Is This A Thai Banking Scam Or What?

[jesimps]

For the last couple of months I've been having a bit of battle with Nationwide in the England about the maximum daily withdrawal amount from ATMs in Thailand. In two months, apart from two occasions, I've only been allowed to take a maximum of 10,000 baht from dozens of machines I've tried here in Pattaya and in Bangkok.

Nationwide have been assuring me that I'm entitled to draw up to 300 GBP per day, regardless of the country and they ephasised that this applies also to Thailand. They suggested that it may be the local banks that put on this limit, but because if I tried to withdraw more than 10,000 baht I was getting a message something like "This transaction is invalid, please contact your bank", I was convinced that it was Nationwide who were applying the restriction. Now I've had a letter from Nationwide in which they sound very sincere, assuring me that there is no restriction and that they'll be very happy to let me have up to the maximum withdrawal in Thailand.

Could it be that the banks have altered their machines to refer you to your own bank if you press the "other amount" button, only paying out if you hit one of the buttons up to 10,000 baht? This obviously means that you have to make more withdrawals and in the process, pay more 150 baht fees.

Even with an exchange rate of 54 baht to the pound say, you should be able to withdraw up to 15,000 baht plus the 150 baht fee and still be comfortably within the 300GBP limit. I know that I can take my passport into my bank and withdraw my money that way but it doesn't suit me, therefore I'd be grateful if you wouldn't suggest this method of withdrawal.

Your thoughts and comments would be appreciated.

[Morden]

I have experienced similar problems from time to time. There are two things that you need to bear in mind:

1. Thai ATM's tell lies. The messages that you might see when cash is refused don't even attempt to tell you the true reason.

2. When you ask Nationwide or any other UK bank a question about your problem you have to make sure it's the right question. If you ask about the ATM limit, they will tell you - but they may not check to see whether your card has been blocked.

There are three limits on individual and daily total limits: by the Thai bank that owns the ATM, by the Thai banking system, by your own bank. That's what a UK bank told me on the 'phone. Some ATM's here will have a low limit for individual withdrawals but allow you to enter the system again immediately and get more cash (there goes another THB150). Others have the same low limit per transaction and per day. If that's lower than your bank allows, tough. I suspect that the withdrawal fee and the local ATM limits might be linked!

There's something else, and this is why you have to ask your bank the right question. UK bank systems occasionally panic when a card is used in Thailand. Sooner or later, the system will refuse an ATM withdrawal for security reasons. You won't be able to get cash anywhere when this happens. You must call your bank in the UK and ask them to reset your card. That doesn't stop the same thing from happening again in the future. The Thai ATM doesn't tell you that you are locked out of your account by your own bank for security reasons. Instead, a message such as the one you have seen appears. Another message suggests that there is a systems error, sending you running around to find an ATM that works. I once got a message to say that there was no receipt paper in the ATM, even though it had not asked me whether I wanted a receipt. As it happened, the ATM was opened for checking minutes later and there was a complete roll of paper in there - more than enough for a family dinner table, in fact.

[Springman]

For the last couple of months I've been having a bit of battle with Nationwide in the England about the maximum daily withdrawal amount from ATMs in Thailand. In two months, apart from two occasions, I've only been allowed to take a maximum of 10,000 baht from dozens of machines I've tried here in Pattaya and in Bangkok.

Nationwide have been assuring me that I'm entitled to draw up to 300 GBP per day, regardless of the country and they ephasised that this applies also to Thailand. They suggested that it may be the local banks that put on this limit, but because if I tried to withdraw more than 10,000 baht I was getting a message something like "This transaction is invalid, please contact your bank", I was convinced that it was Nationwide who were applying the restriction. Now I've had a letter from Nationwide in which they sound very sincere, assuring me that there is no restriction and that they'll be very happy to let me have up to the maximum withdrawal in Thailand.

Could it be that the banks have altered their machines to refer you to your own bank if you press the "other amount" button, only paying out if you hit one of the buttons up to 10,000 baht? This obviously means that you have to make more withdrawals and in the process, pay more 150 baht fees.

