Taking Thai Wife And Child Back To The Uk

[taxin]

Im considering taking the family back to the UK on a permanent basis. Im married to a Thai with a registered marriage in Thailand, have a child who was born in Thailand, child has British and Thai passport. Wife has Thai passport and has traveled to the UK before.

I have been in Thailand for 7 years where I have had a business. I have no registered address in the UK, no bank account and no job to do go to when I arrive in the UK.

I have checked out the UK Home office website but cant find info specific enough for my case, they also did not reply to my email (no surprises there). So im hoping I can get 1st hand advice from any TV members who have had experience with this.

Thanks in advance

[rolypie]

If you return to the uk with no job and no where to live, the chances of you getting a visa for your wife are very minimal.

Your wife can have no recourse to public funds so you with no where to live and no job will be not be able to support her as well as your child.

Ive just been through the whole painstaking procedure and know of people with homes and jobs being refused settlement visas due to the lack of financial support they can give there families.

[taxin]

If you return to the uk with no job and no where to live, the chances of you getting a visa for your wife are very minimal.

Your wife can have no recourse to public funds so you with no where to live and no job will be not be able to support her as well as your child.

Ive just been through the whole painstaking procedure and know of people with homes and jobs being refused settlement visas due to the lack of financial support they can give there families.

I have taken my wife to the UK before without having a job in the UK, and no home, all I had to provide was evidence of savings and bank statements. From memory the embassy were more interested in how firm our relationship was rather than means of supporting her when in the UK. The fact that I had evidence that we lived together in Thailand was the major factor in getting a visa, which im confident will be the case again this time round.

Although I do not have a job in the UK I have a business in Thailand which provides me with an income. My wife is also employed by my company and is financially independent, so in terms of finances im not that worried. I will also have somewhere to live in the UK.

My question really was in relation to my daughter. Im looking to find out the implications of taking a Thai born child with a British passport into England. Im hearing many different stories about this. An example is not being able to obtain state education for your child if they have been resident outside of the UK for a certain amount of time, despite having a British Passport. Does anyone know anything about this ?

Is it really as straight forward as simply walking through immigration and flashing her British passport ?

[dereklev]

My question really was in relation to my daughter. Im looking to find out the implications of taking a Thai born child with a British passport into England. Im hearing many different stories about this. An example is not being able to obtain state education for your child if they have been resident outside of the UK for a certain amount of time, despite having a British Passport. Does anyone know anything about this ?

Is it really as straight forward as simply walking through immigration and flashing her British passport ?

Yes I think it is that simple.

Your daughter has full British citizenship and the same rights as children born in the UK.

She might have been born in Thailand but that does not lessen her rights as a British subject.

[sumrit]

Im considering taking the family back to the UK on a permanent basis. Im married to a Thai with a registered marriage in Thailand, have a child who was born in Thailand, child has British and Thai passport. Wife has Thai passport and has traveled to the UK before.

I have been in Thailand for 7 years where I have had a business. I have no registered address in the UK, no bank account and no job to do go to when I arrive in the UK.

I have checked out the UK Home office website but cant find info specific enough for my case, they also did not reply to my email (no surprises there). So im hoping I can get 1st hand advice from any TV members who have had experience with this.

Thanks in advance

As Dereklev says your daughter is a British Citizen so she has the same rights any other British Citizen, no restrictions at all, you're even entitled to child benefit for her.

The biggest difference between getting a tourist visa for your wife and getting a settlement visa is that with a tourist visa you had to show funding for the trip plus a reason for your wife to return to Thailand at the end of it. With a settlement visa you will need to show adequate accommodation and the means to support your wife without recourse to public funds.

For accommodation for example if, initially, you're going to stay with friends/relatives you will need an invitation from them for you to stay there plus proof that it is their house (eg. utility/council tax bills and rent/mortgage information in there name) and that there is adequate room for you to stay (a bedroom just for yourselves for example).

For funding you will have to show you have adequate means to support your family. This can be from a job, from a private income or from savings or a combination of these. For people such as yourself the Embassy will usually accept a firm job offer as having a job. Savings don't have to be held in a UK bank, they can be held anywhere as long as they are in your name(s) and you have access to them. I believe, two years ago, the minimum amount for a couple was £92 per week but this might have gone up a little and I don't know how much extra you need for children.

