Red-Shirts Blamed For Gunfights, Bomb Attacks

[LuckyFive8888]

One thing to be paid to gather at a site and march around - another thing being shot. It's obvious to all this isn't about Khun T as most people on here once thought.

brit, you kept saying that it is not about thaksin. what do you think the outcome be if the Reds win this fight?

New election = return power to the people.

so i wonder why the reds refuse to have 9 months house dissolution. they would had have a guaranteed new election in 9 months and nobody would have died.

[way2muchcoffee]

The video can still be seen here.

http://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.co...elieve-panitan/

Finally saw it ... doesn't look like that hit came from the direction of the military at all!

It's difficult for me to tell where the military are. At the beginning of the video it appears they are all facing to the right of the road they are standing on. They are facing the barricades. Perhaps they are looking down a small soi? I can't tell. Then within a second or two they turn left and move forward down the street. At this point it appears that the security forces are directly down the soi with most redshirts are facing forward. We see there backs.

So where exactly are the military positioned?

Edited April 11, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[LuckyFive8888]

The video can still be seen here.

http://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.co...elieve-panitan/

Finally saw it ... doesn't look like that hit came from the direction of the military at all!

IMHO, the bullet came from behind (he was facing backward) and took his skull off.

Let not argue about this. But you can I are not expert.

Let's the expert conclude.

you don't need an expert to conclude were the bullet came from. it was very obvious the way he fell.

[Insight]

chantorn - IMHO there appears to be a "hardcore" taking shots at both soldiers and reds, but supported by red shirt guards.

If this is ever proven will it change your opinion about the movement?

[bubba]

The video can still be seen here.

http://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.co...elieve-panitan/

Finally saw it ... doesn't look like that hit came from the direction of the military at all!

IMHO, the bullet came from behind (he was facing backward) and took his skull off.

Let not argue about this. But you can I are not expert.

Let's the expert conclude.

you don't need an expert to conclude were the bullet came from. it was very obvious the way he fell.

Looks at where the bits of his skull and brain landed - in a trail to the front and left. The bullet came from behind and to his right, although the action from the troops to which you can see them reacting is towards the front.

And here is the same man in a photo that was later released by the red shirts as evidence that he had been shot. Interestingly, with the barrel of a weapon in the frame.

Edited April 11, 2010 by bubba

[tracymeaw]

Abhisit pride is worth more than the blood filled streets of Bangkok. Some trolls on this forum like to repeatedly call the redshirts terrorist, insurgents, thugs, etc. A person of this description would not provide aid to a wounded foe and certainly would not return seized weapons (later to be used against them). If it were the Redshirts that wanted to provoke a violent response, they would not hand over weapons. Abhisit is the failed leader that has fueled the violence which has resulted in needless loss of life. He cut media outlets and ordered the most brutal attacks under the cover of darkness in an attempt to hide proof of the inhumane acts against unarmed citizens. Too bad for Abhisit, this is the age of digital cameras, tweets and iphones. Hard to hide the murders these days too because protesters willingly surrender their id cards before coming to Bangkok in case they turn up killed/missing, or both. Today in various news reports, Abhisit claimed the Army had been authorized to fire live rounds over protesters heads. An M16 rifle has an effective range of approx 600 yards... it would take a mindless idiot to authorize troops to fire live rounds over protesters heads in a densely populated urban environment. The man waving the flag (shot through chest) and another instance of a man holding a flag (headshot) are all the proof we need that the soldiers did not fire over their heads. It dosnt really matter which direction the bullet came from! This is all the proof we need that Abhisit is responsible for the senseless murders of innocent unarmed civilians.

Warning Graphic content:

Unarmed civilian shot through chest:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8613482.stm

Unarmed civilian shot through head:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpARrZG7_qw...player_embedded

[Richard W]

The video can still be seen here.

http://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.co...elieve-panitan/

Finally saw it ... doesn't look like that hit came from the direction of the military at all!

The general opinion is that he was hit in the back of the head. From the apparent lack of facial injuries, I surmise (TV instant forensics here!) he was hit from his side. Now, when last seen, he was looking 135 degrees from the soldiers. He was standing very close to a man in a green shirt, and could very easily have bounced off him as he fell. Note that his brains fell out as he fell, rather than being blown out by the bullet (or whatever).

[LuckyFive8888]

The video can still be seen here.

http://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.co...elieve-panitan/

Finally saw it ... doesn't look like that hit came from the direction of the military at all!

It's difficult for me to tell where the military are. At the beginning of the video it appears they are all facing to the right of the road they are standing on. They are facing the barricades. Perhaps they are looking down a small soi? I can't tell. Then within a second or two they turn left and move forward down the street. At this point it appears that the security forces are directly down the soi with most redshirts are facing forward. We see there backs.