Even with an exchange rate of 54 baht to the pound say, you should be able to withdraw up to 15,000 baht plus the 150 baht fee and still be comfortably within the 300GBP limit. I know that I can take my passport into my bank and withdraw my money that way but it doesn't suit me, therefore I'd be grateful if you wouldn't suggest this method of withdrawal.

Your thoughts and comments would be appreciated.

[Springman]

I too have a Nation wide card andI am restricted to 10,000 Baht. That is what the Thai banks to to stop you loosing too much cash should your card be stolen. I totally agree with this. You can withdraw inside the bank for free or make your purchases in anyof the big supermarkets without getting ripped off with a 5% surcharge like you do with small shopk keepers.

[lopburi3]

I have not used an overseas card for many years but what used to happen is that if no contact could be made with your bank you would get invalid transaction, call your bank or such (depending on the ATM) but you could obtain 10,000 baht without your bank approval (suspect that was a Plus System agreement). It sounds as if that might be the problem.

[Carib]

So what makes this a scam??? Why drag `scam` into the theatre??

[Naam]

So what makes this a scam??? Why drag `scam` into the theatre??

in this forum ranting and whining in combination with thai bashing is en vogue. the simple reason is that most Farangs who indulge in this activity hail from highly civilised and cultured countries where nobody makes mistakes. many of them (read the hundreds of postings) are planning to move to neighbouring countries (such as Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos) where they find a highly developed infrastructure, non-corrupt government officials with high integrity, culture and all the other goodies they were used to enjoy in their home countries.

[prakhonchai nick]

I was restricted to 10,000bt last week on both of my Nationwide cards at the GSB ATM but that may have been because they could only dispense 500bt notes and 20 notes is the maximum they can dispense.

However when I re-entered the cards for another 5000bt I was refused. Straight round to the GSB bank branch where they have another ATM, and this time no problem.

In Buriram BIG C 2 weeks ago, both Aeon and GSB refused me money. I reluctantly tried the K bank ATM which would accept my card but politely informed me that they only had 500bt notes (therefore max 10,000bt for my 150bt fee) Across the way I had exactly the same result from SCB. Eventually it was Bangkok Bank ATM that was able to dispense 15000bt

[jesimps]

So what makes this a scam??? Why drag `scam` into the theatre??

I actually asked if it was a scam and asked for opinions. Of course, you sunshiners are always hovering waiting for someone to dare criticise the local setup, where all dealings are straight down the middle.

If the local banks were only paying up to 10,000 because it enabled them to received more 'donations' of 150 baht, then that to me would be bordering on a scam. Just wondered if it was happening to other people so that I have some idea of who is placing the restriction on my withdrawals.

And to reply to a certain other person on here, who seems to take great pleasure in winding people up and who thinks he's the only farang who appreciates living in Thailand: I've lived here for 3 years; I'm married to a Thai and I love Thailand. I do however reserve the right to question certain local practices here and to ask for advice on this forum.

[Naam]

And to reply to a certain other person on here, who seems to take great pleasure in winding people up and who thinks he's the only farang who appreciates living in Thailand: I've lived here for 3 years; I'm married to a Thai...

is that perhaps your problem?

[Carmine6]

...or make your purchases in any of the big supermarkets without getting ripped off with a 5% surcharge like you do with small shopk keepers.

What kind of rate do you get on these types of purchases relative to the ATM rate? Once in a while I use a card for something but it nets maybe 1% to 2% less, although I've never used an ATM card, just credit cards.

[Naam]

I too have a Nation wide card andI am restricted to 10,000 Baht. That is what the Thai banks to to stop you loosing too much cash should your card be stolen. I totally agree with this. You can withdraw inside the bank for free or make your purchases in anyof the big supermarkets without getting ripped off with a 5% surcharge like you do with small shopk keepers.

