House Registration

[ZOOKA]

Hi

My Thai Co (Cough Cough) currently own the land which my house sits and is registered at the address.

As my Thai Co own the land and hopefully all structures on the land???

DO I NEED TO REGISTER THE HOUSE AT THE LAND DEPT?

Most of the farang on my estate have not registered their houses with the Land Dept as they believe it attracts UNWANTED ATTENTION from this dept. The developer just registers the land transfer to the new owner to save money and forgets to mention the property. He avoids paying the tax on the house.

We are looking at about 100 + properties. When I challenged him on this he stated as long as the land is registered in your name at the Land Dept thats it!!

We all have house Numbers then does this mean the house is registered. If so what document do they use for this? Construction permit?

I have all documents to prove the house is mine (Thai Co) Bill of sale, Contract from developer to build the house, Chanote, Yellow Book in my name / Blue Book Thai Co, Construction permit. So believe this is adequate?

Any feedback greatly appreciated!

[PattayaParent]

Your 'house number' is more likley to be the plot number of the land.

If the house is shown on the Chanot then it's registered.

[ZOOKA]

Your 'house number' is more likley to be the plot number of the land.

If the house is shown on the Chanot then it's registered.

Plot No was something like 102. Address along the lines of 2/ 133.

How can the developer give the house No? Surely this must come from Government/Municple or Land Dept?

No house shown on the chanote. I guess when you register the house the chanote gets updated or renewed?

We have just looked at the construction permit. It just says that JOHN SMITH CO wish to build a 2 story house on the land of Chanote Serial No ****** owned by JOHN SMITH CO. No mention of address just city and district. Obviously house address and registration dont come from this permit.

Just interested to see if anyone with a Thai Co has been successfull in registering their house at the Land Dept or maybe best to keep stum!! As long as the chanote shows your Co as the owner then maybe thats the best you can do in LOS!!

[stgrhe]

You can find all information you need on the subject matter from Thailand Law On-line (http://www.thailandlawonline.com/Thai_house_transfer.html). The text is copied below for your convenience.

Hence, you prove your ownership of the structures, i.e. house etc., by either the building permit or the land title document with the dwellings registered on it at the Land Office.

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Buy, sale and transfer of a Thai house or building (property law)

A house/ building as distinct from its land in Thailand can be owned and transferred separate from its land, however, Thai houses (apart from condominiums) do not have any form of title document. A house separate from its land is an immovable property under Thai law. Transfer of ownership of immovable property must be in writing and registered at the competent authority (i.e. the Land Department).

A Ta.Bian.Baan or Tabien Bahn is an administratative document which gives the address of the house and states the persons who live in it (it could state the name of the owner but not necessarily). There are 2 types of Ta Bian Baan: 1 The blue Ta Bian Baan (Thor.Ror.14) for Thai nationals and 2 the yellow Ta Bian Baan (Thor.Ror.13) for foreigners. Non resident foreigners can usually only be registered as the owner of the house in a yellow book.

The house book is not proof of ownership, but merely an administrative document issued by the local Amphur.

When a foreigner buys a real estate property in Thailand, the land part is generally sold under a lease agreement (as foreigners can't own the land) and the house upon the land is sold separate from the land. In this case a land lease agreement and a sale and purchase agreement for the house is drawn up specifying the terms and conditions of the lease and sale. The lease must be registered at the land department and the official transfer process for the house must be followed (at the Land Department).

When buying in a development 'off the plan' instead of a sale agreement a building or construction agreement could be offered (i.e. the building permit should in this case be issued in the foreign purchaser's name). I any case, lease of land and house is the least beneficial structure for foreigners and legally the weakest structure. Ownership over the house must be obtained and preferably combined with a registered right of superficies specifying the foreigner's rights to own the house upon the land.

Ownership of a house in Thailand is obtained without registering a separate right of superficies and a right of superficies is not required to obtain ownership. This is in the first place the building permit in the foreigner's name, or the official sale agreement as administrated at the local land office).

