I Can Finally Leave Thailand.

[ChiangMaiFun]

In these 16 years in Thailand I can not recall I ever had a FRIEND among the local people.

Wow. If that's true, it's really sad.

Sad but true for me too.

Wondering if that's their fault. Or yours.

I have had plenty of close Thai friends, beginning from the first year I arrived. YMMV

you may feel close but you will never be close... you can live here 100 years and you will never be Thai or 100% accepted - I don't even try - they like me or not mai pen rai!

[Tejas]

OP good luck to you where ever you end up...

At 15 years here you have right to your opinion about Thailand.

Wouldnt worry too much about the Thai apologists remarks, who i am sure are only 1 retirement cheque from having to get on a plane because they cant afford to live here anymore, at least you have given yourself options and made a decision...

I think a lot of the "love Thailand or leave it crowd" are one retirement check away from having to deal with Thailand reality.

When they start abrogating the income-related retirement rules, you will hear them singing a different tune.

It is too bad so many people got enamored with the "Thai myth" and sort of got stuck here for various reasons.

The xenophobia is really way out of hand now. Thailand is a sinking ship.

As a retirement destination, there are so many other better places to be.

I admire the OP for taking care of his family obligations here and deciding to move when the time was right.

Many of us would like to do just that, but will never admit it.

[ChiangMaiFun]

As a retirement destination, there are so many other better places to be.

Like where pray tell? I travel extensively and dont see the infra-structure and costs of living combination I see here

[krading]

QUOTE (krading @ 2010-02-12 14:35:02) *

Fifteen years in Thailand and you join up just to say goodbye.

Oh well, good luck and remember to keep in touch.

"Seems to me the OP learned more about life than you ohmy.gif "

What an odd thing to say.

Maybe if the OP had joined the forum eight years earlier he may have found that he is not the only one in that boat.

'"A problem shared is a problem halved" mum

[clockworkorange]

Having lived in Thailand for 15 years, you must have met a lot of people who hated the place, left, and came back again...

Thailand isn't perfect, but neither is anywhere else

Good luck, and the chances are we'll see you back in Thailand again soon.

Edited February 13, 2010 by clockworkorange

[IanForbes]

I don't know if the mods have deleted any replies, but I think most answers were on a positive level. Congrats to the posters on this topic.

But, there IS a truism... if you can't be happy in Thailand then it's unlikely that you will ever be happy anywhere. Being happy is a mindset. You can focus on the good things and learn to ignore the bad, or, you can CHOOSE to look at only the negative aspects of life. I don't know ANYWHERE in the world that has everything. There are faults with every country... including Canada, which has always been voted in the top 10 places to live in the world. I could make a list as long as your arm about the faults of Canada. Likewise, I could list just as many of the good things. I could do the same with Thailand... or just about anywhere in the world.

It is obvious that the OP has English as a second language, so I wonder just what country he plans to move to where life might be better. Earning a living is always a concern wherever you go. Not everyone can sit back in the luxury of retirement income. And, earning an adequate living (by western standards) IS a concern in Thailand.

Edited February 13, 2010 by IanForbes

[hammered]

If you dont like a place you should leave and as soon as possible.

Not really worth debating as what some like others dont. That doesnt make anyone right or wrong. Thats just human nature.

[GuestHouse]

I've said it before - Other people's negative views of Thailand have absolutely no impact on my experience of Thailand.

It's on that basis I really cannot understand why so many people get really upset at someone else's negative comments about the place.

Other than of course the truth only really hurts those who are trying to deny it.

[jdinasia]

If you dont like a place you should leave and as soon as possible.

Not really worth debating as what some like others dont. That doesnt make anyone right or wrong. Thats just human nature.

I agree, life is too short to be in a place that makes you unhappy.

Watching people that seem to only get any joy out of life when they are crying about where they CHOOSE to live makes me believe that they will be unhappy wherever they happen to be.

We have plenty of posters on here that neither live here, nor even visit regularly yet log on to cry about the place. What a waste of precious life!

[popshirt]

I didn't come here for the food, either.

I'll second that! And I really like Indian, Indonesian, Vietnamese, Chinese and Japanese food!