So where exactly are the military positioned?

certainly not were the bullet came from as the activity is more like in the front of the crowd.

[noel2499rk]

BUBBA

The picture is obviously taken later after the body has been moved, is this guy one of the bodies that was taken to hospital and then removed from hospital by reds.

[snorkelador]

Abhisit pride is worth more than the blood filled streets of Bangkok. Some trolls on this forum like to repeatedly call the redshirts terrorist, insurgents, thugs, etc. A person of this description would not provide aid to a wounded foe and certainly would not return seized weapons (later to be used against them). If it were the Redshirts that wanted to provoke a violent response, they would not hand over weapons. Abhisit is the failed leader that has fueled the violence which has resulted in needless loss of life. He cut media outlets and ordered the most brutal attacks under the cover of darkness in an attempt to hide proof of the inhumane acts against unarmed citizens. Too bad for Abhisit, this is the age of digital cameras, tweets and iphones. Hard to hide the murders these days too because protesters willingly surrender their id cards before coming to Bangkok in case they turn up killed/missing, or both. Today in various news reports, Abhisit claimed the Army had been authorized to fire live rounds over protesters heads. An M16 rifle has an effective range of approx 600 yards... it would take a mindless idiot to authorize troops to fire live rounds over protesters heads in a densely populated urban environment. The man waving the flag (shot through chest) and another instance of a man holding a flag (headshot) are all the proof we need that the soldiers did not fire over their heads. It dosnt really matter which direction the bullet came from! This is all the proof we need that Abhisit is responsible for the senseless murders of innocent unarmed civilians.

Warning Graphic content:

Unarmed civilian shot through chest:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8613482.stm

Unarmed civilian shot through head:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpARrZG7_qw...player_embedded

How about the M79 grenades fired, hand grenades and petrol bombs thrown into the armed forces, people with assault rifles etc. walking amongst the reds? What role did they play in the bloodshed yesterday? What would the government be gaining from some operation like the one yesterday?

[grandpops]

Change of tactics by the apologists

Looks like they are going for a good old fashioned conspiracy theory. And because Animatic and a few newbies are regurgitatinng what JD is saying... it must be true.

Looks from the evidence like the army moved in with Tanks and not as a retaliation to some imagined attack from red shirts. The EVIDENCE is there, lines of tanks on video with reporters and reds crawling all over them.

It was a planned attack on the Reds Stage and was repelled. How many conscripts and police have relatives in Red Shirts? Probably most of them.

The strength of the resistance to this all out assault must have shaken the installed Government to its core.

Time to move on Abhisit and plan a come back in 10 years time when the stains of the peoples blood you put on the Bangkok Streets has started to fade. Remember, these reds have left their farms to sort out yours and you cronies corruption and nepotism. They are on away terrirotory and have shown you just what is possible should you try to cling on to power.

Just watch these sick Bangkok soap operas and dramas with all the elites in their lovely mansions with 2 or four cars and lots of servants. Then compare it to the real people who live on less than 200 baht per day.... if they are luck enough to have a job that actually pays. Real contrast and the people seem to have had enough of it.

[hpl]

We can argue all day long who's fault it is, but there is enough blame to go around for everyone!

More so with the red shirted Sae Daeng and his murderous Ronin warriors.

[bkkjames]

Change of tactics by the apologists

Looks like they are going for a good old fashioned conspiracy theory. And because Animatic and a few newbies are regurgitatinng what JD is saying... it must be true.

Looks from the evidence like the army moved in with Tanks and not as a retaliation to some imagined attack from red shirts. The EVIDENCE is there, lines of tanks on video with reporters and reds crawling all over them.

It was a planned attack on the Reds Stage and was repelled. How many conscripts and police have relatives in Red Shirts? Probably most of them.

The strength of the resistance to this all out assault must have shaken the installed Government to its core.

Time to move on Abhisit and plan a come back in 10 years time when the stains of the peoples blood you put on the Bangkok Streets has started to fade. Remember, these reds have left their farms to sort out yours and you cronies corruption and nepotism. They are on away terrirotory and have shown you just what is possible should you try to cling on to power.

Just watch these sick Bangkok soap operas and dramas with all the elites in their lovely mansions with 2 or four cars and lots of servants. Then compare it to the real people who live on less than 200 baht per day.... if they are luck enough to have a job that actually pays. Real contrast and the people seem to have had enough of it.

Nice fabel, while adding up the wealth of the elitests, let's add up the wealth of the red leadership. The last time you had one in power, all he gave your poor people was 30 baht healthcare and a bunch of money which they promptly gambled away no?