The superficies specifies the foreigner's rights to the land and offers additional protection. Rights of ownership of a building upon someone else's land relates directly to the rights to use or possess someone else's land (i.e. if you loose your rights (right of superficies, lease rights, right of usufruct) you loose the rights to own the building upon that land). When building a house upon someone else's land an additional right of superficies does offer greater protection (e.g. you could lose your rights under a land lease agreement, but your rights under the right of superficies could remain enforceable).

<h2 class="style6" align="justify">The official process of transferring an existing house in Thailand</h2>

• The parties must present themselves at the local land office to announce the sale. This is part of the official process and separate from the private sale and purchase agreement between the parties (if a party can't attend the land office (e.g. the foreigner is abroad) a proxy can be appointed. In this case the official land office power of attorney form (document Tor-Dor 21) is required)
  
• Documents required: Tor-Dor 21 (if applicable), building permit or previous land office sale agreement, Ta bian Baan, ID's of the parties (passport or ID-card)
  
• The land office will issue 4 copies of the notification of the sale of a structure ( public notice), to be put up at the Or Bor Tor, the District Office, the Kamnan Office and at the building itself for a 30-day announcement (to see if anyone wishes to contest ownership)
  
• After the 30 days public notice period the parties must present themselves again to sign the official land office sale agreement which effectively transfers ownership.
  

Proof of ownership of the house can be either the official land office sale agreement, as signed at the land office, or the construction permit in the owner's name.

• Order a Land Lease agreement
  
• Order a Right of Superficies agreement
  
• Order a Right of Usufruct agreement
  
• Order a construction agreement
  

[InterestedObserver]

Looks like you have enough documents with your name on them that nobody can dispute your occupancy of the house. As to whether or not the house is registered in your name, only the local land office can answer that question. But is it worth stirring the pot, so to speak? This is not a good time for a farang to go asking questions, especially since the land owner is a "Thai Co (Cough Cough)".

[ZOOKA]

Some good Info chaps Thanks!

Maybe not the right time for Thai Cos at the Land Dept with the current climate.

Maybe never the Right Time?

I just wandered IF IT WAS POSSIBLE / REQUIRED TO REGISTER THE HOUSE IF THE THAI CO OWNED THE LAND???

AND IF ANYONE HAS MANAGED TO DO THIS??

[InterestedObserver]

You could not register the house in you name unless you first secure land rights to the property; i.e. a 30 year lease from the land owner, your Thai company. The land office will not register a house on land that belongs to somebody else. You don't own the land, your Thai company does. Yes, it has been reported in this Forum as being accomplished.

Edited August 22, 2009 by InterestedObserver

[ZOOKA]

You could not register the house in you name unless you first secure land rights to the property; i.e. a 30 year lease from the land owner, your Thai company. The land office will not register a house on land that belongs to somebody else. You don't own the land, your Thai company does.

I think that you may have answered my question unless anyone else has got an alternative.

That may well be one of the reasons why foreigners with the Thai Co never register the house. Easiar to leave alone, not meddle and attract unwanted attention from the authorities.

Just exploring my avenues and wanted everything water tight and correctly registered. As Im MD of the Co I think the 30 yr lease would hopefully be a paper work exercise with the help of a notary. I will investiage the cost and proceedure.

Another point is that I have also presumed that the Thai Co owned all structures on its land so maybe thats another reason why farang never register the house?

Cheers

[Maestro]

…We have just looked at the construction permit. It just says that JOHN SMITH CO wish to build a 2 story house on the land of Chanote Serial No ****** owned by JOHN SMITH CO…

With the construction permit in the name of the Thai Co, this company is obviously the owner of the house. I don’t know if there is a legal requirement to get the house recorded on the chanote when the land owner (Thai Co) builds a house on the land. There probably is, but until the house is sold or leased out the practical necessety does not seem to arise.

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Maestro