Brit In Serious Accident.

[jamesthefirst]

Very recently a British friend of mine had a motorcycle accident here in Thailand. He was drunk at the time and was not wearing a helmet.

An ambulance was called to the scene and he was taken to a local government hospital. After being checked by a doctor it was found that he had a broken femur and a blood clot to his brain.

The blood clot was removed, after which the brain started to swell. As a result of this, two plates had to be removed from his skull to allow the brain to swell and then afterward, to recede. His leg was also taken care of.

When, after two weeks the doctor gave him clearance for discharge from the hospital, I went to pick him up. One of the nurses presented me with a bill exceeding two hundred thousand baht. When I informed her that I could not pay it and neither could my friend, they released him with no charge whatsoever.

It just goes to show that Thailand is not such a bad place after all. But the moral of this story is, do not drink and drive. Also, always wear a crash helmet when riding a motorcycle.

[dekestone]

Really? The guy spent two weeks in hospital, had some serious, perhaps life-saving surgery and full time care and paid nothing?!

[Slaps]

WoW!

Amazing Value Amazing Thailand

Good to hear and good to hear hes OK

Next time wear a bash hat

[Benjie]

Well, At least they will know not to treat foreigners in the future, eh.

Why didn't your friend have any money, he can afford a holiday out here but not his own medical bills?

Drunk driving on a bike, without helmet, crazy with or without insurance.

[hhgz]

"I informed her that I could not pay it and neither could my friend..."

So, you guys just disclaimed all responsibility, and made no attempt whatsoever to settle the debt? Is it any wonder that many Thais dislike farangs?

[Thanyaburi Mac]

"I informed her that I could not pay it and neither could my friend..."

So, you guys just disclaimed all responsibility, and made no attempt whatsoever to settle the debt? Is it any wonder that many Thais dislike farangs?

I'd sure hate to be the next guy who goes in to this hospital for an "emergency."

It'd be right nice, and correct, if that guy could make payments back to the hospital, even if dragged out for a year or two, make us all look better.

Mac

[Penkoprod]

Wouldnt the hospital present a bill to the government/health authorities of the patients home country, as happens to foreign nationals who use the NHS in UK for THEIR emergency treatments?

Penkoprod

[MJP]

I wonder what will happen when he tries to leave the country?

Can't be as simple as this. Agree it's taken the pi$$.

"I informed her that I could not pay it and neither could my friend..."

So, you guys just disclaimed all responsibility, and made no attempt whatsoever to settle the debt? Is it any wonder that many Thais dislike farangs?

[Moonrakers]

I once rushed my (Thai) wife to (Bangkok Pattaya) hospital because she was very sick.

I turned out that she had a severe kidney infection and was indeed extremely ill, she was kept in for a week until being discharged.

Understandably I had not even thought of money until it came to checking out when they handed me a bill for about 60k baht, they fixed her first and asked questions later. I just didn't have the cash at the time but we came to a deal were I would pay them back over a few weeks. They were very, very good about it.

On the flip side.

When my daughter had her first ever epileptic fit, we rushed her to hospital. It was a hospital on Petchburi Rd not far from Ekkamai, I forget the name of the hospital now.

We had no clue what was happening and the doctors could not have either as she had not been diagnosed by then. If could have been anything, poison even. We were terrified, who wouldn't be.

Some stern face miserable faced cow at the front desk told us that treatment would be refused until we paid a 20k baht deposit. The money was not a problem, except we didn't have it with us after all we left home in quite a hurry for obvious reasons.

I had to return home to get my card to pay the deposit, which took a good 40 minutes and even when I got back to the hospital my daughter had to wait another 15 minutes for treatment before the transaction was processed.

Luckily epileptic fits are quite superficial and so no harm was done by being made to wait, but there was no way at the time that anybody could have known the cause.

Private hospitals are businesses, and with all businesses you get the good and the bad.

[Sheryl]

"I informed her that I could not pay it and neither could my friend..."

So, you guys just disclaimed all responsibility, and made no attempt whatsoever to settle the debt? Is it any wonder that many Thais dislike farangs?

I'd sure hate to be the next guy who goes in to this hospital for an "emergency."

It'd be right nice, and correct, if that guy could make payments back to the hospital, even if dragged out for a year or two, make us all look better.

Mac

Agree 100%

In fact I'd say it was his moral responsibility to do so. He was rendered care -- good, life-saving care from the sounds of it. It is perhaps understandable that he might not have had the cash on hand but now that he's out he should take steps to repay, even if it means a loan from family, or payment in installments.

