Thai Wife Must Buy Plane Ticket For Irish Visa Application.

[mountainman]

Hi,

I'm applying for a long stay visa for my Thai wife. I'm living in Ireland and am a UK/Irish national with UK passport.

She has visited the Irish Embassy in Bangkok with all the paperwork, but is now being told she must buy a plane ticket before they can process the application. No mention of this on the Irish INIS website! So she must travel to Bangkok again later. I had triple checked that we had done everything correctly, and now they tell us she needs to buy a ticket before they process her visa.

Seems very odd. What if the visa is refused? Is it possible to buy a refundable open ended or one way plane ticket?

Thanks for any help,

:-)

[spongeman]

That must be something new, I have never heard of that for a spousal or settlement visa. They do ask for it for tourist visas though, as it is for a set time.

I guess you would need to make sure its a changeable ticket you buy her ?

[MJo]

If you go thru travel agents in Bangkok they can book confirmed seat for you but you do not need to pay it right away. Only few days before the actual flight.

This might do the trick unless they are asking for paid ticket for them to see. In that case make sure the ticket class allows re-booking and full refund.

[mountainman]

Thanks. Yes, booking a refundable is something I'll look into.

Being able to book a flight without paying straight away sounds ideal. I'm speaking to my wife later and we'll discuss it.

MJo, your avatar made me laugh!

:-)

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Thanks. Yes, booking a refundable is something I'll look into.

Being able to book a flight without paying straight away sounds ideal. I'm speaking to my wife later and we'll discuss it.

MJo, your avatar made me laugh!

:-)

It sounds crazy. Good luck.

[apetley]

Thanks. Yes, booking a refundable is something I'll look into.

Being able to book a flight without paying straight away sounds ideal. I'm speaking to my wife later and we'll discuss it.

MJo, your avatar made me laugh!

:-)

It sounds crazy. Good luck.

Well it is an Irish visa!

[zzaa09]

I believe this is standard protocol for all visa apps, even UK settlement visas.

[Mossfinn]

but is now being told she must buy a plane ticket before they can process the application.

I find this a little strange MM, why not give them a call, the one in London I have found helpful in the past.

Visa Office

Line 1:

Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service

Line 2:

13-14 Burgh Quay

Line 5:

Dublin 2

County:

Dublin

Country:

IRELAND

Opening Hours:

Mon, Wed, Fri 10.00 a.m. - 12.30 p.m.

Tel:

+ 353 (0)1 6167700

Locall:

1890 551 500

Homepage:

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/WP07000015

Email:

[email protected]

And in the Uk, who I found very helpful

Embassy of Ireland

Passport and Visa Office

Montpellier House

106 Brompton Road

London

SW3 1JJ

020 7225 7700

020 7225 7778 Fax

www.dfa.ie

Edited July 30, 2009 by Mossfinn

[Mossfinn]

I believe this is standard protocol for all visa apps, even UK settlement visas.

10 DOCUMENTS

As we cannot tell in advance how long it will take to decide

particular cases, our general advice is not to make any non urgent

travel arrangements until your passport(s) or travel

document(s) are returned.

Extract from the UK Settlement guidelines

[mountainman]

Thanks for all the responses.

I'll give them a call and try to clarify this.

[theoldgit]

For Schengen Area countries, of which Ireland is not a member, they ask for flight details but the original tickets only need to be shown when picking up a visa that has been granted.

The Irish Government's Immigration website certainly doesn't list confirmed flight reservations in the list of required documents, though it does say that certain offices might impose extra requirements. http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/Visit_Holiday_Visa

[7by7]

I'm applying for a long stay visa for my Thai wife. I'm living in Ireland and am a UK/Irish national with UK passport.

As you are an EEA national (UK) living in another EEA state (Ireland) your wife is entitled to an EEA family permit. This is free, and EEA rules say applications must be processed with the minimum of delay.

See this page for some FAQs on the procedure from the INIS.

[spongeman]

I think they have it wrong. I have done family reunification/spousal visas for people coming here and they were never asked for a plane ticket. They got their ticket after they got the visa.

[Thongkorn]

I believe this is standard protocol for all visa apps, even UK settlement visas.

I dont think that this is true, How can you buy i ticket when you dont know if you will be granted a visa

,and when . if this is true then i have dipped out because i have submited my wifes File for a settlement visa without a ticket , all i put was if and when the visa is granted i will buy a ticket.

[Thongkorn]

I believe this is standard protocol for all visa apps, even UK settlement visas.

I dont think that this is true, How can you buy i ticket when you dont know if you will be granted a visa

,and when . if this is true then i have dipped out because i have submited my wifes File for a settlement visa without a ticket , all i put was if and when the visa is granted i will buy a ticket.

[theoldgit]

I believe this is standard protocol for all visa apps, even UK settlement visas.

