No Impending Coup, Anupong Insists

[webfact]

COUP OR NOT COUP

No impending coup, Anupong insists

By The Nation

Published on January 29, 2010

No impending coup, Anupong insists

BANGKOK: -- As key Army combat units continued to rally in his support yesterday, Army chief Anupong Paochinda once again denied the possibility of a military coup.

"How many times do I have to deny it? You reporters had better help me here. You asked deputy Army chief Prayuth [Chanocha] yesterday and you ask me again today, and you will definitely ask me again tomorrow. If it goes on like this, businesses will suffer," he said.

"There is nothing, and the Army is not divided like some people might think. What you are inquiring about is impossible."

Unprecedented gatherings by key Army units around the country to support Anupong in his confrontation with rebellious officer Maj-General Khattiya Sawasdipol have prompted speculation that the gatherings were meant to check or reconfirm the loyalty there is for the Army leader.

It was also seen by some as a veiled warning to the pro-Thaksin Shinawatra red-shirt movement, or even as a sign that a coup might be forthcoming.

Anupong yesterday insisted that while there might be some "individual problems", the Army remained united and totally behind the democratic system.

Yet, as more gatherings took place yesterday and followed the same pattern of soldiers pledging allegiance to the armed forces and denouncing Khattiya's activities, doubts emerged as to whether the Army was overreacting to just one "rogue" officer or if there was more to it than met the eye.

At the 11th Army Region headquarters, key combat units from the capital and its suburbs gathered to denounce Khattiya as a tool being used to drag the military into politics, causing divisions and damaging its reputation.

"We just want to show that the majority of soldiers are disciplined and ready to protect the honour and dignity of the Army," said Maj-General Ukrit Narongwit, who leads the 11th Army Region.

Meanwhile, at the 11th Army Infantry Regiment headquarters, a seminar on discipline was attended by many battalion commanders, during which Khattiya's activities were widely and harshly condemned.

"It used to be that we had to defend the Army's reputation against outsiders, but now we sadly have to do it within ourselves," lamented Colonel Apirat Kongsompong, head of the 11th Infantry Regiment.

-- The Nation 2010-01-29

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[animatic]

You can bet they are looking at ANY soldier who doesn't step up smartly and renew allegiance.

The problem is not the current army leaders will do a coup, but that Thaksin related generals

will pull some old school tie strings,. and cause a coup or appearances of a coup,

and give Thaksin an excuse for a government in exile ploy.

Or as bad cause violence against civilians and make it LOOK like current army leadership ordered it.

Or even worst case give appearances of a coup with one group

and a false flag loyalist group attempts to put it down,

but is REALLY intent on taking over the government

and BOTH groups gather together and take out Abhisit et al.

All these coup questions just set it up for ANY army movements to be seen as potentially

a big question mark, and maybe hesitation on deciding on a groups loyalties would allow it to

gain traction in some sort of PR or actual coup like action.

I can easily see why Anupong is lining up all the soldiers for a little

loyalty confirmation in front of their brothers in arms.

Edited January 29, 2010 by animatic

[Credo]

If he doesn't want people to ask the questions about what's going on, then don't have these public displays of tanks and checks on loyalty.

Obviously something is going on.

[animatic]

Yes, something is going on.

Thaksin has been publicly recruiting old generals and their down stream loyalties.

And considering the history of small faction lead coups in Thailand, Anupong is

trying something to test or have a good look at many of his junior leaders and

grunts on the line.

[givenall]

It is just a big lie and is put out by Mr. T and his supporter as the last ditch to star up the everything they can to create chaos for Thailand.

Someone should tell Mr. T that is all over and he is too late for making a deal

[Insight]

According to the BP Sae Daeng has made some comments related to the safety of the judges involved Thaksin's corruption trial which are quite frankly jaw-dropping.

I'm sure in the UK or US he would of been arrested by now simply for attempting to incite violence.