BTW this kind of thing is exactly why private hospitals often require a deposit in advance.

Thai government hospitals perpetually operate in the red, a fact which restricts their ability to buy new equipment, provide the newest drugs etc. by contributing to that problem one is depriving poor Thais of better medical care.

The Thai public health system does not have any arrangements or agreements in place to seek reimbursement from foreign national health insurances. (And most of the latter would not pay for care in a foreign country anyway).

BTW he was lucky and such kind behavior cannot be counted on. Hospitals have been known to refuse discharge until bills are settled.

And of course -- nobody should be here without insurance. Take out a policy or self-insure, but wbe sure you have the wherewithal to pay for at least urgent treatment.

I won't even go into the driving drubk without a helmet aspect......

[gotlost]

I'll give odds of 10-1 that they have his passport information. He ant going no where tell that bill is settled. I know a block that has a 460,00 baht bill for about the same thing the hospital has his passport he definitely is not going anywhere.

[Tinkelbell]

If the story is true. The OP's friend is really fortunate indeed.

I find this episode is rather hard to believe. Considering years ago it was on the Thai news about a daughter couldn't take her (serious ill) mom from the Mae Aye hosptial in Chiengrai.

Seemed after the mother spent almost 2 months under the doctor's care, not getting better, she realized her time was getting short so she told the daughter....she wants to die at home.

The bill came around60k+ baht, the daughter couldn't afford to pay. The hospital is holding the mother a hostage until the daughter could raise enought cash.

Reading about her plight, just happens I know the director of the hospital, I emailed the doctor directly and offered to pay for this unfortunate lady.

Never get his reply on this matter, we had corespondented before, so this left me quite puzzled.

[William Osborne]

your friend sounds like a real Einstein....coming to thailand, no money, no insurance, driving a motorbike pissed

He should count himself fortunate that the doctor interfered with natures natural selection process ....

BTW, i am curious to know, how did he pay for the bike (if it was rented) those guys are usually not so lenient ..

[thaibkk]

just one question, what if this was a poor thai national ?

with 6000 baht salary / month

will he have to pay 200.000 baht wich would mean 33 months (or almost 3 years) of his full time salary ?????

so why farang have to cough up ??????????????????????????????????

poor or illegal sick in many european countries go to hospital for free (taxpayer's money)

[motorhead]

If a Thai (or any foreigner) has an accident in the UK they are treated for free. So stop preaching.

[harrry]

If this was a motor vehicle accident he should be covered by third party.

[up-country_sinclair]

The friend of the OP strikes me as an extremely irresponsible person.

He comes to Thailand without travel insurance (or enough money apparently), and then drives a motorcycle while drunk...without a helmet.

My guess is that the hospital contacted immigration and he won't be allowed to leave the country without settling his bill.

[Theyreallrubbish]

My own experience of this was from 17 years ago so I'm sure things have changed and this is merely how it used to be done.

I was working in a Thai hospital and noticed that a couple of days before discharge patients began getting lots of visitors. And I means lots. Dozens. Being naive I commented to the Thai doctors how nice it was that people came to support them. The doctor laughed and told me that it was friends and extended family turning up to help pay the bill.

When a Thai person knew the size of the bill they would reach out to their entire extended social network to get money to pay it. It was considered an obligation to help by giving at least something so there were lots of people turning up and giving at least a little bit of money. On the assumption of course that if they were in the same position everyone would do the same for them.

I asked what happened if they didn't get enough money and the doctor said they let them leave and hoped to get the rest of the money later. Sometimes they did, sometimes they didn't.

It seemed odd to me at the time that the private health care system ran as a business based on relying on a sense of obligation rather than legally enforceable contracts, but it worked for a long time.

As I say, it probably doesn't work like that now, but it was very charming to see it when it did.

[Treborz]

I know of a british guy from my island currently recovering in a Bangkok hospital after crashing his motorbike in Samui.....he also had no insurance. Whether he was wearing a helmet or under the influence i do not know.

I believe the total cost of his treatment including arrangements for getting him home has exceeded £60,000 sterling due to spinal injuries, a punctured lung and a smashed elbow. He was flown to Bangkok but the hospital refused to carry out anything but the most necessary surgery before receiving a down payment. Luckily for him he has had great suppport from his friends and family back home and they have raised almost all of the cash throughvarious collections and fund raising events.

I think the OP and his friend should make an effort to pay at least half of the bill.

[William Osborne]

still no answer on how the owners of the rented motorbike re-acted when duffus turned up and said he had no money to pay for the damage...