[Neeranam]

What surprises me the most is that he is a newbie. Why bother to say anything in this form. Just leave and enjoy the rest of your life

Many posters would like advice from someone who has been here for 15 years. I have been here for the same time and can identify with a lot of what he says. Thailand has become a worse place than 15 years ago. Racism has got a lot worse - due, in my humble opinion, to a lot less desirable foreigners coming. Khon Kaen, for example, I was in a bar last night and it could have been in the middle of Bolton, or Pattaya - bald, beer-bellied sex tourists with football shirts on.

Why did you have to wait until your son finished school? They have schools in the country you're going to, don't they?

Edited February 13, 2010 by Neeranam

[473geo]

I guess MEN still keep coming to Thailand for the same reasons you probably did 15 years ago... It seems to me that the majority just want a 'yes' woman. What I have gathered over the years is that men cannot cope with strong women. I agree with all that has been said about the racism regarding half Thai/ half farang children - same happened in the 60s? with Indian descent Kenyans. Therefore, I ask myself, why in the world would anyone inflict that stigma on a child? Oh, right I remember... Surely you would all be better off staying in a western society and visiting prostitutes? That's exactly what you are all doing in Thailand anyway.

I was in Penang when I decided, after a month into my stay I would like to visit thailand...... as I had never been before.......and knew nothing of it.....(Penang FYI is a small island and I had kind of covered it in a month!!!.....I was exploring asia........so I booked a four flight fly anywhere in Thailand ticket for £250........if you know Penang you will understand all amenities are available......so if I am an example of MEN......I first came to Thailand to see the country.

"Why would anyone inflict that stigma on a child"......such a sad statement........in a multicultural world we educate people, we do not abstain because the minority are are not educated.

As for the Op going back.....good luck and best wishes....hope all works out.

[chicowoodduck]

For sure 15 years is a long time, so if you feel it's time to go, it is.

I have only lived here for 5 years, but had been travelling here for 20. Lived in my home country 40 years and was quite happy to come here as I love the food, and the government of my home country was a mess (GW Bush).

You talk about racism, but that is everywhere, I don't think you can single out Thailand there.

I wonder if you'll spend a year in your new location, then decide, maybe Thailand wasn't so bad after all.

Good luck to you.

The grass is always greener in the neighbor'a yard. No place is perfect, that I have found. One just has to adjust and learn to live with the imperfect.

[Tejas]

I've said it before - Other people's negative views of Thailand have absolutely no impact on my experience of Thailand.

It's on that basis I really cannot understand why so many people get really upset at someone else's negative comments about the place.

Other than of course the truth only really hurts those who are trying to deny it.

This is not directed at you Guesthouse, but to many posters who are in the love Thailand or leave it crowd.

I am not a psychologist....but what you said does makes sense. I think a lot of people are avoiding reality. Some, however, do genuinely like it here.

It seems psychologically weak to be so critical of others who don't like this place. Some posters can't even contemplate that other people might have a different opinion and think they are Thai bashers or delusional or poor or have a visa problem, whatever.

It seems strange to state there is no other place on the planet that can give people the same quality of life...that is simply not true for many people.

That is probably true for the poster that said that. But for many other people a higher quality of life can be found elsewhere.

To say that if you don't like it you should leave ignores the fact that many people have taken on a certain responsibility that keeps them here. Some people are stuck here because of a wife, child, house, job, etc.

Others moved here over a decade ago when it was an inexpensive and fun option and now are stuck here for financial or health reasons (the expat community is getting old and Thailand does offer pretty good medical care).

I have been all over the world (almost every country). I know there are better places than this.

And no way I am going to post them here for the real estate hounds to read.

If I do that those places will get ruined too. Or, some would say, turn into a Paradise in Southeast Asia.

I certainly would not say that. I have been here several decades and all I see is a sinking ship.

Why don't I leave? I do leave.......frequently.

Now, however, I am contemplating leaving for good.

I am sick and tired of the xenophobia, corruption, heat (getting hotter each year), stupid visa rules (even though I don't personally have a visa problem), pollution, rising crime, overdevelopment, and the new farangs moving in that make Rush Limbaugh look like a radical liberal.

No......no need to say "great.....leave."

Just know that when I moved here I loved Thailand and its people.

And I have done everything possible to make it a better place.

But like Dylan said, "Things have changed."

