Yeah, Another Sin Sot Thread....but Not A Painful One

[sassienie]

OK. So don't bother with the 'lovely' story. Its just a story.

Can't see your point here - it is a true story and, as I said originally, the money is being held by my MIL supposedly. What I was trying to get over was that what to me is an amount of money that is less than a good week in Phuket/Pattaya has a totally different meaning to someone who has nothing.

You can't see the point?!

To spell it out, it means the whole story means NOTHING!! Your wife's family took everything, told you "they would give it to your daughter", but put it in their own name.....

The fact that the money means nothing to you is precisely why the cycle continues.... Let's rip off the farang - he's too stupid to realise.

Love is blinding....

So is a ball and chain.

[Matan]

To be honest I would rather be gullible, stupid and happy than being cynical and worrying that somebody is trying to rip me off at every turn but, there again, each to his own. None of us know what the future brings but I know what I have now and am happy with that.

Whilst I can appreciate the benefits of not being as cynical as many posters on here seem to suggest, the fact remains that an overabundance of your lackadaisical attitude is what leads to the sort of situations where the foreign man ends up on his own with his bank account a few million baht lighter and possibly unable to see his child. It should be common sense that a healthy balance of both is required.

[F1fanatic]

OK. So don't bother with the 'lovely' story. Its just a story.

Can't see your point here - it is a true story and, as I said originally, the money is being held by my MIL supposedly. What I was trying to get over was that what to me is an amount of money that is less than a good week in Phuket/Pattaya has a totally different meaning to someone who has nothing.

You can't see the point?!

To spell it out, it means the whole story means NOTHING!! Your wife's family took everything, told you "they would give it to your daughter", but put it in their own name.....

The fact that the money means nothing to you is precisely why the cycle continues.... Let's rip off the farang - he's too stupid to realise.

Fortunately I am very happy at the moment with my life and family so I am not too concerned if you feel I have been ripped off or that I am stupid. I could of course have walked away as soon as my wife to be suggested I pay sinsot for her (the situation that the OP is in now) for what I see as a relatively trivial sum of money and not experienced the happiness I have over the past couple of years including missing out on having a daughter, who incidentally didn't exist at the time of my marriage hence the sinsot not going into an account in her name.

To be honest I would rather be gullible, stupid and happy than being cynical and worrying that somebody is trying to rip me off at every turn but, there again, each to his own. None of us know what the future brings but I know what I have now and am happy with that.

I'm obviously missing something here.... originally you said your wife had a daughter before you married (no intimation it was your daughter).

Now you're implying the daughter was yours all along?.....

Yes, you are gullible and stupid, but as long as you're happy that's fine. Just don't try to pretend that farangs who pay money (and you advocate LOTS!!) to 'the family' for a woman with children is how it should be. More importantly, don't post misleading posts implying that the family were looking out for you all along, when its clear they weren't - if they were the account would be in the child's name. That's why farangs are seen as idiots.

[TexasRanger]

The sin-sod is not a main part of Thai culture and these days it has become mostly regarded as a scam.

What a ridiculous and ill informed post. You obviously know little of Thai culture.

There were 2 weddings in my village earlier this year and one of the girls was previously married, she was given Sin Sodt (albeit not very much). I have not been to a single Thai wedding in Bangkok or the country where sin sodt wasn't paid. These were all Thai/Thai weddings.

I can assure you that I know more about Thai cultrue than you.

Of course you do.......

Edited November 17, 2009 by TexasRanger

[sanook2me]

I can assure you that I know more about Thai cultrue than you.

I believe you, how do you spell it again?

[sassienie]

I can assure you that I know more about Thai cultrue than you.

I believe you, how do you spell it again?

Sorry, I used the old ancient Celtic spelling.

Culture, are you happy now?

[Orac]

To be honest I would rather be gullible, stupid and happy than being cynical and worrying that somebody is trying to rip me off at every turn but, there again, each to his own. None of us know what the future brings but I know what I have now and am happy with that.

