Udd Leaders End Protest

[nikster]

I agree with Waerth i think the army did an outstanding job.

In hindsight - absolutely. The low number of casualties is almost a miracle given the violent nature of the protesters. The two deaths are tragic of course but it looks like the army had nothing to do with that.

Next up: Charging Taksin with high treason, and rebuilding the police. I don't think a state can accept that the police force is unable/unwilling to keep the public order.

As for Thaksin's public image in the north... a lot of people genuinely think of him as their hero and no matter what is said by anyone else that's what they will keep believing. Because they want to. The democrats have their PR work cut out for them if they want to even make a dent there. It's not as easy as handing out money - it will require a lot of time and effort. Taksin was there first, and he did something for them when no other politician had for decades, as far as anyone can remember. The people here will remember that for a long time, and since they have chosen to ignore his outrageous crimes so far, that won't sway their opinion either. Not saying it's impossible, just a lot of work, more than T ever had to do...

[WAERTH]

In this thread on the Dutch Wikipedia I put a few of the pictures I took yesterday (at Din Daeng) and today ... :

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:De_kroeg#Burgeroorlog

Under the CC-BY-SA license everybody can copy these pictures and use hem, as long as credit is given to the maker (me, my real name can be found under the pictures, please give me the credit) and as long as you agree to allow everyone to copy the pictures from you again (you have to put them on your site under CC-BY-SA as well)

Waerth

You should have put a watermark on these photos.

Maybe I should have, but I do not know how to do that ... although there are probably watermarks in the first set ...

[tartempion]

The Red Shirt Terrorists who participated in the violence should be locked up, not sent home. The puppet master, Toxin, should be extradited and charged with high treason.

And the yellow shirts who occupied Government house for months and took the country hostage by occupying the airport should all receive medals for their heroic fight for freedom and democracy.

Their bosses should be promoted and allowed to run the country

Oops, they already do, what's next?

Do they need to change the constitution to change the voting rules? (70% of seats to be assigned by the elite, 30% by popular vote)

[brahmburgers]

To those who suggest making some sort of deal with Mr. T in exchange with a promise he won't meddle any more: That's a non-starter for two basic reasons:

A. Mr. T and his people lost.

B. Mr. T is incapable to telling the truth or keeping a promise.

Also is time to pay for all damages from Taxin frozen money

GOOD IDEA!

Hi All.

So the leaders of the Red shirt terrorist group have surrendered to police, Will they be charged with serious charges, I.E inciting people to riot , commit murder,arson ,terrify the general public. I doubt it, their position and money will insure that they will walk on bail,charges will no doubt be watered down and If ever they have to face a judge it will be a slap on the wrist conditional discharge, Carry on as usual. T I T.

Phupaman.

you're right, Thai justice hates to indict fellow Thais, no matter how serious the crime. at most, they'll do some sort of deal ("promise you'll be good from now on....") or some variation of 'transfer to an inactive post.' On the other hand, if a farang or a hill tribe guy were caught smashing glass doors at a high class Pattaya hotel, there'd be hel_l to pay.

Edited April 14, 2009 by brahmburgers

[fridgemagnet]

I agree with Waerth i think the army did an outstanding job.

In hindsight - absolutely. The low number of casualties is almost a miracle given the violent nature of the protesters. The two deaths are tragic of course but it looks like the army had nothing to do with that.

Next up: Charging Taksin with high treason, and rebuilding the police. I don't think a state can accept that the police force is unable/unwilling to keep the public order.

As for Thaksin's public image in the north... a lot of people genuinely think of him as their hero and no matter what is said by anyone else that's what they will keep believing. Because they want to. The democrats have their PR work cut out for them if they want to even make a dent there. It's not as easy as handing out money - it will require a lot of time and effort. Taksin was there first, and he did something for them when no other politician had for decades, as far as anyone can remember. The people here will remember that for a long time, and since they have chosen to ignore his outrageous crimes so far, that won't sway their opinion either. Not saying it's impossible, just a lot of work, more than T ever had to do...

I thought that Thaksin made the police force his own as he couldn't easily subvert the army. There are still Toxic men in power there.

