Google Ad For Volunteers In Thailand

[H2oDunc]

Whilst reading the Sunday papers online today i noticed a Google ad for volunteers for an animal refuge in Thailand. Out of curiosity I clicked. JEEZ what a rip off. So much for it being a volunteer program. The animal refuge is located near HH and Cha Am. You are required to work 6 days a week and live in mainly shared accommodation. You are also required to donate from 580 pounds / 860 dollars for 2 weeks up to 1465 pounds / 2050 dollars for 12 weeks. That does not include any flights, insurance nor visa's.

This is supposed to be a registered charity but it doesn't ring right to me. I will be doing some more checking on this. The link is here

http://www.globalteer.com/projects/thailan...CFRIYegod7Vy9DQ

[myauq]

i can't recall who said this but it's pertinent to this thread...

"the definition of charity is poor people in rich countries giving money to rich people in poor countries"

[TheLaughingMan]

Absolutely disgusting. You pay to work for a good cause? What will they think of next?

[stiggy]

This is quite common practice for aid work and other such projects, the idea being you support with your cash and get to do some of the work.

Its not a new concept and is loosely based on eco tourism but with animals or people.

Normally the positions are paid for by grants etc and are tied in with the students study at uni, without the financial support from the volunteers there wouldn't be a program to gain experience or assist with to start with.

Its not an Ad for paid work or the odd person who fancies helping out a bit and playing with monkeys tigers etc.

I volunteered at a hospital in UK as part of training in an earlier life as i needed to get my hours up, and yup i had to pay for the privallage of being vomited on daily.

The fact is if its a registered charity it simply means they get tax breaks and show accountability for where the money is going, a non profit company has to show that its reinvesting 20% of turnover back into research for eg.

I cant see why people are getting their knickers in a twist about this, its quite clear and open that they charge for this.

[myauq]

i just resigned today from an ngo (TACDB) which helps burmese refugees here in bangkok. it's run by corrupt thai and burmese people.

reason for resigning: the boss was mouthing off racist slurs against white people in burmese (my wife and i both overheard him), despite the fact that they rely upon the goodwill of foreigners to keep afloat. he also refused to let my wife (whose also from myanmar) attend my class, and spoke to her as if she was a prostitute. i teach for free, but they still want more from me. it's disgusting

[myauq]

This is quite common practice for aid work and other such projects, the idea being you support with your cash and get to do some of the work.

I volunteered at a hospital in UK as part of training in an earlier life as i needed to get my hours up, and yup i had to pay for the privallage of being vomited on daily.

The fact is if its a registered charity it simply means they get tax breaks and show accountability for where the money is going, a non profit company has to show that its reinvesting 20% of turnover back into research for eg.

I cant see why people are getting their knickers in a twist about this, its quite clear and open that they charge for this.

ok, you do realise we're talking about thailand and not the uk?

[Dakhar]

i just resigned today from an ngo (TACDB) which helps burmese refugees here in bangkok. it's run by corrupt thai and burmese people.

reason for resigning: the boss was mouthing off racist slurs against white people in burmese (my wife and i both overheard him), despite the fact that they rely upon the goodwill of foreigners to keep afloat. he also refused to let my wife (whose also from myanmar) attend my class, and spoke to her as if she was a prostitute. i teach for free, but they still want more from me. it's disgusting

sounds about right

[myauq]

i just resigned today from an ngo (TACDB) which helps burmese refugees here in bangkok. it's run by corrupt thai and burmese people.

reason for resigning: the boss was mouthing off racist slurs against white people in burmese (my wife and i both overheard him), despite the fact that they rely upon the goodwill of foreigners to keep afloat. he also refused to let my wife (whose also from myanmar) attend my class, and spoke to her as if she was a prostitute. i teach for free, but they still want more from me. it's disgusting

sounds about right

the other thing that annoys me is the kinds of uppity foreigners who know nothing about the corruption and cultre which support these organisations. they want experience that will enable them to look down upon people (other foreigners).

i am fluent in burmese, but the majority of people i've met people in these organisations aren't. there is a lot of jealousy out there because of this, and anything i say falls on deaf ears. for example, a woman told me to just accept that my wife was being called a 'prostitute', as it's 'part of the culture'. <deleted>! so i said what if someone called you a prostitute, would that be ok? no, was her reply. very hypocritical.

[H2oDunc]

I laughed when reading their FAQ's concerning the need for a work permit / visa. They recommend you ask the travel agent to arrange your visa and to tell them you are only going to Thailand as a tourist and not to work So this charity is happy for you to lie and to work illegally in Thailand and pay them a shed load of money for the privilege.

[maxjay]

I volunteered at a hospital in UK as part of training in an earlier life as i needed to get my hours up, and yup i had to pay for the privallage of being vomited on daily.

