Types Of Land Titles

[siamkiwi]

Can someone tell me where to find info on different land titles.

Particularly where a building has been built on some type of government land and has the "owner's" name registered with the local authority.

Don't just tell me it's dodgy and don't touch it with a barge pole.

Actual facts would be appreciated.

[gotlost]

Can someone tell me where to find info on different land titles.

Particularly where a building has been built on some type of government land and has the "owner's" name registered with the local authority.

Don't just tell me it's dodgy and don't touch it with a barge pole.

Actual facts would be appreciated.

Try http://www.ethailand.com/index.php?id=536 this may be of help.

[siamkiwi]

Can someone tell me where to find info on different land titles.

Particularly where a building has been built on some type of government land and has the "owner's" name registered with the local authority.

Don't just tell me it's dodgy and don't touch it with a barge pole.

Actual facts would be appreciated.

Try http://www.ethailand.com/index.php?id=536 this may be of help.

Thanks, very usefull.

[gotlost]

Can someone tell me where to find info on different land titles.

Particularly where a building has been built on some type of government land and has the "owner's" name registered with the local authority.

Don't just tell me it's dodgy and don't touch it with a barge pole.

Actual facts would be appreciated.

Try http://www.ethailand.com/index.php?id=536 this may be of help.

Thanks, very usefull.

No problem Mr. Siamkiwi

[pkrv]

Also thanks for the link - Yet more ways of spelling Chanote, Chanoot etc

"True title deeds (Chanott ti din) are indeed only to be found in the most and longest developed parts of the Thailand and account in total for only a very small proportion of all the land in the country.

Chanott titles , issued by the Provincial office of the Thai Land Department, are accurately surveyed, plotted in relation to a national survey grid and also marked by unique numbered marker posts set in the ground"

However this caught me by surprise

"The Condominium Act has recently been amended and it is now possible for 49% of the units in all condominiums and for 100% of the units in condominiums with a total development area of under 5 rai located in Bangkok, all municipal districts and such other areas as shall hereafter be announced by the Minister of the Interior (which is expected to include rural Phuket) to be foreign owned, provided always (this is unchanged) that the funds for the purchase have been remitted from aboard.

The qualification most likely to enable an alien to purchase a freehold condominium is providing evidence that the funds used for the purchase of the unit have come from abroad. Before making any large transfer relating to a condo purchase be sure to check with the vendor, your lawyer or a local bank the correct procedure for remitting funds or you may not qualify for foreign freehold."

I don't think I have seen this before.

Edited October 14, 2009 by pkrv

[donx]

Also thanks for the link - Yet more ways of spelling Chanote, Chanoot etc

"True title deeds (Chanott ti din) are indeed only to be found in the most and longest developed parts of the Thailand and account in total for only a very small proportion of all the land in the country.

Chanott titles , issued by the Provincial office of the Thai Land Department, are accurately surveyed, plotted in relation to a national survey grid and also marked by unique numbered marker posts set in the ground"

However this caught me by surprise

"The Condominium Act has recently been amended and it is now possible for 49% of the units in all condominiums and for 100% of the units in condominiums with a total development area of under 5 rai located in Bangkok, all municipal districts and such other areas as shall hereafter be announced by the Minister of the Interior (which is expected to include rural Phuket) to be foreign owned, provided always (this is unchanged) that the funds for the purchase have been remitted from aboard.

The qualification most likely to enable an alien to purchase a freehold condominium is providing evidence that the funds used for the purchase of the unit have come from abroad. Before making any large transfer relating to a condo purchase be sure to check with the vendor, your lawyer or a local bank the correct procedure for remitting funds or you may not qualify for foreign freehold."

I don't think I have seen this before.

From reading the article from the weblink and noting that it came from a different source (Phuket Land), my understanding of the 100% ownership of certain condos in Bangkok referred to in the "Legal Update" section is actually an old update which was added after the 1997 financial crisis. It is my understanding that ownership percentages for foreigners are now at 49%. Note also that the update talks about changing from 40% to 49% which was done quite awhile ago.

