The Ether Has Worn Off

[siamtraveler2010]

I have been a lurker on this post for awhile and finally am giving in to joining and posting, even though there is no answer or solution, maybe just to vent to a crowd that understands the Thai's and their culture.

I was transferred here for my work about a year and a half ago, and like most western men, fell in love with every thin, pretty Thai girl that smiles at me, but now seems to have no effect. It seems to always turn out the same, you meet a nice girl, hit it off, no complications, just like in our culture, blah, blah, and then it starts, some friend or family member worms their way onto a date, and being the good natured people we normally are because that is the way we are raised, we just go with the flow and the date extortion begins. Then, someone from her school, family, from the village, starts all the questions!!! "Why falong (a word I have learned to hate) don't marry you?" "Why he don't have car?" "Why he don't give 200,000-2 million Baht to the family for marriage?" etc and start to feed the poor girls mind with all the trash that has developed from this culture of foreigners living, working, travelling, vacationing etc in Thailand. The end result, is we are made out to be stingy, bad men because we are using our heads, taking into consideration the World economy, the fact we live in a foreign Country and need to be cautious about most financial things we do etc.

I love Thailand, as a Country it has everything a person could want, it is easy to get around, but why is it so difficult to just have a normal relationship with a girl, where you take time and get to know her and find out if you are compatible??? It seems that for a Thai girl and her family, just being a foreigner with an ATM card is enough! Call me a bad man if I am not willing to sign a lease to take care of a Thai girl and her family for X amount of years and X amount of money!!! That seems to take out all the fun, trust and romance and I am to the point where it just seems easier to just avoid Thai girls (and the groups of Thai men who seem to do nothing but sit around and drink beer and whisky all night and only want to befriend you for more liquor, I will work my way up to that post later)

At this point, since I am commited to being here for quite a few more years, my only options are:

1 Just date a Thai girl until the BS starts and then move on to the next one

2 Become a Monk!

3 Find a girl from another Country and bring her here!

4 Many unknown options!

Anyway, at least I feel better venting. I see people on the forum that have had all kinds of results. I am mostly curious how others feel after dealing with all this, do you just become numb to it all? Or just give in and go with the flow knowing the consequeces? Or just keep trying and hope to have the success others have seemed to find?

Ok, enough ranting, I am just going to go have a beer and fuggitabouddit!!! I just feel like I have somehow entered the "Twilight Zone" because zero people from our culture can seem to even fathom what goes on here!

[IanForbes]

So tell us something we DON'T already know. Rentals are fun... but you DO have to realize that they ARE rentals. Every relationship EVERYWHERE comes at a price. It could be your freedom: it could be the money you have in your wallet at the time: it could be having to do something you don't WANT to do just to please the little lady, or, it could be every last nickle you ever hope to make in the next 20 years. You've got to understand that before you play the game. There ARE some rewards if you like children, and occasionally a guy gets lucky enough to marry a woman who has more than he has... and she's attractive as well. But, for every one of those there are 500 of the other kind.

[slapout]

I call it the expert syndrome. Notice that many that hang on, join the party, etc, seem to be an expert on just about every subject mentioned. If they have experienced, observed, heard comments/rumors, or any of their immediate family (thru 4th removed cousins) have any of these experiences , then they offer advice to all who will listen and even those who will not. You have met the individual who you calculate must be older than dirt to have experienced all that he says. Ask these people about 'Big Bang' and see if they tell you 'that is a personal matter between me and my soul mate' or other thoughtful answers and continue on with life.

[sokal]

Date a girl in America for a year or 2 and you will be slowly pushed into getting married. How is it any different in Thailand ?

[phetaroi]

Where are you meeting all these girls?

[a2396]

Date a girl in America for a year or 2 and you will be slowly pushed into getting married. How is it any different in Thailand ?

