Lesson Learned - Check To See Who Owns The Road Leading To Your House

[Tokay]

I foolishly thought the road (which looks like a public road) provided normal access to one of my new units. Today I was informed, due to the way I was parking on this road, that it is privately owned, by some nutty old lady, and she wants to dictate how we park on it or if we even can park on it at all. <deleted>!?

I still have to check with the land office and my attorney, and will do so tomorrow, but thought I would share none the less as it is something I overlooked in this case.

Moral of the story, even if the road looks like a public one, double check on it because, and I hope I'm not about to find out, it could bring a lot of headache.

One beautiful thing about living here is, I learn something new every day. I student for life.

[zzaa09]

I foolishly thought the road (which looks like a public road) provided normal access to one of my new units. Today I was informed, due to the way I was parking on this road, that it is privately owned, by some nutty old lady, and she wants to dictate how we park on it or if we even can park on it at all. <deleted>!?

I still have to check with the land office and my attorney, and will do so tomorrow, but thought I would share none the less as it is something I overlooked in this case.

Moral of the story, even if the road looks like a public one, double check on it because, and I hope I'm not about to find out, it could bring a lot of headache.

One beautiful thing about living here is, I learn something new every day. I student for life.

I can extend empathy towards your plight, Tokay. But your comments come across as if your predicament

should be looked upon a standard for all these types of situations. As access roads go, every situation is different.

[InterestedObserver]

Is the road in question drawn on your chanote? If so it's considered as access to your property; i.e., a public road.

[Crossy]

THE single most expensive piece of our property, was the 5m x 4m patch that provides vehicular access, otherwise need a boat

Luckily the Missus knew all about the access rights (or lack of them) and sorted the relevant paperwork.

[Tokay]

I can extend empathy towards your plight, Tokay. But your comments come across as if your predicament

should be looked upon a standard for all these types of situations. As access roads go, every situation is different.

Yes, I'm sure every situation is different. This is my fault for not checking into everything first. I just wanted to share so perhaps another TV member will not make the same mistake I did. In some cases I'm sure this could be a quite ugly situation.

Is the road in question drawn on your chanote? If so it's considered as access to your property; i.e., a public road.

It's not.

It's one of those little things just slipped right past me. We'll see how it turns out, will post and let you all know. The lady could just be crazy. Or not.

I'll figure it out one way or another and chalk it up to a lesson learned. I'm not upset, just humbled once again.

[DonTron]

Tokay - I got the same problem here at Naklua. We just found out that the connecting road also belongs go some nutty old lady - perhaps its the same lady as you, who knows :-)

Luckily the water and electric to all her land parcels all go thru my land, so perhaps she will be willing to do a "access trade" with me, or we could risk that my cat (mean-mao) starts chewing cables and waterpipes daily

[rgs2001uk]

Tokay - I got the same problem here at Naklua. We just found out that the connecting road also belongs go some nutty old lady - perhaps its the same lady as you, who knows :-)

Luckily the water and electric to all her land parcels all go thru my land, so perhaps she will be willing to do a "access trade" with me, or we could risk that my cat (mean-mao) starts chewing cables and waterpipes daily

Situations such as these are more common than people realise, in most cases you will find that the little old lady, or her family were the original land owners, they sub divided their land and put houses or condos on them. The little old lady will still own the road and all that entails.

Due dilligence, I know its easy to say but always check, these sales people at some of these new housing developments will be in no rush to inform you.

[Tokay]

Due dilligence

Amen.

The thing that got me was, this road looks 100% like a public road. Had this crazy old women not said something, I don't think I would ever know the difference. It even butts right up to the main road, same style or pavement and everything. Learn something every day.

But you are 110% correct... DUE DILIGENCE!

[johnnyk]

Be sweet, take her a gift or two (some of these old Thai ladies can drink!), do a chore for her now and then.

[stgrhe]

We (min wife) recently bought land in Pranburi and we made a proper due diligence. One of the thing I wanted to check was the last 100 metres before development as it is a dirt road, but we found out that it is a public road.

Now, had the access road to the development been privately owned I would have preconditioned the land purchase with a servitude agreement with the land owner, and registered at the land office, for us and now money would have changed hand before such a servitude had been registered.

The second thing that concerned me regarding access rights was a 'right of way' to our plot within the development. I know the law provides us with such a right but I nevertheless wanted such a clause in the purchase agreement. This is the wording I used:

The Buyer shall have full and unrestricted right to access public ways to and from the Land within the Development and if required by the Buyer, the Seller shall arrange for registration with the Pranburi Land Department a servitude entitling the Buyer and the occupiers of the Land Plot to access public ways from the Land Plot free of charges."

