Now Thailand The Creative Hub

[animatic]

In the developed world the guy is still a dunce and should be wearing a tall hat and standing in a corner somewhere.

whatever and wherever the "developed" world is, the same people who should wearing a tall hat, standing in corner and shut up are given membership on TVforum and having here quite a big mouth about things they don't understand or have a clue about.

I see. So you don't agree with me, and you can't quite figure out why you felt bad about what I wrote.

In your opinion, how exactly was I wrong in what I said? Its just that apart from the uninformed abuse, you didn't actually say anything you see, so I wonder why you bothered at all.

If you don't understand the term 'developed world' then ask politely and I will hep you to be better informed, otherwise, it may be less embarrassing for you to put thick gloves on while playing with your son's computer. Or your Dad's.

Kevin don't feed the bloody trolls, they just multiply then.

[keemapoot]

The more 'hubs' they announce, the more 'crackdowns' they will have to pursue to eliminate all the fake hubs. Because nothing will destroy the world's hub central as quickly as copy hubs.

[CDB]

The initiative to promote creative industries is a very welcome idea, even if it is currently short on specifics. As economies mature, they need to be more supportive of valued added services; and become less dependent on manufacturing.

Given that they are currently spearheading the initiative under the ICT ministry (because most creative content is digital) it seems reasonable to have a new State agency. It can be cleaner to have a new agency than to wrest with the entrenched views and portfolios of older ones.

Some notable points about the promotion of creative industries:

* The participants in these industries tend to be much smaller companies (video production, advertising, animation, etc.) than Thailand is used to focusing on. Rather than trying to boost the economy by attracting massive manufacturing companies to set up here, initiatives like this are the kind of diversification that Thailand needs.

* This initiative will create a lot of opportunities for foreigners and co-owned companies. I have friends in these industries who are already planning on doing more movie production here as Thailand brings its incentives in line with other countries.

* Thailand and Thai people are more individualistic and creative than other Asian countries. It's part of the culture. There is a wealth of talent here.

Isn't it so typical of Thaivisa, that when the government tries to do something new -- and even when that initiative will be helpful to foreigners and foreign/co-owned firms -- the trolls all roll in to laugh it off. Not a single positive post! What is wrong with people?

[KevinBloodyWilson]

<snippety>

Isn't it so typical of Thaivisa, that when the government tries to do something new -- and even when that initiative will be helpful to foreigners and foreign/co-owned firms -- the trolls all roll in to laugh it off. Not a single positive post! What is wrong with people?

It's called experience of living in Thailand.

[dieter1]

:D

this makes me nearly speechless ...

for people from foreign (western) countries it´s just a never ending joke, but you can not laugh about this old one any more....

[JR Texas]

The initiative to promote creative industries is a very welcome idea, even if it is currently short on specifics. As economies mature, they need to be more supportive of valued added services; and become less dependent on manufacturing.

Given that they are currently spearheading the initiative under the ICT ministry (because most creative content is digital) it seems reasonable to have a new State agency. It can be cleaner to have a new agency than to wrest with the entrenched views and portfolios of older ones.

Some notable points about the promotion of creative industries:

* The participants in these industries tend to be much smaller companies (video production, advertising, animation, etc.) than Thailand is used to focusing on. Rather than trying to boost the economy by attracting massive manufacturing companies to set up here, initiatives like this are the kind of diversification that Thailand needs.

* This initiative will create a lot of opportunities for foreigners and co-owned companies. I have friends in these industries who are already planning on doing more movie production here as Thailand brings its incentives in line with other countries.

* Thailand and Thai people are more individualistic and creative than other Asian countries. It's part of the culture. There is a wealth of talent here.

Isn't it so typical of Thaivisa, that when the government tries to do something new -- and even when that initiative will be helpful to foreigners and foreign/co-owned firms -- the trolls all roll in to laugh it off. Not a single positive post! What is wrong with people?

The first problem, I think, is that history has shown us that govt. proclamations are just puffs of hot air from a place we would rather not talk about.

The second problem is that creativity is thwarted by the education system.

The third problem is that creativity via foreign competition is thwarted by the govt.

The reason Thailand is not Japan or S. Korea or Singapore today is because of what I just said.

Having said all that, I think it would be great for Thailand to seriously focus on creating a more diverse economy underpinned by creativity..........and guided by the principle of free competition.

The fastest way to that, IMHO, is to open the economy to foreign competition. For that to happen the entire visa/business rule system must be changed.

