Frustrated With Freeway Rules!

[f0xxee]

Greetings all,

In the last 12 months I have become increasingly annoyed by the "no motorbikes" policy on the capitals Freeways and ring roads. Now I can understand a "No scooter" policy, as having recently arrived from Vietnam I have seen daily the carnage that happens when you mix underpowered scooters with overloaded trucks (and riding expertise and mentality of a 10 year old). Its messy.

On the occassions I have had to ride across BKK from Chiang Mai to Pattaya and Pattaya to Hua Hin I have taken the freeways and ring roads, played the dumb falalng card and been prepared to take my lumps should the BIB be waiting for me at the end of the road... I understand the fine can be 1000 baht. (The dumb falang manoeuvre involves arriving at the toll gate with a happy confused smile, and, when being told "no bike!" and being directed to U-turn, waving happily and thanking them and taking off... rapidly down the freeway.)

So far so good: The (9) ring road from the Chonburi-Trat rd (34) to the southern highway (4) at sun rise with the reflection off the bridge is an esctatic moment in motorbike memory for sure... And the worst I have had is a wry smile and amused smile form the toll booth operators at the other end.

But this is not sustainable. I am going to get nicked by the rozzers for sure. I've got a nice bike and I dont want it confiscated.

So:

What are the alternative routes north to south and east to west?

And:

Given the number of big bikes is increasing and more pertiniently being sold to Thais, any rumours of a relaxation of the rules?

I cannot believe I am the only one who is disgruntled with this, so I look forward to some wisdom...

Cheers,

f0xxee

Edited July 27, 2009 by f0xxee

[ScubaBuddha]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

[fred2007]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

Like this one?

[Ithailian]

Amen! Probably my number one or two biggest pet peeve about living here. I always thought they could issue a special permit for big bikes. Requires (a) Money ( a big enough, new enough bike, © experience and short 'rules' lesson. Man, how many times have I thought about trying the "dumb farang" maneuver. I have also heard (but not seen) that for larger groups, access to the big bridges/expressways can be "pre-arranged."

[Travelmate]

I have done the outer ring road, a few years back when I had the Repsol CBR1000RR. Did it several times actually. However I stopped doing it when a copper tried to run me off the road with his pick-up. Very frightening, had to make a fast getaway and create distance between them and me.

Anyhooter needless to say I have never done it again.

I have heard of rumours of 600cc up being proposed to use the King's highway.

[dunder]

oh well.. now when the Japanese manufacturers are marketing "big bikes" in Thailand it should be in their interest to lobby quite hard for opening up the high-/tollways for bikes bigger than 250 CC. At least I'm pretty sure this would boost the sales of these bikes. If not - let's hope someone from their marketing departments is reading this and gets an idea:) TIT and there are some deep pockets in Japan..

Peace,

Johan

[12DrinkMore]

Does anybody have a list of the roads where bikes are not allowed so that I can create a route for my Garmin GPS?

[ScubaBuddha]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

Like this one?

Good lord. I said 250cc, not 1250cc! That thing's the Mother Ship!

[submaniac]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

Like this one?

What is that? The engine doesn't look like an evo or Twin Cam (the cyl heads), kind of like a shovelhead, but not quite right (or not at least what I am used to).

[alant]

i cant see it happening, i dont think we (bikers) let alone farang bikers have any political clout and i cant think of a good reason for anyone to go to the trouble of changing things. except of course for cash, can someone suggest a big bike is a car and therefore we can use the road but we have to pay the same toll.

does anyone have the connections to do that?

[BigBikeBKK]

i cant see it happening, i dont think we (bikers) let alone farang bikers have any political clout and i cant think of a good reason for anyone to go to the trouble of changing things. except of course for cash, can someone suggest a big bike is a car and therefore we can use the road but we have to pay the same toll.

does anyone have the connections to do that?

Spend some time at Thailand's Bike Weeks and you'll quickly notice that a lot of the owners of big bikes in Thailand are high ranking Thai police and other 'high-so' Thais. We falang make up a negligible % of bikers in Thailand. If change is to happen it will be initiated by the Thais and we should certainly support and encourage them. Personally I don't see it happening any time soon, but I'd love to be wrong.

Thai groups regularly arrange special permission to use highways for organized group rides. Dreamchaser is an example that comes to mind...

Ride On!

[katabeachbum]

Xpressways are for rich people and rich people dont drive pickups with passangers on the back or bikes. Periode. For years.

