Do You Count Yourself As A Permanent Resident Of Thailand

[beano2274]

Just out of curiosity I would like to ask the Question.

If you live here, do you consider you are a permanent Resident or not?

In another topic this was discussed, when you fill in a form, what is your permanent residence, is it your home country or Thailand (I don't mean those with PR), I mean the teachers and the other workers.

If you vote in your home country then that is your permanent address, IMHO.

If you have a Visa or Extension to stay in Thailand then again you are not a permanent resident of Thailand, this being my opinion.

What do you think?

[dave111223]

Just out of curiosity I would like to ask the Question.

If you live here, do you consider you are a permanent Resident or not?

In another topic this was discussed, when you fill in a form, what is your permanent residence, is it your home country or Thailand (I don't mean those with PR), I mean the teachers and the other workers.

If you vote in your home country then that is your permanent address, IMHO.

If you have a Visa or Extension to stay in Thailand then again you are not a permanent resident of Thailand, this being my opinion.

What do you think?

Your saying it's possible to consider yourself a permanent resident without having an official PR (fair enough)...but then you say if you have a Visa you cannot be considered a permanent resident??

So what does that leave us with? It's only possible to consider yourself a permanent resident if you either have PR, or have no Visa at all and are living illegally?

Edited May 31, 2009 by dave111223

[Jingthing]

I state whatever is convenient. To the US tax people I am a resident of Thailand. To the US banks I deal with, I am a US resident. To Thai immigration I am a non-immigrant. Welcome to the land of ambiguity.

[beano2274]

Your saying it's possible to consider yourself a permanent resident without having an official PR (fair enough)...but then you say if you have a Visa you cannot be considered a permanent resident??

So what does that leave us with? It's only possible to consider yourself a permanent resident if you either have PR, or have no Visa at all and are living illegally?

A visa or travel visa is a document which gives someone permission to travel into a specific country and stay there for a set period of time. Do you need a Visa when you goto your Home Country, no I doubt that very much, so you are not a permanent Resident of Thailand if you hold a visa or an extension for Thailand.

People on PR, do not need a Visa or an Extension.

[dave111223]

A visa or travel visa is a document which gives someone permission to travel into a specific country and stay there for a set period of time. Do you need a Visa when you goto your Home Country, no I doubt that very much, so you are not a permanent Resident of Thailand if you hold a visa or an extension for Thailand.

People on PR, do not need a Visa or an Extension.

So your saying only Citizens and PR holders can be considered permanent residents....so whats the point if this thread?? (I'm pretty sure everyone already knows that)

Edited May 31, 2009 by dave111223

[geriatrickid]

I state whatever is convenient. To the US tax people I am a resident of Thailand. To the US banks I deal with, I am a US resident. To Thai immigration I am a non-immigrant. Welcome to the land of ambiguity.

Ok, so as a resident of thailand and one that gains the tax benefits, do you expect the US government, fundeed by the taxpayers, to respond to you in a time of need? Crime, evacuation etc.?

Just wondering. Same goes for all the other foreigners that claim the tax treatment of being a non resident.

[Jingthing]

Maybe he is saying that perhaps many of us are deluding ourselves ...

[beano2274]

A visa or travel visa is a document which gives someone permission to travel into a specific country and stay there for a set period of time. Do you need a Visa when you goto your Home Country, no I doubt that very much, so you are not a permanent Resident of Thailand if you hold a visa or an extension for Thailand.

People on PR, do not need a Visa or an Extension.

So your saying only Citizens and PR holders can be considered permanent residents....so whats the point if this thread?? (I'm pretty sure everyone already knows that)

It's a poll.

Also when you fill out a document from your Embassy, what do you enter as your permanent address?

If you read through some threads you would see that people are being turned away from getting married as there permanent address on the form is in Thailand and not their home country

[Jingthing]

Good point. Put down on any form what benefits you the most and hurts you the least ...

[Moonrakers]

When I have a work permit, then I call myself an expat. When I don't, I'm a tourist.

[Jingthing]

When I have a work permit, then I call myself an expat. When I don't, I'm a tourist.

