Why So Many Ladyboys?

[BrissyBoy]

Maybe there are no more here than elsewhere, it's just that in other countries they have to keep low key about it, in Thailand nobody cares.

Same as with gays, in some countries they are discriminated against or ridiculed, maybe in Thailand there is more tolerance and acceptance so people do not have to hide what they really are.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would also have to agree totally with what DrJohn said.

In Australia a few years ago there was a bit of a problem with gay people getting beat up for no reason and in a few cases dying. For this reason a lot don't come out because of quite a few fears.

Whatever happened to the old saying live and let live. After all are they really hurting anybody.

But then again we are who we are through learnt experiences. So if we see these things at an early age we take it as the perceived norm. Thereby in the future generations it may become more pronounced. That may be what we are seeing now.

My wifes 2 year old son is already showing manerisms of a katoey. This has been picked up from her brother and his friends. I don't like it but it's just something he has learnt. It is funny for others to see, so he does it for attention. Hopefully i can take him away from that environment and unteach him soon. He has even been taught to squat to piss and not stand up.

[cdnvic]

TV shows in los are littered with katoeys/ladyboys and kids are obviously growing up seeing this as normal behaviour so it's no wonder there's an excess of them. I shall be having satellite installed shortly so as my son doesn't become one of the many, so influenced.

I'm watching basic cable and seeing two lesbians licking each other from head to toe. You think you're gonna find family values on satellite? Why not teach your kid that even if he doesn't agree with what other people choose to do in living their lives, that we are all free to do so, and lucky for it.

I hope your son isn't gay as you seem to have no tolerance for him if he is.

cv

[chuchok]

TV shows in los are littered with katoeys/ladyboys and kids are obviously growing up seeing this as normal behaviour so it's no wonder there's an excess of them. I shall be having satellite installed shortly so as my son doesn't become one of the many, so influenced.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm watching basic cable and seeing two lesbians licking each other from head to toe. You think you're gonna find family values on satellite? Why not teach your kid that even if he doesn't agree with what other people choose to do in living their lives, that we are all free to do so, and lucky for it.

I hope your son isn't gay as you seem to have no tolerance for him if he is.

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can't agree Vic.The lesbian thing is cool.

To be serious though, when young kids see it as being acceptable to be a katoey in Society here, it can certainly influence them in life. Not just on TV but by also what they see walking down the road.

It's a similar reason when the media start reporting about youth sucicide.As soon as it is reported and there are TV and newspaper articles on the subject, the number of young people topping themselves goes up.

TV here can glamorise katoeys.What it doesn't show is how many of them kill themselves because of there lives etc.

To a certain extent I agree with jackr. I can't see how his comment is anti gay?

[cdnvic]

TV shows in los are littered with katoeys/ladyboys and kids are obviously growing up seeing this as normal behaviour so it's no wonder there's an excess of them. I shall be having satellite installed shortly so as my son doesn't become one of the many, so influenced.

I'm watching basic cable and seeing two lesbians licking each other from head to toe. You think you're gonna find family values on satellite? Why not teach your kid that even if he doesn't agree with what other people choose to do in living their lives, that we are all free to do so, and lucky for it.

I hope your son isn't gay as you seem to have no tolerance for him if he is.

cv

I can't agree Vic.The lesbian thing is cool.

To be serious though, when young kids see it as being acceptable to be a katoey in Society here, it can certainly influence them in life. Not just on TV but by also what they see walking down the road.

It's a similar reason when the media start reporting about youth sucicide.As soon as it is reported and there are TV and newspaper articles on the subject, the number of young people topping themselves goes up.

TV here can glamorise katoeys.What it doesn't show is how many of them kill themselves because of there lives etc.

To a certain extent I agree with jackr. I can't see how his comment is anti gay?

Its because he's saying that being gay is something you can pick up like its some new kind of dance fad. You either are or you aren't no matter what you see on TV. Here its legal for them to marry and I'm cool with that. All people should be eaqual regardless of how they were born. That I think is one of the most important things I can teach my kids, especially as they will be mixed race.

cv

[chuchok]

TV shows in los are littered with katoeys/ladyboys and kids are obviously growing up seeing this as normal behaviour so it's no wonder there's an excess of them. I shall be having satellite installed shortly so as my son doesn't become one of the many, so influenced.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm watching basic cable and seeing two lesbians licking each other from head to toe. You think you're gonna find family values on satellite? Why not teach your kid that even if he doesn't agree with what other people choose to do in living their lives, that we are all free to do so, and lucky for it.