As long as all bikes require same driving lisence, they wont class them differently for xpressway driving. Periode. For years.

Only organised rides on Xpressway. Organised by thais, like the Bike Weeks.

Fine is 200-1000 baht depending on Bibs mood.

[bangsaenguy]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

Like this one?

What is that? The engine doesn't look like an evo or Twin Cam (the cyl heads), kind of like a shovelhead, but not quite right (or not at least what I am used to).

Looks like a shovelhead to me

[onnut]

I would rather there no bikes on the express ways. its the only place you can feel safe from bikes while driving. guys, just imagine the carnage if a pick up is traveling at 150KPH and cant slow down in time when a bike vears across the lane. I am not saying you would be the bike rider, but you have to admit that a lot of riders out there dont know how to ride and that it will happen, not could happen.

or this is more like it.imagine you doing close to 200KPH and some dumb pratt swaps lanes in front of you. you know that it is a possibility as well. I am not trying to stir up trouble on your forum but we all know that bikes and cars do not mix very well over here.

On the other hand I do understand your plite and if I rode bikes over here I would be thinking the same. but I am a car driver and hope it never happens. sorry I dont mean to sound harsh.

[thaicbr]

oNNUT YOU SHOULD NOT BE DOING 150KMH ANYWAY. you are breaking the speed limit. Naughty,naughty car driver you.

[dunder]

or this is more like it.imagine you doing close to 200KPH and some dumb pratt swaps lanes in front of you. you know that it is a possibility as well. I am not trying to stir up trouble on your forum but we all know that bikes and cars do not mix very well over here.

Imagine this on "normal" thai roads!

[neverdie]

I would rather there no bikes on the express ways. its the only place you can feel safe from bikes while driving. guys, just imagine the carnage if a pick up is traveling at 150KPH and cant slow down in time when a bike vears across the lane. I am not saying you would be the bike rider, but you have to admit that a lot of riders out there dont know how to ride and that it will happen, not could happen.

or this is more like it.imagine you doing close to 200KPH and some dumb pratt swaps lanes in front of you. you know that it is a possibility as well. I am not trying to stir up trouble on your forum but we all know that bikes and cars do not mix very well over here.

On the other hand I do understand your plite and if I rode bikes over here I would be thinking the same. but I am a car driver and hope it never happens. sorry I dont mean to sound harsh.

As opposed to a taxi or a pickup on the same highway doing it (swapping lanes)?

If you are driving at those sorts of speed amoungst other traffic here, its only a matter of time and you need to get your head read. Guess your completely safe in the big honda ....hopefully you only kill yourself.

You are being very naughty onut, just admit it

Edited July 28, 2009 by neverdie

[LivinLOS]

Spend some time at Thailand's Bike Weeks and you'll quickly notice that a lot of the owners of big bikes in Thailand are high ranking Thai police and other 'high-so' Thais.

Dont they get to ride where they want anyway ??

[fred2007]

I agree. I have always felt there should be something like a 250cc or bigger rule.

Like this one?

What is that? The engine doesn't look like an evo or Twin Cam (the cyl heads), kind of like a shovelhead, but not quite right (or not at least what I am used to).

Looks like a shovelhead to me

You might be right but I am not an expert on bikes in any case this is the bike of my friend

I only posted the pic because I made the trailer, I guess it is not looking that bad is it ?

[f0xxee]

Hmmm. Onut.

Wrong thread, wrong outlook. Motorbike riders learn to be defensive and look for the swerving taxi, the Toyota Hilux full of people, the pot holes, the loose loads on trucks, the girls in honda applying lipstick while sending a text... we learn to observe, avoid, survive. Slow learners either don't survive or become anti-bike car drivers...

What about you brother? how often do you check and I mean really check your blind spots before changing lanes?

[neverdie]

Hmmm. Onut.

Wrong thread, wrong outlook. Motorbike riders learn to be defensive and look for the swerving taxi, the Toyota Hilux full of people, the pot holes, the loose loads on trucks, the girls in honda applying lipstick while sending a text... we learn to observe, avoid, survive. Slow learners either don't survive or become anti-bike car drivers...

What about you brother? how often do you check and I mean really check your blind spots before changing lanes?