[quiksilva]

Checking loyalty at these times seems like a prudent measure given all the political heat, pending the Thaksin verdict, but personally I dont think we'll see a coup... after all the army previously sided against Thaksin. If Thaksin didn't have enough clout to prevent or get forewarning about the coup which ousted him, I can not see how is he going to find enough now to get rid of the Dems.

Now whilst he can probably still find some support with a few old generals and probably a fair few within the ranks, the current government would have seen this type of move coming along time ago, hence the checks and public flogging of the 'rogue general'.

I also don't believe that the Army want to seize power for themselves, they did such a terrible job of it last time.

All these rumours are I think just that, rumours, designed to cause further uncertainty and pressure on the government ahead of the verdict.

Caution : wild speculation ahead..

There's a part of me which also suspects that the protests at Mathaphut have Thaksin's fingerprints on them too... which by the way I think are correct to a point. I truly believe that tighter environmental control regulations are needed in this country and whilst they are in place, not having a government agency setup to handle those approvals, shine a big glaring spotlight on government ineptitude for all the world to see, placing further pressure on the govt. If that wasn't enough, once that was handled, we then see that same group trying to further stall the approval process, questioning the legality of setting up the agency under the office of the PM so as to speed this through.

This, to me, hints at something deeper going on, if the group wants these projects to abide by the regulations why stall them? What's in it for them? The timing is just a little too convenient.

[humbug]

Checking loyalty at these times seems like a prudent measure given all the political heat, pending the Thaksin verdict, but personally I dont think we'll see a coup... after all the army previously sided against Thaksin. If Thaksin didn't have enough clout to prevent or get forewarning about the coup which ousted him, I can not see how is he going to find enough now to get rid of the Dems.

Now whilst he can probably still find some support with a few old generals and probably a fair few within the ranks, the current government would have seen this type of move coming along time ago, hence the checks and public flogging of the 'rogue general'.

I also don't believe that the Army want to seize power for themselves, they did such a terrible job of it last time.

All these rumours are I think just that, rumours, designed to cause further uncertainty and pressure on the government ahead of the verdict.

Caution : wild speculation ahead..

There's a part of me which also suspects that the protests at Mathaphut have Thaksin's fingerprints on them too... which by the way I think are correct to a point. I truly believe that tighter environmental control regulations are needed in this country and whilst they are in place, not having a government agency setup to handle those approvals, shine a big glaring spotlight on government ineptitude for all the world to see, placing further pressure on the govt. If that wasn't enough, once that was handled, we then see that same group trying to further stall the approval process, questioning the legality of setting up the agency under the office of the PM so as to speed this through.

This, to me, hints at something deeper going on, if the group wants these projects to abide by the regulations why stall them? What's in it for them? The timing is just a little too convenient.

I am only replying to the part of Mathaphut, are you serious, you think this has thaksins fingerprints, you either been reading too many conspiracy theories or finally you have cracked over the last few years due to the barrage of misinformation and propaganda eminating from this very paranoid regime,

[Samuian]

It is just a big lie and is put out by Mr. T and his supporter as the last ditch to star up the everything they can to create chaos for Thailand.

Someone should tell Mr. T that is all over and he is too late for making a deal

...not too sure, this MR.T. will go for "all out".... he is simply way too attached to his ego and that to the frozen money, questionable money, he calls "my life savings" but then his children (supposedly) claim that they made this money with the help of a bit of pocket money (~357 Mill.) from Mom... and then another time he claims "this money was mine BEFORE I before I took office!"

and he want's his playgrounds back, everyone plays by HIS rules, complete obedience, forgive him and his entourage, "cover all" Amnesty and legal Immunity forever, reinstate him as the only one and ever genuine democratic leader of Thailand Inc. abolish, those foolish money and time consuming elections, every citizen loves him "the great leader" anyway - not much more, it isn't much, is it?

Yes, he won;t stop... not in the near future - unless there is a miracle!

[Donnyboy]

Yes, he won;t stop... not in the near future - unless there is a miracle!

lets all pray it comes soon

[Meridian007]

Animatic has it, this is a game of loyalties so the military has no option but to squash any rumors that Khattiya makes. Whoever has the larger "baramee" will win out, and I think Khattiya (and Thaksin) have miss-judged how much they have.

