Retro With Side Car Arrived

[guzzi850m2]

After several delays I finally got the Retro. I never ridden/driven a side car MC before so it was a big difference from what I am used to . The "rig" is mainly bought for the wife to go shopping in when I am over seas working.

When out on the first drive I was surprised by the amount of attention the bike got, more so when going on the Harley, but okay a lot of HD's in Pattaya area. When my wife had a go, she declared the rig impossible to ride/drive, so I am going with her inside the village for teaching her for the next 3 days or so. Well the "teacher" is green too so we take it easy in the start. Mixed feelings about the riding, I think using the word driving fells more appropriate , well I will have to get used to it I guess.

The Retro don't come with a owner's manual? Any Retro owners knows anything about this?

I haven't owned a chain driven bike for a long time, which lube is the best to use. Can't find anything here in TV by searching?

[CHdiver]

Congratulations, looks very nice. You may get some Informations about your Bike here Tiger and Sachs Club

[patcat]

congrats to that real nice bike...looks very special and i understand why you got all the attention...the sidecar looks great...and the kid inside too:-)

Owners manual i can't be much help of ...but the link from CHdiver seems very interesting.

happy "driving",

patcat

[Nio]

Very Cool.

After learning how to balance on 2 wheels, adding a side car is a whole new experience

Have to think more like you are driving a car than riding a motorcycle

No leaning required

[guzzi850m2]

Thanks to all for the nice replies.

Gone 46 km so far, going for an oil change tomorrow.

Yes I guess it is more driving than riding, but quite funny actually . 2 kids + 2 adults on board but can still take a lot of shopping so very practical.

Passed 3 BIB check points today wearing my Harley cap, no problems .

[katabeachbum]

Thanks to all for the nice replies.

Gone 46 km so far, going for an oil change tomorrow.

Yes I guess it is more driving than riding, but quite funny actually . 2 kids + 2 adults on board but can still take a lot of shopping so very practical.

Passed 3 BIB check points today wearing my Harley cap, no problems .

looks great

can I ask

is it road legal, IOW seating for 3 in reg book and 3 wheels?

how much was it, and is it all made by Tiger?

is it available with a front disc brake?

[guzzi850m2]

Thanks to all for the nice replies.

Gone 46 km so far, going for an oil change tomorrow.

Yes I guess it is more driving than riding, but quite funny actually . 2 kids + 2 adults on board but can still take a lot of shopping so very practical.

Passed 3 BIB check points today wearing my Harley cap, no problems .

looks great

can I ask

is it road legal, IOW seating for 3 in reg book and 3 wheels? Only bike as far as I know where the side car is actually in the green book so fully road legal , don't know about the seating haven't got the book yet

how much was it, and is it all made by Tiger? 54k incl a 2 year burglar insurance, yes all made by Tiger.

is it available with a front disc brake? Sadly no, brakes are not good on this thing, but at least you got 2 rear drum brakes which helps a little.

[ThunderDuck]

Sadly no, brakes are not good on this thing, but at least you got 2 rear drum brakes which helps a little.

Congratz on your purchase ... looks great!

Edited March 24, 2010 by ThunderDuck

[Garry]

How's it tracking Guzzi, is it pulling/fighting you any particular way at all when moving? You said its a bit hard at times. It may need tweaking

http://www.cyclesidecar.com/Guides/alignment.html

http://www.scooter-sidecars.com/alignment.htm

Edited March 24, 2010 by Garry

[guzzi850m2]

How's it tracking Guzzi, is it pulling/fighting you any particular way at all when moving? You said its a bit hard at times. It may need tweaking

http://www.cyclesidecar.com/Guides/alignment.html

http://www.scooter-sidecars.com/alignment.htm

Thanks for the links Garry, well maybe it pulling slightly to the side car side, but will have to find a nice even straight road to check (that will be difficult to find here ) thoroughly.

[barrybike]

check this one out lol

[guzzi850m2]

I wrote about the bad brakes on my Tiger/sidecar in another topic (Retro has arrived).

Anyway I went to a small bike shop recommended by a Thai friend here in Pattaya, the mechanic looked at the rig and tested the sidecar drum which he could turn by hand when I stepped on the brake (sidecar jacked up). After looking at the system he told me that it will never work, as the sidecar drum is pulled by cable and bike rear drum by a thin iron bar. Same thing regarding the front drum brake, you need a lot of force to get it work properly!! How the fuc_k Tiger got this rig approved is beyond me.