And don't forget you will have to show 'proof' of you relationship again. Don't assume that because you provided the information for your wife's last visa that they will have everything 'on file'. This part should be a formality but they will want to see some documentation. I spoke to one person who's wife was refused a visa because they didn't provide proof of their relationship even though she'd been to the UK before. It was overturned on appeal but it was a hassle and delay they didn't need to have.

[ThaiVisaExpress]

You may stay with family short term only while you find employment in the UK. I cannot see any issues if you have children i presume they have UK passports etc. And your wife may be entitled to ILE the UK as you have been living together for 4 years and above.

[taxin]

Im considering taking the family back to the UK on a permanent basis. Im married to a Thai with a registered marriage in Thailand, have a child who was born in Thailand, child has British and Thai passport. Wife has Thai passport and has traveled to the UK before.

I have been in Thailand for 7 years where I have had a business. I have no registered address in the UK, no bank account and no job to do go to when I arrive in the UK.

I have checked out the UK Home office website but cant find info specific enough for my case, they also did not reply to my email (no surprises there). So im hoping I can get 1st hand advice from any TV members who have had experience with this.

Thanks in advance

As Dereklev says your daughter is a British Citizen so she has the same rights any other British Citizen, no restrictions at all, you're even entitled to child benefit for her.

The biggest difference between getting a tourist visa for your wife and getting a settlement visa is that with a tourist visa you had to show funding for the trip plus a reason for your wife to return to Thailand at the end of it. With a settlement visa you will need to show adequate accommodation and the means to support your wife without recourse to public funds.

For accommodation for example if, initially, you're going to stay with friends/relatives you will need an invitation from them for you to stay there plus proof that it is their house (eg. utility/council tax bills and rent/mortgage information in there name) and that there is adequate room for you to stay (a bedroom just for yourselves for example).

For funding you will have to show you have adequate means to support your family. This can be from a job, from a private income or from savings or a combination of these. For people such as yourself the Embassy will usually accept a firm job offer as having a job. Savings don't have to be held in a UK bank, they can be held anywhere as long as they are in your name(s) and you have access to them. I believe, two years ago, the minimum amount for a couple was £92 per week but this might have gone up a little and I don't know how much extra you need for children.

And don't forget you will have to show 'proof' of you relationship again. Don't assume that because you provided the information for your wife's last visa that they will have everything 'on file'. This part should be a formality but they will want to see some documentation. I spoke to one person who's wife was refused a visa because they didn't provide proof of their relationship even though she'd been to the UK before. It was overturned on appeal but it was a hassle and delay they didn't need to have.

Thanks for the advice.

My wife will probably go there on a tourist visa to start with. I wont be applying for a settlement visa just yet as I will be coming back to Thailand at some point.

Most of my income comes from my online business with the funds going offshore, would this still qualify as an income ?

I still cant help thinking it sounds too easy with regards to my daughter. Are you saying that I can actually claim child benefits as a single parent, even though I have not lived in the UK for 7 years ? And even more so claim for child that was not even born in the UK, or even been to the UK before ?

Not that im looking to go back to the UK for this purpose, but its interesting to know all the same.

[paully]

My wife will probably go there on a tourist visa to start with. I wont be applying for a settlement visa just yet as I will be coming back to Thailand at some point.

I still cant help thinking it sounds too easy with regards to my daughter. Are you saying that I can actually claim child benefits as a single parent, even though I have not lived in the UK for 7 years ? And even more so claim for child that was not even born in the UK, or even been to the UK before ?

Remember that the ability to apply for a change from visitor visa to settlement in-country in the UK was abolished several years ago. In other words, if your wife arrives on a visitor visa she (not you or your daughter) will have to leave the UK within 6 months and apply back in Thailand for settlement/ILE. You say you will have to come back to Thailand 'at some point', but when and for how long?

Yes, it really is that easy for your daughter. She's got UK citizenship, right?

[taxin]

My wife will probably go there on a tourist visa to start with. I wont be applying for a settlement visa just yet as I will be coming back to Thailand at some point.

I still cant help thinking it sounds too easy with regards to my daughter. Are you saying that I can actually claim child benefits as a single parent, even though I have not lived in the UK for 7 years ? And even more so claim for child that was not even born in the UK, or even been to the UK before ?