[sbk]

Posts have been deleted, lets keep it civil, thanks

[Ulysses G.]

If you dont like a place you should leave and as soon as possible.

Not really worth debating as what some like others dont. That doesnt make anyone right or wrong. Thats just human nature.

I agree, life is too short to be in a place that makes you unhappy.

Watching people that seem to only get any joy out of life when they are crying about where they CHOOSE to live makes me believe that they will be unhappy wherever they happen to be.

We have plenty of posters on here that neither live here, nor even visit regularly yet log on to cry about the place. What a waste of precious life!

Ain't it the truth!

[tmwke]

Always a good laugh when the foreign watch dogs slam a poster for posting his/her negative feelings about Thailand. My opinion... everyone has their own view based on their experiences. Some come to Thailand and feel as if it is heaven on earth while others feel it is a cesspool of corruption and lies. As with all widely different views, the truth lies somewhere in between.

Good luck to the OP and I hope that where ever he ends up that his kids, himself and wife (is there a wife?) are very happy.

TheWalkingMan

Wise words from the walking man.

I think the op has posted on here for the first time to validate his reason for leaving the same as some others post here hoping that they will be validated for their reasons to stay.

No one is right or wrong as Mr Walking Man has pointed out everyone has their own view based on their experiences.

Me I'm with the stayers, though Thailand isn't what it was for expats or tourists 5 years ago.

Every one to there own,but i agree with the above (Thailand is not the same as five years ago) if you dont belive the above or me ,just ask the Thais !

[GungaDin]

I've said it before - Other people's negative views of Thailand have absolutely no impact on my experience of Thailand.

It's on that basis I really cannot understand why so many people get really upset at someone else's negative comments about the place.

Other than of course the truth only really hurts those who are trying to deny it.

This is not directed at you Guesthouse, but to many posters who are in the love Thailand or leave it crowd.

I am not a psychologist....but what you said does makes sense. I think a lot of people are avoiding reality. Some, however, do genuinely like it here.

It seems psychologically weak to be so critical of others who don't like this place. Some posters can't even contemplate that other people might have a different opinion and think they are Thai bashers or delusional or poor or have a visa problem, whatever. <Snip>

Good post.

[Birdman]

It seems psychologically weak to be so critical of others who don't like this place. Some posters can't even contemplate that other people might have a different opinion and think they are Thai bashers or delusional or poor or have a visa problem, whatever.

No, it's rather more the fact, that people, who really can't stand life here, are not strong enough to move, or, if that is not an option, can't manage to arrange their lives here in a way to reduce all the negative aspects to a minimum and enjoy all the positive aspects amap, but only complain about this and that, food, traffic, double pricing, low quality of this and that........

Best example are these frustrated guys, who stay in the middle of nowhere only because her wife was born there. Without the wife they would never ever be there. For sure, if they were at other places in Thailand, they would have a much better life.

[bina]

i really dont understand at all why people move somewhere 'for a better quality of life' unless u are coming from a country where the quality of life is non existant or you are a persecuted minority. like the sudanese coming here to my country. i came to my country as an almost teenager, mostly cause it seemed like a good idea at the time, i was marrying someone from here, and then life happened.

i had kids, dogs, garden, friends, enemies, places that i like to visit, just life in general that happens. and life here is certainly no picnic. ive been through three wars, various governments, personal crises, coutnry crises... the people are rude, the wages suck, racism -- well u all dont know what racism is until u have a thai husband here or u are a 'minority' yourself'-stores, busses and work close down promptly two hours before sundown on friday and dont start up again until two hours after sundown on saturday..the do's and dont's of food are a pain in the butt, tourists are ripped off (tell me a country where tourists arent ripped off), the drivers are maniacs, the corruption is rampant, the good ol' boys network is in full working order, u get jobs based on who u know, the rich are getting richer the poor are getting poorer... sounds just like thailand eh? (apart form the food and friday saturday)..

when people move, they dont just move with their physical luggage. their personal luggage stays with them and never gets lost at the airport or sent to the wrong destination... unhappy people will probably be unhappy most anywhere. satisfied people will be ok probably anywhere. hopefully when people finally leave a place they werent happy in, they dont feel they wasted their entire llife previous to leaving. its like marriage. if u stay in the marriage 'because of the kids' then u have to live with that decision with a full heart, without harping and complaining about it.

