Thailand To Jail Foreigners At Political Rallies

[jdinasia]

I'm still planning to go check out the rally this weekend

I will be supporting the red shirts at their rallies on the weekend.

Stay safe please, guys.

Thaksin pulling-out his family is a clear sign, if ever there was one, that this 'peaceful-protest' is not going to stay peaceful.

As I said earlier- having the protest stay peaceful is not part of the government plan. The aim of the game is to crush the red-shirts by an means necessary. And that is exactly why a very large foreigner/foreign media presence is vital. The UDD already have orders for everyone to bring cameras, and they will be filming suspected blue-shirt/special forces moles and turning them over to police. But make no mistake, this government will get away with murder unless their international reputation is on the line.

Here's how it will play out: First the police lines will "collapse" (planned), then the Army will open up with rubber bullets. If the Reds retaliate (which, if enough of them turn up, they might very well try) then the Army will switch to live rounds. 1992 all over again!

Is this all coming from your unsupported "inside" information where supposedly people with the inside scoop are talking around some random foreigner?

You said at first the plan was to issue live ammunition from the beginning etc but now it is rubber bullets? Some reds have been told to bring cameras but it is documented (directly from the Reds) that many have been told to bring weapons. This isn't from random outside sources but directly from red radio in Chiang Mai during live broadcasts.

BTW --- your assumptions about folks that are anti-Thaksin are very very wrong (unless the 5 small beers I have opened in the last 3 months put me into the class you described earlier in this thread

[frogz]

Bad news.....I had already purchased my bozo the clown outfit for this friday

i know just bought a red liverpool top. think had better put that back in the cupbaord

I was going to wear my City top, which is blue, but after Thaksin owning the club...? It may start of blue when I leave the house but be red on my return if things turn nasty.

Let's hope they won't turn nasty.

Edited March 10, 2010 by frogz

[jdinasia]

I only have 2 red shirts (one is a dress shirt that is too warm for Thailand for the most part and the other is a golf shirt. Both will remain in the back of the closet for the forseeable future.

[Spee]

I wish the government in my native land would enforce the immigration and visa laws as rigidly. In the US, illegal immigrants and visa violators are encouraged to join protests, instead of getting tossed out on their tucus for conspiring to incite unrest, in violation of immigration, visa and guest visitor laws.

[TAWP]

I know for a fact that there will be soldiers dressed in civilian clothing and blue-shirts dressed as reds with orders to create reasons for the Thai army to open up on the crowds

If you know it for a fact I am sure you can present the facts that made you know it.

[Jingthing]

I only have 2 red shirts (one is a dress shirt that is too warm for Thailand for the most part and the other is a golf shirt. Both will remain in the back of the closet for the forseeable future.

Mine are now in the rag pile.

[reallyok]

In a country where I have to report my status every 90 days, beside the fact of holding a valid 1 year visa and paying a nice amount of taxes each year, I dont even want to be bothered to go to those Mass Rallies and protest against whatever they, the Red Shirts, protest against (Surpreme Court etc etc.) In a country where "protesters" throw feces in to the PM's House / Residence pretty much sums up most people opinion about these protesters.

The severe drought around the corner is nothing compared to what is planed, allowed and not allowed for the upcoming days. It is time to concentrate on more important issues than migrants showing up to the rallies. Not sure if the American Engineer, Burmese Contruction worker, Philippino Nanny, German Manager, Scottish Teacher or Australian Pub Owner had any strong interest in going there.

This Topic actually deserves a poll on whether some one even had an interest to participate, attend, watch or "show up" at these rallies.

I think the point of the report in the OP isn't to stop the odd farang (no pun intended) from wandering along to join the protest, but to stop any red sympathising employer of a large group of migrant workers from "volunteering" them to go along to the protest. How easy would it be for a factory owner employing, say, 1000 Burmese to tell them they're going to Bangkok to join the demonstration, and if they don't like it they can go home? It also doesn't require a huge leap in thinking to see that such a group could possibly be seen as expendable by the red shirt leadership, opening the way for violence enacted upon them or by them.

Oh C'mon.................Dont really think this will happen as the rich factory owners taking advantage of the poor workers are the very ones who support and finance Abishit and his 'cronies'...........the ruling elite !

[mrtoad]

Bad news.....I had already purchased my bozo the clown outfit for this friday

Don't worry ND - there are plenty of clowns lined up already, and I think you would need a work permit to perform as a clown.

[jdinasia]

Oh C'mon.................Dont really think this will happen as the rich factory owners taking advantage of the poor workers are the very ones who support and finance Abishit and his 'cronies'...........the ruling elite !