No so !! Nothing like Thailand. Many American women don't want married & want to stay single and FREE. Normally, their families and parents don't have their nose stuck in the woman's relationship from the beginning, trying to manipulate things to their advantage. I dated my first wife (American) for 10 years before we got married. If you can't see the difference between Thailand and most western counties about this, you really have got blinders on.

[a2396]

My advice is just to keep searching. Sooner or later you will find one who is capable of independent thinking. I have two close friends (Thai girls) who seem to fit my requirements. Neither is obsessed with marriage. One I give money to and one I have never given any. One is very loving and 100% giving with her emotions and sincerity. The other is one who I would like a closer relationship with but cannot, even after two years. She is quite a complex person but with many good qualities none-the-less.

I would make it clear from the beginning that you are not interested in being "railroaded" into a quick marriage and that you expect that she (the woman) has some capability in independence in making her own decisions, She should also have some motivation to hold down a job and a reasonable level of education and intelligence.

[Curt1591]

Sounds like you simply wish to find someone to occupy your time until you split.

Renting is the obvious solution.

[jackr]

Learn a bit of Thai and check out the banks and upper-end supermarkets while not donning shorts, vest and raggedy shoes.

[Tejas]

Sounds like you simply wish to find someone to occupy your time until you split.

Renting is the obvious solution.

Many expats take 10, 20, 30 years to get to where you are at.

I can't count the number of male idiots who have gone down the "must save her and her family because she is so sweet and kind" road.

Then, after marriage, the horns start to grow on top of their heads.

I sit with expats almost every day and we laugh at the "newbies." We know the mistakes they are about to make.

Solution: No commitment...........short time and see ya!

Cold? Yes. Sorry ladies.

[Loz]

Was going to say I am curious about the OP's age and profession but it matters not a jot, really.

I arrived at the same destination, mate. I'm a thirty-something brit used to dating independent articulate women (and some smoking hot duffers!) and thai women, even the ones I still can like are just not interesting to me. And truth me told, I am pretty sure I am not interesting to them.

Last night I was composing a post in my head about this girl who works in a place that I eat at. She is kinda pretty and has a sheepish nieve look to her. She is always polite but brief. Not flirtatious at all. She's probably mid twenties and here is the rub. I keep trying to find her attractive. I mean I WANT to find her attractive, but I just can't! She is slim and doesn't dress like a pro. You'd think guys would be all over her but I have never seen one near her. She seems to work ALL THE TIME. And still, I can't even get a 1/4 chubby thinking about her. I caught myself thinking, WHY THE CHUFF am I even trying to find her attractive?

My thoughts now are just leave them be. They don't have anything I want that I can't get from a decent propper massage.

[givenall]

So tell us something we DON'T already know. Rentals are fun... but you DO have to realize that they ARE rentals. Every relationship EVERYWHERE comes at a price. It could be your freedom: it could be the money you have in your wallet at the time: it could be having to do something you don't WANT to do just to please the little lady, or, it could be every last nickle you ever hope to make in the next 20 years. You've got to understand that before you play the game. There ARE some rewards if you like children, and occasionally a guy gets lucky enough to marry a woman who has more than he has... and she's attractive as well. But, for every one of those there are 500 of the other kind.

I agree with this post but, I always wondered why the man is one in the bottom and has to do all. I want to know if is there anyone one or ones lucky enough that a Thai gal is renting or doing all these for a farang guy?

Edited March 25, 2010 by givenall

[noise]

Where are you meeting all these girls?

That is a very astute question. The OP made it sound like he has gone through many "girl friends" in just 1 1/2 years. It is hard to build a good cross cultural meaningful relationship in that amount of time, specially when one does not speak the language and does not fully know/understand the culture. Now, financial relationships, on the other hand.......

Edited March 25, 2010 by noise

[Ulysses G.]

I agree with this post but, I always wondered why the man is one in the bottom and has to do all. I want to know if is there anyone one or ones lucky enough that a Thai gal is renting or doing all these for a farang guy?