He told me that he will mount a Fino drum brake on the front as it is roughly double size and works fine as rear hand pulled brake on the excellent little Fino city bike.

However today when we went over to pick the rig up he told us that the Retro shaft is thinner compared to the Fino's and it can't be installed unless you make a system of bushes to fit in the drum brake housing. Too complicated for him to do and at least he didn't charge us anything for his time but got a well earned 100 bath tip for his trouble. He also tried other drum braked laying around in his workshop, but no.

He told us that the only option for getting proper brakes on the rig is to mount 2 pcs disk brakes on the rear wheels but that will set us back app. 6000 bath which we declined as I will try more shops when coming back from overseas working in Nov. Month.

So for the time being we ride with only one working brake (same when we bought it) and only do 30 km/h in Pattaya as you can't stop in time if somebody cuts in, in front of you (and they do).

If anybody know a very good small bike shop in Pattaya for modification of drum brakes please let me know.

Tiger Sacks Club: Hope you pass this on to the factory

[Tigersachsclub]

I wrote about the bad brakes on my Tiger/sidecar in another topic (Retro has arrived).

Anyway I went to a small bike shop recommended by a Thai friend here in Pattaya, the mechanic looked at the rig and tested the sidecar drum which he could turn by hand when I stepped on the brake (sidecar jacked up). After looking at the system he told me that it will never work, as the sidecar drum is pulled by cable and bike rear drum by a thin iron bar. Same thing regarding the front drum brake, you need a lot of force to get it work properly!! How the fuc_k Tiger got this rig approved is beyond me.

He told me that he will mount a Fino drum brake on the front as it is roughly double size and works fine as rear hand pulled brake on the excellent little Fino city bike.

However today when we went over to pick the rig up he told us that the Retro shaft is thinner compared to the Fino's and it can't be installed unless you make a system of bushes to fit in the drum brake housing. Too complicated for him to do and at least he didn't charge us anything for his time but got a well earned 100 bath tip for his trouble. He also tried other drum braked laying around in his workshop, but no.

He told us that the only option for getting proper brakes on the rig is to mount 2 pcs disk brakes on the rear wheels but that will set us back app. 6000 bath which we declined as I will try more shops when coming back from overseas working in Nov. Month.

So for the time being we ride with only one working brake (same when we bought it) and only do 30 km/h in Pattaya as you can't stop in time if somebody cuts in, in front of you (and they do).

If anybody know a very good small bike shop in Pattaya for modification of drum brakes please let me know.

Tiger Sacks Club: Hope you pass this on to the factory

Guzzi, you already are member at Tiger/Sachs Forum which is viewed by Tiger Motors ...please post your article there and it will be seen by them,. Did you try to contact the Shop where you ordered your Retro w/sidecar through? Having only 1 working brake is certainly not the way it should be. There is a 3 year or 30000km warranty on it so why not getting the dealer involved? if they are not following up you can also contact me on : [email protected] , but first contact the Dealer you bought it from as i usually & primarily look after those who bought Online... the Tiger/Sachs Forum is already there as tool and you are welcome to use it.

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

[guzzi850m2]

Guzzi, you already are member at Tiger/Sachs Forum which is viewed by Tiger Motors ...please post your article there and it will be seen by them,. Did you try to contact the Shop where you ordered your Retro w/sidecar through? Having only 1 working brake is certainly not the way it should be. There is a 3 year or 30000km warranty on it so why not getting the dealer involved? if they are not following up you can also contact me on : [email protected] , but first contact the Dealer you bought it from as i usually & primarily look after those who bought Online... the Tiger/Sachs Forum is already there as tool and you are welcome to use it.

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

I have been to the dealer twice and they just adjust the brakes and send me on my way again. The brakes are clearly not up to the job. Yes will post in the T/S forum later.

[Tigersachsclub]

Guzzi...ok i understand , seeing that it is not followed by the seller (or not to your satisfaction)you can also send me an email which i than address further in order to get you some help.

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

[CMX]

Guzzi,

You probably know this, but just in case, I have seen that BigBikeBKK has the same sidecar and Retro, and he tears apart and builds bikes for fun. Maybe a PM would get an analysis from a savvy biker. He's on the abovementioned forum too. Last I saw, he did get some satisfaction out of both rear brakes, though mostly others ride I recall.

