Tuk Tuks Make Australian Newspapper

[alfbondi]

<h1 class="cN-headingPage prepend-5 span-11 last">Phuket rip-off: the trouble with tuk-tuks </h1> February 6, 2010 Seeing red ... tourists pay 10 times more for tuk-tuks in Phuket than in Bangkok. Photo: Austin Bush/Lonely Planet

Tourists in Phuket are being taken for a ride.

Most of Phuket's tuk-tuks are red, which is the colour tourists are seeing when they encounter extortionate fares and sometimes gruff and thuggish behaviour by the drivers of these strange local taxis.

The quaint open-sided vehicles provide a ride that's about as comfortable as the back of a ute but visitors are charged a five-star luxury price for the privilege of being bounced all over the holiday island.

One Canadian tourist complained about the 150 baht ($5) fare for a one-minute journey and was punched in the face five times by a driver last month. A French tourist argued about a parking space on December 26 and had his arm broken.

The cost of a tuk-tuk from Phuket's airport to Patong, a journey of 40 kilometres, is 800 baht, about the same price as the bus fare to Bangkok, 852 kilometres away.

Phuket's tuk-tuk drivers snaffle the best parking spots along the island's popular beaches, charge more than 10 times what their Bangkok colleagues ask and the number of drivers is growing quickly.

While Phuket tuk-tuks have four wheels compared to the three-wheelers in Bangkok, that extra wheel hardly seems to justify prices that are on par with those charged for air-conditioned taxi services in the world's most popular cities.

Natdanai Chaowana, a prominent tuk-tuk owner in Patong, says: "In Patong, everybody knows that it's 200 baht just to start the engine of a tuk-tuk." When asked why the cost is so high, he adds: "'Look at the economy of Phuket. Everything is expensive here."

Patong's police chief, Colonel Grissak Songmoonnark, says there are too many tuk-tuks on Phuket. There are about 500 in Patong alone, he says, not including unregistered vehicles. "Two hundred tuk-tuks would be enough for the whole island," he says.

"Problems arise because of the rivalry between the tuk-tuk groups, which means they often cannot make pick-ups so return trips are usually made empty. It should be 150 baht to travel from Karon to Patong but because the driver has to return empty, he charges 300 baht."

Tourists and expat residents have used internet chat sites to call for a boycott, petitions and the introduction of a proper public transport system on Phuket.

Visitors to Phuket can hire cars or motorcycles or catch slow buses from Patong on the west coast to Phuket City on the east coast. Taxis from the airport, for example, can drop passengers in Patong, Karon and Kata but they cannot pick up passengers.

There are no buses linking the popular west-coast beaches, so tuk-tuks and motorcycle taxis have a monopoly along the west coast.

It is widely acknowledged that tuk-tuk drivers have supporters in local government, resulting in growing pressure for intervention by the Thai government. Even Phuket's powerful provincial governor, Wichai Praisa-ngob, who recently forced unscrupulous jet-ski operators to pay for compulsory insurance, seems unable to rein in the "the tuk-tuk mafia".

[logbags]

When you have a corrupt system it is just about impossible to make any meaningful changes. Laws exist that could clean up most of Phuket's growing problems but bribery and corruption allow people to do what they want, when they want, if they pay the right people.

You have the tuk tuk problem, a massive scam with illegal migrants openly working in Patong, certain venues owned by influential people being allowed to open late, total lack of enforcement of the rule of law or any sanction against Thais who attack foreigners etc. Ugly and illegal buildings have sprung up all over the place with no thought of any infrastructure, parking, traffic flow etc.

The corruption on the streets only mirrors the massive corruption higher up the totum pole. It is extremely hard to change the mind set of people who have grown up in such a corrupt system. Nobody will make a stand, nobody can as in the end they will end up much worse off or even get killed if they expose wrong doers.

I recently watched a Thai chat show where they had a guy on who was once Sor Sor of a major province . He was saying he was the same age and era of Sanoh Thiengthong but he flatly refused to take bribes or get involved in corruption. Today he lives in a tin shed with nothing except a very small pension. He was saying that if most of the politicions and police are totally corrupt. Who then can enforce the law?

I often ask people to look at the private sector. Shopping centres have car parking, clean toilets and are well built and managed in most cases. The same can be said for hotels and spas. Most are well built, clean and have nice gardens, service etc. Then compare what you see in the private sector to what you see in the public sector. Crumbling roads, filthy or no public toilets anywhere, tradesmen with bamboo ladders, Burmese labourers paid a pittance to do the lackey work etc. It doesn't take Einstein to figure out someone is creaming and taxing the public purse big time.