I know several handsome farangs who are being supported by wealthy Thai women and, over the years, have seen a numbers of pros take on farang boy toys that they "kept" for a long period of time.

[a2396]

Where are you meeting all these girls?

That is a very astute question. The OP made it sound like he has gone through many "girl friends" in just 1 1/2 years. It is hard to build a good cross cultural meaningful relationship in that amount of time, specially when one does not speak the language and does not fully know/understand the culture. Now, financial relationships, on the other hand.......

The OP is talking about meeting "nice" girls, so maybe we can assume he is not trolling the bars & parlors. It should not take over a year to get the "lay of the land" here about dating and relationships. The language barrier is a problem. 95% of the women I encounter cannot speak English, or very little of it. In my opinion, it is better to look for a girl with some passable English, than to to try to learn Thai, unless you have some talent for foreign language. It would take years to learn adequate Thai to go sparring with some of these ladies. Presumably, these women have had 12 years of schooling in English, if they did not sleep their way through class.

[bunta71]

I never listened to my Father. He always told me "If it flies, floats or f**ks. rent it!" So far I have owned several boats, two airplanes and two wives have owned me... always listen to your father. Give him a call.

Edited March 25, 2010 by bunta71

[Ulysses G.]

Your father is a wise man indeed.

[bunta71]

I knew being the scholar you are that you would indeed agree with Dad.

[sbk]

Oh dear, I hope this isn't going to turn into yet another woman hating/bashing thread.

OP is having dating difficulties. Perhaps he should try a little less hard. Perhaps he should take classes and meet people that way. He doesn't mention where and how he meets this multitude of dates, so maybe he's not looking in the right places.

Perhaps the OP also needs to grasp Thai culture a little better. At least among the Thais I know (and maybe city Thais are different) but a long term serious relationship is expected to lead to marriage. And yes, they leap into these things far more quickly than we do in the West. But, its the way things work here IME and if you aren't willing to at least understand their rules then perhaps you should get out of the game.

[Ulysses G.]

I don't hate woman at all, but I have come to realize that I am pretty much only physically attracted to the much less honorable ones and have no amorous interest in the good kind - it is my problem, not theirs.

However, that is why I prefer relationships that are only short time.

Edited March 25, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[jubby]

Was going to say I am curious about the OP's age and profession but it matters not a jot, really.

I arrived at the same destination, mate. I'm a thirty-something brit used to dating independent articulate women (and some smoking hot duffers!) and thai women, even the ones I still can like are just not interesting to me. And truth me told, I am pretty sure I am not interesting to them.

Last night I was composing a post in my head about this girl who works in a place that I eat at. She is kinda pretty and has a sheepish nieve look to her. She is always polite but brief. Not flirtatious at all. She's probably mid twenties and here is the rub. I keep trying to find her attractive. I mean I WANT to find her attractive, but I just can't! She is slim and doesn't dress like a pro. You'd think guys would be all over her but I have never seen one near her. She seems to work ALL THE TIME. And still, I can't even get a 1/4 chubby thinking about her. I caught myself thinking, WHY THE CHUFF am I even trying to find her attractive?

My thoughts now are just leave them be. They don't have anything I want that I can't get from a decent propper massage.

To the OP. keep on doing what your doing, your obviously not stupid like a lot of us. Maybe, Someday someone will be able to see through all the Bullshit from family and friends and like you for who you are. I guess it is difficult, I've observed quite a few times a thai will say something that they've heard to a group of thai friends thats really ridiculous but everyone seems to believe it. Its like sheep mentality. OK, I'm not generalising , its my experience. Maybe one day you'll meet someone who's not a sheep so to speak.

I'm intrigued by Loz's post. I'm pretty sure I would find her attractive. Seriously, whats different to her and the massage Girls ?, you'll have to spell it out. I've honestly never had more than a real massage. Is it possible that if you were to ask her on a date, she just might turn up dressed differently etc. and give you the horn or turn out to be a total Nympho. why not give it a try and ask her out or is it something deeper

[robblok]

Oh dear, I hope this isn't going to turn into yet another woman hating/bashing thread.