Whilst I can appreciate the benefits of not being as cynical as many posters on here seem to suggest, the fact remains that an overabundance of your lackadaisical attitude is what leads to the sort of situations where the foreign man ends up on his own with his bank account a few million baht lighter and possibly unable to see his child. It should be common sense that a healthy balance of both is required.

Fair point.

I had made the point several times that I could easily afford the figures being talked about, not to brag but to emphasise that my situation might not be entirely the same as the OP. We all place different values on money.

Money that is earmarked for our future, and more importantly, the future of my daughter, is ring fenced and cannot be accessed directly by my wife or her family even should something unspeakable happen to me!

What I was trying to emphasise was that 100k baht is a relatively small sum of money to the vast majority of foreigners when compared to a possible lifetime of happiness or even a few weeks of happiness in a few cases!

There is the arguement that this is the thin end of the wedge and that a constant stream of requests for more money will occur but, since the OP does not live in the village and his g/f is well educated and able to provide for herself there is no reason he can't say no in the future. My advice to him to visit the parents before hand will give him an indication of their current standard of living which may have some influence over future demands for money.

[Orac]

I'm obviously missing something here.... originally you said your wife had a daughter before you married (no intimation it was your daughter).

Now you're implying the daughter was yours all along?.....

Yes, you are gullible and stupid, but as long as you're happy that's fine. Just don't try to pretend that farangs who pay money (and you advocate LOTS!!) to 'the family' for a woman with children is how it should be. More importantly, don't post misleading posts implying that the family were looking out for you all along, when its clear they weren't - if they were the account would be in the child's name. That's why farangs are seen as idiots.

As you say, you are clearly missing something - my daughter is 8 months old. I can't see anything where I said my wife had a child before we married and by refering to our child as 'our' daughter I thought there was a pretty clear intimation that I was the father.

As for the misleading post, sorry if you see it that way - as I said before, our child was born after we were married so there was no account specifically for her to pay the money into. To be honest it is a small amount to worry about to me now but I would probably drive you apolplectic if I told you that our house was actually in my MIL name (though I am not sure she actually knows this!) and our car (worth twice as much as the house!) is in my wifes name.

I am certainly not advocating that anybody else does this but it is entirely an individuals decision that they must make based on their own circumstances.

[F1fanatic]

I'm obviously missing something here.... originally you said your wife had a daughter before you married (no intimation it was your daughter).

Now you're implying the daughter was yours all along?.....

Yes, you are gullible and stupid, but as long as you're happy that's fine. Just don't try to pretend that farangs who pay money (and you advocate LOTS!!) to 'the family' for a woman with children is how it should be. More importantly, don't post misleading posts implying that the family were looking out for you all along, when its clear they weren't - if they were the account would be in the child's name. That's why farangs are seen as idiots.

As you say, you are clearly missing something - my daughter is 8 months old. I can't see anything where I said my wife had a child before we married and by refering to our child as 'our' daughter I thought there was a pretty clear intimation that I was the father.

As for the misleading post, sorry if you see it that way - as I said before, our child was born after we were married so there was no account specifically for her to pay the money into. To be honest it is a small amount to worry about to me now but I would probably drive you apolplectic if I told you that our house was actually in my MIL name (though I am not sure she actually knows this!) and our car (worth twice as much as the house!) is in my wifes name.

I am certainly not advocating that anybody else does this but it is entirely an individuals decision that they must make based on their own circumstances.

Sorry, I misunderstood the situation. BUT believe me, the MIL would have opened an account in the child's name if she had the smallest of intentions of the money going to the child.

Again, its a small amount of money to you - but it perpetuates the whole cycle of farangs being nothing other than 'cash cows'.

If you think the MIL doesn't know the house is in her name - you are seriously deluded. Do you honestly think your wife hasn't told her???

Don't worry though, as long as you keep paying your relationship will be fine.

[Orac]

I'm obviously missing something here.... originally you said your wife had a daughter before you married (no intimation it was your daughter).

Now you're implying the daughter was yours all along?.....