My guess is that this web page hasn't been updated for many years.

[pkrv]

From reading the article from the weblink and noting that it came from a different source (Phuket Land), my understanding of the 100% ownership of certain condos in Bangkok referred to in the "Legal Update" section is actually an old update which was added after the 1997 financial crisis. It is my understanding that ownership percentages for foreigners are now at 49%. Note also that the update talks about changing from 40% to 49% which was done quite awhile ago.

My guess is that this web page hasn't been updated for many years.

Hi donx - In reading your reply I agree, yes the 1997 crash 100% Farang quota, which was not true anyway, it expired when you came to sell, is the most logical explaination.

I agree the web page is WAY out of date and has sadly just added confusion.

BTW I have asked "Courtesy of William Pinsent of Phuket Land "

To update the topic you never know they may come back to us

Edited October 16, 2009 by pkrv

[pkrv]

Jeremy Khan of Phuket Land has updated the article in question this clarifies the condo issues - how about house/land ownership, are you guys happy with this definition?

http://www.ethailand.com/index.php?id=536

It looks like these guys are standing fast on the spelling/translation as Chanott ti din or short spelling Chanott

With acceptable variations

response enclosed.

"Please find attached my amendments to William's article on title.

Actually the amendments are not that major. I have stripped out references to the 1997 Sor Bor Kor scandal which was current when William first penned the article.

I imagine, the main confusion is likely to be over reference to the now elapsed temporary right of 100% foreign freehold in condominiums in municpalities. The law has for some years reverted to allow only 49%. Thus the article just states this, the current allowance.

Best regards, Jeremy Khan

Phuket Land."

Edited November 2, 2009 by pkrv

[pkrv]

Stupid of me I assumed a link what should have been posted is this

Understanding Land Titles

It is pertinent to note that by no means all land in Thailand (particularly in many of the more rural areas of the country) are titled or even surveyed to any degree of accuracy. This is especially true of the hilly and or forested sections of the country and the direct coastal lands.

Comprehensive titling cannot exist without complete land surveys and unlike many western countries the process of national land surveys is still an ongoing process in Thailand. Up until a few decades ago it was possible to simply stake a claim over a piece of jungle, register that claim and farm or otherwise develop that land (some of these claims still exist and can in some cases be converted to title deeds) but thereafter the government stopped this free-for-all and in essence claimed that all remaining untitled hillside and forested lands were Forestry Department Lands (or National Park). These new lands were never surveyed in any detail, so inevitably encroachment and ownership disputes have continued.

True title deeds (Chanott ti din ) are indeed only to be found in the most and longest developed parts of the Thailand and account in total for only a very small proportion of all the land in the country.

Chanott titles ( which are also commonly transliterated as Chanot, Chanote ) , issued by the Provincial office of the Thai Land Department, are accurately surveyed, plotted in relation to a national survey grid and also marked by unique numbered marker posts set in the ground

It is the long term goal of the Land Department, that all land in Thailand will be covered under the Chanott title system, but with currently available funds, manpower and resources this process will take several decades to complete.

Most "titles" in rural Thailand are however of the Nor. Sor. Sam or Nor Sor. Sam Kor. (N.S.3.) variety and are in the strictest interpretation "land exploration testimonial deeds". They are to all practical purposes land title deeds (issued and maintained by the Ampher , the District land office) in as much as clear records of ownership are maintained, and that they may be sold, leased, used as mortgage collateral etc. In the case of the Nor. Sor. Sam. (but not the more recently issued Nor. Sor. Sam. Kor.) There is however a requirement that 30 days public notice is necessary before any change of status over the land can be registered.

N.S.3. titles are in general less accurately surveyed than Chanott titles. In the case of the older (now increasingly rare N.S.3.) titles the boundaries are only recorded in relation to the neighboring plots and survey errors in length of boundary or area of as much as 20% are not unusual.