Also - why do the Democrats not bung in a few WELL THOUGHT OUT populist policies? The tactic made Toxic many loyal friends.

[Oberkommando]

This was a massive victory for Thaksin whichever way you look at it.

The groundswell of foreign public opinion is overwhelmingly on his side now. The red-shirts haven't been defeated, merely subdued for the time being. He may have lost some support in grassroots Thailand because of the militant red-shirts but that won't be a major concern.

Thaksin is still in self-imposed exile and untouchable. This government must regret letting him go now. Their fault entirely on that one.

The country was disrupted for several days, the current government embarrassed as the ASEAN summit cancelled and their inability to handle the situation exposed.

Meanwhile conditions on the domestic front, especially economically look to worsen considerably.

This government will cling on and on with the support of the military and judiciary as Thailand continues its downward spiral into the abyss.

[debcmai]

I would be very skeptical of what I read in the Bangkok Post. They are clearly bias in favor of the present government.

Well you hardly find anyone who can read and write who is biased to Chalerm or the corrupt murder Thaksin.

That is so unfair and so untrue. I have many friends in Isaan....some highly educated, some teachers, who say that when Thaksin was PM their students had books for the first time in 20 years....the other governments promised, promised promised...got elected....forgot. Poor Isaan folks just were not important enough to keep promises too. These folks have genuine grievances and they are NOT happy to have their votes thrown out time and time again. PLEASE do not say about them being 'paid' to vote. I know now from working here ten years, that no matter what....they do what they want. SO funny to think that some one is forcing them to vote for them. What a joke.

[rixalex]

I agree with Waerth i think the army did an outstanding job.

In hindsight - absolutely. The low number of casualties is almost a miracle given the violent nature of the protesters. The two deaths are tragic of course but it looks like the army had nothing to do with that.

Next up: Charging Taksin with high treason, and rebuilding the police. I don't think a state can accept that the police force is unable/unwilling to keep the public order.

As for Thaksin's public image in the north... a lot of people genuinely think of him as their hero and no matter what is said by anyone else that's what they will keep believing. Because they want to. The democrats have their PR work cut out for them if they want to even make a dent there. It's not as easy as handing out money - it will require a lot of time and effort. Taksin was there first, and he did something for them when no other politician had for decades, as far as anyone can remember. The people here will remember that for a long time, and since they have chosen to ignore his outrageous crimes so far, that won't sway their opinion either. Not saying it's impossible, just a lot of work, more than T ever had to do...

Good post.

You are spot on about the mentality involved here.

You can present all the evidence you like and no matter how damning, there are some who will simply put there fingers in their ears and go on believing what they want to believe. The Democrats can't stop or undo the hero-worship that Thaksin enjoys and exploits so well, but they can start making their own good impression, and from what i understand of some of the new policies in the pipe-line, that will begin very soon (hence why Thaksin was in such a hurry to throw a spanner in the works).

Politicians of Thailand now fully understand the power of populist policies thanks to Thaksin, and i hope they go on implementing them, with the proviso that they are long-term, sustainable and not just done to cheaply win votes with tax-payers money.

Anyway, one step at a time. As has just been demonstrated, a week is a very long time in politics. A few days ago, after the Pattaya debacle, things look on the brink - and now, a few days later, the government looks in control and the future seems bright again. Who knows what next week will hold?! Don't go anywhere folks!

[Old Man River]

I wonder what will happen to these terrorists and what will be the outcome of this whole terrorist campaign?

[Oberkommando]

I would be very skeptical of what I read in the Bangkok Post. They are clearly bias in favor of the present government.

Well you hardly find anyone who can read and write who is biased to Chalerm or the corrupt murder Thaksin.

That is so unfair and so untrue. I have many friends in Isaan....some highly educated, some teachers, who say that when Thaksin was PM their students had books for the first time in 20 years....the other governments promised, promised promised...got elected....forgot. Poor Isaan folks just were not important enough to keep promises too. These folks have genuine grievances and they are NOT happy to have their votes thrown out time and time again. PLEASE do not say about them being 'paid' to vote. I know now from working here ten years, that no matter what....they do what they want. SO funny to think that some one is forcing them to vote for them. What a joke.

Most posters here won't ever understand what it is really all about, they are all still too fixated about one man.