So Stiggy, your volunteerism, was actually done to further your career and probably make more money. It wasn't done out of the goodness of your heart?

Well, in an "earlier life", I was very active in volunteer work in the U.S. I volunteered at hospitals, cancer centers for children, telephone crisis lines, juvenile judicial system, Big Brothers, community theatre groups, opera companies, museums, etc.

Never once, did I have to pay/donate or was even asked to "donate" any money for the privilege of volunteering. My time spent/work was my donation.

In fact all the places I volunteered with, would all have an annual dinner party to honor their volunteers. Some had events for their volunteers more than once a year.

Edited May 24, 2009 by maxjay

[sriracha john]

'H2oDunc' date='2009-05-24 15:34:37' post='2758020']

http://www.globalteer.com/projects/thailan...CFRIYegod7Vy9DQ

"1465 pounds / 2050 dollars for 12 weeks"

"The centre is on temple grounds"

"those who exploit wildlife for the benefit of people are not suitable for this project"

one wonders why that doesn't apply to the organizers

12. Do I need a visa?

Full information will be supplied about visas in our "comprehensive information brochure" as requirements change with duration and nationality.

Often the easiest source is through the agency with whom you book your flight.

State that you are visiting as a tourist, NOT to work as a work visa is not for volunteers.

Blatant lies.

Proper visa AND work permit are absolutely required.

[Mario2008]

Many organisations offer volunteer work in Thailand and require you to pay a large sum of money. I have asked some of them for more information about a workpermit. They just say it isn't needed or don't wory, there is no problem when I point out that volunteering without a workpermit is carries a maximum jail term of 5 years. Non of the organisations I have contacted has corrected their information and they continue to keep quit about the WP.

Volunteering is big business for some organisations.

[sriracha john]

"Almost 300 volunteers joined with Globalteer this financial year (ending June 2008)"

300 people risking jail, fines, deportation, and blacklisting... well done to the Elliotts...

"The charity is a company limited by guarantee which was incorporated on 7 June 2006 and became a registered charity on 18 June 2007"

and in only your very first year of being "open for business".... extremely well done to the Elliotts...

Globalteer

S Elliott : General Manager

J Elliott : Public Contact for the charity

[beano2274]

Lets find out what they say then, am gonna send an email asking about visas and some other things, check the answer when I get it.

I am considering volunteering for this project, as am taking a sabbatical, and would like to know about the relevant documentation for Visa, I have heard I need a tourist visa to work on this project, I am not a frequent traveler so am not sure about these things. Also I have never been so far outside of the UK, can you supply me more info about the weather in Thailand and what I would need to take with me, I have been reading on the net but have found so many different things, that I do not know which one to follow

[Mario2008]

Lets find out what they say then, am gonna send an email asking about visas and some other things, check the answer when I get it.

I am considering volunteering for this project, as am taking a sabbatical, and would like to know about the relevant documentation for Visa, I have heard I need a tourist visa to work on this project, I am not a frequent traveler so am not sure about these things. Also I have never been so far outside of the UK, can you supply me more info about the weather in Thailand and what I would need to take with me, I have been reading on the net but have found so many different things, that I do not know which one to follow

I would ask about a work permit, that is the most important. Although if they say a tourist visa is enough then they won't provide (help with) a WP, as you can't get one on a tourist visa.

[PeaceBlondie]

Here's a charity run by a TVisa sponsor, in which the volunteers pay for their work visa, work permit, and police check

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Volunteer-En...er-t267810.html

[GuestHouse]

I've been posting against this kind of thing for a long time now over on the Lonely Planet (which gets more questions on 'Joining "Volunteer" programs'.

As much of a rip off as this is, there are worse programs being run, offering access to children in schools, orphanages and refugee camps.

The risks do not need explaining.

And meanwhile volunteer programs back west are crying out for helpers - I guess making a commitment you have to stick to back home, rather than a few days during your holiday doesn't have the same attraction - Not to mention the large dose of 'We need to help these people'.

Sadly, judging by the increase in interest in these kind of programs I think we can look forward too 'Voluntourism' becoming a large part of the Thai tourist industry - Look to the TAT promoting it any time soon.

[WaiWai]

I've been posting against this kind of thing for a long time now over on the Lonely Planet (which gets more questions on 'Joining "Volunteer" programs'.

As much of a rip off as this is, there are worse programs being run, offering access to children in schools, orphanages and refugee camps.

The risks do not need explaining.

And meanwhile volunteer programs back west are crying out for helpers - I guess making a commitment you have to stick to back home, rather than a few days during your holiday doesn't have the same attraction - Not to mention the large dose of 'We need to help these people'.

Sadly, judging by the increase in interest in these kind of programs I think we can look forward too 'Voluntourism' becoming a large part of the Thai tourist industry - Look to the TAT promoting it any time soon.