The anti-foreigner xenophobia also has to change..........the truth is that most foreigners come from countries that are 50 years ahead of Thailand in terms of "creativity." Thailand could take advantage of that fact...............

They already have some creative Western business models that have worked: 7-11 (yes, I know the Japanese own most of it, but it originated in the USA), Pizza Company, Subway, Starbucks, McDonald's etc.

There are many opportunities for progress in Thailand outside of the fast food industries..........the models already exist in Western countries.

[animatic]

There are many opportunities for progress in Thailand outside of the fast food industries..........the models already exist in Western countries.

Several correct assessments.

I think one thing missed in the rant countering pessimistic foreigners vis a vis

Thailand creativity in the market place, is the HARDENED to the bone nationalist bent here.

And it's effect and origin within the school system, and ongoing in a parasitic cycle.

Most Thais come by it naturally, raised in such a newly molded country, at a cultural crossroads.

There are many 'peoples' all compressed into the lable Thai People.

This was no easy homogenizing task, and in many quarters conservative is not considered finished.

How do you CREATE a country from so many different peoples, all tied to nations surrounding it?

By making the New Entity head and shoulders ABOVE all others in the people's mindset.

Make out all those who don't conform to this national uniformity as enemies or at least

lesser people in society, and thus suspect. Insert hill tribe name ____. Then keep them down.

By making the neighbors a threat to calm society, jobs and individuals wellbeing,

and hammering that message home for decades.

Create a sense of martial spirit, nationalism and orderliness from very young ages,

via mandatory; school uniforms, rote learning, scouting, 'uber-patriotic songs',

and NEVER QUESTIONING your superiors, which ties in perfectly with Kow Tow social mores.

The school system makes 'good little Thais', the AFTER school profit centers for teachers,

create passable students...if the parents can afford it.

There has been in effect a nationally sponsored mind control scheme of decades to ~CREATE THAILAND

out of 20 different peoples and vapor. And they against much odds succeeded.

Ironically the name Thai means free, but the formerly free minds,

lost that natural creative freedom during creation of the 'nation of the free'.

Ah, but at what cost?

They lost the natural unity of Siam, but that never included the major

Khemer, Lanna, Malay and Burmese components, so it had to go too.

A NEW motif was needed; THAI.

And then the past creativity was also sublimated to the needs of nation building

and cultural homogenization. SO we have 3-4 generations completely

raised within this system, and ONLY in this system, and so

when in doubt; don't improvise.

What was an easy decision for English trained Abhisit to let this young kid go to Japan,

was a horror for the ministry heads because it was so far out of their brief

they could only hem and haw and kick it up stairs. No decisions could be made.

Stasis and grid lock, because that is their training.

Creativity and freedom to make decisions is TRAINED OUT, in the schooling,

but because of this INCULCATED Nationalistic impulse AGAINST others, and individuality.

Farangs, Burmese, Khmers, Malays and tribes, all get a stifling treatment,

if not openly, yet still in the mind's eye, and officially with limited thought options about it.

Those options have been taught out of the ministry leaders minds also, because of the

over-arching, over-weening shunting from natural impulses, of the school systems nationalistic bent.

'Thai', the idea must be preserved against all encroachment.

And it is so hard to change BECAUSE all those at the top are EXAMPLES

of it's self fulfilling handy work. Rare exceptions break molds, and those often find success,

and they almost uniformly send THEIR CHILDREN to international schools or abroad.

Just to avoid this lock-step, inculcation of blind, unquestioning nationalism, and educational torpor.

And not to go against Thailand the nation and idea,

but so their KIDS can make the most of life here.

If creativity is to be taught, individuality must be taught FIRST, nay relearned.

Come on folks, the country is here now. Time to relax and build PRODUCTIVE citizens,

not just obedient ones.

Edited September 5, 2009 by animatic

[Plus]

JR Texas - what is so creative about Japan or South Korea or Singapore?

Those are probably the most collectivist countries with no thinking outside the prescribed box allowed.

There is a recognizable Japanese and South Korean "creative" waves, however.

What I see is what I said in my post on the previous page - they just try to exploit someone else's creativity deeper than any competitors, including the "creative" West itself. In many ways they are already better at this than Disney that's been cashing on the same basic formula for decades.

Everybody can do that, it's not real creativity, it's just higher degrees of copycatting.

>>

Thailand has it's own outlook on the world to work from. The stuff they produce from their traditional arts and stories is solid good, thought not entirely in tune with the new metro-sexual world. Even if it does not become a commercial success it is still capable of capturing people's hearts and imagination as it appeals to basic human emotions, albeit form a different angle, and that's where they can exploit the "creativity".