Yes, you are gullible and stupid, but as long as you're happy that's fine. Just don't try to pretend that farangs who pay money (and you advocate LOTS!!) to 'the family' for a woman with children is how it should be. More importantly, don't post misleading posts implying that the family were looking out for you all along, when its clear they weren't - if they were the account would be in the child's name. That's why farangs are seen as idiots.

As you say, you are clearly missing something - my daughter is 8 months old. I can't see anything where I said my wife had a child before we married and by refering to our child as 'our' daughter I thought there was a pretty clear intimation that I was the father.

As for the misleading post, sorry if you see it that way - as I said before, our child was born after we were married so there was no account specifically for her to pay the money into. To be honest it is a small amount to worry about to me now but I would probably drive you apolplectic if I told you that our house was actually in my MIL name (though I am not sure she actually knows this!) and our car (worth twice as much as the house!) is in my wifes name.

I am certainly not advocating that anybody else does this but it is entirely an individuals decision that they must make based on their own circumstances.

Sorry, I misunderstood the situation. BUT believe me, the MIL would have opened an account in the child's name if she had the smallest of intentions of the money going to the child.

Again, its a small amount of money to you - but it perpetuates the whole cycle of farangs being nothing other than 'cash cows'.

If you think the MIL doesn't know the house is in her name - you are seriously deluded. Do you honestly think your wife hasn't told her???

Don't worry though, as long as you keep paying your relationship will be fine.

You are giving my MIL credit far beyond her capabilities - she is a very simple village lady who probably doesn't even know what a bank account is! She is very much looked after by my wife hence my lack of concern about the house. FYI, I was out of the country when the deal went through and the land office wouldn't accept my wifes signature without me countersigning so she got her mother to sign and we have never gotten round to changing it. I do not see a great deal of difference between it being in my wifes name or the MIL, the important part was to give my wife the feeling of security she needed when she had our baby.

As for the comment about keeping paying, I am sure this is the same for many relationships and I certainly went in to this one with no illusions that I would not have to support my family financially I and am well placed to do that.

[F1fanatic]

I'm obviously missing something here.... originally you said your wife had a daughter before you married (no intimation it was your daughter).

Now you're implying the daughter was yours all along?.....

Yes, you are gullible and stupid, but as long as you're happy that's fine. Just don't try to pretend that farangs who pay money (and you advocate LOTS!!) to 'the family' for a woman with children is how it should be. More importantly, don't post misleading posts implying that the family were looking out for you all along, when its clear they weren't - if they were the account would be in the child's name. That's why farangs are seen as idiots.

As you say, you are clearly missing something - my daughter is 8 months old. I can't see anything where I said my wife had a child before we married and by refering to our child as 'our' daughter I thought there was a pretty clear intimation that I was the father.

As for the misleading post, sorry if you see it that way - as I said before, our child was born after we were married so there was no account specifically for her to pay the money into. To be honest it is a small amount to worry about to me now but I would probably drive you apolplectic if I told you that our house was actually in my MIL name (though I am not sure she actually knows this!) and our car (worth twice as much as the house!) is in my wifes name.

I am certainly not advocating that anybody else does this but it is entirely an individuals decision that they must make based on their own circumstances.

Sorry, I misunderstood the situation. BUT believe me, the MIL would have opened an account in the child's name if she had the smallest of intentions of the money going to the child.

Again, its a small amount of money to you - but it perpetuates the whole cycle of farangs being nothing other than 'cash cows'.

If you think the MIL doesn't know the house is in her name - you are seriously deluded. Do you honestly think your wife hasn't told her???

Don't worry though, as long as you keep paying your relationship will be fine.

You are giving my MIL credit far beyond her capabilities - she is a very simple village lady who probably doesn't even know what a bank account is! She is very much looked after by my wife hence my lack of concern about the house. FYI, I was out of the country when the deal went through and the land office wouldn't accept my wifes signature without me countersigning so she got her mother to sign and we have never gotten round to changing it. I do not see a great deal of difference between it being in my wifes name or the MIL, the important part was to give my wife the feeling of security she needed when she had our baby.