[eurasianthai]

How about the M79 grenades fired, hand grenades and petrol bombs thrown into the armed forces, people with assault rifles etc. walking amongst the reds? What role did they play in the bloodshed yesterday? What would the government be gaining from some operation like the one yesterday?

Well, as we say in French, if you do not want to get burned, do not play with fire.

I actually did not see any hand grenades, petrol bombs, ... thrown at anybobody BEFORE the army intervened.

[tangcoral]

Out of curiosity, how would this been handled by the west, namely the US if shots were fired by a group of couple thousand protesters? Would live ammunition be fired back to the crowd? Or a sniper team will wait to identify the subject and fire in a densely packed area?

[hawthorne]

This Thread should not have been opened as it is in Contradiction with the aim of what the Nation has written in "our darkest day".

Yesterday morning, before any incident, I have underlined that Army should stay in its barracks because Army is a symbol of National Unity and should not be used against any fellow citizen- only reserved to external threats.

Young soldiers with several rounds of rubber and some (for warning) live ones, can confuse easily in the heat of a battle. Once everything begins to degenerate, everybody is warming up and the situatiion is escalading on both sides.

The decision to engage army (reluctant initially to be involved) is the key to this tragic saturday.

People engaged in a battle are loosing restraints it is well known: this kind of situation nearly always is degenerating.

The real responsability belongs to those who have created the situation, not to the fighters.

ARMY should have never been involved in this action.

I totally disagree with your opinion

The ARMY had to be engaged

I second that opion that the army was justified to protect the innocent people around BKK and the huge losses to investments that are being destroyed by these CRIMNINALS and now Terrorists.

[tangcoral]

Just watch these sick Bangkok soap operas and dramas with all the elites in their lovely mansions with 2 or four cars and lots of servants. Then compare it to the real people who live on less than 200 baht per day.... if they are luck enough to have a job that actually pays. Real contrast and the people seem to have had enough of it.

Arent most soap operas in the west based on the wealthy as well? I dont think the audience are drawn to the poor.

[TheOldWolf]

Out of curiosity, how would this been handled by the west, namely the US if shots were fired by a group of couple thousand protesters? Would live ammunition be fired back to the crowd? Or a sniper team will wait to identify the subject and fire in a densely packed area?

Maybe by an foreign army, perhaps in Iraq or Afghanistan, but not at their people. Or you maybe have an example in wich western country this has happen?

[britmaveric]

Well most western countries require permits and coordination with police. Rules are setup on how, when and where. I don't think it would be possible.

[grandpops]

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Edited April 11, 2010 by grandpops

[philw]

Change of tactics by the apologists

Looks like they are going for a good old fashioned conspiracy theory. And because Animatic and a few newbies are regurgitatinng what JD is saying... it must be true.

Looks from the evidence like the army moved in with Tanks and not as a retaliation to some imagined attack from red shirts. The EVIDENCE is there, lines of tanks on video with reporters and reds crawling all over them.

It was a planned attack on the Reds Stage and was repelled. How many conscripts and police have relatives in Red Shirts? Probably most of them.

The strength of the resistance to this all out assault must have shaken the installed Government to its core.

Time to move on Abhisit and plan a come back in 10 years time when the stains of the peoples blood you put on the Bangkok Streets has started to fade. Remember, these reds have left their farms to sort out yours and you cronies corruption and nepotism. They are on away terrirotory and have shown you just what is possible should you try to cling on to power.

Just watch these sick Bangkok soap operas and dramas with all the elites in their lovely mansions with 2 or four cars and lots of servants. Then compare it to the real people who live on less than 200 baht per day.... if they are luck enough to have a job that actually pays. Real contrast and the people seem to have had enough of it.

Agree.

And where is the logic in the Army moving in late afternoon instead of early morning ???

Live ammo in an urban confrontation when they ( army ) have overwhelming force and every possibly alternative.

There was no need for any of these deaths.

The Gov't had many options and to rise in this way to the provocations of the reds shows their total and complete incompetance.

Provoked or not, their duty is to minimise the harm and damage and in this they failed.

It's Thailand and there will never be a meaningful enquiry, blame or responsibility will never be apportioned and this and following Govt's will perpetuate the lies and spin.

Sad beyond words and no solution in sight.

ph

[hpl]

It's good that the world can see now that the so-called democracy movement was a sham and that their violent tendencies finally surfaced as their dubai leader began running out of steam and thus needed to escalate their rhetoric and physical provocations to the point that the Army was left with no choice but to control their violence.