Remember that the ability to apply for a change from visitor visa to settlement in-country in the UK was abolished several years ago. In other words, if your wife arrives on a visitor visa she (not you or your daughter) will have to leave the UK within 6 months and apply back in Thailand for settlement/ILE. You say you will have to come back to Thailand 'at some point', but when and for how long?

Yes, it really is that easy for your daughter. She's got UK citizenship, right?

I dont plan to attempt at changing the visitor visa to a settlement while in the UK, I know we would have to return to apply again.

I would come back to Thailand in 6 months and decide then what I want to do. Stay in Thailand or pursue the more long term option.

Can anyone confirm this rule that a child cannot qualify for free schooling in the UK, if the child has been out of the country for so long ? Im worried that I will go back to the UK and find out that I have to pay for a private school, which is not an option for me at UK prices.

[samran]

the school thing applies to university fees, which are set at resident or non resident rates, and require, from memory, residency for 4 years to be eligible for local fees. I don't believe they apply to primary or secondary schooling, which is available to all legal residents in the UK, regardless of length of stay.

[gregchambers]

There is a difference between being a British citizen abd being resident in the UK. If you become resident again you will qualify for NHS right away (as will child and wife if she has the right visa) BUT you can not get any state benefits until you have been resident for two years - which will be worth pointing out to the embassy if you apply for ILR for the wife (ie they can't complain that you will take up state benefit due to lack of funds because you are not entitled to them yet). As it is illegal for your child not be schooled the implication has to be that state education must be available but that is just logic not knowledge on the ground on my part.

If you are going to apply for a tourist visa for the wife best not to mention your probable intention of returning to the UK - you have got the visa previously, I would guess, because it is clear you are living full time in Thailand and have a reason for the wife to come back with you, so reapply on the same basis as before.

Also be careful when and how you become resident as your offshore income and bank account interest may be subject to tax in the year of residence - and if you want to be regarded as non-resident then you can not stay on average for more than 90 days in a tax year (it is supposed to be averaged from the last three years on an on-going basis).

[sumrit]

My wife will probably go there on a tourist visa to start with. I wont be applying for a settlement visa just yet as I will be coming back to Thailand at some point.

I still cant help thinking it sounds too easy with regards to my daughter. Are you saying that I can actually claim child benefits as a single parent, even though I have not lived in the UK for 7 years ? And even more so claim for child that was not even born in the UK, or even been to the UK before ?

Remember that the ability to apply for a change from visitor visa to settlement in-country in the UK was abolished several years ago. In other words, if your wife arrives on a visitor visa she (not you or your daughter) will have to leave the UK within 6 months and apply back in Thailand for settlement/ILE. You say you will have to come back to Thailand 'at some point', but when and for how long?

Yes, it really is that easy for your daughter. She's got UK citizenship, right?

I dont plan to attempt at changing the visitor visa to a settlement while in the UK, I know we would have to return to apply again.

I would come back to Thailand in 6 months and decide then what I want to do. Stay in Thailand or pursue the more long term option.

Can anyone confirm this rule that a child cannot qualify for free schooling in the UK, if the child has been out of the country for so long ? Im worried that I will go back to the UK and find out that I have to pay for a private school, which is not an option for me at UK prices.

Schooling is free for everybody, including your daughter, even if she's never been to the UK before. I'm taking my wife and stepdaughter to the UK in two weeks and the schooling is free for my stepdaughter, and she's Thai, not British, and has never been to the UK. You can claim child benefit for your daughter as soon as you arrive in the UK but must stop claiming if you and your family return to live in Thailand. I think the actual rule is you can't claim once your daughter has been out of the UK for three months.

As for your income from your on line business, yes it would qualify as income providing you can supply documentary proof of it, and of course have access to it.

As ThaiVisaExpress said staying with relatives shouldn't be a permanent arrangement, but it's perfectly acceptable as a temporary one, and I don't think there's an actual/fixed time limit for an arrangement like this. As an example after living in Thailand for a few years I have to go back to the UK to live (work related). I haven't got a house in the UK any more so initially we're going to stay with my son. In his 'invitation' letter I gave to the British Embassy he just said he had plenty of room and we were welcome to stay as long as we wanted (he did supply documentary proof of his house). In my sponsors letter I said we would stay there until we were settled in the UK and found the right house to buy/rent. We didn't put a time limit on it and that must have been perfectly acceptable to the ECO as they didn't question it or ask for any other information.