>>

To the people who complain about rote learning in Thai schools - get over it. Genetically Thais must be pretty average with the average amount of creativity genes. The education system can dampen those genes development but it's not the only factor. In some ways rebelling against that school system can give the best creativity boost ever. Same thing happened in the West decades ago, didn't it?

>>>

I have no faith in West creativity at this point anymore. It's the thing of the past, creative genes have been weeded out. It's my personal opinion, based on the lack of any inspiring ideas in any field of human knowledge in the past decade or so. The creative spunk is gone. Will Asia or Thailand in particular pick it up? I don't know. At best I think they've got a healthy reaction going on. I don't know if it is sustainable.

[SHYTALK]

Thailand is the hub of military coups.

[brahmburgers]

Thailand's best hope for creativity is to take western innovations and possibly add a few whistles or bells.

Creativity can be encouraged, to some extent, in youngsters' homes and schools, but that tradition doesn't exist in Thailand. How many Thai kids are reading books about science/art/invention/biographies of innovative thinkers - in their spare time, or anytime? They're more likely watching TV soaps or going to the mall to buy whitening cream and new covers for their mobile phones.

Since families and schools do little to encourage creativity, perhaps the powers that be would consider the following:

A. better libraries, which include areas where creative activities could take place.

B. TV shows which showcase creativity and innovation (since so many Thais are stuck on being glued to the tube). Discovery, Animal Planet, Nat'l Geo, already do that to some extent. Could Thai-based TV programmers produce similar programming?

C. contests related to creative activities. art / inventions / problem solving / music

[animatic]

There is/was an excellent Thai TV show for science buffs.

Small teams must look for clues and answer logical science tests,

and then move on to another. It was excellent because the science was good,

and the shows style encouraged children to like science and think it might be cool.

Of course it seems to have been dropped, haven't seen it i awhile.

Must have threatened some bad teachers somewhere and they complained to their puyai about it.

The producers should be put in charge of re-writing the curriculum from high school science for sure.

Here too often the cream rises top the top,

and is skimmed off and dropped down the drain.

[Chang_paarp]

Thailand's best hope for creativity is to take western innovations and possibly add a few whistles or bells.

<<snip for brevity>>

A. better libraries, which include areas where creative activities could take place.

B. TV shows which showcase creativity and innovation (since so many Thais are stuck on being glued to the tube). Discovery, Animal Planet, Nat'l Geo, already do that to some extent. Could Thai-based TV programmers produce similar programming?

C. contests related to creative activities. art / inventions / problem solving / music

A. Build some libraries, and make them available to the general populace. Make reading books cool, real books with words and pages and a cover.

B. Unforntunately the Thai TV system is,

1) You buy the airtime

2) You sell the advertising.

3) You make a programme.

This system does not include the profession of TV programmer, it is a financial transaction at a number of levels.

[jayboy]

JR Texas - what is so creative about Japan or South Korea or Singapore?

Those are probably the most collectivist countries with no thinking outside the prescribed box allowed.

There is a recognizable Japanese and South Korean "creative" waves, however.

What I see is what I said in my post on the previous page - they just try to exploit someone else's creativity deeper than any competitors, including the "creative" West itself. In many ways they are already better at this than Disney that's been cashing on the same basic formula for decades.

Everybody can do that, it's not real creativity, it's just higher degrees of copycatting.

>>

Thailand has it's own outlook on the world to work from. The stuff they produce from their traditional arts and stories is solid good, thought not entirely in tune with the new metro-sexual world. Even if it does not become a commercial success it is still capable of capturing people's hearts and imagination as it appeals to basic human emotions, albeit form a different angle, and that's where they can exploit the "creativity".

>>

To the people who complain about rote learning in Thai schools - get over it. Genetically Thais must be pretty average with the average amount of creativity genes. The education system can dampen those genes development but it's not the only factor. In some ways rebelling against that school system can give the best creativity boost ever. Same thing happened in the West decades ago, didn't it?

>>>

I have no faith in West creativity at this point anymore. It's the thing of the past, creative genes have been weeded out. It's my personal opinion, based on the lack of any inspiring ideas in any field of human knowledge in the past decade or so. The creative spunk is gone. Will Asia or Thailand in particular pick it up? I don't know. At best I think they've got a healthy reaction going on. I don't know if it is sustainable.