I dont think that this is true, How can you buy i ticket when you dont know if you will be granted a visa

,and when . if this is true then i have dipped out because i have submited my wifes File for a settlement visa without a ticket , all i put was if and when the visa is granted i will buy a ticket.

You are correct, it isn't true.

The French, for a Schengen ask for details of your proposed travel plans to be submitted with the application and advise that you will need to show them confirmed return flights when you collect the visa, though they didn't ask my girlfriend for her tickets when she collected her visa a couple of weeks ago.

UK Visas specifically advise against purchasing a ticket before any visa is issued, though they again ask you supply a proposed itinerary if available.

I suppose at the end of the day if you don't have a ticket you will not make the trip, if you don't have a return ticket you could be denied entry at the proposed destination or possibly even denied boarding at the point of departure.

I am very suprised that the Irish officials have decided to implement this policy.

[spongeman]

I think that somebody in the consulate over there does'nt know what they are talking about.

Very bizzare.

Edited July 31, 2009 by spongeman

[gerard50]

Hi,

I'm applying for a long stay visa for my Thai wife. I'm living in Ireland and am a UK/Irish national with UK passport.

She has visited the Irish Embassy in Bangkok with all the paperwork, but is now being told she must buy a plane ticket before they can process the application. No mention of this on the Irish INIS website! So she must travel to Bangkok again later. I had triple checked that we had done everything correctly, and now they tell us she needs to buy a ticket before they process her visa.

Seems very odd. What if the visa is refused? Is it possible to buy a refundable open ended or one way plane ticket?

Thanks for any help,

:-)

I think you have to show embassy that you have ticket reservation, I have the same problems with the Dutch Embassy.

Gerard

[john321]

We applied 2 times for an Irish visa. I am a Dutch national, living in Ireland.

For the first visa request, we needed to have an actual booking, and paid for. I made arrangements with the travel agency that we could get a refund if the visa would be refused. This gave no problems. The first visa+appeal were refused.

For the second visa application we did not file the travel documentation and they didnot asked for it.

They have different requirements for a tourist visa or a spouse visa.

At the end, my wife got an EU_Treaty application visa. This means that she could be in Ireland to make the application for her EU Treaty rights (She had to be physically present in Ireland). She got these rights after 6 months.

Ireland and the UK are both no part of the Schengen agreement, and UK nationals cannot request in Ireland for an EU treaty visa. But, because of agreements between Ireland and the UK, UK nationals can only apply according to the national Irish standards, which are not very encouraging for Asian woman. This, there are the national rules and the eu-rules. The last ones are not applicable for Irish and UK citizens. Another thing is that they have a list with all sorts of requirements they can ask from, based on their judgements. This is not a public list and they dont give you any information about that list. (It took me a long while to find out that I were supposed to have 3 different face-to-face meetings with her INSIDE Thailand. I went 4 times during 1 year).

I learned a lot about the Irish by looking at the visa decision list on the INIS website. It tels a lot about their way of thinking and their way to make it as hard as possible. Ashame.

[7by7]

Ireland and the UK are both no part of the Schengen agreement, and UK nationals cannot request in Ireland for an EU treaty visa.

True, neither the UK nor the RoI are signed up to the Schengen agreement; but the Schengen agreement has nothing to do with EEA treaty rights.

Both the UK and the RoI are full members of the EU/EEA and so their citizens have the same treaty rights as any other EEA national; and that includes the right to an EEA family permit for their non-EEA spouse.

[blakegeee]

When my GF came to Canada with a tourist visa she needed to show a "confirmed flight". It doesn't cost a travel agent anything to make this "itinerary" for you. Then after they print it for you they can just cancel it right away. Just explain why you need it and I am sure they will do it for you for a small fee. I had a travel agent friend in CM and they did it for us for free since it cost them nothing.

[spongeman]

Mmmm. Two interesting cases here, both linked by the fact that the spouses of the applicants are not Irish, yet they are applying from Ireland. I also know of a Frenchman living here who married a girl from Japan in Dublin, yet she was not given permission to stay. I have never heard of the spouse of anybody Irish being asked for a plane ticket, and maybe this is the reason why.

Edited August 2, 2009 by spongeman

[Mossfinn]

I have never heard of the spouse of anybody Irish being asked for a plane ticket, and maybe this is the reason why.

Neither have I and perhaps you may have solved the anomaly, I was never asked for a confirmed ticket for the wife, worth an enquiry, I think.

[spongeman]

I have never heard of the spouse of anybody Irish being asked for a plane ticket, and maybe this is the reason why.

Neither have I and perhaps you may have solved the anomaly, I was never asked for a confirmed ticket for the wife, worth an enquiry, I think.