I'm also amazed that Khattiya hasn't been arrested. For a country with such strong defamation laws, it's surprising that direct, public threats against people (no matter who they are, but especially government) are seemingly tolerated. If Thailand was still under Thaksin, any dissenter would probably be labeled as a drug lord, and would "disappear".

[Insight]

Meridian007 - can only assume Abhisit and co have decided not to appear oppressive in any way towards the red shirts, rather let themselves continue to shoot themselves in the diminishingly collective feet.

[Samuian]

Meridian007 - can only assume Abhisit and co have decided not to appear oppressive in any way towards the red shirts, rather let themselves continue to shoot themselves in the diminishingly collective feet.

Seconded, they are doing really well!

There are too many people in the ranks who can't really control what they say and do....

unmask themselves, step, by step - good work!

[Old Man River]

According to the BP Sae Daeng has made some comments related to the safety of the judges involved Thaksin's corruption trial which are quite frankly jaw-dropping.

I'm sure in the UK or US he would of been arrested by now simply for attempting to incite violence.

Yes, no question. It is up to Abhisit and his government to get this guy under control. By dragging their feet they are beginning to look weak.

[quiksilva]

I am only replying to the part of Mathaphut, are you serious, you think this has thaksins fingerprints, you either been reading too many conspiracy theories or finally you have cracked over the last few years due to the barrage of misinformation and propaganda eminating from this very paranoid regime,

.. more likely to have finally cracked, I will be making tin foil hats soon

[Old Man River]

Checking loyalty at these times seems like a prudent measure given all the political heat, pending the Thaksin verdict, but personally I dont think we'll see a coup... after all the army previously sided against Thaksin. If Thaksin didn't have enough clout to prevent or get forewarning about the coup which ousted him, I can not see how is he going to find enough now to get rid of the Dems.

Now whilst he can probably still find some support with a few old generals and probably a fair few within the ranks, the current government would have seen this type of move coming along time ago, hence the checks and public flogging of the 'rogue general'.

I also don't believe that the Army want to seize power for themselves, they did such a terrible job of it last time.

All these rumours are I think just that, rumours, designed to cause further uncertainty and pressure on the government ahead of the verdict.

On the coup, I agree. For now.

If we see Thaksin return to Thailand, surrounded by armed Red Shirts violently trying to take over the capital then the military would call a State of Emergency (SOE) and step in to restore order. This is not a coup. Once order is maintained, the same government would still be in place.

The only time I think we could see a coup is if a PT led government attempts to return to the 1997 constitution and overturn all court cases and bans against Thaksin paving the way for his return. That is a non starter and if that occurs, tanks will role. Anything short of this and no coup.

[animatic]

Meridian007 - can only assume Abhisit and co have decided not to appear oppressive in any way towards the red shirts, rather let themselves continue to shoot themselves in the diminishingly collective feet.

Seconded, they are doing really well!

There are too many people in the ranks who can't really control what they say and do....

unmask themselves, step, by step - good work!

I think minor Major General "Sea Dung" Khattiya is getting the same let them hang themselves,

non-oppression treatment. Let the fool make so many threats and comments that there

will no questions asked when the hammer finally comes down in a very non-Buddhist way.

~Threatening the judges before the verdict is oh so very democratic isn't it?

The guy is toast when he finally gets caught.

Edited January 29, 2010 by animatic

[jayjayjayjay]

Why would the army have a coup now. This is just ridiculous speculation by the press. The guys they want in power now are there. Any option to the Dems is none army friendly. A coup placing in a military leader now would result in a civil war. Nothing short. If a new election was called, Dems would not get back in, neither would Newin Chidchob get votes like he did last election. BhumiJai would be as good as history. I've got 2000 staff who say that, and I'm in the heart of Newin country. The only elected option is a proxy Thaksin gov and nobody in the army wants that, except for crazy Maj Gen Khatti-ya-whatever.