5% surcharge? but that's terrible! my heart goes out for anybody who is ripped off that way

[Briggsy]

Nothing you have said suggests this is "a Thai banking scam".

I suggest you PM the mods and get the title changed to "Photos of scantily clad sweet young things" as it would be no less relevant.

Go into the branch and withdraw the 500,000 or whatever you need over the counter with no fee too.

[Naam]

Nothing you have said suggests this is "a Thai banking scam".

I suggest you PM the mods and get the title changed to "Photos of scantily clad sweet young things" as it would be no less relevant.

Go into the branch and withdraw the 500,000 or whatever you need over the counter with no fee too.

hey Briggsy! nice to notice you possess humour

[jesimps]

And to reply to a certain other person on here, who seems to take great pleasure in winding people up and who thinks he's the only farang who appreciates living in Thailand: I've lived here for 3 years; I'm married to a Thai...

is that perhaps your problem?

Hello soft lad, you still here? Surprised the mods haven't thrown you off by now for disrupting any thread that's ever been started on these boards. Still, s'pose when you sit at the computer all day every day, you have little else to do but pass sarcastic comments. Maybe one of these days you'll surprise us all by posting a reply that actually helps someone.

Overly optimistic of me to hope that all the replies would be helpful, but thanks to those who did offer sensible comments. To those who didn't, especially 'He who shall not be naamed", please go and get laid, it'll probably make you less bitter and twisted.

If you can't think of a suitable reply, I'm sure there're plenty of spelling mistakes here that you can jump on. Oh! And by the way, I probably won't be able to read your sarcy reply for a while because I have a life and can't be arsed to sit at the computer all day.

[rkidlad]

All banks are awful. Thai banks on the other hand are completely foreign to me. I had to pay for my ATM card. The interest rate is awful and I have to pay money to withdraw money from my own bank's ATM outside of Bkk. (I think it's anywhere outside of Bkk, I've been charged everywhere I've been)

Also there is some rule where you can only withdraw from Thai banks outside of your own twice a month before being charged. My girlfriend told me everyone here knows this and just accept it. Okay, I accept this. All I want is a simple message "You will be charged 5 Baht for making this transaction. Do you wish to continue?"

Call me old fashioned but I like to know every time a bank wants to sting me; even if is only 5 Baht!

As for you original post - you should be able to dictate how much you withdraw. The bank try to protect you from thieves by limiting your with-drawls but I think you can tell them how you want it to be.

[roiethome]

HSBC Singapore ATM card regularly dispenses 40K per day no problem. Does not sound like a Thai bank scam

[kevkev1888]

Use Bank of Ayudaia (spelling) the yellow ATM's lots of them arround and NO 150 baht charge with Nationwide card.

Also I have no problems drawing up to £300 on my nationwide card but have had their security dept block card on a few occasions, they have told me withdrawalls near the £300 daily limit can trigger this.

[aurelius]

All banks are awful. Thai banks on the other hand are completely foreign to me. I had to pay for my ATM card. The interest rate is awful and I have to pay money to withdraw money from my own bank's ATM outside of Bkk. (I think it's anywhere outside of Bkk, I've been charged everywhere I've been)

But consider the upside as well...

- anyone can open a bank a/c in Thailand (not like the US where significant parts of the population are denied basic banking services)

- no minimum balance required

- no monthly fees, no account keeping fees (only one that kicks in if the a/c is dormant over 12 months)

They have to make money somewhere - "user pays" is better than unilateral fees in my view for a developing nation. Charges for using foreign ATMs are at least 2 dollars in some countries - 5 bt - is not even with doing the accounting for.

[personchester]

For the last couple of months I've been having a bit of battle with Nationwide in the England about the maximum daily withdrawal amount from ATMs in Thailand. In two months, apart from two occasions, I've only been allowed to take a maximum of 10,000 baht from dozens of machines I've tried here in Pattaya and in Bangkok.