I hope your son isn't gay as you seem to have no tolerance for him if he is.

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can't agree Vic.The lesbian thing is cool.

To be serious though, when young kids see it as being acceptable to be a katoey in Society here, it can certainly influence them in life. Not just on TV but by also what they see walking down the road.

It's a similar reason when the media start reporting about youth sucicide.As soon as it is reported and there are TV and newspaper articles on the subject, the number of young people topping themselves goes up.

TV here can glamorise katoeys.What it doesn't show is how many of them kill themselves because of there lives etc.

To a certain extent I agree with jackr. I can't see how his comment is anti gay?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its because he's saying that being gay is something you can pick up like its some new kind of dance fad. You either are or you aren't no matter what you see on TV. Here its legal for them to marry and I'm cool with that. All people should be eaqual regardless of how they were born. That I think is one of the most important things I can teach my kids, especially as they will be mixed race.

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree,but he's not talking about being gay or being equal, we are talking about people who are changing their gender.

The debate to "if you are or ain't" is another issue. There is enough research to suggest that both genes and/or influence are reasons.

The influence that our early life has on us is huge, just as our surroundings are.I would no more let my children watch licking lesbians or a hetro couple going for the doctor. I of course would watch both.

[jingjingna]

Apparently, some high ranking Govt. official in the past openly displayed his female side which later became a law. The law being that Katoeys/ladyboys are also a gender recognised by the Thai Govt. Now, I don't know if this is true, I am just passing on what a Thai friend's opinion is on this thread, me personally, don't know and don't care!

[cdnvic]

Does Thailand recognise marriage between katooeys (with the full operation) and either male or females?

cv

[chuchok]

Does Thailand recognise marriage between katooeys (with the full operation) and either male or females?

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nope. Not at all.

Having different WC's in Unis etc is one thing.Getting the Thai Govt. to legalise gender issues is another.

[cdnvic]

So a post-op katooey cannot legally marry either sex?

cv

[chuchok]

So a post-op katooey cannot legally marry either sex?

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Correct.

[cdnvic]

So a post-op katooey cannot legally marry either sex?

cv

Correct.

I see an opportunity for an alternative tour business opening up.

cv

[Jockstar]

Each to their own. But what really cracks me up is. That the ladyboys in the west wait for a few years before getting the op. Many well after their 30's and beyond. So they change from a man into an UGLY woman. Go figure. Where as in LOS many of the ladyboys but not all are not too bad. Not that its my preference but just making an observation.

[chuchok]

So a post-op katooey cannot legally marry either sex?

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Correct.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I see an opportunity for an alternative tour business opening up.

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

sorry, I was not quite correct.A katoey can legally marry a women, they cannot marry another man.

I see where you are heading about the biz opportunity.

[cdnvic]

Each to their own. But what really cracks me up is. That the ladyboys in the west wait for a few years before getting the op. Many well after their 30's and beyond. So they change from a man into an UGLY woman. Go figure. Where as in LOS many of the ladyboys but not all are not too bad. Not that its my preference but just making an observation.

There's one down the street from me that looks like Kojack in his mother's dress. His wig is always askew, and he stinks of booze, he's about 55-60 but certainly adds colour to the neighbourhood.

cv

[jackr]

TV shows in los are littered with katoeys/ladyboys and kids are obviously growing up seeing this as normal behaviour so it's no wonder there's an excess of them. I shall be having satellite installed shortly so as my son doesn't become one of the many, so influenced.

I'm watching basic cable and seeing two lesbians licking each other from head to toe. You think you're gonna find family values on satellite? Why not teach your kid that even if he doesn't agree with what other people choose to do in living their lives, that we are all free to do so, and lucky for it.

I hope your son isn't gay as you seem to have no tolerance for him if he is.

cv

Good god, talk about pc! I'm not anti gay. Of course satellite's loaded with the type of unscrupulous activity that would also be influencing and even disturbing for kids, I was merely ribbing good ol' Thai TV. Surely, far better to start his early years of TV watching with NORMAL cartoons, nature programs with herds of wilderbeast sweeping across the landscape and other educational material, as opposed to seeing katoeys and the-like parading across the screen as soon as the box is turned on and chance it that he will not see this as ordinary life outside the home.

Best leave it at that in case this un's closed too, eh vic.

[cdnvic]

Best leave it at that in case this un's closed too, eh vic.

Not alot of grapes grown here but good to see the whine industry is thriving in Thailand.

cv

[jackr]

Best leave it at that in case this un's closed too, eh vic.