[taxin]

There is a difference between being a British citizen abd being resident in the UK. If you become resident again you will qualify for NHS right away (as will child and wife if she has the right visa) BUT you can not get any state benefits until you have been resident for two years - which will be worth pointing out to the embassy if you apply for ILR for the wife (ie they can't complain that you will take up state benefit due to lack of funds because you are not entitled to them yet). As it is illegal for your child not be schooled the implication has to be that state education must be available but that is just logic not knowledge on the ground on my part.

If you are going to apply for a tourist visa for the wife best not to mention your probable intention of returning to the UK - you have got the visa previously, I would guess, because it is clear you are living full time in Thailand and have a reason for the wife to come back with you, so reapply on the same basis as before.

Also be careful when and how you become resident as your offshore income and bank account interest may be subject to tax in the year of residence - and if you want to be regarded as non-resident then you can not stay on average for more than 90 days in a tax year (it is supposed to be averaged from the last three years on an on-going basis).

This the bit that im concerned about. Its the difference between those words "resident" and "citizen". I see myself as a UK citizen, but I dont see myself as a UK resident. I have been on a continuous 1 year visa in Thailand (extension of stay), been working, paying taxes in Thailand, etc.. My daughter is certainly not a UK resident, hence why im trying to find out where I stand.

What does ILR mean ?

[7by7]

A British citizen by right of birth is always a British citizen; unless you choose to renounce it.

As a non resident British citizen then once you are again resident in the UK you are entitled to claim all the state benefits that any other citizen is entitled too, including child benefit. There may be some conditions you need to satisfy, such as showing you intend to remain resident in the UK for the foreseeable future, and you may have to serve a qualifying period, up to 26 weeks for child benefit, but there is no set rule as each case is treated on it's merits.

The best option, I feel, is if you need to then make a claim; the worst that will happen is they'll turn you down.

You will not, of course, be able to claim any NI contribution based benefits until you have been working and paying contributions for the relevant qualifying period.

Your wife will not be able to claim any public funds until she has ILR.

ILR is Indefinite Leave to Remain. It is the final visa stage for immigrants and gives them the right to live in the UK indefinitely. Someone entering the UK for settlement as a spouse can apply for it once they have lived in the UK for 2 years.

You may find Maintenance and accommodation helpful.

[sumrit]

A British citizen by right of birth is always a British citizen; unless you choose to renounce it.

As a non resident British citizen then once you are again resident in the UK you are entitled to claim all the state benefits that any other citizen is entitled too, including child benefit. There may be some conditions you need to satisfy, such as showing you intend to remain resident in the UK for the foreseeable future, and you may have to serve a qualifying period, up to 26 weeks for child benefit, but there is no set rule as each case is treated on it's merits.

The best option, I feel, is if you need to then make a claim; the worst that will happen is they'll turn you down.

You will not, of course, be able to claim any NI contribution based benefits until you have been working and paying contributions for the relevant qualifying period.

Your wife will not be able to claim any public funds until she has ILR.

ILR is Indefinite Leave to Remain. It is the final visa stage for immigrants and gives them the right to live in the UK indefinitely. Someone entering the UK for settlement as a spouse can apply for it once they have lived in the UK for 2 years.

You may find Maintenance and accommodation helpful.

Taxin if you and your wife have been together for more than four years when she applies for a settlement visa your wife can apply for ILR, then she doesn't have to go through the two year qualifying period in the UK.

[7by7]

Taxin if you and your wife have been together for more than four years when she applies for a settlement visa your wife can apply for ILR, then she doesn't have to go through the two year qualifying period in the UK.

To apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain one needs to already be in the UK. What Sumrit is talking about is Indefinite Leave to Enter, which is to all intents and purposes the same as ILR except that it is granted outside the UK.

When your wife applies she will be applying for settlement in the UK as your wife. Assuming all the other criteria are met, if she qualifies for ILE then this is what she will be granted, if she doesn't then she will be granted a 2 year spouse visa.