The newer Nor. Sor. Sam. Kor. is in general much more accurately surveyed and each plot is crossed referenced to a master survey of the area and a corresponding aerial photograph. For this reason whenever purchasing N.S.3. land which lacks clearly defined physical boundaries it is a wise precaution to ask the owner to stake out the boundaries and then ask neighboring land owners to confirm the vendors interpretation of the boundary - don't rely solely on the drawing on the deed.

The Chanott and the Nor. Sor. Sam. Kor. are the only titles over which registerable right of ownership or lease can exist, and are as such the only ones that a prudent foreigner should consider. Summaries of some of the lesser land title/claims are covered in

Below the Chanott and N.S.3. title outlined, there are a host of other forms of land claim document such as the Sor. Kor. Nung (S.K.1)., the Tor. Bor. Tor. Hoc. (T.B.T.6) and the Tor. Bor. Tor. Ha.(T.B.T.5.). These rights are essentially a form of squatter or settler's claim, which has been filed with the district office and upon which a small fee has been paid. Unlike the Chanott and N.S.3.. it is neither possible to register a sale or lease over these land rights, nor will a bank accept them for collateral and most importantly you cannot apply for (or obtain approval to) build on such land.

In certain circumstances, based on the length of the claim and the use to which the land has been put, it is possible to upgrade these land claims (to N.S.3. or Chanott title). The steps involved in such an application and the number of government departments required to approve such an application (where such approval is often discretionary) is however quite daunting and most definitely not recommended to anyone without the best of connections at the district, provincial and (in many cases) national level.

Sor. Bor Kor. titles are very different to the above claims. These are true title deeds, accurately surveyed and pegged (like a Chanott). They may be mortgaged; planning permission for development may be sought and granted. The one significant thing that may not happen with a Sor. Bor Kor, is that it may not be sold or transferred (except under last will and testament).

A condominium title (first established under the condominium act of 1979) is a title to a part of a building or buildings with multiple owners, and a fractional interest in the land (always a Chanott) and other common assets (such as a swimming pool) and common parts of the building (such as the stair well or lobby). The title will state the floor area of the private apartment, the ground area of the common land and the percentage interest which that apartment has in the common property. This percentage also represents the value of the voting interest in the condominium company or owners association.

The current condominium law allows, aliens (that is non-Thais) to own (subject to certain important qualifications) up to 49%, by floor area, of the units in a registered condominium.

The qualification most likely to enable an alien to purchase a freehold condominium is providing evidence that the funds used for the purchase of the unit have come from abroad. Before making any large transfer relating to a condo purchase be sure to check with the vendor, your lawyer or a local bank the correct procedure for remitting funds or you may not qualify for foreign freehold.

Buildings other than condominiums do not have any form of title document, but their sale or long lease can be registered at the Ampher (district) land office. Proof of ownership, must be established either from proof of construction or document showing previous sale-purchase (do not confuse this with the House License document, which is only a register of the house's occupants).

Transfer of a building as distinct from its land requires the posting of 30 days public notice (to see if anyone wishes to contest the ownership). Foreign nationals (aliens) may own a building (as distinct from its land) and may register such transfer of ownership into their names at the local district office.

Courtesy of William Pinsent of Phuket Land

Sponsored Links

Understanding_Land_Titles_updated_Oct_26_09__2_.pdf

Edited November 2, 2009 by pkrv

[thefalang]

Can someone tell me where to find info on different land titles.

Particularly where a building has been built on some type of government land and has the "owner's" name registered with the local authority.

Don't just tell me it's dodgy and don't touch it with a barge pole.

Actual facts would be appreciated.

They're probably referring to some "Tor Bor Tor 5" or "Tor Bor Tor 6" land which is abundant in the Laem Promthep area.

Forget it, you can't safely lease long-term because it's impossible to record a lease at the land department as there's no title document. I believe that max term for an valid or enforceable land lease (unrecorded) is 3-years (check with an atty).

You cannot get a building permit on this type of property regardless of what anyone tells you.