As for the comment about keeping paying, I am sure this is the same for many relationships and I certainly went in to this one with no illusions that I would not have to support my family financially I and am well placed to do that.

You're so obviously kidding yourself that this is no longer fun.

Why do I somehow know that your wife comes from Isaan?

Your MIL may well be a 'simple, village lady', but she sent her daughter out to earn money where you found her and understands MONEY, if not bank accounts, v well.

As I said before, as long as you're happy knowing that your role is to give lots of money to your wife and her family (and you've made it clear you understand this v well) - then everythings fine.

My problem is that this perpetuates the Thai belief that ALL farang are stupid and ripping them off is the natural order of things.

Edited November 17, 2009 by F1fanatic

[Orac]

I suppose you are entitled to your opinion on my life since I chose to put some details on here but, reassured, I am happy and not trying to kid myself.

As for the Isaan bit, I stated where I live in the original post so you guessing that suggests you probably didn't read it properly anyway.

There are two pieces of advice, often stated as 'rules', which are very often quoted here and elsewhere frequently which are not to be worth more dead than alive and also not to bring anything into Thailand that you cannot walk away from. My lack of concern to any assets here or money I have spent is probably due to me having already written these off as things I can use but not get anything back from in the future. Rest assured though that everything of any value I would call my own is well away from Thailand apart from my family of course.

[Orac]

I forgot to mention, for the OP, that my MIL actually comes from Sang Khom from a very large family and my wife lived there for a number of years before we met - you never know but you could be marrying in to the same family

[baksiidaa]

Be lucky you are marrying a poor village girl. 100K is peanuts compared to some.

I've dated two upper-middle class girls from Bangkok. One who is Thai-Chinese and the other is Thai. They both are well educated and have good jobs. I've asked them before in casual conversation what the typical sinsod is. Using their cousins as examples who married Thais and what their parents would likely expect from someone marrying their daughters, the sinsod is somewhere close to a million baht. I will say that there is a difference of marrying a girl from a wealthier family in that they likely will give the money back. A Thai buddy of mine mentioned that sinsod is mainly for show and that a lot of people will just take a big loan from the bank to put on display, then give it back after the ceremony. For a hi-so girl, I wouldn't be surprised with sinsod in excess of 10 million baht. Offering 100K or trying to bargain for an attactive daughter of an upper-middle class family would probably be insulting.

By the way, sinsod is definitely not some ploy to rip off Farangs. Most Thais know that it's expected which is why you see so many Phua-Mia living together as if they were married but not ever having had a ceremony because they couldn't afford to pay sinsod.

Edited November 17, 2009 by baksiidaa

[GungaDin]

F1fanatic

Give it a rest.

[MiG16]

alright everyone, lets not make this a debate about the personal situation of one or the other shall we

please continue to give your views/experiences about the sinsod practices (and everyone has had different ones Im sure), but there really is no need to go on the offensive just cos someone is proposing something different to your views

I will however add one thing AGAIN, you can spin whatever logic for it, but sinsod was NOT invented for Thais to get money off some farang

[a2396]

The sin-sod is not a main part of Thai culture and these days it has become mostly regarded as a scam.

Anyone that gives money in this way is an idiot, plain and simple.

...

All you're showing here is that you've rarely (if ever) been to Thai weddings, whether Thai-Thai or Thai-foreigner, and you really have no clue on the subject...

Yes, true enough. there are plenty of Thai idiots paying this as well, although not in such outrageous amounts, unless some high-so who wants to make a show. It is a disgusting, outmoded "custom" that should have gone by the boards long ago. Nothing more than selling women for money. Plan & simple.

[bifftastic]

I see that this thread has wandered off into 'I think it's wrong because it's like buying a wife...I would never do it' versus 'It's what Thais do you should just pay it' and the ensuing slanging matches between people of the different viewpoints.

In the end, everyone must do what they and their wife to be are comfortable with.

If a woman in England is married twice the father of the bride may or may not cough up again. It was the tradition but people work around it and these days most people pay for their own weddings.