Huh? I have seen Abhisit being described as a crony for unnamed groups (by people with no clue) but never as having cronies ... The fact that a LOT of the upcountry "elite" (as if that word means anything) are behind Thaksin isn't a secret, just always conveniently overlooked by the reds on this board. One result of some of Thaksin's populist schemes have been farmers losing their land when those loans they were given came due. This has benefitted many of Thaksin's friends that would actually be amongst the first to lose in any REAL land/wealth redistribution that could take place (Therefore completely unlikely to happen under any Thaksin puppet government.)

[a99az]

This is not going to be good for anyone the sh..... I thinks.

[Jolene]

A non-electoral Government and PM selection process will not be accepted.

Welcome to Thaivisa.

Please gen up on your knowledge before posting again.

Thanks

Attacking the messenger instead of the message evokes images of intellectual vacuity.

Thanks

[citizen33]

Dear oh dear, the international media and educated opinion are going to see things very differently from most on here. I fear that the iron fist is becoming increasingly manifest.

[Jingthing]

Dear oh dear, the international media and educated opinion are going to see things very differently from most on here. I fear that the iron fist is becoming increasingly manifest.

Could you be more specific?

[johncitizen]

There is lots of talk about non-reds dressing up as reds and causing violence, but I wonder if the opposite might be true too. The reds may also turn up in other colours and agitating them to make it look like others started it.

You would have to be open to the possibility of this happening.

There is no need for the government to CRUSH the reds. As soon as the money runs out they will whither away.

Fine for the foreign media to be there to report it in an unbiased way, but unless you are foreigner supporting bringing Thaksin back, then it's far safer to leave it to the media.

Do you actually think that these people want to be killed? The reason they are aiming at such a high turnout is precisely because they DON'T want violence to occur. Think about it. With one million people, you wouldn't need to inflict violence to bring down the government- you would just need to "sit down in the street" so to speak. Peaceful non-compliance will be their greatest weapon.

Violence only becomes a risk when groups of reds get separated from the main crowd, where they are easier targets for agitators or military suppression (again, targeting smaller groups was the same tactics used in 1992.)

And you are on the wrong track about the money- the Thaksin well dried up long ago, thus the asset seizure case hasn't worked out as well as the government had hoped. The UDD is now large enough to fund itself, through merchandising (ie. shirts, hats, bags, sunnies, I've even seen UDD brand rice cookers and bottles of water), competitions, concerts and fundraising. Richer red shirts are sponsoring poorer red shirts, and everyone brings everything they need with them to the rallies. For those of you who have been to one of the mass rallies before, you would know it's like a portable city has just popped up out of nowhere.

[Jingthing]

Shutting down the city for 3 days peacefully wouldn't even begin to be a reason for the government to cave in. It's a small Songkran, a holiday. Tell us a story we can actually believe. The reds have people power from ONE REGION and mostly of specific classes in that region. Such does not make a revolution, at least not a peaceful one.

Edited March 10, 2010 by Jingthing

[jdinasia]

There is lots of talk about non-reds dressing up as reds and causing violence, but I wonder if the opposite might be true too. The reds may also turn up in other colours and agitating them to make it look like others started it.

You would have to be open to the possibility of this happening.

There is no need for the government to CRUSH the reds. As soon as the money runs out they will whither away.

Fine for the foreign media to be there to report it in an unbiased way, but unless you are foreigner supporting bringing Thaksin back, then it's far safer to leave it to the media.

Do you actually think that these people want to be killed? The reason they are aiming at such a high turnout is precisely because they DON'T want violence to occur. Think about it. With one million people, you wouldn't need to inflict violence to bring down the government- you would just need to "sit down in the street" so to speak. Peaceful non-compliance will be their greatest weapon.

Violence only becomes a risk when groups of reds get separated from the main crowd, where they are easier targets for agitators or military suppression (again, targeting smaller groups was the same tactics used in 1992.)

And you are on the wrong track about the money- the Thaksin well dried up long ago, thus the asset seizure case hasn't worked out as well as the government had hoped. The UDD is now large enough to fund itself, through merchandising (ie. shirts, hats, bags, sunnies, I've even seen UDD brand rice cookers and bottles of water), competitions, concerts and fundraising. Richer red shirts are sponsoring poorer red shirts, and everyone brings everything they need with them to the rallies. For those of you who have been to one of the mass rallies before, you would know it's like a portable city has just popped up out of nowhere.