[h90]

I would be very skeptical of what I read in the Bangkok Post. They are clearly bias in favor of the present government.

Well you hardly find anyone who can read and write who is biased to Chalerm or the corrupt murder Thaksin.

That is so unfair and so untrue. I have many friends in Isaan....some highly educated, some teachers, who say that when Thaksin was PM their students had books for the first time in 20 years....the other governments promised, promised promised...got elected....forgot. Poor Isaan folks just were not important enough to keep promises too. These folks have genuine grievances and they are NOT happy to have their votes thrown out time and time again. PLEASE do not say about them being 'paid' to vote. I know now from working here ten years, that no matter what....they do what they want. SO funny to think that some one is forcing them to vote for them. What a joke.

I read the first half seriously, but when reading the second part I figured out that it is complete nonsense at all.

So you tell me Thaksin paid hundreds of millions for vote buying even they would have vote for him anyway. I really dislike Thaksin but I don't think he is silly with his money.

This nonsense causes that I also doubt that 20 year book story.....Most probably the same nonsense specially on the fact that always the Democrats tried to push education while Thaksin did not. As well Democrat dominated areas are therefore much better educated (see the south).

[helvetian]

This doesn't solve anything long term. Sure, Bangkok will be free of protests for the next days, maybe even the next weeks, but all the red shirts are heading back home, re-group, maybe even get new leaders and then come back for the next round. It's highly optimistic wishful thinking that this is over and Thailand is back to normal.

Abhisit, if he's smart, needs to hold elections to show the world that he has the support of the majority of Thais.

[debcmai]

I would be very skeptical of what I read in the Bangkok Post. They are clearly bias in favor of the present government.

Well you hardly find anyone who can read and write who is biased to Chalerm or the corrupt murder Thaksin.

That is so unfair and so untrue. I have many friends in Isaan....some highly educated, some teachers, who say that when Thaksin was PM their students had books for the first time in 20 years....the other governments promised, promised promised...got elected....forgot. Poor Isaan folks just were not important enough to keep promises too. These folks have genuine grievances and they are NOT happy to have their votes thrown out time and time again. PLEASE do not say about them being 'paid' to vote. I know now from working here ten years, that no matter what....they do what they want. SO funny to think that some one is forcing them to vote for them. What a joke.

I read the first half seriously, but when reading the second part I figured out that it is complete nonsense at all.

So you tell me Thaksin paid hundreds of millions for vote buying even they would have vote for him anyway. I really dislike Thaksin but I don't think he is silly with his money.

This nonsense causes that I also doubt that 20 year book story.....Most probably the same nonsense specially on the fact that always the Democrats tried to push education while Thaksin did not. As well Democrat dominated areas are therefore much better educated (see the south).

I am just telling you exactly what they told me. They said, "Khun Debbie, I don't know about corruption...what I know is, first time in 20 years, my students have books."

[Oberkommando]

the government looks in control and the future seems bright again.

On what planet is this?

World's Gloomiest Countries - #3 Thailand

[taxexile]

i was surprised when the yellow shirts said that the reds were not educated enough to vote, i thought they were elitist remarks and to be taken with a pinch of salt.

but having spent most of the past few days watching the news i have to say that those comments had more than just a grain of truth .

the reds are no more than a bunch of straw chewing village idiots (they even come complete with protruding teeth and silly hats.)

nasty, violent and rowdy troublemakers , full of anger, empty of reason , they were easily bought , easily convinced to do wrong, it is good to see them, at last, defeated with heads held low, boarding the cattle trucks and trains that will take them back to their miserable little villages.

abhisit ? after a slow and disappointing first half in pattaya, he came out after half time full of determination and played a wonderful tactical second half to win the game.

[h90]

This doesn't solve anything long term. Sure, Bangkok will be free of protests for the next days, maybe even the next weeks, but all the red shirts are heading back home, re-group, maybe even get new leaders and then come back for the next round. It's highly optimistic wishful thinking that this is over and Thailand is back to normal.

Abhisit, if he's smart, needs to hold elections to show the world that he has the support of the majority of Thais.

Yes and they work on a new weapon!

they are sending us thousands of new perfect leader. They clone Thaksin in Dubai.