My girl was married before, only Bhuddist ceremony, no paper, same as the OP. Husband paid 30,000 baht plus 2 baht gold. She says 'can pay two times or three or four is ok up to everybody' I think she means you need to talk about it with your g/f and her family but there's no hard and fast rule that it only gets paid once. She definitely knows it's just for show at the wedding and you should negotiate the return of at least half of it if you will need the money for the future success of the marriage (ie buying a house etc.)

As for how much 'Up to you'

Silly to leave yourself skint just to show off at the wedding, having said that many people in the UK do the same, borrow tens of thousands and blow it all on 'the big day' then spend years paying it back whilst others are more sensible.

If you can afford it then you'll be showing them that you have money to throw around. If you were marrying my daughter and I hardly knew you, and you threw money around I'd ask you to keep throwing it, in my direction!

If you talked to me and told me you wanted a great wedding day but also wanted to make sure you could provide for a stable future and would definitely not be sponsoring the whole family ad infinitum. I'd respect that.

Cultural things are what they are but everyone has to live in the real world and you, and your wife to be, need to be happy. So you need to talk about it with her first and the family next.

They may have an idea in their mind about what would happen ideally and they will need to move towards your position and you towards theirs.

Hard to say what is best to do without knowing them. I know my friends daughters boyfriend impressed him when he (eventually) plucked up the courage to tell him to '<deleted> off and mind his own business' I'm not suggesting that as a course of action, merely trying to point out that you need to get to know the rest of the family, rather than just seeing them as this whole 'Thais are like this or Thais are like that' thing. They will also be regarding you in similar terms 'Farang are like this Farang are like that'

Everyone involved in this brings their own cultural perspective to the table but if happiness is to be one of the products of the whole process then they will all have to see through as much of that as is possible.

They're people, and people are all different.

Good luck

[sanook2me]

rather than just seeing them as this whole 'Thais are like this or Thais are like that' thing. They will also be regarding you in similar terms 'Farang are like this Farang are like that'

Everyone involved in this brings their own cultural perspective to the table but if happiness is to be one of the products of the whole process then they will all have to see through as much of that as is possible.

They're people, and people are all different.

Good luck

Great whole post and is something i would have liked to have written.. you hit the nail on the head...

Not sure if OP is planning on staying in LoS or running off with the blushing bride back to farang land.

If back to farangland surely he can sit down with the future family and explain there will not be a big wedding and sin sod but the family will get more money from the wife going out to work in farangland and she will send money back...

[skeech33]

One thing I would suggest is that the OP takes the time to visit his future wifes parents and village before he marries as this might give him a better insight into why the money is being asked for.

When I married a couple of years ago to a girl from a village about 15 mins from Sang Khom, where I now live, my future wife initially said that her parents didn't want any money from me. A year later they changed their mind and my g/f, very sheepishly, asked for 100k baht. Since I could afford this and to save rocking the boat i agreed to it without question - my thinking on this was that if such a small amount was more important to me than my g/f and the rest of our lives together then why was I getting married in the first place.

On the day of our wedding, the pink envelopes were collected from the guests and after the evening party in a hotel in Nong Khai (and a number of bizarre photos on our wedding bed) I was left with my wifes family to count the money that had been collected. I was appaulled at the time by the greed and avarice on their faces as all the notes were counted - since a number of my friends and family from England had attended there were quite a few large notes in there. When the money had been counted, and it came to more than the sinsot, my wife asked what I was going to do with it with her family drooling in front of me it was clear what was expected. For the sake not ruining my wedding day and bearing in mind I could afford to, I told my wife she could give it to her family if she wanted which she did - I went to the bar and joined our guests for a drink thinking how I had been ripped off but not telling anyone what had actually happenned.

A couple of years down the line now and having bought a small house in the village I have got to know her family a lot better. The sinsot is still held in a seperate account by my MIL which will be used for our daughter if/when she needs it. The other money was used to by some land for growing chillis on. I found her family to be very poor with one brother living with wife, three children and his MIL/FIL (FIL is blind MIL disabled and neither have Thai ID) in what was little more that a shed without a decent roof or walls - you can see right through it.