Yes; perhaps we could even help in parliament one day .

the other thing that annoys me is the kinds of uppity foreigners who know nothing about the corruption and cultre which support these organisations

Have to agree - "instant karma"! Gap-year kids could be forgiven but others ought to know to check a little more carefully. Even worse, though, are the foreigners taking advantage of these idealistic foreigners and telling them it doesn't matter if they don't have a work permit.

Sorry about your experience.

[myauq]

the other thing that annoys me is the kinds of uppity foreigners who know nothing about the corruption and cultre which support these organisations

Have to agree - "instant karma"! Gap-year kids could be forgiven but others ought to know to check a little more carefully. Even worse, though, are the foreigners taking advantage of these idealistic foreigners and telling them it doesn't matter if they don't have a work permit.

Sorry about your experience.

hey, thanks

unfortunately that's not the worst experience. i was physically assulted and swore at by the head of the unhcr in mae la refugee camp a few months ago. though i was given permission to be there by the thai soldiers who escorted us to where we wanted to go, this obnoxious american/australian (not sure what nationality, but a tall guy with bleach blonde hair) was a complete asshol_e.

all week people told us stories about how their food rations, medicines and house materials donated by ngos were being sold-off in the town by the corrupt burmese un workers.

i've also been told by countless refugees in australia and thailand that people in burma get promised a safe passage to the camp by these un representatives, then when they arrive they have their money and propery taken, then sent back to face jail. once handed over to burmese gov authorities the un worker gets a payment. i actually met someone who had been in jail in yangon for this reason. at that time i thought the un was a top organisation helping burmese refugees, as i was quite niave back then. but now i've heard waaaaay too many stories to believe that it's anything but corrupt.

also, when we were inside the camp the thai soldiers kindly advised my wife not to hand over her (myanmar) passport to the un. they said that when they have her passport they will blackmail her to get it back.

two indian-burmese guys said that the un tried to confiscate phones and and extort money out of people to hasten their visa applications. burmese people won't say this to ordinary foreigners - why would they? they are too scared, and they're already used to this kind of crap living in burma. there is just as much danger in the refugee camp for them. it's because of people like unhcr fuc_kwit that such corruption in the un is so rampant.

my wife and i were depressed for about two weeks after coming back to the big smoke after that. it's completely changed my perception of the un (an organisation i once wanted to work for). very sad

[Datsun240Z]

There's also one for dogs i believe, about the same situation. Make me rich.com

[GuestHouse]

myauq, you are making some pretty serious allegations - Not that I doubt them, but I contrast them with allegations made against any private companies in Thailand and how such posts are swiftly removed or edited to remove identifying information.

That said, you do have a means open to you to address these issues, you can write to the UNHCR and ask for an explanation.

As an ex employee of the UN you would of course know where to find the contact details to make your complaint.

[abdulrahman]

Here's a charity run by a TVisa sponsor, in which the volunteers pay for their work visa, work permit, and police check

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Volunteer-En...er-t267810.html

And it smells,too.

Why should someone pay for all the expenses in order to make (a charity? volunteer organisation?)look good?

When you can do the same in a Thai public school in the same area for a nominal salary?

Oh,yes,4 hours teaching in the week,of your choosing too!

Easy way for a year Visa?

[PeaceBlondie]

Here's a charity run by a TVisa sponsor, in which the volunteers pay for their work visa, work permit, and police check

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Volunteer-En...er-t267810.html

And it smells,too.

Why should someone pay for all the expenses in order to make (a charity? volunteer organisation?)look good?

When you can do the same in a Thai public school in the same area for a nominal salary?

Oh,yes,4 hours teaching in the week,of your choosing too!

Easy way for a year Visa?

Since you asked,

The expenses are nominal, well worth the priced to be legal.

It is very difficult to get part-time decent work in Thailand, that provdes visa and WP.

Yes - easy way for a year visa, and give free services to Thailand.

[sriracha john]

Here's a charity run by a TVisa sponsor, in which the volunteers pay for their work visa, work permit, and police check

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Volunteer-En...er-t267810.html

And it smells,too.

Why should someone pay for all the expenses in order to make (a charity? volunteer organisation?)look good?

When you can do the same in a Thai public school in the same area for a nominal salary?

Oh,yes,4 hours teaching in the week,of your choosing too!

Easy way for a year Visa?

Since you asked,

The expenses are nominal, well worth the priced to be legal.

It is very difficult to get part-time decent work in Thailand, that provdes visa and WP.

Yes - easy way for a year visa, and give free services to Thailand.

Even one of the board's biggest cynics regarding these matters (me) had trouble finding fault with how things are organized with this particular set-up.

All the usual shortcomings and/or half-truths regarding other similar deals I've used in the past to disparage these groups/companies were not applicable here... which was shockingly refreshing.