[Treborz]

It doesn't say anywhere that the bike was rented.

[metisdead]

This thread has been running for a week now, no comments from the OP. Totally irresponsible behavior by the guy who had the accident.

[onnut]

If this was a motor vehicle accident he should be covered by third party.

Do'h, he was drunk! Meaning his insurance would of been nul and void.

[onnut]

I know of a british guy from my island currently recovering in a Bangkok hospital after crashing his motorbike in Samui.....he also had no insurance. Whether he was wearing a helmet or under the influence i do not know.

I believe the total cost of his treatment including arrangements for getting him home has exceeded £60,000 sterling due to spinal injuries, a punctured lung and a smashed elbow. He was flown to Bangkok but the hospital refused to carry out anything but the most necessary surgery before receiving a down payment. Luckily for him he has had great suppport from his friends and family back home and they have raised almost all of the cash throughvarious collections and fund raising events.

I think the OP and his friend should make an effort to pay at least half of the bill.

Why do you think the OP should pay the bill?

[citizen33]

I'd guess there is a big difference in the way Americans and Europeans regard a case where life-saving treatment is given free. In an NHS or social health insurance system there is the idea of pooling risk across a population and sharing the cost. In countries with a private insurance system there is usually a high degree of resistance to subsidising the socially disadvantaged (though obviously there is some public provision), and insurance premiums are mostly based on individual actuarial risk. For a Brit like myself, it is a sign of a civilised system to accept some non-payers (even when they clearly should have paid), but for others the immorality of not paying is a bigger issue than the immorality of not treating.

I was talking to a colleague who occupies a senior position in the Thai health care system and has struggled to make the universal coverage health reforms work. He said that Thais are different from Europeans because they do not place the same value on social solidarity (this is not a Marxist term by the way but a word often applied to European systems by policy analysts). According to him this is attributable to Buddhist notions of karma and the idea that people are where they are because of past actions, but I privately wondered whether tambun and traditional obligations might cut the other way. If this story is true, the solidarity principle is not dead in Thailand and I think that is a very good thing.

Edited March 7, 2010 by citizen33

[Thongkorn]

Quick somebody ring the News of the world or the Daily mail in the UK, Bet they will not print Something positive for the Thai Tourist Industry for a change, They only seem to print negative things., If the man has any decency he would at least send some money when he gets Home as a form of gratitude , but then there is still time, I see many Thai people who cannot get medical treatment in there own Country, so it would be a nice gesture.

[Treborz]

I know of a british guy from my island currently recovering in a Bangkok hospital after crashing his motorbike in Samui.....he also had no insurance. Whether he was wearing a helmet or under the influence i do not know.

I believe the total cost of his treatment including arrangements for getting him home has exceeded £60,000 sterling due to spinal injuries, a punctured lung and a smashed elbow. He was flown to Bangkok but the hospital refused to carry out anything but the most necessary surgery before receiving a down payment. Luckily for him he has had great suppport from his friends and family back home and they have raised almost all of the cash throughvarious collections and fund raising events.

I think the OP and his friend should make an effort to pay at least half of the bill.

Why do you think the OP should pay the bill?

Because he was there and saw the hospital in all likeliness save his friends life free of charge. I'm not for one moment suggesting that his friend doesnt reimburse him but between the two of them i'm sure they would be able to pay at least some if not all of the bill quicker.

[BangkokHank]

I was treated last year in the emergency room of a Thai government hospital - the Police General Hospital (for an injury sustained in an attack from an aggressive ladyboy - but that's another story). While I was being treated, I got into a conversation with the only other farang there - an Aussie who had been beaten up pretty badly by an off duty Thai policeman / security guard at a bar when he was accused of not having paid his bill. (He said he paid it but they were trying to extort him.) When it came time to pay his hospital bill, he said he didn't have any money as the cop had taken his wallet. So they rather angrily told him to get out - which he did - without paying. They were clearly not pleased, but at the same time it didn't seem like it was the first time something like that had happened.

As a note, I gladly paid my bill as it was only 1,200 baht for the works. (X-ray; stitching up of a serious cut in my hand; tetanus shot; anti-biotics; etc.) It was the best 1,200 baht I ever spent, although I do think that ladyboy should have paid it.

[sibeymai]

Simple fact is there is no free medical care for farangs in Thailand, in either government or private hospitals.

[jamesthefirst]

Really? The guy spent two weeks in hospital, had some serious, perhaps life-saving surgery and full time care and paid nothing?!

Yes. I still find it hard to believe myself.