I now feel fairly guilty about how I felt on my wedding day - the greed I saw was little more than shock at never having seen money like that before - and I cannot believe how selfish I felt about an amount of money that meant relatively nothing to me but everything to them.

I have since helped them build a proper house opposite mine in the village (cost me 29k baht!) and feel I can now hold my head up slightly higher when my parents visit from England next year and I introduce them to the rest of MY family.

I don't know if the above is of any help to the OP but it is important to remember that your future wifes family will always be very important to her and, if you really care for her, should have some importance to you.

Nice post. Thanks for sharing it.

Its a lovely story. So the account with the money is in your daughter's name?

what comfuses me is his contribution of 29k baht to build house. is that 5% of total? the family put in the rest of the money? where did they get it?

or was 29k what it cost to build house? was the house built w reinforced cardboard? who pays for house upkeep? i dont see how a dirt poor family has the means to keep house in good shape, the farang must be paying.

nothing wrong w paying but why dont guys admit it, its part of marrying no income people!

[MiG16]

If you talked to me and told me you wanted a great wedding day but also wanted to make sure you could provide for a stable future and would definitely not be sponsoring the whole family ad infinitum. I'd respect that.

totally agree with the above in particular

[joorakee]

Putting the sin soot issue aside, there is a big advantage of marrying a divorced woman. You will always have a higher status (of course, if you weren't married previously). You will be highly respected, being the one without a stigma. Even if you are a penniless drunkard and layabout (not personally to the OP - I'm just generalizing).

[joorakee]

Silly to leave yourself skint just to show off at the wedding, having said that many people in the UK do the same, borrow tens of thousands and blow it all on 'the big day' then spend years paying it back whilst others are more sensible.

The same in Poland and many other countries (f.e. Japan).

Well, it's up to people what they spend their money (or the loan...) on.

[MikeyIdea]

To deserve the right to live in Thailand, westerners need to respect Thai culture and tradition

In my experience respect is earned not demanded and seeing as we are dicussing cross cultural marriages, which are suppose to be partnerships, by the same token that the Westerner's should respect Thai culture and tradition, the Thai spouse should respect the Westerners culture and traditions.

Then we both agree, right?

Westerners have to respect Thai tradition as long as they are in Thailand and Thais respect the culture and tradition in the country they move to

No we dont agree..its about compromise/determining the middle ground of a Thai/Western relationship irrespective of where the parties live, in this sort of relationship, one parties cultures or traditions should not be allowed to overide or overshadow the other parties.

I write that Westerners have to respect Thai tradition as long as they are in Thailand and Thais respect the culture and tradition in the country they move to.

Let me get that right, you answer that you don't agree with that

[MikeyIdea]

One thing I would suggest is that the OP takes the time to visit his future wifes parents and village before he marries as this might give him a better insight into why the money is being asked for.

****

A couple of years down the line now and having bought a small house in the village I have got to know her family a lot better. The sinsot is still held in a seperate account by my MIL which will be used for our daughter if/when she needs it. The other money was used to by some land for growing chillis on. I found her family to be very poor with one brother living with wife, three children and his MIL/FIL (FIL is blind MIL disabled and neither have Thai ID) in what was little more that a shed without a decent roof or walls - you can see right through it.

I now feel fairly guilty about how I felt on my wedding day - the greed I saw was little more than shock at never having seen money like that before - and I cannot believe how selfish I felt about an amount of money that meant relatively nothing to me but everything to them.

I have since helped them build a proper house opposite mine in the village (cost me 29k baht!) and feel I can now hold my head up slightly higher when my parents visit from England next year and I introduce them to the rest of MY family.

I don't know if the above is of any help to the OP but it is important to remember that your future wifes family will always be very important to her and, if you really care for her, should have some importance to you.

Nice post. Thanks for sharing it.

Its a lovely story. So the account with the money is in your daughter's name?