OP is having dating difficulties. Perhaps he should try a little less hard. Perhaps he should take classes and meet people that way. He doesn't mention where and how he meets this multitude of dates, so maybe he's not looking in the right places.

Perhaps the OP also needs to grasp Thai culture a little better. At least among the Thais I know (and maybe city Thais are different) but a long term serious relationship is expected to lead to marriage. And yes, they leap into these things far more quickly than we do in the West. But, its the way things work here IME and if you aren't willing to at least understand their rules then perhaps you should get out of the game.

SBK don't you know the woman are the root of all evil in this world ?

I would advise the guy to look at a different kind of woman. Maybe he wants too much him being old and wanting a young pretty girl then you can be expected to pay. If you just date within your one age group (and a lil below) you can find plenty girls that are looking for a guy and not for money.

[a2396]

Oh dear, I hope this isn't going to turn into yet another woman hating/bashing thread.

OP is having dating difficulties. Perhaps he should try a little less hard. Perhaps he should take classes and meet people that way. He doesn't mention where and how he meets this multitude of dates, so maybe he's not looking in the right places.

Perhaps the OP also needs to grasp Thai culture a little better. At least among the Thais I know (and maybe city Thais are different) but a long term serious relationship is expected to lead to marriage. And yes, they leap into these things far more quickly than we do in the West. But, its the way things work here IME and if you aren't willing to at least understand their rules then perhaps you should get out of the game.

There are some exceptions to the "Thai way" that you mention. One the ladies that I mentioned in my post lived with her BF (Thai) in BKK for 4 years and never told her parents. She eventually split with him for the usual reason, he had another lady. The other one I mentioned is a bit more complicated, but she is not "obsessed" with marriage either. Both are very attractive and in their 20's. What's most important is that both people are comfortable with a mutually agreed upon set of conditions for their relationship. This should be free from meddling family members, who are usually pursuing a financial agenda or "hide-bound" to Thai traditions of the past. Just because the man is living in Thailand, does not mean he needs to dance to the local music and wind up later married into a situation he would have never done in his own country. There are also plenty of Thai men who enjoy serious relationships with women that do not lead to marriage, at least not a quick one. It is when a Farang appears on the scene that the cash registers start ringing, usually with the girl's family.

[sokal]

Date a girl in America for a year or 2 and you will be slowly pushed into getting married. How is it any different in Thailand ?

No so !! Nothing like Thailand. Many American women don't want married & want to stay single and FREE. Normally, their families and parents don't have their nose stuck in the woman's relationship from the beginning, trying to manipulate things to their advantage. I dated my first wife (American) for 10 years before we got married. If you can't see the difference between Thailand and most western counties about this, you really have got blinders on.

So the girls that you have had relationships with in the US want to stay single ? then why where they with you ?

American girls like to lie about taking the pill, that is their way of getting you. I would prefer the Thai way over that.

[a2396]

Times they are a changin' !! Believe it or not, there is change on the horizon in the region (East Asia). See the attached article about women in Korea and the conflicts they have to face between working and marriage. A quote from the article as follows: "The no-husband, no-baby trend has become a demographic epidemic in East Asia. Among the 10 countries or territories with the world's lowest fertility rates, six are in the Asia-Pacific region, according to a 2008 CIA ranking. From Japan to Singapore, the percentage of women who remain single into their mid-30s is rising at historically unprecedented rates".

Sooner or later Thailand will also be dragged from the 19th century to the 21st.

South_Korean_women_put_off_marriage_and_childbirth.rtf

[myrealprofit]

Was going to say I am curious about the OP's age and profession but it matters not a jot, really.

I arrived at the same destination, mate. I'm a thirty-something brit used to dating independent articulate women (and some smoking hot duffers!) and thai women, even the ones I still can like are just not interesting to me. And truth me told, I am pretty sure I am not interesting to them.