I didnt know that they fitted mirrors to ivory towers

90% of the drivers here probably dont even adjust the mirror yet alone have a look into them before verging

[onnut]

I would rather there no bikes on the express ways. its the only place you can feel safe from bikes while driving. guys, just imagine the carnage if a pick up is traveling at 150KPH and cant slow down in time when a bike vears across the lane. I am not saying you would be the bike rider, but you have to admit that a lot of riders out there dont know how to ride and that it will happen, not could happen.

or this is more like it.imagine you doing close to 200KPH and some dumb pratt swaps lanes in front of you. you know that it is a possibility as well. I am not trying to stir up trouble on your forum but we all know that bikes and cars do not mix very well over here.

On the other hand I do understand your plite and if I rode bikes over here I would be thinking the same. but I am a car driver and hope it never happens. sorry I dont mean to sound harsh.

As opposed to a taxi or a pickup on the same highway doing it (swapping lanes)?

If you are driving at those sorts of speed amoungst other traffic here, its only a matter of time and you need to get your head read. Guess your completely safe in the big honda ....hopefully you only kill yourself.

You are being very naughty onut, just admit it

sorry, maybe I was not clear. i am talking about the big bikes doing 200KPH. I would not have the balls for them speeds in my car anymore. I drive very safe now I have a little boy and im not a boy racer anymore....

if a big bike wanted to open up on the over head toll way out near Bang-Nar he could do no problem. but that would be messy hitting a car that just pulls out from the left lane for no reason as we sometimes see over here.

[neverdie]

my full apologies onut.....I couldnt work out what you were talking about and I thought you had gone mad, I wasnt the only one.

and you are somewhat correct about what you are saying.

I will have to call the hit squad off now ....if theres a knock at the door in the next 10 minutes, DON'T ANSWER

[12DrinkMore]

oNNUT YOU SHOULD NOT BE DOING 150KMH ANYWAY. you are breaking the speed limit. Naughty,naughty car driver you.

Actually Onnut(ter) was talking faster than that

or this is more like it.imagine you doing close to 200KPH....

A speed which in Farangland would be rapidly caught by radar and result in substantial fines and maybe a lost licence. And if a "dumb pratt" travelling at the legal limit swaps lanes and gets tail ended by a considerably "dummer pratt" travelling around 60% faster than the legal limit, I sincerely hope that the illegal lunatic ends up in a coffin first.

[katabeachbum]

sorry, maybe I was not clear. i am talking about the big bikes doing 200KPH. I would not have the balls for them speeds in my car anymore. I drive very safe now I have a little boy and im not a boy racer anymore....

if a big bike wanted to open up on the over head toll way out near Bang-Nar he could do no problem. but that would be messy hitting a car that just pulls out from the left lane for no reason as we sometimes see over here.

I am an Accord driver at high speeds, and a biker.

There is a reason why pickups with passangers at the back of the bed and bikes are not allowed on the Xpressways. Its such a mess to clean up.

A car can be removed with occupants inside.

Life in LOS

[onnut]

Hmmm. Onut.

Wrong thread, wrong outlook. Motorbike riders learn to be defensive and look for the swerving taxi, the Toyota Hilux full of people, the pot holes, the loose loads on trucks, the girls in honda applying lipstick while sending a text... we learn to observe, avoid, survive. Slow learners either don't survive or become anti-bike car drivers...

What about you brother? how often do you check and I mean really check your blind spots before changing lanes?

ok F0xxee, very good point. im touching wood now and can say in 5 years driving in Thailand I have not come close to hitting a bike due to not looking in blind spots and / or mirrors. but have come close a few times because they change lanes in front of me with no warning whatsoever. this being a popular sport on Sukhumvit in Bangkok! and it is these types of riders that I really could not hack on the freeways. like I said in my first post, I do not think there would be a problem with guys like yourselves riding the freeways, its the general somchai population. we do get these idiots in cars up there so why would it be any different with the bikes? except, bikes can travel a lot faster than most cars over here...

yes, I drive a car! i do not like bikes, that is because I dont ride them and never did. thats my choice. that does not mean though that I do not have respect for riders of bikes. we can all share the roads. it just makes me wonder about the problems of having you guys on these machines bombing around the freeways where at the moment we as car drivers do not need to worry about that. when I say you guys, I mean the the other part of the population!

can you really say that you have never seen a guy on a bike in Thailand do a stupid thing that nearly got him and overs killed. we all know car drivers can do stupid things as well but the bikes do not have protection as we do in cars.