More inaccurate information and another change of information from you. This time they are no longer planning on firing into the crowd but now they will be picking off people outside of the main group! (meaning of course that the people outside of the main group would obviously be armed because saying you saw a gun in a large group of people is different than saying you were fired on from a small group!) Regarding your 1992 remark .... pure b.s.

But again we ask ----- tell us the SOURCE of all your inside info

[johncitizen]

Perhaps it will go on longer than 3 days then

Btw. you are wrong about the ONE REGION. There will be international journalists (including from CNN, Al-Jazeera, and a French television station) embedded in the incoming convoys from 5 different regions (including the South.) A sixth group will be coming from Ayutthaya via a flotilla along the river. The journalists will bear witness that the UDD's intentions are truly peaceful, and will also be filming any attempts at suppression by the military or "third-parties."

Core supporters of the UDD attending the rally have each been issued with ID's. And as of 12:30pm today, I know that almost 50 000 from Bangkok ALONE have already registered. And there's still 4 more days to go...

JD: Save your bluster, mate. I already offered to meet with you in person to discuss all of this with you. If you think I'm going to fire off sources over the MICTnet, you're wrong.

Edited March 10, 2010 by johncitizen

[anotherpeter]

Dear oh dear, the international media and educated opinion are going to see things very differently from most on here. I fear that the iron fist is becoming increasingly manifest.

What the international media will see (most likely) are some violent protests between the reds and the army in an area of Bangkok.

What the international media will show and say is that there are violent protests between the civilians and the army all over Thailand. Which is basically what the reds want.

[Jingthing]

Perhaps it will go on longer than 3 days then

Btw. you are wrong about the ONE REGION. There will be international journalists (including from CNN, Al-Jazeera, and a French television station) embedded in the incoming convoys from 5 different regions (including the South.) A sixth group will be coming from Ayutthaya via a flotilla along the river. The journalists will bear witness that the UDD's intentions are truly peaceful, and will also be filming any attempts at suppression by the military or "third-parties."

Core supporters of the UDD attending the rally have each been issued with ID's. And as of 12:30pm today, I know that almost 50 000 from Bangkok ALONE have already registered. And there's still 4 more days to go...

There are many northern and Isaan people in Bangkok (and Pattaya). More than 3 days? That's what your propaganda says the goal is -- 3 days. So a crack in your line, huh? Say they intend to shut the country down through Songkran. Well then that is not acceptable and you can expect a forceful response. You guys aren't fooling anyone. People can see violence is in the air, coming from the red side. Remember Black Songkran.

[johncitizen]

The OBJECTIVE is to use non-violence to force Abhisit to dissolve the government and call for internationally monitored elections.

The GOAL is to do this in 3 days or less.

There is a difference.

EDIT: @ Jing, to paraphrase Avatar the movie: "It is hard to fill a cup which is already full." You'll believe what you want to believe, and it isn't my job, nor that of the international media, to convince you otherwise.

Edited March 10, 2010 by johncitizen

[jdinasia]

Perhaps it will go on longer than 3 days then

Btw. you are wrong about the ONE REGION. There will be international journalists (including from CNN, Al-Jazeera, and a French television station) embedded in the incoming convoys from 5 different regions (including the South.) A sixth group will be coming from Ayutthaya via a flotilla along the river. The journalists will bear witness that the UDD's intentions are truly peaceful, and will also be filming any attempts at suppression by the military or "third-parties."

Core supporters of the UDD attending the rally have each been issued with ID's. And as of 12:30pm today, I know that almost 50 000 from Bangkok ALONE have already registered. And there's still 4 more days to go...

JD: Save your bluster, mate. I already offered to meet with you in person to discuss all of this with you. If you think I'm going to fire off sources over the MICTnet, you're wrong.

Again no source .....

As I am in CNX within shouting distance of the "red" enclave here I am guessing that you must not be able to understand Thai language for all these things you hear, because they certainly are only propaganda and nothing else.

IP addresses are quite telling

edit to change what city I am actually in (after living in BKK for years it is habit to type that instead of CNX

Edited March 10, 2010 by jdinasia

[anotherpeter]

There is lots of talk about non-reds dressing up as reds and causing violence, but I wonder if the opposite might be true too. The reds may also turn up in other colours and agitating them to make it look like others started it.

You would have to be open to the possibility of this happening.

There is no need for the government to CRUSH the reds. As soon as the money runs out they will whither away.

Fine for the foreign media to be there to report it in an unbiased way, but unless you are foreigner supporting bringing Thaksin back, then it's far safer to leave it to the media.