Not alot of grapes grown here but good to see the whine industry is thriving in Thailand.

cv

Loseeeeeerrr

[BrissyBoy]

Out of curiosity have there always been katoeys in thailand or is it only been in relatively recent time (last 10 - 20 years)?

And if it was recent what could have caused it?

[leftcross]

Some interesting points. I wasn't sure whether it was because being openly gay was looked down upon while being a ladyboy was deemed more acceptable. Homosexuality by the backdoor, if you will

[jackr]

Out of curiosity have there always been katoeys in thailand or is it only been in relatively recent time (last 10 - 20 years)?

And if it was recent what could have caused it?

Ability for blokes to earn money (coinciding with the tourist boom of recent times), and the scattering of them over all TV channels here must have some bearing on their numbers.

[tors]

One late night someone gave me the following explanation, don't know if it's true but it sounds like a possible explanation:

Statistically there are more men wanting to have a sex-change operation in Thailand than in any other country, this could be explained by social circumstances but there is also an extremely high number of hermafrodites here and the men have less of typical male hairgrow (chest, beard, arms...) and the women are more feminine;

The reason they give for this is the amount of the female hormone Oestrogene in soja, and since for generations the Thai are large consumers of Soja milk (and far less of cow milk) there is possibly some relation...

[bina]

funny u should mention soy milk, in israel now they are recommending not to give children soy milk for that exact reason: the estrogen in it.... can remember where they were discussing it, probably in one of those baby/mother magazines that they put out at the doctor's waiting room...

[lovethailandlongtime]

so does a swim in the thames!

[Merlin]

...... the families were unaware of what their sons were doing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Curious they don't ask questions when their sons come home from the big city with breasts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

well FWIW [and probably that's not too much...], in my highly scientific survey [alright, I've only spoken to a few of them...] two out of three ladyboys said that if they ever went home their father or brothers would kill them. One said that her mother comes to visit her sometimes, and the whole family knows and is cool with it.

I don't know what that says about acceptance, percentage wise. Probably not much

[cdnvic]

I guess first born son coming home in a dress would be the ultimate face loss with alot of these people. Maybe not so much in the cities where its more commonplace, but certainly if said family is from the sticks.

cv

[chanchao]

Couldn't agree more either, but with TheCoder's post instead.

> Perhaps a mutant gene somewhere back in Thai ancestory has been

> passed down?

If it was genetic it would die out in no-time. Think about it. Ladyboys, being attracted to men, typically don't father children. So any gene that controls this behaviour would die out right then and there; it doesn't get passed on.

Cheers,

Chanchao

[pedro01]

I don't think there are less or more gays here than abroad. Here they can openly dress like a woman. Abroad they cannot because of the public riducle they would bear the grunt of. Most of the ladyboys do not have the full cosmetic surgery done. The bottom is still intact. No, I don't know from a lot of personal exp. but it's too costly for the avg. person. Live and let live as most of the Thai society does.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The bottom is still intact ?????

I somehow doubt it...

[booma]

...... the families were unaware of what their sons were doing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Curious they don't ask questions when their sons come home from the big city with breasts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's because they also come home with big wallets.

cv

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who's saying they go home?

And even spend the money on wallets?

If I had turned myself into a girl to support my family, then that is where all the money would go!

Besides wallets are so not lady like!

B

Edited February 21, 2005 by booma

[Jai Dee]

...... the families were unaware of what their sons were doing.

Curious they don't ask questions when their sons come home from the big city with breasts.

It's because they also come home with big wallets.

cv

Who's saying they go home?

And even spend the money on wallets?

If I had turned myself into a girl to support my family, then that is where all the money would go!

Besides wallets are so not lady like!

B

I think cv was referring to the big wallets they steal from tourists in the not so desirable naughty nightlife areas.

[Shola]

Couldn't agree more either, but with TheCoder's post instead.

> Perhaps a mutant gene somewhere back in Thai ancestory has been

> passed down?

If it was genetic it would die out in no-time.  Think about it.  Ladyboys, being attracted to men, typically don't father children. So any gene that controls this behaviour would die out right then and there; it doesn't get passed on.

Cheers,

Chanchao

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good point, hadn't thought of that, although perhaps the gene lays dormant in some?

I am pretty convinced it is something to do with genes, I don't see how anything can explain such a large number of transexuals.

I have worked in schools where I've seen boys(more than a few), (too young to be influenced by sexuality) acting/sounding like the girls, shunning the boys groups in favour of being with girls and interacting with them just like a girl.

I like the soy milk suggestion though, sounds like a possibility...