The money is always in the Mother-in-Laws hands. You never pay the daughter, always the parents, you should know that

Edited November 18, 2009 by MikeyIdea

[Latindancer]

A lot of it really comes down to personal choice and what you both are comfortable with - bearing in mind the wife will have some loyalties to the family that will sway her opinion. I think you need to discuss further the situation with her, and then perhaps with the family. You definitely need more info from her to base your decision on:

Questions to ask:

1) What was her Sinsot first time round?

2) What have her brothers/ sisters / cousins /nephews /neices etc paid/received?

3) What happened to the Sinsot on all these occasions: returned or kept?

4) What would she expect from a Thai on a second marriage?

5) What have her brothers/ sisters / cousins /nephews /neices etc paid/received on a second marriage?

6) What happened to the Sinsot on all these occasions for second marriage: returned or kept?

These will give you a benchmark as to the ballpark IF she was a first timer, as well as some idea of what their custom is second time, and answer most of your questions. My guess is you'd be slightly higher standing that most of the relatives, so might be expceted to do a bit more but not too much.

Now given she's not a first timer, and given you're a foreigner, there are strong arguments for a flat refusal, anyway. You have to balance that versus marrying a girl you love, and perhaps wanting a nice ceremony, being part of the family etc.

So then you get the following type of questions:

Do you want a nice Thai wedding to remember or are you happy with a functional registry do - bit miserable when you look back?

How comfortable are you paying that amount - how much is it to you?

How important is it for you to have a relationship with the family?

What will she do if you refuse to pay? - Would you risk the love of your life for USD 3k?

What is your wife's views? - Very important

Personally if it were me, and given the amounts mentioned above are not that much to me:

1) I would be prepared to pay something as a compromise

2) Definitely not what they've asked: i) on principal ii) it looks high.

3) I'd like a nice wedding, and I'd like to announce to the world including her family and friends this is my wife.

4) Call me competitive but I'd offer a little more than her first husband paid - to mark out my position (terrible description I know) and establish for all to see we are now together

5) In years to come when you have kids, it will be nice to show them photos of a wedding. You can focus on having married like everyone else, rather than: it was mummy's 2nd time, so it wasn't special and we just signed some paper etc etc.

6) I'd like to give her some face, even if one argues it's not necessary.

7) Note: In years to come when you look back with a happy family, the amount could seem ridiculously small

Lastly:

8) If they insist on 100k - which I guess they would want to keep in their society based on info of background - I would expect back the difference between my offer and their 100k, as my last compromise. i.e pay 100k but get back 40k if 60k was my offer. Explain very firmly at this point:

" It's not my custom, I love your daughter but she has been married before. I am willing to compromise because I love her and to give her and the family face. I expect you and your family to compromise too as compromise is what spending the rest of our life together will involve across cultures"

I would seriously consider walking away at point 8) on principle and at this stage would definitely play hardball. If you are compromising so should they, otherwise the marriage will likely go nowehere in the future. If you get to number 8) don't be afraid to leave them chewing it over a few days. And don't be afraid to walk away, knowing you had compromised and done everything reasonable to try and make it happen. This might give comfort in later years you did the right thing if you don't proceed. Otherwise you could look back and for the sake of USD2k missed the love of your life - at least you'll know you tried but she wasn't worth it.

BTW Do check out and confirm with evidence she is divorced first!

BTW2 I applied in practice much of what I've written above, with the exception that for me my wife was marrying 1st time round.

Yes it can be a difficult time in some ways, but if you're both not prepared to compromise at the start of a marriage, when will you? We thoroughly enjoyed the day and set some important precedents for the future. I have to be honest and say at first I was uncomfortable with the concept at all - with hindsight it was definitely the right decision to compromise and pay something. In terms of amount, with every day that passes the amount looks smaller and smaller. I would consider myself a complete idiot to let slip by such happiness just because I wouldn't compromise, and am glad I did. All her family paid/received Sin Sot when they were married too.