if i leave here with husband, its not cause we cant stand here, but because we want to be there (korat)-- for whatever reasons, good, bad, ugly, for rich and for poor, until we make an other decision. at the moment we are 'stuck' here (israel) for financial reasons, children reasons (son in active duty, no way i will leave him until he gets out, alive and in one piece), and possibly, inertia.

every country is 'getting worse then it was 5-10-15-20' years ago; the people are stingier, nastier, more aggressive, more violent, the weather is getting worse, the food sucks, the pollution is bad, the job situation is bad. frankly, it sounds like my grandparents , parents and us of this generation complaining also... things always get worse, not better once u get used to a place. the veneer wears off. patience runs thin.

someone wants to try their luck somewhere else, no problem. good luck and all that. its just too bad that the leaving is in a negatie perspective, like a waste of time for the past 15 years. hopefully the son wont be blamed for making parents suffer -- becasue of u, we stayed in this miserable place....

good luck to the op

bina

israel

[Richb2004v2]

I've been here living here a little over five years, recently had kids, and have also decided to call time on life here and move back home. I can think of nothing at all positive about Thailand anymore and especially so now that I have kids to think about.

I agree that the food is way over rated. Over the past couple of years I have eaten in more dire establishments than good ones. Even when we find a good one it's very likely the service is very poor.

Originally we were going to stay for another three years. A while ago my wife reduced that to two years. I now just want to get out asap.

[Slaps]

i really dont understand at all why people move somewhere 'for a better quality of life' unless u are coming from a country where the quality of life is non existant or you are a persecuted minority. like the sudanese coming here to my country. i came to my country as an almost teenager, mostly cause it seemed like a good idea at the time, i was marrying someone from here, and then life happened.

i had kids, dogs, garden, friends, enemies, places that i like to visit, just life in general that happens. and life here is certainly no picnic. ive been through three wars, various governments, personal crises, coutnry crises... the people are rude, the wages suck, racism -- well u all dont know what racism is until u have a thai husband here or u are a 'minority' yourself'-stores, busses and work close down promptly two hours before sundown on friday and dont start up again until two hours after sundown on saturday..the do's and dont's of food are a pain in the butt, tourists are ripped off (tell me a country where tourists arent ripped off), the drivers are maniacs, the corruption is rampant, the good ol' boys network is in full working order, u get jobs based on who u know, the rich are getting richer the poor are getting poorer... sounds just like thailand eh? (apart form the food and friday saturday)..

when people move, they dont just move with their physical luggage. their personal luggage stays with them and never gets lost at the airport or sent to the wrong destination... unhappy people will probably be unhappy most anywhere. satisfied people will be ok probably anywhere. hopefully when people finally leave a place they werent happy in, they dont feel they wasted their entire llife previous to leaving. its like marriage. if u stay in the marriage 'because of the kids' then u have to live with that decision with a full heart, without harping and complaining about it.

if i leave here with husband, its not cause we cant stand here, but because we want to be there (korat)-- for whatever reasons, good, bad, ugly, for rich and for poor, until we make an other decision. at the moment we are 'stuck' here (israel) for financial reasons, children reasons (son in active duty, no way i will leave him until he gets out, alive and in one piece), and possibly, inertia.

every country is 'getting worse then it was 5-10-15-20' years ago; the people are stingier, nastier, more aggressive, more violent, the weather is getting worse, the food sucks, the pollution is bad, the job situation is bad. frankly, it sounds like my grandparents , parents and us of this generation complaining also... things always get worse, not better once u get used to a place. the veneer wears off. patience runs thin.

someone wants to try their luck somewhere else, no problem. good luck and all that. its just too bad that the leaving is in a negatie perspective, like a waste of time for the past 15 years. hopefully the son wont be blamed for making parents suffer -- becasue of u, we stayed in this miserable place....

good luck to the op

bina

israel

Good Post Bina

and you mean it!

[cognos]

Thsi what i do, i get burned out living here from time to time. When i get to that point i jump on a plane over to Phnom Penh

to 4-5 days and when i come back i am completely re-energized on Thailand and feel great!

You mean a visa run to PP?

I think you confuse "bored" with "burned out".