There was an incident here in Hua Hin a couple of years ago when a house owner in a development choose to purchase his swimming pool directly from a swimming pool dealer and not through the developer. When the swimming pool contractor arrived the developer stopped them from entering the development and hel_l broke lose. When buying into a development is it therefore important to ensure you have full access right to your house written in the purchase/lease agreement even though the law is on your side.

Edited because of missing word

Edited July 28, 2009 by stgrhe

[TPI]

I foolishly thought the road (which looks like a public road) provided normal access to one of my new units. Today I was informed, due to the way I was parking on this road, that it is privately owned, by some nutty old lady, and she wants to dictate how we park on it or if we even can park on it at all. <deleted>!?

I still have to check with the land office and my attorney, and will do so tomorrow, but thought I would share none the less as it is something I overlooked in this case.

Moral of the story, even if the road looks like a public one, double check on it because, and I hope I'm not about to find out, it could bring a lot of headache.

One beautiful thing about living here is, I learn something new every day. I student for life.

Maaaate! The little lady an I bought a large plot of land from her "good neighbour" at a premium price "because they're old"...only later, when we started to build on the land did we find out that the 100m dirt access road was owned by another neighbour... the legendary "little old chinese lady" who insisted that we couldn't use any part of her land to run water, telephone or power, especially alongside the road?

Sly moves were done with the daughter of said little lady...money changed hands and now, for 2 years, we haven't had any problems...but! Now we're negotiating to buy the access road, the Land Department is coming to value the land etc etc. I don't think we'll get out of it for less than 100K

Moral? Don't trust anyone, even "good, friendly neighbours"

[quiksilva]

As you might imagine we see this quite often. One of the most common cases is where a parcel of land is sold which seemingly connects to the public road (from a visual inspection) but in fact there may well be a narrow strip a metre or so wide that lies between the parcel and the road, for which the land owner will charge a fortune.

Always check the title deeds, but don't leave your DD there, compare them against the neighbouring plots' titles via the cadastral map at the land department, if there are parcels that block access to the main road, check those titles to see if they have any servitudes (in this case rights of way) to your plot registered on them, and negotiate accordingly.

Edited July 28, 2009 by quiksilva

[Tokay]

We (min wife) recently bought land in Pranburi and we made a proper due diligence. One of the thing I wanted to check was the last 100 metres before development as it is a dirt road, but we found out that it is a public road.

Now, had the access road to the development been privately owned I would have preconditioned the land purchase with a servitude agreement with the land owner, and registered at the land office, for us and now money would have changed hand before such a servitude had been registered.

The second thing that concerned me regarding access rights was a 'right of way' to our plot within the development. I know the law provides us with such a right but I nevertheless wanted such a clause in the purchase agreement. This is the wording I used:

The Buyer shall have full and unrestricted right to access public ways to and from the Land within the Development and if required by the Buyer, the Seller shall arrange for registration with the Pranburi Land Department a servitude entitling the Buyer and the occupiers of the Land Plot to access public ways from the Land Plot free of charges."

There was an incident here in Hua Hin a couple of years ago when a house owner in a development choose to purchase his swimming pool directly from a swimming pool dealer and not through the developer. When the swimming pool contractor arrived the developer stopped them from entering the development and hel_l broke lose. When buying into a development is it therefore important to ensure you have full access right to your house written in the purchase/lease agreement even though the law is on your side.

Edited because of missing word

Maaaate! The little lady an I bought a large plot of land from her "good neighbour" at a premium price "because they're old"...only later, when we started to build on the land did we find out that the 100m dirt access road was owned by another neighbour... the legendary "little old chinese lady" who insisted that we couldn't use any part of her land to run water, telephone or power, especially alongside the road?

Sly moves were done with the daughter of said little lady...money changed hands and now, for 2 years, we haven't had any problems...but! Now we're negotiating to buy the access road, the Land Department is coming to value the land etc etc. I don't think we'll get out of it for less than 100K

Moral? Don't trust anyone, even "good, friendly neighbours"

As you might imagine we see this quite often. One of the most common cases is where a parcel of land is sold which seemingly connects to the public road (from a visual inspection) but in fact there may well be a narrow strip a metre or so wide that lies between the parcel and the road, for which the land owner will charge a fortune.

Always check the title deeds, but don't leave your DD there, compare them against the neighbouring plots' titles via the cadastral map at the land department, if there are parcels that block access to the main road, check those titles to see if they have any servitudes (in this case rights of way) to your plot registered on them, and negotiate accordingly.

All good posts.

Heading off to the land office in a little bit to see what pans out.

[Tokay]

I was told the lady did a deal with the original builders of the units to allow them to use the road. In return the builders paved this road for her. There is a contract I am told, and will be getting my hands on it in a few days.

Looks like this old lady is just crazy and a trouble maker.

[hhgz]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

[johnnyk]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

She has high cards in her hand. The "trouble" was self-inflicted via lack of research.