Moss further to that, in general although marriage to an Irish Citizen does not automatically confer citizenship rights, nearly every time there is no problem getting a residence visa, unlike the UK where it appears to be more stringent.

[bangla]

everybody is talking about a holiday visa but the original question is about a long stay visa.

Hi,

I'm applying for a long stay visa for my Thai wife.

I'm living in Ireland and am a UK/Irish national with UK passport.

local irish laws do not apply here, only EU law.

[spongeman]

everybody is talking about a holiday visa but the original question is about a long stay visa.

Hi,

I'm applying for a long stay visa for my Thai wife.

I'm living in Ireland and am a UK/Irish national with UK passport.

local irish laws do not apply here, only EU law.

The holiday visa was mentioned earlier as anybody coming to Ireland on a tourist visa has to show a ticket, with a return date on it. The sponsor in Ireland will be phoned by immigration police at the Airport to verify this.

However the spouse of Irish citizen coming for long term does not have to show same.

I think you will find that Ireland tends to do its own thing in relation to immigration as opposed to the EU,

hence the OP's difficulties, as he is not Irish.

[7by7]

The RoI is a member of the EU and so has no choice over the matter. They must follow EU rules/law and allow citizens of other member states their full treaty rights, and this includes family permits.

If they are denying people their treaty rights then I'm sure someone wpuld have taken the Irish government to court over this issue by now!

[owen01]

I've been through this myself ... I think it breaks down as follows

1. A confirmed booking (rather than an actual ticket) is required so as to match the date for the entry to Ireland - it was possible for me to get this in Bangkok without payment - but my wife found it difficult to convince a travel agent to do it - (a bit of an example of thais giving other thais a hard time ?). This is further complicated by the fact that many proported travel agents do not supply tickets but just act as intermediaries between the customers and "real" (ie. ticket issuing) agents - it is these "real" agents that can make bookings with the airlines, and print off the appropriate confirmation.

2. The embassy in Bangkok is not infact an embassy but merely a consulate - a lawyers office performing front office tasks for the embassy in KL. as such the girls there are usually performing a box-ticking exercise and have no discretion over the requirements set by KL - even when they don't necessarily apply to your particular situation.

3. Your wifes initial visa to Ireland will be a single-entry spousal visa - after she has registered with the GNIB in Burgh Quay and been issued with a GNIB card, then she will be able to get an additional multiple-entry visa added into her passport (at another desk in the same location) - this visa will last until the expiry of her passport.

Also - I don't think that your UK passport matters - it is your Irish citizenship that entitles your wife to come to Ireland - not your passport. If we can assume that your cizitenship is being granted with through you or one of your parents being born in Ireland.

From http://www.dfa.ie/home/index.aspx?id=267

Every person born on the island of Ireland before 1 January, 2005 is entitled to be an Irish citizen. ...Under the Irish Nationality and Citizenship Acts, 1956 to 2004, a person who was born outside Ireland is automatically an Irish citizen by descent if one of that person's parents was an Irish citizen who was born in Ireland.

Best of luck

Owen

Edited August 3, 2009 by owen01

[mountainman]

I've been through this myself ... I think it breaks down as follows

1. A confirmed booking (rather than an actual ticket) is required so as to match the date for the entry to Ireland - it was possible for me to get this in Bangkok without payment - but my wife found it difficult to convince a travel agent to do it - (a bit of an example of thais giving other thais a hard time ?). This is further complicated by the fact that many proported travel agents do not supply tickets but just act as intermediaries between the customers and "real" (ie. ticket issuing) agents - it is these "real" agents that can make bookings with the airlines, and print off the appropriate confirmation.

Thanks very much. I've read all the replies and appreciate everyone's help.

I 'phoned DFA and they advise people NOT to buy tickets before a visa is issued, and could not understand why the Consulate in Bangkok would request one. So we concluded there must be a mistake, and I said I'd ring them to clarify. (A little awkward, as they open from 2.30AM to 6.30AM Irish time, and there was no reply for 45 minutes. Just kept hitting redial every 5 minutes while watching YouTube...:-)). Eventually got through to a helpful enough Thai lady who explained that a "Provisional Booking", one way, was all that was required, NOT an actual ticket. A travel agent would do it free or for a tiny fee, 50 baht, she said.

Your point about finding a "real" agent is noted! My wife said she could get a provisional booking but it would cost 20% of the full fare. This is why I wanted clarification. She must have seen an 'intermediary'. I'll let her know tomorrow that she needs to find an appropriate agent and it shouldn't cost more than 50 baht, if not for free.

If anyone knows of such an agent in Bangkok, I'd be very grateful if you'd let me know. I'm going to post a new thread now and ask. It's very awkward for my wife to travel around Bangkok, so it would be great if she knew exactly where to go.

Thanks again everyone who posted. Hopefully, she will get a visa after all the effort put into the application.