Last night I was composing a post in my head about this girl who works in a place that I eat at. She is kinda pretty and has a sheepish nieve look to her. She is always polite but brief. Not flirtatious at all. She's probably mid twenties and here is the rub. I keep trying to find her attractive. I mean I WANT to find her attractive, but I just can't! She is slim and doesn't dress like a pro. You'd think guys would be all over her but I have never seen one near her. She seems to work ALL THE TIME. And still, I can't even get a 1/4 chubby thinking about her. I caught myself thinking, WHY THE CHUFF am I even trying to find her attractive?

My thoughts now are just leave them be. They don't have anything I want that I can't get from a decent propper massage.

To the OP. keep on doing what your doing, your obviously not stupid like a lot of us. Maybe, Someday someone will be able to see through all the Bullshit from family and friends and like you for who you are. I guess it is difficult, I've observed quite a few times a thai will say something that they've heard to a group of thai friends thats really ridiculous but everyone seems to believe it. Its like sheep mentality. OK, I'm not generalising , its my experience. Maybe one day you'll meet someone who's not a sheep so to speak.

I'm intrigued by Loz's post. I'm pretty sure I would find her attractive. Seriously, whats different to her and the massage Girls ?, you'll have to spell it out. I've honestly never had more than a real massage. Is it possible that if you were to ask her on a date, she just might turn up dressed differently etc. and give you the horn or turn out to be a total Nympho. why not give it a try and ask her out or is it something deeper

I am afraid to say, but I think you confirmed what I already knew, and I think I picked the right word for the syndrom "Ether!!!" I guess I am just oblivious to what foreign men, and Thai men for that matter, seem to be under the spell of!! Without exaggerating, it seems like every week, I hear about a co-workers friend, themselves, family member etc, who was bitten hard by a Vampire, but swears up and down, they never saw her teeth!! OK, bad analogy, but probably too close to the truth!

Anyway, I mostly posted just to vent, but I am surprised that I have gotten some good responses! And yes, I think I will just keep playing the field, I mean really, what more could a guy ask for, a date with a different pretty Thai girl every night in the meantime, and if Mrs Right comes along, all the better, but I am getting to the point where I just don't like complications, so marriage is probably not in the cards for me I guess! Maybe I need to find a Geisha girl, silent, walks 3 paces behind me!!! (Ok, to the ladies, I am just trying to lighten things up)

[TheLaughingMan]

Date a girl in America for a year or 2 and you will be slowly pushed into getting married. How is it any different in Thailand ?

No so !! Nothing like Thailand. Many American women don't want married & want to stay single and FREE. Normally, their families and parents don't have their nose stuck in the woman's relationship from the beginning, trying to manipulate things to their advantage. I dated my first wife (American) for 10 years before we got married. If you can't see the difference between Thailand and most western counties about this, you really have got blinders on.

So the girls that you have had relationships with in the US want to stay single ? then why where they with you ?

American girls like to lie about taking the pill, that is their way of getting you. I would prefer the Thai way over that.

Uh ya... in ALABAMA. Maybe don't date rednecks?

[a2396]

Date a girl in America for a year or 2 and you will be slowly pushed into getting married. How is it any different in Thailand ?

No so !! Nothing like Thailand. Many American women don't want married & want to stay single and FREE. Normally, their families and parents don't have their nose stuck in the woman's relationship from the beginning, trying to manipulate things to their advantage. I dated my first wife (American) for 10 years before we got married. If you can't see the difference between Thailand and most western counties about this, you really have got blinders on.

So the girls that you have had relationships with in the US want to stay single ? then why where they with you ?

American girls like to lie about taking the pill, that is their way of getting you. I would prefer the Thai way over that.

They were with me because they liked me, not because they were "hel_l-bent" to get married. Never saw on lie about taking the pill. Most woman with half a brain would know such kind of trickery is going to backfire, in one form or another.