[Tokay]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

Considering that she signed a contract to allow the unit owners to use this road, then wants to ignore that contract and just boss people around, I would indeed call her a trouble maker.

She should have never signed it if she didn't want people to use it.

She has high cards in her hand. The "trouble" was self-inflicted via lack of research.

I did not research the road, you are correct. Though now I hold a contract that she signed allowing unit owners to use this road. She has no cards now. As soon as we showed her this contract today, she mumbled a bunch of crap and stormed off. Hasn't bothered us since.

She is a old, hateful, bossy, Chinese-Thai trouble maker. Not the first I've encountered here, and it certainly won't be the last.

[johnnyk]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

Considering that she signed a contract to allow the unit owners to use this road, then wants to ignore that contract and just boss people around, I would indeed call her a trouble maker.

She should have never signed it if she didn't want people to use it.

She has high cards in her hand. The "trouble" was self-inflicted via lack of research.

I did not research the road, you are correct. Though now I hold a contract that she signed allowing unit owners to use this road. She has no cards now. As soon as we showed her this contract today, she mumbled a bunch of crap and stormed off. Hasn't bothered us since.

She is a old, hateful, bossy, Chinese-Thai trouble maker. Not the first I've encountered here, and it certainly won't be the last.

Good news. She's pissed that her ship just hit the rocks.

[dale8]

Hello, this is a good post as I did not know this could be a problem in LOS. It is another thing to look at when buying a place to live, and I am happy things turned out well for you. Cheers.

[StatlerandWaldorf]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

Considering that she signed a contract to allow the unit owners to use this road, then wants to ignore that contract and just boss people around, I would indeed call her a trouble maker.

She should have never signed it if she didn't want people to use it.

She has high cards in her hand. The "trouble" was self-inflicted via lack of research.

I did not research the road, you are correct. Though now I hold a contract that she signed allowing unit owners to use this road. She has no cards now. As soon as we showed her this contract today, she mumbled a bunch of crap and stormed off. Hasn't bothered us since.

She is a old, hateful, bossy, Chinese-Thai trouble maker. Not the first I've encountered here, and it certainly won't be the last.

I agree with you, she is a trouble maker. She is Thai, she wanted her road paved for free without having to give anything up herself!

[beekaykay]

I foolishly thought the road (which looks like a public road) provided normal access to one of my new units. Today I was informed, due to the way I was parking on this road, that it is privately owned, by some nutty old lady, and she wants to dictate how we park on it or if we even can park on it at all. <deleted>!?

I still have to check with the land office and my attorney, and will do so tomorrow, but thought I would share none the less as it is something I overlooked in this case.

Moral of the story, even if the road looks like a public one, double check on it because, and I hope I'm not about to find out, it could bring a lot of headache.

One beautiful thing about living here is, I learn something new every day. I student for life.

Tokay you wouldn't be referring to a certain condo in Wittayu Road by any chance would you, as it sounds very familiar

[Lancashirelad]

I was told the lady did a deal with the original builders of the units to allow them to use the road. In return the builders paved this road for her. There is a contract I am told, and will be getting my hands on it in a few days.

Looks like this old lady is just crazy and a trouble maker.

Considering that she signed a contract to allow the unit owners to use this road, then wants to ignore that contract and just boss people around, I would indeed call her a trouble maker.

I see a difference.

[Gary A]

One never knows how things will turn out. My wife's mother and father live in a small village. Their house had a small road just big enough for a six wheel truck to get to it. A couple of years ago they tore down the old house and built a new house. Shortly after their new house was finished, one of the neighbors built an extension on his house. He blocked the existing road to the extent that only a motorbike or someone walking can now pass through. The village chief told them that the road portion area was on the neighbors chanote and that nothing can be done even though everyone had been using the road for more than fifty years.

[bellachg]

"Looks like this old lady is...a trouble maker."

Asserting her legal right, and not allowing you to trespass on her property does not make her a "trouble maker".

Considering that she signed a contract to allow the unit owners to use this road, then wants to ignore that contract and just boss people around, I would indeed call her a trouble maker.

She should have never signed it if she didn't want people to use it.

She has high cards in her hand. The "trouble" was self-inflicted via lack of research.

I did not research the road, you are correct. Though now I hold a contract that she signed allowing unit owners to use this road. She has no cards now. As soon as we showed her this contract today, she mumbled a bunch of crap and stormed off. Hasn't bothered us since.

She is a old, hateful, bossy, Chinese-Thai trouble maker. Not the first I've encountered here, and it certainly won't be the last.

She may very well executed a contract so that people can use the road for access and regress. That gives you the right to pass over the road, but it does not necessarily give you the right to PARK on it. As a matter of fact all such agreements I have seen mention the word "Pass over", and passing over is not the same as parking on.