Now I wonder how much of the private sectors money had it's origins in the public purse? So many politicions, police and other government officials own hotels, resorts and spas it is ridiculous. The money they are supposed to earn from ther salary should not allow this but of course nobody asks when they see a policeman driving a benz as everyone knows he probably extorted the money off someone.

Most people highly placed in the Thai political sector are also placed highly in the business sector, so nepotism runs rife with every major contract or tender rigged to favor a family members company. At a lower level we can see this with the families in Patong who control the jet skis etc. So until the culture of corruption changes, nothing else will. The system must change from the top down and what hope is there with psychos like Seh Daeng and Thaksin running loose.

My Thai niece summed it up yesterday while looking at photos online of Seh Daeng with Thaksin in Dubai. "In Thailand if you are ruay, nobody cares how you made your money, you are ruay, being ruay is everyones dream. How you get ruay is not important."

[Yamantaka]

I am sure there will be many more suggestions as to what to do about the tuk-tuk problem, most of which will demand that the government do something. As was outlined beautifully in the above posting, this will not be the most immediate or effective solution. Like the saying goes, if you want something done right, do it yourself.

With the large number of farang/expat/travel websites and so many people who want to solve the problem by putting the tuk-tuk mafias out of business, I would propose a coordinated, active effort. This would involve: 1) mass postings on these web sites warning potential visitors not to take tuk-tuks under any circumstances in conjunction with the numerous alternative means of transport specifically and clearly laid out. 2) In addition, there should be flyers printed up with the same message and information, delivered surreptitiously (to avoid retaliation by the mafia) to every hotel, restaurant and bar which tourists patronize. 3) Offering tourists a friendly ride home from a bar at night would mean they don't have to look for other transport (just don't give anyone the finger). 4) This could be enhanced by offering a "car pool" type online posting when residents know they will be going from point A to point B on a certain day at a certain time, for example, driving from Patong to Central in the morning, or when going past a particular beach and past a certain hotel in the afternoon.

With these as the initial methods of boycott, I am sure many more will be thought of and put into use. If everyone who has complained on this web site and others takes an active role, the tuk-tuk mafia can at least have their attitude adjusted as the mafia dons begin to see their revenues radically diminished.

[tomwct]

Expats get Smart!!! Tell tourists to avoid TukTuk's and take bus and taxi's with meters and do it in front of the TukTuk Drivers!!! When their business drops 50%, some will go out of business and some will drop their prices!!! Get united and the Thai Owners will take action and clean up Phuket's problem!!! I always take a Taxi in Bkk because they are air cond., but also cheaper in most cases!!!

Edited February 6, 2010 by tomwct

[LivinginKata]

Expats get Smart!!! Tell tourists to avoid TukTuk's and take bus and taxi's with meters and do it in front of the TukTuk Drivers!!! When their business drops 50%, some will go out of business and some will drop their prices!!! Get united and the Thai Owners will take action and clean up Phuket's problem!!! I always take a Taxi in Bkk because they are air cond., but also cheaper in most cases!!!

Trouble is that there are no meter taxis at the popular beach areas, and the bus service is very limited and stops at 17.00.

[madmitch]

Expats get Smart!!! Tell tourists to avoid TukTuk's and take bus and taxi's with meters and do it in front of the TukTuk Drivers!!! When their business drops 50%, some will go out of business and some will drop their prices!!! Get united and the Thai Owners will take action and clean up Phuket's problem!!! I always take a Taxi in Bkk because they are air cond., but also cheaper in most cases!!!

No, they would probably raise the prices.

[Felt 35]

Laws exist that could clean up most of Phuket's growing problems but bribery and corruption allow people to do what they want, when they want, if they pay the right people.

hear hear

Nothing will ever change in Phuket. Read the history about the place its an inherited thing.

[logbags]

The above guy who was a Sor Sor has been deserted by his family including his children who all think he was stupid for not accepting a 10 million baht bribe amongst other things. He now lives in a shed by himself because he refused to play the corruption game.

Rather than people respecting him, people ridicule him and say he let his family down etc. He had to beg for money from Suthep Thaugsuban to send his children to school. His story was recently on Jo' Jai and he said he had no friends or support so went to live in the deep jungle for many years.

He served under Kriangsak and Prem if I remember correctly so it was late 70's early 80's.

[ScubaBuddha]

One minor correction: Tuk tuks don't travel to and from the airport. The metered taxi's, "limousine" taxi's, and unregistered illegal taxi's (whiteplated) do.