However, as well as the 4 year qualifying period Sumrit mentions, in order to qualify for ILE she must have satisfied the knowledge of language and life in the United Kingdom (KOL) requirement; and this can only be done in the UK. So, unless your wife has already satisfied the KOL requirement on a previous visit, she will not be granted ILE even if she otherwise qualifies. She will be given a 2 year spouse visa instead. In which case once she has satisfied the KOL requirement she can immediately apply for ILR without having to wait until the end of the 2 years.

[DiscoCol]

All I can say is good luck,

with out a job to go back too or savings to live on your'll be in real trouble, being out of the counrty for so long you may not be able to claim any benifits, the only ones you may get will be child care related. I may be wrong.... lets hope so. You may need to find family members who can act as sponsors.

Good Luck.

[jantrevor]

If your daughter has dual citizenship she can enter the UK with no problem. You can:

Apply for a UK passport in her name with a copy of her birth certificate which you used to register her birth as a UK citizen

Or:

Add her to your passport.

Just go to a UK embassy or Consuls office.

Jan

[jantrevor]

Senior Member

****

Group: Advanced Members

Posts: 830

Joined: 2008-08-29

From: Surrey and Bangsu

Member No.: 67,187

A British citizen by right of birth is always a British citizen; unless you choose to renounce it.

The British Government does not recognize renunciation if it is (was) forced by a foreign government. As an example when I became an American citizen I had to renounce my British citizenship. The British did not recognize this and I could apply for, and receive, a Brtish passpoert.

The Americans have since changed their policy.

Jan

[imaneggspurt]

Im sure you have a friend or relative that can offer you rented accomadation, and a job offer in writing shouldnt be that hard to obtain

[teddy_bare]

If your daughter has dual citizenship she can enter the UK with no problem. You can:

Apply for a UK passport in her name with a copy of her birth certificate which you used to register her birth as a UK citizen

Or:

Add her to your passport.

Just go to a UK embassy or Consuls office.

Jan

For the UK, any child must be on a separate passport.

[steve187]

If your wife comes to the uk on a 6 month tourist visa, she could sit and pass the knowledge of language and life in the United Kingdom test, then on her return to thailand she would then be able to apply for ILE instead of a spouse 2 year settlement visa. As to children on your passport as far as I am aware this is not allowed now and all children must have their own passport,

[7by7]

If your wife comes to the uk on a 6 month tourist visa, she could sit and pass the knowledge of language and life in the United Kingdom test, then on her return to thailand she would then be able to apply for ILE instead of a spouse 2 year settlement visa.

True, but:-

The current cost of a postal ILR application is £820.

Even with stop-overs the cheapest return fares Bangkok to London are over £300 per person.

Plus the cost of the visit visa; £67.

So, unless one was coming for a visit anyway, would it be worthwhile making a special trip just to sit the Lituk test?

Of course, a simple and fair solution would be to allow those who otherwise qualify for ILE to take the test at the Embassy.

Simple and fair; since when has either of thos two been a concern of this government?!

Edited July 6, 2009 by 7by7

[robint]

Senior Member

****

A British citizen by right of birth is always a British citizen; unless you choose to renounce it.

My I please correct you on this point,

what you mean is that being designatede a British Citizen gives you the Right of Abode in the UK

there are 6 different categories of British nationality affecting passport status, depending on whether you are a British Citizen or a British National (descended from the defucnt British Empire and dependant territories). Its very complex.

* British citizenship;

* British overseas citizenship;

* British overseas territories citizenship;

* British national (overseas);

* British protected person; and

* British subject.

check it out if you want a headache

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/britishc...eascitizenship/

Citizenship can be downgraded if you are resident overseas for more than 20 years continuously, hold dual nationality and have no UK ties.

A pal of mine , east end cockney born and bred, worked in Nigeria for over 20 years continuously. When he came to renew his passport locally he was given a

downgraded British commonwealth passport, endorsed to the effect that he did not have right of abode in the uk. This was because he held Nigerian citizenship having lived an ran a business for more than 20 years.

This wasnt an irreversible step but he would have to go to UK and reapply for British Citizenship.