In stark contrast to the group mentioned in the OP, I give the Good Luck and Thumbs Up to the one cited by PB... for their efforts to do things "the right way".

Edited May 24, 2009 by sriracha john

[stiggy]

So MaxJay im very humble in your presence , Your assumptive stance is exactly the kind of attitude that I now expect from the holier than thou volunteer crew that puts others off.

I received 250 dollars before expenses are taken per month for working full time for just over 5 years in Asia, the rest of my income came from savings.No rent etc so excuse me for taking the money and profiteering while others give up their weekends and enjoy their annual back patting dinners.

Mauq

Yes I was working in Asia, Thailand India being the main places, I still assist with new projects but like yourself Have had my fill of corruption etc. However what do you do? Turn your back ? start out again and eventually come up against the same vultures ?

Its difficult I wouldn't of accepted the abuse you and your partner received either.

As for the Original post my point is simple this type of operation is not uncommon and has it place , in many cases it does provide Donation based help where none other would exist or want to help.

Edited May 25, 2009 by stiggy

[abdulrahman]

Here's a charity run by a TVisa sponsor, in which the volunteers pay for their work visa, work permit, and police check

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Volunteer-En...er-t267810.html

And it smells,too.

Why should someone pay for all the expenses in order to make (a charity? volunteer organisation?)look good?

When you can do the same in a Thai public school in the same area for a nominal salary?

Oh,yes,4 hours teaching in the week,of your choosing too!

Easy way for a year Visa?

Since you asked,

The expenses are nominal, well worth the priced to be legal.

It is very difficult to get part-time decent work in Thailand, that provdes visa and WP.

Yes - easy way for a year visa, and give free services to Thailand.

Even one of the board's biggest cynics regarding these matters (me) had trouble finding fault with how things are organized with this particular set-up.

All the usual shortcomings and/or half-truths regarding other similar deals I've used in the past to disparage these groups/companies were not applicable here... which was shockingly refreshing.

In stark contrast to the group mentioned in the OP, I give the Good Luck and Thumbs Up to the one cited by PB... for their efforts to do things "the right way".

OK PB and Sriracha,may be I'm wrong,this time.

If that's the case I'm sorry.

My cynicism comes with the experience!

[PeaceBlondie]

SriRachaJohn and I are TVisa's loudest cynics, and we could be wrong. But I know SEE and John Quinn, and I trust them.

[myauq]

myauq, you are making some pretty serious allegations - Not that I doubt them, but I contrast them with allegations made against any private companies in Thailand and how such posts are swiftly removed or edited to remove identifying information.

That said, you do have a means open to you to address these issues, you can write to the UNHCR and ask for an explanation.

As an ex employee of the UN you would of course know where to find the contact details to make your complaint.

yes i will make a complaint, but only after my wife gets australian pr.

i'll get some more qualitative research behind me too, and write a report for a human rights journal. my participants will have to be australian citizens. there's just no way i can guarantee the safety of interviewees in this country.

[mrtoad]

I volunteered at a hospital in UK as part of training in an earlier life as i needed to get my hours up, and yup i had to pay for the privallage of being vomited on daily.

.

Someone saw you coming. I've never know a hospital in the UK turn away a free pair of hands or charge for the privilage of getting your

nads

(hands) dirty.

Edited May 25, 2009 by mrtoad

[maxjay]

So MaxJay im very humble in your presence , Your assumptive stance is exactly the kind of attitude that I now expect from the holier than thou volunteer crew that puts others off.

I received 250 dollars before expenses are taken per month for working full time for just over 5 years in Asia, the rest of my income came from savings.No rent etc so excuse me for taking the money and profiteering while others give up their weekends and enjoy their annual back patting dinners.

As for the Original post my point is simple this type of operation is not uncommon and has it place , in many cases it does provide Donation based help where none other would exist or want to help.

Thanks Stiggy, but really it was a joy to help out where I could.

However your post's Stiggy are a little confusing, originally, you said you volunteered in the U.K.:

I volunteered at a hospital in UK as part of training in an earlier life as i needed to get my hours up, and yup i had to pay for the privallage of being vomited on daily.

But, now you are saying it was in Asia. I'm a little confused?

And what exactly does: "part of training...as I needed to get my hours up" mean???

I am a little familiar with the medical world...so I read that as you needed the hours to fulfill some sort of paying job requirement for in-service hours? If I am wrong I apologize in advance.

FYI. I did my volunteer commitments joyfully, after my regular work day, during the weekends, and on holidays.

However, I really don't want to debate this.

This whole thing about paying to be a volunteer is very foreign to me, and that was the point of my Original Post on this topic.

Maybe I've been away too long?

Perhaps, if I went back to the States after 10 years away, and went into a non-profit organization and offered my time and services on a volunteer basis, they would also ask me for a financial donation in addition to my volunteer time and services?

Edited May 25, 2009 by maxjay