Edited January 29, 2010 by jayjayjayjay

[Old Man River]

Why would the army have a coup now. This is just ridiculous speculation by the press. The guys they want in power now are there. Any option to the Dems is none army friendly. A coup placing in a military leader now would result in a civil war. Nothing short. If a new election was called, Dems would not get back in, neither would Newin Chidchob get votes like he did last election. BhumiJai would be as good as history. I've got 2000 staff who say that, and I'm in the heart of Newin country. The only elected option is a proxy Thaksin gov and nobody in the army wants that, except for crazy Maj Gen Khatti-ya-whatever.

I am completely in agreement with this.

As I have written earlier today, the only time we could see a coup is if the PT comes in and reverts back to the 1997 constitution and reverses all cases and bans against Thaksin et. al. Then, another coup would be likely (in my opinion). Otherwise, there is absolutely no need to replace this government or, for that matter, even a PT led coalition as long as they don't reverse the court cases and bans.

[SomTumTiger]

There is that overused "civil war" claim. Give it a rest jay.

[mythBuster]

And we all believe Anupong. After all Anupong defended this week the purchase and use of the very same bomb scanners (900,000 to 2,000,00 per piece) banned by the UK for export to Afghanistan and Iraq because they are a complete fake and costs hundred of lives in those countries. (Not to mention the immoral UK government who put up and export ban for those countries were their troops are but not for Thailand and Pakistan)

We certainly put our trust in a man who believes in hocus-pocus and never opened one of the sim cards to see for himself that nothing is in it. (He is probably afraid to wreck the warranty).

[Old Man River]

And we all believe Anupong. After all Anupong defended this week the purchase and use of the very same bomb scanners (900,000 to 2,000,00 per piece) banned by the UK for export to Afghanistan and Iraq because they are a complete fake and costs hundred of lives in those countries. (Not to mention the immoral UK government who put up and export ban for those countries were their troops are but not for Thailand and Pakistan)

We certainly put our trust in a man who believes in hocus-pocus and never opened one of the sim cards to see for himself that nothing is in it. (He is probably afraid to wreck the warranty).

You are right to not believe Anupong as no military man would ever admit to planning a coup, just as no central bank governor would ever admit to planning to devalue or revalue a currency.

What you need to do is analyze it for yourself. Here, my analysis says no need for a coup. What does your analysis say?

[CLOD]

ooh, still laughing at that one.

Anupong , the army and democracy, the guys a berk.

Before he comes out with rubbish like that he really ought to drop the corruption, and go find out what an electoral democracy is all about.

[Ricardo]

Threatening the judges before the verdict is oh so very democratic isn't it?

Quite, I thought Thaksin (in another thread) was very concerned, about the undue influences being put upon the judges ahead-of their ruling in his latest case, and yet here is a self-proclaimed Red-Shirt leader doing exactly that. He must have lost his 'lines' ? He certainly doesn't seem to have been slapped-down yet, or denied, by the other Red-Shirt leaders.

Meanwhile the UDD & Red-Shirts appear to be getting ever more desperate, to find proof or even a hint, of a seemingly non-existent coup, one which is consistently denied by the military-leadership ? Why ? What are they about to do, which requires the apparent justification, of heading-off another coup ?

[animatic]

ooh, still laughing at that one.

Anupong , the army and democracy, the guys a berk.

Before he comes out with rubbish like that he really ought to drop the corruption, and go find out what an electoral democracy is all about.

Uh... is'nt that a Burk?

As in James Burke made you giggle on TV?

or rhyming slang word that many people don't even realize is short for

"Berkeley-Hunt", who was an 1890s stage idiot. and ryhms with; total ....

Of course you would think Anupong is a total ....

What else is new.

PS there is an electoral democracy in Thailand, right now.

The parliament is filled with duly elected Minsiters of Parliament, doing their jobs as we speak.

The only ones whining about that not being so,

are those who couldn't get all this elected MPs to back their chosen Prime minister candidate,

and so they can only whine that they've been ripped off. Crocodile tears.