Having said that, it was an unusual step, and I think he was a naughty boy and upset the High Commission over the years

Never forget pefidious albion, British governments throughout history have been the most devious and untrustworthy ever, just ask the French (who were ever their match)

[aussiebebe]

Never forget pefidious albion, British governments throughout history have been the most devious and untrustworthy ever, just ask the French (who were ever their match)

Hi robint, I had to look that up on Wikipedia 'cos I'm an uneducated sod; is that meant humorously or do people really go around slotting 'pefidious albion' into everyday speech?

[MAJIC]

Hi Guys

As a newbie on this blog I have been a regular vistor of Thai visa for about 5 years, I am writing this to help others who may be in similar hopeless situation as I myself, who was at his witsend. No I am not a benefit scrounger,having worked for 40 years and paid my UK TAXES AND NI CONTRIBUTIONS,so please no Flaming, this is merely to help other guys in a similar hopeless situation.

I can on topic give you my experience of returning to the the UK after 7 years in Thailand for reasons I wont go into on this site (email me if you want more in depth info)

Arrived at Heathrow,sailed through as a British Citizen and as one should expect.

My mate put me up for 2 months,while I went through, re establising my right of abode/citizenship and the need to claim benefits through ill health (In Thailand I paid for my own treatment until it became financialy impossible). Yes you can try to make a claim for whatever you want with exceptions mainly on employment i.e Jobseekers allowance (too many migrants flitting over the channel to claim benefits),its all changed now all claims are done by phone expect 30-40 minutes on the phone,without all your paperwork on hand,you have to skip many questions which will come through the post 2-3 weeks later for correction.

Then you will get hit with the letter that says you have been out of the UK for x number of years and now have basically prove your right of abode/residency in the UK," country of birthright,.

Someone will contact you to make an appointment to interview you to take the HRT (Habitual Residency Test) at this stage I hadnt a clue what was involved, a few weeks later a very nice Lady came along and gave me a 1.25 hour interview/grilling, along the lines of why have you come back/ what are your reasons to be here in the first place and a hundred and one other questions.

At this stage you are beginning to feel like an illegal immigrant (very depressing) but dont take it personal.

However I must say I had very courtious and respectful treatment and a credit to the system, humane with it as well, when I said to the lady who's job it was to interview me"I feel bad about this and would rather not be claiming" she replied non committaly "You are a British Citizen for Gods sake" implying its your rights.

So all you Guys out there who listen to the Know all Bar room lawyers,jobes comforters,and doom mongers,dont listen to them,you still have your Birth rights and your country behind you if needs be, lessened as they may be. If you cant go home in times of need,where the F*** can you go.If you have paid your dues in the UK all your doing is taking up your rights,which most of us have paid our dues into the system.

Hope this posting has been of some help to someone out there.

MAJIC

[ThaiVisaExpress]

Are you not applying for a family visit ?

You said Tourist visa as your wife ?

Sorry been busy have only glanced through the thread but i believe a family visit is more appropriate ?

[MAJIC]

As has been discussed before on Thai Visa

The Thai wife will no doubt have in her settlement Visa "NO ACCESS TO PUBLIC FUNDS" does this stop a husband from claiming for his wife on an application such as 65 year pension in the UK,WOULD BE OBLIGED IF SOMEONE HAS THE ANSWER TO THIS.

[MAJIC]

Teddy_bare agree with you,new rules from however long ago. the child must have a passport in their own right

[7by7]

As has been discussed before on Thai Visa

The Thai wife will no doubt have in her settlement Visa "NO ACCESS TO PUBLIC FUNDS" does this stop a husband from claiming for his wife on an application such as 65 year pension in the UK,WOULD BE OBLIGED IF SOMEONE HAS THE ANSWER TO THIS.

Would be obliged if you would refrain from posting in capitals.

NI based benefits, such as the retirement pension, are not on the list of proscribed public funds. However, the guidance I can find seems to refer to the immigrant claiming it in their own right, not their spouse claiming extra due to the marriage. Usually, whilst a UK resident spouse can, of course, claim any and all state benefits, they cannot claim extra due to their immigrant spouse living with them. There are exceptions, such as tax credits, but I am not sure about the state pension.

Unless someone else here can advise, I suggest contacting the DWP and asking them.

(UKBA leaflet on public funds)

Edited August 19, 2009 by 7by7