Edited August 25, 2010 by CMX

[guzzi850m2]

Guzzi,

You probably know this, but just in case, I have seen that BigBikeBKK has the same sidecar and Retro, and he tears apart and builds bikes for fun. Maybe a PM would get an analysis from a savvy biker. He's on the abovementioned forum too. Last I saw, he did get some satisfaction out of both rear brakes, though mostly others ride I recall.

Thanks for the advise, but I been riding big bikes on/off for 30 years and covered over 150K km on them (without major accidents, knock-knock). I am currently riding a HD Road King here in LOS with 3 VERY good disk brakes. I will state that the brakes are under dimensioned on the Retro w side car.

[HDRIDER]

HI

The 3 wheeler looks great, sure that Tiger would/should do something about it as somebody say they have good mechanic and will come to your place if you have problems, how did they get rego on it if it cant brake??

[surayu]

Does anybody knows if it would be possible to get a sidecar for a Yamaha Nouvo MX ?

[JohnLeech]

the sidecar drum is pulled by cable and bike rear drum by a thin iron bar. Same thing regarding the front drum brake, you need a lot of force to get it work properly!! How the fuc_k Tiger got this rig approved is beyond me.

This is far from an ideal solution, as cable brakes (front and sidecar) have far more travel than rod brakes (rear). One solution would appear to be retaining the foot brake pedal to the rear brake only and fitting an additional brake lever for the left hand, connected to the sidecar brake. Cheap, no more than a few hundred baht at most, readily available and easily fitted by most small bike shops, certainly more effective than the current set up, and great for those sharp left hand turns/power slides!

[guzzi850m2]

This is far from an ideal solution, as cable brakes (front and sidecar) have far more travel than rod brakes (rear). One solution would appear to be retaining the foot brake pedal to the rear brake only and fitting an additional brake lever for the left hand, connected to the sidecar brake. Cheap, no more than a few hundred baht at most, readily available and easily fitted by most small bike shops, certainly more effective than the current set up, and great for those sharp left hand turns/power slides!

John, that's the best advise I got so far, thanks. It will not be perfect as the front brake (pulled from right hand lever off course) is very weak. It is still worth trying as it is much cheaper than the 2 rear disk solution the shop mec. suggested.

I am leaving for overseas working on Sunday so no time to do it now, but will try that when I am back in Nov. month unless somebody comes up with a better solution.

[guzzi850m2]

Does anybody knows if it would be possible to get a sidecar for a Yamaha Nouvo MX ?

Yes you can buy one from Tiger, BUT it won't be road legal, the side car will not be in the green book so be prepared for trouble with the police/insurance.

[BigBikeBKK]

Dear Guzzi,

Sorry to hear you're still having problems with the brakes on your Retro, but like mbox said, you've got a 3 year warranty and need to get Tiger to fix it for you because what you're experiencing is certainly not normal.

I agree that the front brake is a very odd contraption, but apparently that's the same kind of brake as the Honda Cub and that's the kind of "Retro" look (and performance) that Tiger is going for. I rarely take the Retro with sidecar over about ~80km/hr and the brakes seem adequate up to that speed. This bike isn't meant to go fast. 60km/hr is a comfortable "cruising" speed for me.

As for the rear brakes I'm able to lock up BOTH rear wheels pretty easily and don't have to exert all that much force on the rear brake pedal to lock them up so it sounds to me like there's definitely something wrong with your bike that Tiger needs to fix.

Hope you can get it sorted! Dare I say you shouldn't ride it until you do! Good luck and keep us posted.

Happy Trails!

Tony

[guzzi850m2]

Hi Tony, I am very surprised that you can lock BOTH rear brakes. My sidecar wheel can be turned by hand when stepping hard on the foot brake and we tried to adjust the cable for the sidecar brake.

No it ain't no racing bike for sure and wasn't bought for that purpose, I think the fastest I ever gone on it (alone) is 70 km/h.

Well my wife will be using it once or twice a week for major shopping when I am gone for work, but she will go very slow.

Well I might try to push the dealer harder to get them to fix it, or try to get somebody from the factory to Pattaya to have a look.

[Tigersachsclub]

Hi Tony, I am very surprised that you can lock BOTH rear brakes. My sidecar wheel can be turned by hand when stepping hard on the foot brake and we tried to adjust the cable for the sidecar brake.

No it ain't no racing bike for sure and wasn't bought for that purpose, I think the fastest I ever gone on it (alone) is 70 km/h.

Well my wife will be using it once or twice a week for major shopping when I am gone for work, but she will go very slow.

Well I might try to push the dealer harder to get them to fix it, or try to get somebody from the factory to Pattaya to have a look.