I'm not sure I fully understand or necessarily agree with all this (The West's creativity is still impressive) but it's so original and thought provoking (by this forum's standards) it made my hair stand on end.I"m sure Plus is on to something.The Thais are who they are -original, quirky, self confident, oddly unknowable - and it's slightly dispiriting to see how many foreigners in this thread latch on to the tired cliches.There's a great deal of original thinking among Thais and the superficial conformity mask is just that, a mask.

[Thai at Heart]

C'mon now guys, they have a virtual monopoly on creative thinking when it comes to political sagas.

No one of us could have fictitiously created the longest running soap opera in modern political history. Coups, rigged ballots, political marriages of convenience, court cases, protests, riots. It sure beats the "Bold and the Beautiful".

Edited September 6, 2009 by Thai at Heart

[animatic]

Cliche's only become so because the kernel of truth was left germinating for too long.

Tired they might be, but the question is"

are they so far out of date?

or

are they out of date, so far?

One can but hope for them to be replaced by more functional methodologies,

but the system, still at this juncture, appears entrenched.

[blunotes]

There are many opportunities for progress in Thailand outside of the fast food industries..........the models already exist in Western countries.

Several correct assessments.

I think one thing missed in the rant countering pessimistic foreigners vis a vis

Thailand creativity in the market place, is the HARDENED to the bone nationalist bent here.

And it's effect and origin within the school system, and ongoing in a parasitic cycle.

Most Thais come by it naturally, raised in such a newly molded country, at a cultural crossroads.

There are many 'peoples' all compressed into the lable Thai People.

This was no easy homogenizing task, and in many quarters conservative is not considered finished.

How do you CREATE a country from so many different peoples, all tied to nations surrounding it?

By making the New Entity head and shoulders ABOVE all others in the people's mindset.

Make out all those who don't conform to this national uniformity as enemies or at least

lesser people in society, and thus suspect. Insert hill tribe name ____. Then keep them down.

By making the neighbors a threat to calm society, jobs and individuals wellbeing,

and hammering that message home for decades.

Create a sense of martial spirit, nationalism and orderliness from very young ages,

via mandatory; school uniforms, rote learning, scouting, 'uber-patriotic songs',

and NEVER QUESTIONING your superiors, which ties in perfectly with Kow Tow social mores.

The school system makes 'good little Thais', the AFTER school profit centers for teachers,

create passable students...if the parents can afford it.

There has been in effect a nationally sponsored mind control scheme of decades to ~CREATE THAILAND

out of 20 different peoples and vapor. And they against much odds succeeded.

Ironically the name Thai means free, but the formerly free minds,

lost that natural creative freedom during creation of the 'nation of the free'.

Ah, but at what cost?

They lost the natural unity of Siam, but that never included the major

Khemer, Lanna, Malay and Burmese components, so it had to go too.

A NEW motif was needed; THAI.

And then the past creativity was also sublimated to the needs of nation building

and cultural homogenization. SO we have 3-4 generations completely

raised within this system, and ONLY in this system, and so

when in doubt; don't improvise.

What was an easy decision for English trained Abhisit to let this young kid go to Japan,

was a horror for the ministry heads because it was so far out of their brief

they could only hem and haw and kick it up stairs. No decisions could be made.

Stasis and grid lock, because that is their training.

Creativity and freedom to make decisions is TRAINED OUT, in the schooling,

but because of this INCULCATED Nationalistic impulse AGAINST others, and individuality.

Farangs, Burmese, Khmers, Malays and tribes, all get a stifling treatment,

if not openly, yet still in the mind's eye, and officially with limited thought options about it.

Those options have been taught out of the ministry leaders minds also, because of the

over-arching, over-weening shunting from natural impulses, of the school systems nationalistic bent.

'Thai', the idea must be preserved against all encroachment.

And it is so hard to change BECAUSE all those at the top are EXAMPLES

of it's self fulfilling handy work. Rare exceptions break molds, and those often find success,

and they almost uniformly send THEIR CHILDREN to international schools or abroad.

Just to avoid this lock-step, inculcation of blind, unquestioning nationalism, and educational torpor.

And not to go against Thailand the nation and idea,

but so their KIDS can make the most of life here.

If creativity is to be taught, individuality must be taught FIRST, nay relearned.

Come on folks, the country is here now. Time to relax and build PRODUCTIVE citizens,

not just obedient ones.

You're right. It would be hard to change the believe system here. Thais are not hardwired for creativity since birth. They have to think and do according to what was drawn by their superiors' comfort mainly the parents. They are brought up with a very limited ability to think for themselves and that's why art still imitates life exactly here and life still trying to imitates whatever on the imported magazines and movies but not very well.