Nationwide have been assuring me that I'm entitled to draw up to 300 GBP per day, regardless of the country and they ephasised that this applies also to Thailand. They suggested that it may be the local banks that put on this limit, but because if I tried to withdraw more than 10,000 baht I was getting a message something like "This transaction is invalid, please contact your bank", I was convinced that it was Nationwide who were applying the restriction. Now I've had a letter from Nationwide in which they sound very sincere, assuring me that there is no restriction and that they'll be very happy to let me have up to the maximum withdrawal in Thailand.

Could it be that the banks have altered their machines to refer you to your own bank if you press the "other amount" button, only paying out if you hit one of the buttons up to 10,000 baht? This obviously means that you have to make more withdrawals and in the process, pay more 150 baht fees.

Even with an exchange rate of 54 baht to the pound say, you should be able to withdraw up to 15,000 baht plus the 150 baht fee and still be comfortably within the 300GBP limit. I know that I can take my passport into my bank and withdraw my money that way but it doesn't suit me, therefore I'd be grateful if you wouldn't suggest this method of withdrawal.

Your thoughts and comments would be appreciated.

I would recommend to open a Thai bank A/c, transfer a GBP lump sum into it via the banks counter, together with the requested documents and at the same time request a Thai bank ATM card and ask for a daily withdrawal limit of say 30K. and thereafter replenish you Thai bank a/c from time to time with lump sums.

That will solve any ATM problems emanating from the UK bank which may result in several emails that are not being answered instantly, or expensive phone calls, moreover, ATM withdrawal from certain Thai banks are free charge, and should there be problems a visit to nearest bank branch will solve it.

[cocopops]

So what makes this a scam??? Why drag `scam` into the theatre??

If the local banks were only paying up to 10,000 because it enabled them to received more 'donations' of 150 baht, then that to me would be bordering on a scam.

It's sometimes known as 'commerce'. Expecting Thai banks to do everything for free is called an 'entitlement complex'.

[hhgz]

"Thai ATM's tell lies."

There you go. Thanks for the in depth analysis of a non-problem.

[spacemand]

Sounds like a restriction with your ATM card.

I usually withdraw 20K or what ever the max the ATM will allow me using a Visa Electron card in US$ been using KBank, Bangkok bank, Aeon and the yellow one.

[Chaimai]

All banks are awful. Thai banks on the other hand are completely foreign to me.

Quote of the week !

[CaptainNemo]

And to reply to a certain other person on here, who seems to take great pleasure in winding people up and who thinks he's the only farang who appreciates living in Thailand: I've lived here for 3 years; I'm married to a Thai...

is that perhaps your problem?

Hello soft lad, you still here? Surprised the mods haven't thrown you off by now for disrupting any thread that's ever been started on these boards. Still, s'pose when you sit at the computer all day every day, you have little else to do but pass sarcastic comments. Maybe one of these days you'll surprise us all by posting a reply that actually helps someone.

Overly optimistic of me to hope that all the replies would be helpful, but thanks to those who did offer sensible comments. To those who didn't, especially 'He who shall not be naamed", please go and get laid, it'll probably make you less bitter and twisted.

If you can't think of a suitable reply, I'm sure there're plenty of spelling mistakes here that you can jump on. Oh! And by the way, I probably won't be able to read your sarcy reply for a while because I have a life and can't be arsed to sit at the computer all day.

I have to agree... "Naam" is not being especially witty really... but you can see by his sig that he may harbour ambitions to be a "troll lite"... so you're probably best off not taking the bait.

Edited September 4, 2009 by CaptainNemo

[nurgut73]

So what makes this a scam??? Why drag `scam` into the theatre??

in this forum ranting and whining in combination with thai bashing is en vogue. the simple reason is that most Farangs who indulge in this activity hail from highly civilised and cultured countries where nobody makes mistakes. many of them (read the hundreds of postings) are planning to move to neighbouring countries (such as Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos) where they find a highly developed infrastructure, non-corrupt government officials with high integrity, culture and all the other goodies they were used to enjoy in their home countries.

brilliant, i s**t myself laughing!!!