Hi.....remember me ? The OP ? Wow ! I should have known I'd open up such a can of worms ! There is however, a lot of very good advice here, in particular Fletchsmile's, quoted above. He has a well-balanced viewpoint. Some others do too. But I think the posters who see sin sot as buying a girl are seeing the small picture rather than the big picture. There might be that element to it in certain cases, but it's a lot bigger an issue than that. In fact, I'm going to have to do much more thinking than I thought.....for instance, my gal and I are going to Australia for her 4 week vacation next year, and I expect her to want to move there after seeing our lifestyle. Right now she's paid by the government as a teacher, so her parents get free healthcare from the government. They won't get this if she goes to OZ, so I feel morally obliged to pay for health insurance of some sort for them. She has no children, but wants one. I guess she will be sending money back to parents / family from time to time when she gets work there. So if I pay sin sot now, as it is a 'one-off" payment, maybe we can avoid money leaking out for years later. Money made by either of us in the future will be OURS, not HERS, to send off as she wishes. Deep thought needs to be done on the subject.

I might mention here, as an aside, that I hereby claim her as "The Catch of the Year". Having grown up on a farm, then having gone to Uni to be a teacher, she has the best of both worlds. Lovely to look at, to be with, I trust her completely. ( And having been here before, when I came to Thailand this time, my "Bullsh_t Meter" was set to "high" ).

She has no temper at all and is very feminine.

The subject of Sin Sot is the only area where there has ever been disagreement between us.

Still mulling it all over. Thanks for your input, gentlemen.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Latindancer

[skeech33]

actually you a man w no money. but lots of love to give. im sure the parents would be overjoyed to see their daughter marry for the right reasons!

i really dont see whats the problem. do they know their daughter is marrying an equal.

Edited November 18, 2009 by skeech33

[MikeyIdea]

It’s fun to open up a can of worms, then you know which stink

Soory guys, couldn't help it :D

[MikeyIdea]

Hi.....remember me ? The OP ? Wow ! I should have known I'd open up such a can of worms ! There is however, a lot of very good advice here, in particular Fletchsmile's, quoted above. He has a well-balanced viewpoint. Some others do too. But I think the posters who see sin sot as buying a girl are seeing the small picture rather than the big picture. There might be that element to it in certain cases, but it's a lot bigger an issue than that. In fact, I'm going to have to do much more thinking than I thought.....for instance, my gal and I are going to Australia for her 4 week vacation next year, and I expect her to want to move there after seeing our lifestyle. Right now she's paid by the government as a teacher, so her parents get free healthcare from the government. They won't get this if she goes to OZ, so I feel morally obliged to pay for health insurance of some sort for them. She has no children, but wants one. I guess she will be sending money back to parents / family from time to time when she gets work there. So if I pay sin sot now, as it is a 'one-off" payment, maybe we can avoid money leaking out for years later. Money made by either of us in the future will be OURS, not HERS, to send off as she wishes. Deep thought needs to be done on the subject.

I might mention here, as an aside, that I hereby claim her as "The Catch of the Year". Having grown up on a farm, then having gone to Uni to be a teacher, she has the best of both worlds. Lovely to look at, to be with, I trust her completely. ( And having been here before, when I came to Thailand this time, my "Bullsh_t Meter" was set to "high" ).

She has no temper at all and is very feminine.

The subject of Sin Sot is the only area where there has ever been disagreement between us.

Still mulling it all over. Thanks for your input, gentlemen.

I'm glad that you start to think like a Thai. Government healthcare for your wife's parents is a nice thought

Practicality rules in Thailand. The one-off money you give won't last forever. Thai husbands are expected to help the wife's parents with a bit of money. Don't worry about it now, when you get to know them better and see how they live, then you will know better what is needed. I happily pay 3,000 bath per month to my wife’s parents and grand mothers parents (totally 4 people), knowing how much it means to them. And I pay a bit more in rice season to pay for additional expenses. I feel privileged to have the opportunity to do that, the rice that they have made with their own hands taste much better than any rice that I can buy at Carrefour and I am the first one to taste it every year

[ozzieovaseas]

In your words..He always asks for 100,000???...for each marriage??!!

I wonder how many times he's done this?

hmm..I thinks any self respecting Isaan father would indeed be encouraging his little girl to get married every 2 years..

The only problem being that she would be limited to farangs, no thai guy would be silly enough to fall for it