[animatic]

Threatening the judges before the verdict is oh so very democratic isn't it?

Quite, I thought Thaksin (in another thread) was very concerned, about the undue influences being put upon the judges ahead-of their ruling in his latest case, and yet here is a self-proclaimed Red-Shirt leader doing exactly that. He must have lost his 'lines' ? He certainly doesn't seem to have been slapped-down yet, or denied, by the other Red-Shirt leaders.

Meanwhile the UDD & Red-Shirts appear to be getting ever more desperate, to find proof or even a hint, of a seemingly non-existent coup, one which is consistently denied by the military-leadership ? Why ? What are they about to do, which requires the apparent justification, of heading-off another coup ?

Do as I say, not as I do.

As always if it benefits the Reds all roads are traveled, by their fellow travelers....

but if it benefits all others it's treacherous and anti-democratic...

Propaganda 101 and 102,

repeat, repeat, repeat, the message you want believed,

and some will be foolish enough to believe it.

Why? Propaganda 103.

Disinformation in case of the 'fog or war'... if the balloon goes up,

and segments of the military mutineé for Thaksin's side,

then there is a message or rational put in place in advance,

the idea that;

'it is actually an 'Army leadership induced coup',

and so in theory soldiers will not know which side is coming and hesitate...

long enough for a foothold or strangle hold on the government to be taken.'

Also for propaganda purposes; Thaksin can claim for international consumption that ;

'the Thai army mutinee'd and HIS loyal troupes came in a saved the country

by putting down a mutinee!' And incidentally taking over from the displaced cabinet

and dissolved parliament... which was dissolved because Thaksin had to declare a SOE

since the army was in mutinee!... fait acompli. Job done and enter the conquering hero.

It's on face value absurd, but he isn't thinking on all 4 cylinders...

Edited January 30, 2010 by animatic

[hammered]

Of course the military dont want to do a coup now.

The press are in a frenzy fueled by an organized PR offensive by PTP and the red guys stating there will be a coup. Remember the asset case stuff is coming to conclusion and so that side needs a game changer as they fear for the loss of the money. Any game changer whether coup, violence, parliamentary collapse or if we hear from a certain general death of a judge will do. If everything remains as is then the case is smoothly moved past whatever the decision.

The military by the way are no admirers of the Dems for those that fantasize that way tio fit their poltical assumptions. They never have been and likley never will. The military though will be very happy the Dems have burst the constitutional change bubble for now even if the Dems reasons for doing so are very differerent form the militaries - lookat what Chuan said. The military in the future could quite happily live alongside a PTP government like the old Samak or Somchai ones (although hopefully not as utterly useless in running the country by actually doing nothing as either of those). OMR has it about right for what the issues are that set the military off imho. And if people think it is far fetched to imaginfe the PTP and military coexisitng then listen to the nice words Chalerm and Chavalit have about Prayuth even if the the more street orientated reds and their champagne socialist PTP MPs see or maybe it is better to say are wishful things would be different.

[zzaa09]

Yes, something is going on.

Thaksin has been publicly recruiting old generals and their down stream loyalties.

And considering the history of small faction lead coups in Thailand, Anupong is

trying something to test or have a good look at many of his junior leaders and

grunts on the line.

We would agree, would we not, that such a speculative coup this time around might be a 'different' thematic altogether? It's realistically that a broader civil conflict could easily manifest from the diverse factions that exist today......let's hope not.

[SomTumTiger]

One thing that I haven't heard mention. It is quite possible Thaksin has a few of these media hounds in his pocket, who's sole task is to create the "Coup" story. Asking the same question again and again, in order to make the public think that something is going on that isn't. Just another part of Thaksin's "Last war". (Last.....or 2nd to last, or maybe 4th...etc)

[CLOD]

This is so funny.

All this hot air about an imaginary coup, is it, isnt it, will it , wont it.

Democracy would be better served by turning attention back to the coup that actually did happen, the coup that removed the last democratically elected government, and allowed the set up of the current illegitimate, human rights abusing , corrupt , stinky administration.

Short memories some folk.