Do you actually think that these people want to be killed? The reason they are aiming at such a high turnout is precisely because they DON'T want violence to occur. Think about it. With one million people, you wouldn't need to inflict violence to bring down the government- you would just need to "sit down in the street" so to speak. Peaceful non-compliance will be their greatest weapon.

Violence only becomes a risk when groups of reds get separated from the main crowd, where they are easier targets for agitators or military suppression (again, targeting smaller groups was the same tactics used in 1992.)

And you are on the wrong track about the money- the Thaksin well dried up long ago, thus the asset seizure case hasn't worked out as well as the government had hoped. The UDD is now large enough to fund itself, through merchandising (ie. shirts, hats, bags, sunnies, I've even seen UDD brand rice cookers and bottles of water), competitions, concerts and fundraising. Richer red shirts are sponsoring poorer red shirts, and everyone brings everything they need with them to the rallies. For those of you who have been to one of the mass rallies before, you would know it's like a portable city has just popped up out of nowhere.

The people protesting don't want to be killed. I don't think the red leaders seem to care either way.

I agree with you that IF they were able to get a million then they wouldn't need to be violent. The number that they are expecting is dropping well below that though. I did see a quote of a red leader in a newspaper article this morning (on TV) that they were expecting 100,000. But who believes the quotes in newspapers (<- serious comment ... semi-serious anyway).

I just don't see how inciting violence helps the government's cause. They want it to be peaceful. Then it can be ignored. Particularly because it won't be a million people.

It's the red leaders that have been inciting the violence in their speeches. There is much more international media impact if there is violence. The reds will use that to try and show what the "army dictatorship" (or how ever they want to describe the current government and the army) is like.

If (When) there is violence, there will ofcourse be all the rhetoric that it was blues/greens(army)/yellows dressed as reds doing all the violence, but it's a pretty good chance that it will just be reds dressed as reds, or reds dressed as blues/yellows/greens.

[Netfan]

Perhaps it will go on longer than 3 days then

Btw. you are wrong about the ONE REGION. There will be international journalists (including from CNN, Al-Jazeera, and a French television station) embedded in the incoming convoys from 5 different regions (including the South.) A sixth group will be coming from Ayutthaya via a flotilla along the river. The journalists will bear witness that the UDD's intentions are truly peaceful, and will also be filming any attempts at suppression by the military or "third-parties."

Core supporters of the UDD attending the rally have each been issued with ID's. And as of 12:30pm today, I know that almost 50 000 from Bangkok ALONE have already registered. And there's still 4 more days to go...

JD: Save your bluster, mate. I already offered to meet with you in person to discuss all of this with you. If you think I'm going to fire off sources over the MICTnet, you're wrong.

So the international media already know what they are going to report? Funny, because last time out - April, which you have never bothered to address, the media filmed Reds going wild in the streets. No leadership, just drunken mayhem. But it will be different this time? Why? Because the Reds say so? They have a track record and it does not match up with what they are saying.

[neverdie]

Rainman.

I seem to recall you saying that the yellows should be attacked, shot and even killed whilst they were protesting. Funny that you should be concerned about human rights now.

The words pot and black kettle spring to mind.

Thats the best thing about being in the middle of something like this, I dont like either side and have my reasons for it. So sitting on the 'fence' I always find it amusing when a Red poster like Rainman starts jumping up and down about this and that. He does seem very concerned about human rights now, strangely enough he doesnt have any of those concerns when issues get brought up about how thousands were unlawfully killed in drug wars when his almight mate was the PM.....doubt very much human rights concerned him too much then.

Its easy to pick and chose when you want to get all moral on something, isnt it

[elcent]

I'm still planning to go check out the rally this weekend

I will be supporting the red shirts at their rallies on the weekend.

Stay safe please, guys.

Thaksin pulling-out his family is a clear sign, if ever there was one, that this 'peaceful-protest' is not going to stay peaceful.

As I said earlier- having the protest stay peaceful is not part of the government plan. The aim of the game is to crush the red-shirts by an means necessary. And that is exactly why a very large foreigner/foreign media presence is vital. The UDD already have orders for everyone to bring cameras, and they will be filming suspected blue-shirt/special forces moles and turning them over to police. But make no mistake, this government will get away with murder unless their international reputation is on the line.

Here's how it will play out: First the police lines will "collapse" (planned), then the Army will open up with rubber bullets. If the Reds retaliate (which, if enough of them turn up, they might very well try) then the Army will switch to live rounds. 1992 all over again!

There were no rubber bullets in 1992. When they first appeared there was nothing in their guns at all. The second time when they came back they just had them fire into the crowd, apart from the snipers.

[johncitizen]

I stand corrected.