First success it reported today: http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/14...st-cloned-camel

DUBAI - The United Arab Emirates has claimed its own version of Dolly the sheep, the world's first cloned mammal, with the birth of a cloned camel in Dubai

"This is the first cloned camel in the world," said Nisar Wani, researcher at the Camel Reproduction Centre.

Injaz, a female, was born on April 8 after five years of work by scientists at the Camel Reproduction Centre and the Central Veterinary Research Laboratory, The National newspaper said.

"This significant breakthrough in our research programme gives a means of preserving

[nitecm]

I would be very skeptical of what I read in the Bangkok Post. They are clearly bias in favor of the present government.

Well you hardly find anyone who can read and write who is biased to Chalerm or the corrupt murder Thaksin.

That is so unfair and so untrue. I have many friends in Isaan....some highly educated, some teachers, who say that when Thaksin was PM their students had books for the first time in 20 years....the other governments promised, promised promised...got elected....forgot. Poor Isaan folks just were not important enough to keep promises too. These folks have genuine grievances and they are NOT happy to have their votes thrown out time and time again. PLEASE do not say about them being 'paid' to vote. I know now from working here ten years, that no matter what....they do what they want. SO funny to think that some one is forcing them to vote for them. What a joke.

I read the first half seriously, but when reading the second part I figured out that it is complete nonsense at all.

So you tell me Thaksin paid hundreds of millions for vote buying even they would have vote for him anyway. I really dislike Thaksin but I don't think he is silly with his money.

This nonsense causes that I also doubt that 20 year book story.....Most probably the same nonsense specially on the fact that always the Democrats tried to push education while Thaksin did not. As well Democrat dominated areas are therefore much better educated (see the south).

I think the Thai Military Know the situation much better than you

[caf]

i was surprised when the yellow shirts said that the reds were not educated enough to vote, i thought they were elitist remarks and to be taken with a pinch of salt.

but having spent most of the past few days watching the news i have to say that those comments had more than just a grain of truth .

the reds are no more than a bunch of straw chewing village idiots (they even come complete with protruding teeth and silly hats.)

nasty, violent and rowdy troublemakers , full of anger, empty of reason , they were easily bought , easily convinced to do wrong, it is good to see them, at last, defeated with heads held low, boarding the cattle trucks and trains that will take them back to their miserable little villages.

abhisit ? after a slow and disappointing first half in pattaya, he came out after half time full of determination and played a wonderful tactical second half to win the game.

absolutely right, taxexile.

all is over now. how nice for you to be exiled in a country where there is no question that some parliamentary posts will be by appointees, with no corruption, a fair police force tasked with and proud to be doing the job of keeping order, justice for all irrespective of colour of skin or shirt, good education systems allowing career moves for students who pass to move up the career ladder based on merit not family connections. your list is probably endless.

please confirm you are talking of thailand.

[BigSnake]

Yes, call it a day AFTER loss of life, could you see you made your point with the cancellation of ASEAN. SAD RIP now to those who loss their life.

[Oberkommando]

It's quite disgusting the contempt for the rural poor shown on Thai Visa sometimes.

And those "miserable little villages" are the foundation on which modern Thailand is built, and so it seems will be what causes it to fall.

[taxexile]

all is over now. how nice for you to be exiled in a country where there is no question that some parliamentary posts will be by appointees, with no corruption, a fair police force tasked with and proud to be doing the job of keeping order, justice for all irrespective of colour of skin or shirt, good education systems allowing career moves for students who pass to move up the career ladder based on merit not family connections. your list is probably endless.

rome wasnt built in a day.

it will all come one day , but the next building block is abhisit and those pulling his strings, not a bunch of over-excitable club wielding and, lets be honest , none too bright country bumpkins led on by a megalomaniac with a telephone.

thaksin is increasingly beginning to resemble one of those "teetering on the verge of insanity" millionaire villains out of the james bond films who live in big rooms without windows at unknown locations and make pronouncements by videophone to their henchmen in the outside world.

these riots were inevitable and to be welcomed really. they redress the balance ( which had swung too far into the yellow) somewhat and will send out a warning to the yellows and those that fund and support them not to take anything for granted yet.

but the reds showed to the world that they are nowhere near fit to take charge yet. best they go home now and learn some manners.

the country is slowly ( very slowly) working its way to a true 2 party democracy.

