the Privvy councilors house and government house?

Seems Thaksin has lost this one, perhaps now maybe he will just slip off quietly and let Thailand deal with more important issues... fat chance!

Yes, yesterday was D Day. They said it was their day to declare victory (which they didn't). They said it was their day to get 1 million Thais out (which they didn't). Then yesterday, they said, we're giving you 24 more hours to meet our demands. lol. Last night Thaksin asked people to bring their children to the rally -

"Tell your children to come," he told the crowd. "There is something here. Stop going to the mall for a couple of days and lay the foundation for future generations.

"I do not care whether I can return, I do not care. I cannot allow the country to go on like this. "Let me be the last victim of the brutality of the bureaucratic polity."Thaksin also spoke in English to appeal to the international media, saying the fight was not about him but about the country and democracy for the people and future generations.

Yet, the front page of the BKK Post includes this little gem -

"The source said that Thaksin's family had left for safety reasons amid speculation of civil unrest the UDD holds is mass rally today."

Ladies and Gentleman - the protest yesterday does show that there is support and a following for the red shirt message. Many of them feel like they have legitimate grievances, and want to see change. The problem is that by using Thaksin as their symbol, they lose all legitimacy for their cause. Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I know that the red shirts doesn't get this information, or are given manipulated information, so many never are able to think about these things for themselves. Those of us on this forum should be different. We have access to a great deal of information, from all sides, and are able to discuss and debate these issues clearly.

I hate Thaksin - I make no bones about this. I hate him for the leader that he could have been, and should have been for the Kingdom , and for the leader he actually was - completely self interested, dangerous, corrupt, and morally bankrupt.

Edited April 9, 2009 by jbowman1993

[Old Man River]

Maybe it has something to do with the fact that contrary to the PAD crowd, vastly composed of old ladies, middle class housewives coming with their kids (and their self-indulgence) at the sittings and other wanke_rs who don't actually need to work to make a living and therefore can afford to come clap their little clappers ad eternum, the reds are mostly working class peoples who, as crazy as it sounds for a Bangkok hiso, have to work in order to pay the bills at the end of the month.

Then how can they afford to take time off to come to Bangkok?

You don't get it do, you? They aren't taking time off from work, because the vast majority don't work regular jobs. My sister-in-law in Udonthani was offered 1,000 baht for 3 days in Bangkok, plus free food, and a guarantee that the hired buses would get her back home in time for the weekend. She sells Issan sausages from a cart and her average income after expenses is about 150 baht per day.

You don't get it do you? You obviously haven't read anything I have written.

Of course they are being paid. The going rate has been THB 300 per day, plus food and transportation (but not lodging). Your sister in law is getting a good deal. I imagine she took it.

Anyone who doubts these people are being bused in must walk around obliviously, wondering where have all the buses come from that have miraculously appeared?

[Old Man River]

Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I am glad you picked up on that. It pretty much says it all about the leadership of this "peoples" demonstration.

[caf]

Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I am glad you picked up on that. It pretty much says it all about the leadership of this "peoples" demonstration.

Leaving Taksin aside and leaving aside preconceived ideas and opinions; do posters think people are right to seek cahnge in their couintry. that is the real question

[jbowman1993]

Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I am glad you picked up on that. It pretty much says it all about the leadership of this "peoples" demonstration.

Leaving Taksin aside and leaving aside preconceived ideas and opinions; do posters think people are right to seek cahnge in their couintry. that is the real question

I don't think it is the real question. People already agree that everyone has the right to seek change, in a peaceful, non-violent manner that does not violate the rights of others. In this litmus test, both the reds and yellows, and the army fail miserably. The real question right now is - who do you want to lead Thailand, from this moment forward. There are only 2 choices. Abhisit or Charlerm. Anyone who says otherwise is naive. Would you want Charlerm on Hard Talk last night?

"So your son has murdered people and gotten away with it. Does that make you proud?"

Drooooool. Ummmmmm. Uuhhhhhhh.

[Thai at Heart]

Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I am glad you picked up on that. It pretty much says it all about the leadership of this "peoples" demonstration.

Leaving Taksin aside and leaving aside preconceived ideas and opinions; do posters think people are right to seek cahnge in their couintry. that is the real question

If the people can't seek change in their own country then what type of country is Thailand? If history has shown anything, resisting change for long enough in a country often ferments great feelings of injustice. Unfortunately, Thailand has taken the path of corruption in politics and mob protest as a means of enabling change which has led to the chaotic situation now. The world and peoples ideas change, so inevitably Thailand changes. Just like any country, some resist, others go forward. Harking back with rose tinted glasses to the past has never been a particularly effective way of dealing with problems today.