[onnut]

I didnt know that they fitted mirrors to ivory towers

90% of the drivers here probably dont even adjust the mirror yet alone have a look into them before verging

what do you mean by ivory towers? and im one of the 10%

[f0xxee]

Ah Onnut,

The number of times I have nearly come to meet the baby Jesus in the past few years...

I have had the OAP's on a honda snot 20cc motorbike weave from right lane to left lane without looking and have clipped my front wheel to their back wheel.

I have travelled the shoulder to have a cow on a leash discharge a torrent of bowel action hot and slippery just as I was braking for the cows owner.

I have had trucks launch retreads, trucks jack-knife etc.

So its not just cars by any means.

In Vietnam the skill of all persons on wheels is abysmal, as motorbikes and cars only took over from the humble pushbike in the early 90's. Imagine 80 million people driving and riding like they are still on a pushbike! They do, as anyone who has lived there can attest. There are no rules and no respect and accidents are nasty ugly daily affairs. (14,000 road users killed in the first 9 months in Vietnam in 2008).

In honesty most Thai drivers are better (IMHO) than their counterparts around them in SE Asia.

The fact is LESS accidents happen in general and to motorbikes in particular on freeways because they are mono-directional. Most motorbikes get taken out by cars on the wrong side of the road, themselves on the wrong side of the road by bad riding, by turning across traffic or having traffic turn in front of us.

So really the freeway is the safest place for us to co-exist.

Yes we buzz around for sure... but speed, braking and vision are our assets: the lack of armour our weakness.

Keep an eye out for us!

Cheers Onnut!

[onnut]

Ah Onnut,

The number of times I have nearly come to meet the baby Jesus in the past few years...

I have had the OAP's on a honda snot 20cc motorbike weave from right lane to left lane without looking and have clipped my front wheel to their back wheel.

I have travelled the shoulder to have a cow on a leash discharge a torrent of bowel action hot and slippery just as I was braking for the cows owner.

I have had trucks launch retreads, trucks jack-knife etc.

So its not just cars by any means.

In Vietnam the skill of all persons on wheels is abysmal, as motorbikes and cars only took over from the humble pushbike in the early 90's. Imagine 80 million people driving and riding like they are still on a pushbike! They do, as anyone who has lived there can attest. There are no rules and no respect and accidents are nasty ugly daily affairs. (14,000 road users killed in the first 9 months in Vietnam in 2008).

In honesty most Thai drivers are better (IMHO) than their counterparts around them in SE Asia.

The fact is LESS accidents happen in general and to motorbikes in particular on freeways because they are mono-directional. Most motorbikes get taken out by cars on the wrong side of the road, themselves on the wrong side of the road by bad riding, by turning across traffic or having traffic turn in front of us.

So really the freeway is the safest place for us to co-exist.

Yes we buzz around for sure... but speed, braking and vision are our assets: the lack of armour our weakness.

Keep an eye out for us!

Cheers Onnut!

I do not think I could handle Vietnam, that sounds really bad. 14000 ! I count my lucky stars that I am in Thailand then. hey by the way, I have just started another thread in the Motor Forum about this topic just to see what other car drivers think about you guys riding on the freeways. feel free to state your case there as well.

I must admit, your point about cars and bikes riding in one direction does make sense. no reason to be changing lanes if there is nowhere to go I suppose.

[Lagoud]

I think the original question was how to avoid BKK expressways and traffic, so:

Coming from the North: Just South of Saraburi take a left on R33 to Nakhon Nayok, right on R319 to Prachin Buri and then South on R331 to Sattahip/Rayong and break off to Pattaya. Nice and easy, quick and avoids BKK all together. reverse route to head back up North.

To cut across South BKK: Here are some directions from another forum:

"You can get to the ferry by going down Sukhumvit 50 (Tesco Lotus, On Nut) and turning left at the tee-junction onto the 3114. Careful if you go early, though, as it is one-way against you till 0900 to ease rush hour traffic. The 3114 is vaguely interesting as it is the dock road and takes you past a bit of industry and the odd naval ship.

The second traffic lights you come to allow you to turn right onto the 3113 (clearly signposted). This road is still quite industrial and you will see at least one place restoring big bikes if you look to the right. At the end of the 3113 is a slip road to a perfectly servicable bridge. You are not allowed on it, though, so carry on to the end of the road where the ferry awaits you."

Most of the ferries in this area cross over to Suksawat Road from where you can get onto Rama II and turn left to go South to Petchaburi etc....

Hope this helps.