Takes a bit more than 4-5 days to get over it if you are burned out.

By the way, what kind of life style do you have here when you get burned out regularly?

He parties a lot, and has a mia noi, plus whatever/whoever else.. he seems like a nice fellow in general

signed: respect him, but stopped doing almost everything he does to avoid burnout

[MrHammer]

Thailand seems stuck between 3'rd world and first world. Too expensive to be a real cheap option (like the Philipines) and too backwards to be able to offer enough employment, social and financial options for someone to make a real life here as a foreigner. I don't think Thailand is that great of a deal to be honest. Maybe in ten years when Thailand grows up, they will begin to understand the world and their place in it. Right now, Thailand is like a teenager with megalomanic tendencies. The current generation in power came from palm trees and bamboo huts to mass consumerism and collective delusion of grandeur.

I figure Thailand will either get it's act together and move towards a real first world society (like Korea and Japan), or at least their own kind like China. Or it will remain a nationalistic closed nation and slowly degenarate into Laos, Cambodja, Burma. Either way, that would make Thailand more interesting as a place to live. Right now, Thailand really seems like more of a good tourist/retirement destination than a place to make your life.

[sokal]

Thailand seems stuck between 3'rd world and first world. Too expensive to be a real cheap option (like the Philipines) and too backwards to be able to offer enough employment, social and financial options for someone to make a real life here as a foreigner. I don't think Thailand is that great of a deal to be honest. Maybe in ten years when Thailand grows up, they will begin to understand the world and their place in it. Right now, Thailand is like a teenager with megalomanic tendencies. The current generation in power came from palm trees and bamboo huts to mass consumerism and collective delusion of grandeur.

I figure Thailand will either get it's act together and move towards a real first world society (like Korea and Japan), or at least their own kind like China. Or it will remain a nationalistic closed nation and slowly degenarate into Laos, Cambodja, Burma. Either way, that would make Thailand more interesting as a place to live. Right now, Thailand really seems like more of a good tourist/retirement destination than a place to make your life.

The quasi 1st and 3rd world is the best part about Thailand in my opinion. Less bureaucracy and regulation yet all the things you want in a modern country. Maybe its just because I am 25. I just like the idea that I can jump onto a 1600cc jetski , hand a guy 25$ and hit the ocean for a half hour. That is after relaxing on the beach with a few Chang beer and my 45kg GF at my side.

[MrHammer]

Thailand seems stuck between 3'rd world and first world. Too expensive to be a real cheap option (like the Philipines) and too backwards to be able to offer enough employment, social and financial options for someone to make a real life here as a foreigner. I don't think Thailand is that great of a deal to be honest. Maybe in ten years when Thailand grows up, they will begin to understand the world and their place in it. Right now, Thailand is like a teenager with megalomanic tendencies. The current generation in power came from palm trees and bamboo huts to mass consumerism and collective delusion of grandeur.

I figure Thailand will either get it's act together and move towards a real first world society (like Korea and Japan), or at least their own kind like China. Or it will remain a nationalistic closed nation and slowly degenarate into Laos, Cambodja, Burma. Either way, that would make Thailand more interesting as a place to live. Right now, Thailand really seems like more of a good tourist/retirement destination than a place to make your life.

The quasi 1st and 3rd world is the best part about Thailand in my opinion. Less bureaucracy and regulation yet all the things you want in a modern country. Maybe its just because I am 25. I just like the idea that I can jump onto a 1600cc jetski , hand a guy 25$ and hit the ocean for a half hour. That is after relaxing on the beach with a few Chang beer and my 45kg GF at my side.

You don't live in Thailand full time, do you? Thailand is a great place to be when you bring in money from the outside, scratch that, it's fuc_king awesome to be young and have money in Thailand, but unless you have a trust fund, you have to work for a living eventually. I am 27 and I don't think there are any real options to make a career in Thailand. It's basically TEFL or online business.

Thailand really isn't that cheap if you want a condo with decent amenities, motorbike, car, money for travel etc, money to go to decent restaurants, universities, clubs, taking out the girlfriend. All things which are necessary to meet the right people.

They have 45 kg girlfriends in other countries too. The Philippines is just as much fun as Thailand and much cheaper. They also speak English and have a work ethic. I am thinking of setting up an office there.