[donx]

Thaksin is perhaps the most self serving individual I've ever seen, from any walk of life. To invite people to bring their children to a protest, while he whisks away his own on fears of safety is hypocrisy of the worst kind.

I am glad you picked up on that. It pretty much says it all about the leadership of this "peoples" demonstration.

Leaving Taksin aside and leaving aside preconceived ideas and opinions; do posters think people are right to seek cahnge in their couintry. that is the real question

I don't think it is the real question. People already agree that everyone has the right to seek change, in a peaceful, non-violent manner that does not violate the rights of others. In this litmus test, both the reds and yellows, and the army fail miserably. The real question right now is - who do you want to lead Thailand, from this moment forward. There are only 2 choices. Abhisit or Charlerm. Anyone who says otherwise is naive. Would you want Charlerm on Hard Talk last night?

"So your son has murdered people and gotten away with it. Does that make you proud?"

Drooooool. Ummmmmm. Uuhhhhhhh.

I think that many would disagree that there are only 2 choices.

[jbowman1993]

I think that many would disagree that there are only 2 choices.

Please feel free to enlighten us!

[donx]

I think that many would disagree that there are only 2 choices.

Please feel free to enlighten us!

Regardless of what is said publicly, I'm certain that many of the redshirts are actually pushing for Thaksin to return to power.

[jbowman1993]

Big crowd but not a D-Day

By Pravist Rojanaphruk

The Nation

Published on April 9, 2009

Protesters vowed to keep the pressure on until they manage to remove what they see as the elite influence in politics, through rallies that are bound to become lengthy.

Though well short of the 300,000 people protest leaders hoped for, the turnout was large enough as pro-Thaksin Shinawatra protesters effectively shut down a large part of Bangkok, turning it into a sea of red, with more people joining in as the sun set.

Nobody expected as many red shirts to show up outside Prem's official residence in Si Sao Theves, and hurl abuse as they called for his resignation as top adviser to His Majesty the King. Prem and Abhisit were widely attacked while hundreds of police stood guard. The protesters voiced anger at the man who they claim was behind the 2006 coup that ousted Thaksin.

A protest leader standing atop a truck in front of Prem's residence gave the privy councillor four choices: "A) to resign; to get out; C) not to stay on; D) or all of the above."

Still, the protesters were mixed in whether they could really get rid of Prem, who they believe also pulls strings behind the ruling Democrat Party. The red shirts claim this thwarts the poor and the uneducated from having a real political say.

"I don't think [Prem] will resign," said |a 50-something woman called Suksanguan, who teaches criminal justice at a leading Bangkok university. "But we want to |show him that Thais don't want him. |Though we don't have evidence [that he's behind the coup], we know his traits. We are against him, not the [monarchy] institution. General Prem should no longer stay in the post. Dissolving the House would also be the best solution. Hold a quick [general] election and let us accept the winner, whoever it is."

Suraphan, a 60-something former mechanic, said: "Everyone is clinging on to Prem [to manipulate politics from behind the scenes]. I pity him but I don't empathise with him."

But Chaiyaphon Tarunadamrongdej, 59, a retired teacher from Suan Sunandha Rajabhat University, believes Prem will resign. "It will be more graceful. If not we will chase him away in two or three days."

The abuse hurled at Prem was more heated than the insults flung at Abhisit and some protesters even made fun of Prem's alleged gender orientation. A picture of Prem's face was posted on the exit of the nearby Army Club with the words "Beast from hel_l" written underneath.

Despite the huge number of protesters at Government House and Prem's residence nearby, protesters near Theves bridge realised yesterday was not the "D-Day" that would force Prem or the government out.

"Though we were not victorious today, please call your friends, brothers and sisters [to come and join us]. If they don't, we can't achieve equality and democracy," a red-shirt protester declared.

The Student Federation of Thailand (SFT) issued a statement yesterday saying the government was being "dishonest to the principle of democracy" in reference to the military's role in forming the Abhisit government.

The SFT called on the government to dissolve the House and warned that: "No conservative power can obstruct the wheel of human history which seeks to better the lives of all."

The SFT also slammed the government for what they see as a delayed judicial process against leaders of the People's Alliance Against Democracy (PAD), which shut down Bangkok's two airports last November.

The crowds at Government House were thick and walking under the hot sun was |a challenge to one and all. Some police resting near Government House's Gate One removed name tags from their khaki uniforms. Some sales staff at the Bangkok Cooperative on Sri Ayudhaya Road were also seen sporting red.

Source - http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/04/09...cs_30100011.php

[jbowman1993]

I think that many would disagree that there are only 2 choices.

Please feel free to enlighten us!

Regardless of what is said publicly, I'm certain that many of the redshirts are actually pushing for Thaksin to return to power.