Guzzi, seen your post on Tiger/Sachs Forum and replied there , also contacted the Factory and expect reply today ( or tomorrow) will let you know more later.....as you leave for overseas would it actually be possible to fix it during that time, or is that only possible in november when you back?

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

[guzzi850m2]

Guzzi, seen your post on Tiger/Sachs Forum and replied there , also contacted the Factory and expect reply today ( or tomorrow) will let you know more later.....as you leave for overseas would it actually be possible to fix it during that time, or is that only possible in november when you back?

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

Thanks for contacting the factory Mbox. Well my wife need the bike when I am gone, but she can be contacted if they decide to come to Pattaya. The sooner we can get it fixed the better.

If necessary I can leave you her phone no.

[thaicbr]

I agree with Tony. Get the factory to sort it out. That's the benefit of buying Tiger. Also you say that it spins the wheel while the side car is tilted up so that may or may not affect the brake rod/cable. But for sure if Tony's is working ok then its defiantly fixable.

Also the front brake 'strangeness'has been well documented that's what you get when you go 'Retro'.

Its also one of the reasons why i did not get a retro for my girlfriend. I believe they should offer one with a disc option or a drum option on a standard telescopic fork so with out the trailing link fork.

[Richard-BKK]

The wheel on a sidecar needs less braking power compared to the rear wheel brake, otherwise the vehicle becomes unstable, possible very dangerous as the motorcycle wants to move left without losing enough momentum making it possible that you flip over.

I not suggest that the brakes on the Tiger Retro 110 are okay, that would be impossible to diagnose from behind my desk. But at Honda they tested a Honda Scoopy-i with a sidecar, and found that if all brakes worked 100% the bike with sidecar was a death trap, the whole vehicle became stable while braking when the sidecar wheel didn't brake (what isn't exactly acceptable with the Thai law) so braking power on the sidecar was limited until the whole thing became acceptable safe.

As the law of physics applies to Honda in the same way as it will apply to Tiger, it is likely that Tiger also limited the sidecar braking power. And on the Scoopy-i it is possible that the rear wheel is 100% blocked but you still able to move the wheel on the sidecar.

For the people who will reply on where I can buy a Scoopy-i with sidecar, Honda determined that there is no market for a 110cc scooter with sidecar. So, with this we can conclude that not all research by Honda and Tiger lead the the same result...

[katabeachbum]

<BR>The wheel on a sidecar needs less braking power compared to the rear wheel brake, otherwise the vehicle becomes unstable, possible very dangerous as the motorcycle wants to move left without losing enough momentum making it possible that you flip over.<BR><BR>I not suggest that the brakes on the Tiger Retro 110 are okay, that would be impossible to diagnose from behind my desk. But at Honda they tested a Honda Scoopy-i with a sidecar, and found that if all brakes worked 100% the bike with sidecar was a death trap, the whole vehicle became stable while braking when the sidecar wheel didn't brake (what isn't exactly acceptable with the Thai law) so braking power on the sidecar was limited until the whole thing became acceptable safe.<BR><BR>As the law of physics applies to Honda in the same way as it will apply to Tiger, it is likely that Tiger also limited the sidecar braking power. And on the Scoopy-i it is possible that the rear wheel is 100% blocked but you still able to move the wheel on the sidecar.<BR><BR>For the people who will reply on where I can buy a Scoopy-i with sidecar, Honda determined that there is no market for a 110cc scooter with sidecar. So, with this we can conclude that not all research by Honda and Tiger lead the the same result...<BR>

<BR><BR>as for all cars and bikes, most braking power is on the front wheel(s). I love the look of this side car bike, but without a front disc, it just isnt for me. Ill have to stick to my trailer on auto bike with front disc:) <BR><BR> Edited August 26, 2010 by katabeachbum

[Tigersachsclub]

Guzzi, seen your post on Tiger/Sachs Forum and replied there , also contacted the Factory and expect reply today ( or tomorrow) will let you know more later.....as you leave for overseas would it actually be possible to fix it during that time, or is that only possible in november when you back?

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox

Thanks for contacting the factory Mbox. Well my wife need the bike when I am gone, but she can be contacted if they decide to come to Pattaya. The sooner we can get it fixed the better.

If necessary I can leave you her phone no.

Guzzi, you got an feedback from Khun Pariya at Tiger/Sachs Forum ...need your name, address (maybe phone nr too) as they will send some staff to check your Retro w/sidecar.

Tiger/Sachs Club - Mbox