I'm afraid that the suggestions by above posters to "Get Smart," is actually suggesting we "Get Stupid." You need to understand that you cannot, even surreptitiously, hand out fliers suggesting tourists boycott the tuk tuks and taxi's. We're talking about people that will literally break your arm for parking in their parking space, punch you several in the face for suggesting 150 baht is to much for a 50 second ride which you could have easily walked had the driver informed you ahead of time, as the poor bastard in my avatar learned.

What do you think they will do if they catch you handing out fliers or standing in front of their tuk tuk stands intercepting fares to inform them of alternative transport options, or providing free rides? You or your car, or both, will be inflicting some serious damage, trust me on that. All we can do is try to spread the word from behind the relative safety of our keyboards, write letters to officials, sign petitions, spread the info via word of mouth, report what we see and hear to the media, post reviews on travel websites and whatnot, but that is as far as I recommend anyone going, unless they have a death wish. (Yes this coming from the guy that flipped off a tuk tuk after he tried to run me off the road. I don't recommend that either)

I would even caution people using this forum unless you have at least some of anonymity as I recently learned that a member here on TV who is often seen defending the tuk tuks' is an expat who has married into the tuk tuk mafia.

One thing I will do is if dropping a mate off at the airport, on his way in I will have him find the hottest girl or girls arriving and tell them I will give them a free ride to the beach since I am already going there, but I do that for other reasons. Knowing it means 800 baht less in the crims pocket is just icing.

I totally believe the Sor Sor to have been abandoned by his family. No surprise there. Is their even a Thai word for integrity?

Edited February 6, 2010 by ScubaBuddha

[logbags]

Is their even a Thai word for integrity?

จริยธรรม Ja- ri- ya- thaarm

Good question, but most Thais only use simple language like ชื่อสัตย์ (honest) and จริงใจ (sincere) when talking about integrity. In the south they have their own language. Phuket born people have a very distinct accent. The majority of people in places like Patong are not even Thai. Lao, Khmer, Burmese, Bangaldesh, Nepal etc so be careful when you say "Thais"

Most of these people have little education, little business training and limited resources. However they all seem to be able to scam and bluff so many people on this forum. Being scammed is also an indictment on yourself as you always have the choice of saying NO. Most of those people selling stuff in Patong cannot even speak Thai. Most bar girls speak Lao.

I usually use a Thai proverb when talking to Thais being totally unreasonable. "the honest eat forever, cheats eat for a little while only" it usually leaves them speechless and embarassed. It appeals to their superstitious and cultural phobia of losing face or merit.

Most Thais feel Farangs use too much emotion over trivial issues and don't understand prices are meant to be negotiated. Flying into a rage gets you nowhere, you are better off staying calm, smile and negotiate. Then you get respect rather than disrespect.

Giving the forks or finger is just beeing stupid, anywhere in the world that gesture is going to get you some agro or facetime. Remember Thai boxing is only a sport in Thailand, if you make a Thai seriously angry- he is going to want to kill you with whatever he can get his hands on. Don't go there............

[LivinLOS]

Most of those people selling stuff in Patong cannot even speak Thai. Most bar girls speak Lao.

Disagree with those really.. sure a lot of BG's speak northern dialect and can speak Lao / Khamen dialects but to say most people dont speak Thai, or speak pure Lao.. Thats a big leap.

Most Thais feel Farangs use too much emotion over trivial issues and don't understand prices are meant to be negotiated. Flying into a rage gets you nowhere, you are better off staying calm, smile and negotiate. Then you get respect rather than disrespect.

I do remain calm, just smile and let them rave, but simply politely saying no has had a few flying into a rage, as well as many more saying shitty things in Thai if they cant make an idiot sale. Its THEM flying off the handle not me. Its to the point you dont want to go to browse simply as the hassle is not worth the crappy goods.

[KarenBravo]

The only thing that is going to happen is that tuk-tuks will get meters with the price starting at 250 Bt.

This keeps the tuk-tuk mafia happy and the politicians will save face and can say "See, we've got rid of the corruption. The prices are the same for everyone".

[MisterMan]

shouldnt the newspaper be credited?

[katabeachbum]

Most of those people selling stuff in Patong cannot even speak Thai. Most bar girls speak Lao.

most of the nepal, india, myanmar, vietnam and so on selling goods in patong speek ok thai.