So someone who has been retired here for 10 years isn't an expat? Hmmmmm.

[wefearourdespot]

No.

And I wouldn't consider myself a resident even if I had a PR.

There's no rule of law in this country.

[beano2274]

When I have a work permit, then I call myself an expat. When I don't, I'm a tourist.

So someone who has been retired here for 10 years isn't an expat? Hmmmmm.

Read the persons text, it says he calls himself an expat, he is talking about himself not everyone else

[GuestHouse]

I'm legally and fully resident in Thailand, before that I was legally and fully resident in Saudi Arabia and before that legally and fully resident in Italy.. the list goes on.

By legally and fully resident I mean, the correct visa, the correct work permit, registered to pay(or not pay) taxes, legally not resident elsewhere.

I do not make the mistake of telling myself that being legally and fully resident in a place automatically makes that my permanent residence.... especially not when I'm on a non immigrant visa.

Now if you where to ask me where would I go if the sh1t hit the fan, I lost my rights to remain where I am now, health or some other issue that meant I could not remain here - I would go to where I regard as my home - England, where I have inalienable rights to residence, where I can own what property I wish in my own name and where health care and welfare are available to me regardless of my ability to pay for it..... Actually might consider Italy for similar reasons.

With respect the OP's point about voting. I vote in two countries and at the time of living in Italy I voted in three ... I don't know what that says about 'permanent residence'.

Edited May 31, 2009 by GuestHouse

[Ijustwannateach]

I'm with GH- legally and fully resident, but not a permanent resident by visa definition.

[beano2274]

Thanks GuestHouse.

I also had voting rights in Germany when I was there. I noticed you talk about Italy, no visa required there, same as me in Germany, but I needed a "permission to stay' in order to stay there, and work legally there.

[noahvail]

Maybe he is saying that perhaps many of us are deluding ourselves ...

Perhaps indeed. I know a few farang who say they are residents, but in fact are here on a visa - which I interpret as being at the will and pleasure of the Kingdom. On a retirement extension, and with no work permit, I know that the will and pleasure may change... then, it's back to NZ, which I am entitled to call home, rather than the US, which I am entitled to call home as well...personal preference. Those are the two countries in which I enjoy citizenship, as opposed to Thailand, where I am a guest.

[GuestHouse]

I noticed you talk about Italy, no visa required there, same as me in Germany, but I needed a "permission to stay' in order to stay there, and work legally there.

Yes, the Permesso di Soggiorno, a requirement for all Non Italians living permanently in Italy but a formality for holders of European citizenship and for non Europeans married to Europeans living in Italy. Rights to work, own property vote, borrow money.... the list goes on. And hence why I include Italy as an alternative.

Short of obtaining permanent residence in Thailand I would not call myself a permanent resident here - Without PR or citizenship we are and always will be guests.

Do not kid yourself otherwise and remember, the biggest lies Farangs hear in Thailand are the lies they tell themselves.

[Jingthing]

Yeah, but if we live here full time, we live here full time, until we don't ...

As long as we are alive, you generally have to park your arse somewhere ...

That's not the same thing as having secure legal status, of course.

Edited May 31, 2009 by Jingthing

[Denim]

Unless you hold a Thai passport you can never really regard yourself as a permanent resident unless you die here, with your boots on, so to speak. Never forget that immigration rules change all the time and we could all be forced to depart without so much as a bye or leave. The usual method for this is to up the financial bar and bring the bar for number of days allowed to reside in any given year down. Not that it matters...there are other places to live.

[villagefarang]

Guess I have been happily deluding myself for the last 30+ years. I am so upset now, to find out that I am not really residing here, and it is all an illusion. Maybe I don't exist either. I just imagined myself and where I live. Oh dear this is so distressing.

I think in reality, I'm in the ambiguity camp, of being whoever I need to be on any given day.

[GuestHouse]

Guess I have been happily deluding myself for the last 30+ years. I am so upset now, to find out that I am not really residing here, and it is all an illusion. Maybe I don't exist either. I just imagined myself and where I live. Oh dear this is so distressing.

I think in reality, I'm in the ambiguity camp, of being whoever I need to be on any given day.