As i said, anyone who thinks there are other choices are naive.

[jbowman1993]

Thaksin calls for more people, food for rally

By The Nation

Published on April 9, 2009

Thaksin calls for more people, food for rally

Ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra last night called on more people to join the red shirt rally aimed at installing "a true democracy" in Thailand.

"I ask for more people to come out and more food and moral support to be added to the rally. The goal is to make our country a true democracy. We will not go home empty-handed," Thaksin told a large gathering of protesters in the capital during his nightly video-linkup.

He told the protesters to "continue enduring until we are victorious".

Thaksin, who has been threatening the government with a "people's revolution", urged civil servants, police and military officers to resist official orders.

During his address last night, the ex-leader also spoke in English, a move intended for the international media. "The fight is not about me. It's about our country, our people and the future generation. We want a Thailand that has liberty, equality and fraternity," he said.

Source - http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/04/09...cs_30100008.php

[LevelHead]

Thaksin knows that the people who conspired to make up false allegations against him, those who "did the dirty" and sold out things that are normally not told, those Elite who have for years run Thailand as their personal money making enterprise, those big Army generals with Billions of baht they should not have etc etc...... are more afraid of something else.

Thaksin knows that his life is now finished, his name tarnished.

However, he also knows that if he blows the whistle on all of those Elite who conspired to kick him out, he will "take them down, just as they took him down".

Ultimately this is why I like the reds cause, for the end result will be good for the Thai people. Thaksin is now fighting for true democracy, as this is the one thing all those fat greedy corrupt Elite do not want.

They threw stones in a glass house, and now Thaksin is making sure those stones break the glass, just as he had his glass broken.

Do not see this as the PAD / Democrats / Elite are trying to "spin" it as. They want people to think its just Thaksin wanting to get off all charges.

The real fight here is Thaksin now supporting "true Democracy" in Thailand, and the Bangkok Elite finally getting kicked into touch.

It might be revenge for Thaksin, but it really is the future and freedom for the Thai people thats now on the line.

[jbowman1993]

Thaksin knows that the people who conspired to make up false allegations against him, those who "did the dirty" and sold out things that are normally not told, those Elite who have for years run Thailand as their personal money making enterprise, those big Army generals with Billions of baht they should not have etc etc...... are more afraid of something else.

Thaksin knows that his life is now finished, his name tarnished.

However, he also knows that if he blows the whistle on all of those Elite who conspired to kick him out, he will "take them down, just as they took him down".

Ultimately this is why I like the reds cause, for the end result will be good for the Thai people. Thaksin is now fighting for true democracy, as this is the one thing all those fat greedy corrupt Elite do not want.

They threw stones in a glass house, and now Thaksin is making sure those stones break the glass, just as he had his glass broken.

Do not see this as the PAD / Democrats / Elite are trying to "spin" it as. They want people to think its just Thaksin wanting to get off all charges.

The real fight here is Thaksin now supporting "true Democracy" in Thailand, and the Bangkok Elite finally getting kicked into touch.

It might be revenge for Thaksin, but it really is the future and freedom for the Thai people thats now on the line.

Yes, that is red party line. Thanks for sharing LH. Im not being sarcastic, I actually appreciate learning about the thoughts on that side, and I appreciate the frustration of the red party. The main problem I have is the casting of Thaksin as the "Victim". He's not responsible for his troubles, it was all thrust upon him by the bad "Bangkok Elite" whoever they are. It can't be my fault, its a conspiracy.

Edited April 9, 2009 by jbowman1993

[h90]

Thaksin knows that the people who conspired to make up false allegations against him, those who "did the dirty" and sold out things that are normally not told, those Elite who have for years run Thailand as their personal money making enterprise, those big Army generals with Billions of baht they should not have etc etc...... are more afraid of something else.

Thaksin knows that his life is now finished, his name tarnished.

However, he also knows that if he blows the whistle on all of those Elite who conspired to kick him out, he will "take them down, just as they took him down".

Ultimately this is why I like the reds cause, for the end result will be good for the Thai people. Thaksin is now fighting for true democracy, as this is the one thing all those fat greedy corrupt Elite do not want.

They threw stones in a glass house, and now Thaksin is making sure those stones break the glass, just as he had his glass broken.

Do not see this as the PAD / Democrats / Elite are trying to "spin" it as. They want people to think its just Thaksin wanting to get off all charges.

The real fight here is Thaksin now supporting "true Democracy" in Thailand, and the Bangkok Elite finally getting kicked into touch.

It might be revenge for Thaksin, but it really is the future and freedom for the Thai people thats now on the line.

and what is with the true allegations?

The 3000 dead?

The extreme corruption?

Thaksin is (part of) this greedy elite. You guys are sitting on the wrong horse.