[snorkelador]

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Well, at least from where I'm sitting it seems clear who instigated the violence. Dude, they were calling for it for days and pushing the red followers harder and harder towards violence. All they needed to get the action the red leaders were longing for was the government to start dispersing rallies and a spark here and there to set it off. There was only one way it would go, then throw in some grenades, the petrol bombs they have been telling the reds to prepare for weeks and shoot off a few live rounds and you now they can proudly present their martyrs! Sick is a grave understatement of the mindset of those dirtbags!

[tangcoral]

Out of curiosity, how would this been handled by the west, namely the US if shots were fired by a group of couple thousand protesters? Would live ammunition be fired back to the crowd? Or a sniper team will wait to identify the subject and fire in a densely packed area?

Maybe by an foreign army, perhaps in Iraq or Afghanistan, but not at their people. Or you maybe have an example in wich western country this has happen?

No I am not referring to any incidents that has happened in the US. I was just curious on how this would of been handled in the US if shots were fired at police/army which are trying to disperse a crowd of few thousand in tight areas?

[eurasianthai]

It's good that the world can see now that the so-called democracy movement was a sham and that their violent tendencies finally surfaced as their dubai leader began running out of steam and thus needed to escalate their rhetoric and physical provocations to the point that the Army was left with no choice but to control their violence.

Funny how stupid the posts can get in this forum these days, an example among many...

[grandpops]

The Nation TV in particular and most of the other Thai Chanels seem at last to be taking this seriously.

Much better and fairer reporting today. I assume they want their licences renewed under the next administration!!!

They were portraying the redshirts as normal people. Families, old and young, all with the same burning sense of passion for their Monarch, Country and religion. Much better all round and might even risk a newspaper tomorrow.

Abhisit was portrayed as he was. Nervy, hesitant, twitching, worried and unsure of himself. So regardless of the PTV being down, the countries population are getting and idea of what went on last night.

The Government version lacks credibility for many reasons, but the one true visual truth that is apparant is that the Army planned an assault and sent in the tanks. They are all their for the world to see, empty, ransacked and abandoned by their occupants who lack the elitist outlook of their commanders. They were ordered there, but like the proverbial horse that you can lead to water, they wouldn't, when it came to it, drink!

Well, at least from where I'm sitting it seems clear who instigated the violence. Dude, they were calling for it for days and pushing the red followers harder and harder towards violence. All they needed to get the action the red leaders were longing for was the government to start dispersing rallies and a spark here and there to set it off. There was only one way it would go, then throw in some grenades, the petrol bombs they have been telling the reds to prepare for weeks and shoot off a few live rounds and you now they can proudly present their martyrs! Sick is a grave understatement of the mindset of those dirtbags!

I don't normally reply to posts like yours, but it is so funny and rabid I simply had to.

The bit "all they needed to get the action .... was the government to start dispersing rallies" is incredible. You have basically agreed with us that the government started it yet toned it as if it was unimportant. So who instigated it? You really think a column of tanks, gas grenades (it was live on TV when it kicked off) and 5000 bullets to be a mere detail? Such posts should be pinned.

Your last sentence says so much about you and your ilk.

Edited April 11, 2010 by grandpops

[hpl]

It's good that the world can see now that the so-called democracy movement was a sham and that their violent tendencies finally surfaced as their dubai leader began running out of steam and thus needed to escalate their rhetoric and physical provocations to the point that the Army was left with no choice but to control their violence.

Funny how stupid the posts can get in this forum these days, an example among many...

This is not a suggestion. Drop the flames now. Next one will earn a suspension.

Adios, eurasianthai

[MAJIC]

4 soldiers dead and hundreds wounded....

If thailand had a professional police, with anti riot force to front the insurgents, special forces to quickly and clean arrest the red leaders, they had no needs for the intervention of the Thai Army.

But cops are too busy to count the baht made with their corrupted activities and to scared to face to face a mob.

Excellent post.

Thai army is probably the worst in the world in anyway. The weakest / spent money. They lost against Laos and they'd lose against Cambodia.

Abisith is also 100% responsible for the yesterday drama. He never tried to understand the other opinions. Friday, Thai police and Thai army tried to solve the issue in a Thai way but at 10 PM, Abisith put some oil on the fire.

I don't think you understand the other opinions.

The red shirts want power. They don't want to change anything else.

Hmm................ That sounds like 100% change and you just spun yourself out of the argument!

[eurasianthai]

Adios, eurasianthai

Your sixth post is the best.

You're progressing.

[hpl]

stupid

Adios, eurasianthai

Your sixth post is the best.

You're progressing.

At least you've stopped flaming while you await your suspension.

Anyway, for others that can still post, as I stated earlier, it's encouraging that stations such as Channel News Asia and Al Jazeera are portraying the red shirts for what they really are and that the media has caught on to all the various elements of the group and the shady violent characters therein.

Edited April 11, 2010 by hpl