I d say all thai bar girls speak bkkthai in addition to their village language, which can be lao/khamen or south thai or CM/CRthai

[Yamantaka]

I'm afraid that the suggestions by above posters to "Get Smart," is actually suggesting we "Get Stupid." You need to understand that you cannot, even surreptitiously, hand out fliers suggesting tourists boycott the tuk tuks and taxi's.

Maybe the use of the word "surreptitiously" was confusing. It means secretly, covertly, clandestinely. In other words the mafia would not know about who put the fliers out. Personally I have never had a problem with tuk-tuks in ten years living here. I just get tired of people endlessly whining but not willing to do anything more than talk to improve the situation.

[ScubaBuddha]

Maybe the use of the word "surreptitiously" was confusing. It means secretly, covertly, clandestinely. In other words the mafia would not know about who put the fliers out. Personally I have never had a problem with tuk-tuks in ten years living here. I just get tired of people endlessly whining but not willing to do anything more than talk to improve the situation.

No, I know perfectly well what surreptitious means, thanks. And what I meant by you couldn't do it surreptitiosly was that there is no way to remain anonymous about it. Someone has to walk into every hotel and hand the flyers to a Thai. And Thai's just loooovvve to gossip. Your actions will not remain surreptitious for long. What do they call it? The bamboo telephone I think? Maybe you can post it to them.

Some of us are trying to do something, and maybe we are doing it "surreptitiously" in other ways, therefore you don't know about it. I spelled out earlier what some of us can do about it. Coming on this forum and other forums. blogs, travel review websites and "endlessly whining" as you put it, can make a difference. I think it's fair to say that most visitors to Thailand will do a little research online before visiting. Better they know what to expect before hand and can avoid getting into trouble or getting scammed to badly. Often local English media comments on the amount of activity in a forum on a certain subject, and this has happened on this subject in this forum.

How ironic your suggestion for us to basically shut up about it comes in a thread which is a result of a expat our tourist "doing something about it." How do you reckon this story made it into a foreign paper in the first place?

If your one of those people that doesn't care about anything unless it directly affects you, then I suggest you don't bother reading or commenting in these threads. A lot of people do care about this issue, even if you don't. They may want to do something, but aren't sure what they can do. If you don't care, or have family in the tuk tuk bisiness like I now some of the expats on ThaiVisa do, fine. Don't try tell us to keep quite just because "you've never had a problem with them."

[Yamantaka]

First, I apologize for upsetting you. There are many people on the forum for whom English is not a first language so I didn't know if the word was commonly known. Secondly, I wasn't advocating not speaking about the problem on this web site. In fact I recommended that those who wish to accomplish the goal get onto as many tourism, travel and expat forums as possible and spread the word, as advice rather than denigration. But there is a big difference between so many posts about this and many other situations that insult Thais, Thailand, Thai government and Thai culture rather than making constructive suggestions which is what I had hoped I was doing.

As concerns flyers, if people can be robbed and killed without the perpetrators being caught, I am confident that they can be distributed to tourists without any harm coming to those delivering them.

[ScubaBuddha]

First, I apologize for upsetting you.

Not upset at all.

There are many people on the forum for whom English is not a first language so I didn't know if the word was commonly known. Secondly, I wasn't advocating not speaking about the problem on this web site. In fact I recommended that those who wish to accomplish the goal get onto as many tourism, travel and expat forums as possible and spread the word, as advice rather than denigration. But there is a big difference between so many posts about this and many other situations that insult Thais, Thailand, Thai government and Thai culture rather than making constructive suggestions which is what I had hoped I was doing.

Fair enough. I read over your previous posts again and realized I may have interpretted your messege incorrectly.

As concerns flyers, if people can be robbed and killed without the perpetrators being caught, I am confident that they can be distributed to tourists without any harm coming to those delivering them.

Sorry, again? That bit doesn't make sense to me.

[Yamantaka]

Sorry, again? That bit doesn't make sense to me.

Maybe English isn't my native tongue after all! I meant that there are many activities which can be completed successfully in a covert manner if one plans well and executes efficiently. It is done all of the time on both sides of the law.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Yamantaka

[ScubaBuddha]

Sorry, again? That bit doesn't make sense to me.

Maybe English isn't my native tongue after all! I meant that there are many activities which can be completed successfully in a covert manner if one plans well and executes efficiently. It is done all of the time on both sides of the law.

Ah ok I see. A bet of inductive reasoning that. Well, fortunately some do get caught. I wouldn't want to be one of them.

Your right tho, there are many things that can be done, like focusing on the advertisers. Two Chefs and Buffalo Steakhouse, among others. We should all boycott them and inform them we will until they pull their advertising.