But what kind of visa do you have/have you held these past 30 years? Are you now a legally permanent resident (after 30 years living in a country one would expect you are) or are you still on a Non Immigrant Visa? And in 30 years how many visa runs have you done?

[Geekfreaklover]

A big NO vote for me.

I have a work permit, Tabien Ban, own a legal business, pay taxes, have two kids at school, lived here lamost ten years. But that means nothing, I'm afraid.

But I am on a non-immigrant visa extension. Non-immigrant means just what it says.

I'm a British citizen who is allowed to stay in Thailand for as long as they allow me to stay.

Surprised to see so many people consider themselves residents, when they don't have residency status.

Edited May 31, 2009 by Geekfreaklover

[garro]

I legally stay, work, and raise a family in Thailand. I would say that I'm resident here. Mind you, if the more worldly-wise people on Thaivisa feel that I'm deluding myself then I can live with that. At the end of the day though, it would be hard for me to think of a less trivial accusation. I personally couldn't give a flying tuk-tuk how people who stay here choose to view themselves be it visitor, resident, native...Life is too short.

[villagefarang]

Guess I have been happily deluding myself for the last 30+ years. I am so upset now, to find out that I am not really residing here, and it is all an illusion. Maybe I don't exist either. I just imagined myself and where I live. Oh dear this is so distressing.

I think in reality, I'm in the ambiguity camp, of being whoever I need to be on any given day.

But what kind of visa do you have/have you held these past 30 years? Are you now a legally permanent resident (after 30 years living in a country one would expect you are) or are you still on a Non Immigrant Visa? And in 30 years how many visa runs have you done?

The first 20+ years there were so many changes of governments and rules, that I can't begin to remember the various kinds of visas I had. I do remember there was a time when I could fly down and back on the same aircraft to Penang, I think it was. Get off the aircraft. Stamp out, stamp in and back with the same crew. Later they plugged that whole and I would go shopping in Singapore for a few hours and catch the evening flight back home.

At various times I had jobs that took care of things for me. The last ten years my wife has been so kind as to sponsor me but I guess I'm qualified for a retirement visa, as well.

Just when you think the fear mongers have all died off or gone home, a new batch of recruits takes up the call to arms. The sky is falling, the sky is falling, they cry. Not knowing any better I continue to plod along in blissful ignorance of my impending demise.

Not that any of this, is any of your business. I'm just in a jovial mood today.

Edited May 31, 2009 by villagefarang

[GuestHouse]

Sorry VillageFarang, I have no intention of setting off any fears - though since you bring them up perhaps they are present.

As you say, over the years the rules have changed so very often - that might be the source of fears, to blame them on people who take a realistic view of Farang rights to residence in Thailand is to blame the news bringer.

But like I say, the biggest lies ......

[Birdman]

Sorry VillageFarang, I have no intention of setting off any fears - though since you bring them up perhaps they are present.

As you say, over the years the rules have changed so very often - that might be the source of fears, to blame them on people who take a realistic view of Farang rights to residence in Thailand is to blame the news bringer.

But like I say, the biggest lies ......

You don't get it, that here are also foreigners for many years, who really do not care about their official status. They can prolong their visas yearly without any difficulties. They can live where they want. They can buy what they want. Even land, because they have companies or real wives/husbands in the sense of a "normal, happy marriage".

The question "counting myself as a permanent resident of Thailand" is never in their minds.

[Moonrakers]

Define permanent.

I have been here for nearly 10 years without leaving and have no intention of doing so (is that what the OP would consider to be permanent), yet it is possible that I may at some point and up with no choice but to live elsewhere.

p.s. Just to preempt some smart sod, yes I have left for visa runs.

[villagefarang]

I am, only if some official form says I am. I'm sorry, but I have never looked at life that way. Labels, titles and legal mumbo jumbo are just things to be manipulated to ones benefit. Something only has the meaning or value that one bestows upon it. Be a "realistic" worrier if you choose. I would have wasted so much time, if I had spent the last 30+ years worrying.

[lazygourmet]

No,

but I am permanently residing into temporal.