[moetownblues]

I have been coming to, working in and living in Thailand for about 16 years now and I can understand a little of how you feel.

However for me, now retired with a 5 year old son, a good Thai wife with her own business who makes enough to support herself and our son when I die, I can't get enough of Thailand.

I like the food though at times it is too spicy and my body is unhappy with it I can always ask for mai phet kap and get it how I like it.

My wife owns our home and the 20 rai that we live on. I know it can never be mine but so what, I can't take it with me when I die anyway.

Up here in the central region out in the sticks I have not noticed any racism but mainly friendly Thais and not so many farangs an I don't live in a farang ghetto.

My neighbours are Thai and the 2 nearest farangs work offshore and come over 2 or 3 times a year.

Most of the farangs that I know in Thailand are not lazy as they have land and businesses and work hard at it and the others have worked 50 years or so like me and are retired.

I pay mostly the same prices as the locals do for anything I buy.

You say the only reason that you would come back to Thailand would be to see your son though he seems to want to go anyway.

He may have problems back in your home country.

Sorry to see you go but life is really what you make of it.

I agree 100%

[sokal]

Thailand seems stuck between 3'rd world and first world. Too expensive to be a real cheap option (like the Philipines) and too backwards to be able to offer enough employment, social and financial options for someone to make a real life here as a foreigner. I don't think Thailand is that great of a deal to be honest. Maybe in ten years when Thailand grows up, they will begin to understand the world and their place in it. Right now, Thailand is like a teenager with megalomanic tendencies. The current generation in power came from palm trees and bamboo huts to mass consumerism and collective delusion of grandeur.

I figure Thailand will either get it's act together and move towards a real first world society (like Korea and Japan), or at least their own kind like China. Or it will remain a nationalistic closed nation and slowly degenarate into Laos, Cambodja, Burma. Either way, that would make Thailand more interesting as a place to live. Right now, Thailand really seems like more of a good tourist/retirement destination than a place to make your life.

The quasi 1st and 3rd world is the best part about Thailand in my opinion. Less bureaucracy and regulation yet all the things you want in a modern country. Maybe its just because I am 25. I just like the idea that I can jump onto a 1600cc jetski , hand a guy 25$ and hit the ocean for a half hour. That is after relaxing on the beach with a few Chang beer and my 45kg GF at my side.

You don't live in Thailand full time, do you? Thailand is a great place to be when you bring in money from the outside, scratch that, it's fuc_king awesome to be young and have money in Thailand, but unless you have a trust fund, you have to work for a living eventually. I am 27 and I don't think there are any real options to make a career in Thailand. It's basically TEFL or online business.

Thailand really isn't that cheap if you want a condo with decent amenities, motorbike, car, money for travel etc, money to go to decent restaurants, universities, clubs, taking out the girlfriend. All things which are necessary to meet the right people.

They have 45 kg girlfriends in other countries too. The Philippines is just as much fun as Thailand and much cheaper. They also speak English and have a work ethic. I am thinking of setting up an office there.

No I don't live in Thailand but I plan to when I have enough money coming in. I invest allot of money so my plan is to live off of money coming from outside Thailand. Phils is definitely a better place to make a living in I have heard. I like street vendor food and I don't go to clubs much so my lifestyle does not cost much. In your case, it sounds like the Phils would suit you better.

With a 2.5% unemployment rate, I would not consider Thai people lazy with no work ethic.

[TheWalkingMan]

...

With a 2.5% unemployment rate, I would not consider Thai people lazy with no work ethic.

I think a percentage of people will take issue with your last sentence.

TheWalkingMan

[Heng]

Work ethic is relative. IMO folks with a good work ethic jump at overtime and don't complain about the pay rate. If there's an employee meeting of say 300 folks, with overtime shifts on offer, on average you might get about a 15% rate of volunteers. In Singapore (way higher pay rate regardless) or China (also regardless of a way lower pay rate) that might be more like 60%.

That said, their work ethic is hardly a drag on my own work ethic, and every screw, nail, and bolt has its purpose, no matter how lazy (or not) it is. If it costs me a few extra people to get my product to market, that hardly affects my kid's education, my property taxes in other countries, or whatever lifestyle I have created for myself and my family.