[johna]

i was surprised when the yellow shirts said that the reds were not educated enough to vote, i thought they were elitist remarks and to be taken with a pinch of salt.

but having spent most of the past few days watching the news i have to say that those comments had more than just a grain of truth .

the reds are no more than a bunch of straw chewing village idiots (they even come complete with protruding teeth and silly hats.)

nasty, violent and rowdy troublemakers , full of anger, empty of reason , they were easily bought , easily convinced to do wrong, it is good to see them, at last, defeated with heads held low, boarding the cattle trucks and trains that will take them back to their miserable little villages.

abhisit ? after a slow and disappointing first half in pattaya, he came out after half time full of determination and played a wonderful tactical second half to win the game.

I do not know why wee allow the rich to vote, they are just a bunch of greedy corrupt people who's only interest in Democracy is how they can use to further enrich themselves.

[cmsally]

It will be interesting to see if Abhisit can sit tightly enough on the can of worms to keep everything in place. With some of the wildcards he has behind him, not to mention a military who now have the flavour of power that they didn't enjoy a few years back, for quite a long period. These guys have big egos which have just been given a boost.

I bet Abhisit is now wishing he took a cushy job with one of the big banks or multinationals a while back ago, it would have been a much easier career path. In Thailand things seem easy on paper but then inject the human factor and everything can quickly dissolve before your very eyes.

[trogers]

This doesn't solve anything long term. Sure, Bangkok will be free of protests for the next days, maybe even the next weeks, but all the red shirts are heading back home, re-group, maybe even get new leaders and then come back for the next round. It's highly optimistic wishful thinking that this is over and Thailand is back to normal.

Abhisit, if he's smart, needs to hold elections to show the world that he has the support of the majority of Thais.

Thaksin cannot even get an acceptable proxy PM...what new 3 stooges will there be?

[Oberkommando]

I think what we have seen is a precursor to a real revolutionary movement, through both peaceful and militant means, by the red-shirts.

There will no doubt be factions of the red-shirt movement that will adopt militant and even paramilitary tactics after facing the army and Newin's blue shirt vigilantes.

A new escalation of the struggle seems likely.

[h90]

I think what we have seen is a precursor to a real revolutionary movement, through both peaceful and militant means, by the red-shirts.

There will no doubt be factions of the red-shirt movement that will adopt militant and even paramilitary tactics after facing the army and Newin's blue shirt vigilantes.

A new escalation of the struggle seems likely.

it isn't a good time for revolutionary red movements. Communism has failed.

[Prempoutine]

It's quite disgusting the contempt for the rural poor shown on Thai Visa sometimes.

And those "miserable little villages" are the foundation on which modern Thailand is built, and so it seems will be what causes it to fall.

That is precisely what will doom those educated fools.

They are blind and deaf to the needs of 90% of Thai people.

They have been fed at the trough of corruption and cronyism since they were born , and in any other country they would barely make it above the poverty line on their own merits.

[TAWP]

This was a massive victory for Thaksin whichever way you look at it.

The groundswell of foreign public opinion is overwhelmingly on his side now. The red-shirts haven't been defeated, merely subdued for the time being. He may have lost some support in grassroots Thailand because of the militant red-shirts but that won't be a major concern.

/../

Once again one of our reoccurring spinmeisters tell it like it isn't.

No, the fleeing traitor Thaksin isn't seeing overwhelming foreign support. And the support he has is diminishing fast as HE is now clearly working AGAINST democracy. At this speed soon even the Economist might give him the cold shoulder, as the reds actions leads to worsened economical outlook.

And losing the grassroot-support should be his concern, unless a coup is his goal.

[Scott]

I think some people are getting mixed up about a battle and war. This is just a battle; I think the war has barely begun.

I also predict the yellows won't win.

[TAWP]

I think some people are getting mixed up about a battle and war. This is just a battle; I think the war has barely begun.

I also predict the yellows won't win.

I hope the Thai people wins. That includes making sure the Red never wins.