Expat Retiree Cost Of Living--higher And Higher

[Tokay]

It's actually cheaper to live in USA, Europe and Australaia at the minute compared to pattaya.

Are you serious?

Obviously imported food is going to cost you more here than it its country of origin. Isn't that basic commonsense?

If you can survive on a limited amount of imported food, living in Pattaya is far cheaper than in Europe, USA and Australasia.

Yes. Where I come from in the USA it is now cheaper the live there than in Pattaya.

[Ulysses G.]

Maybe, in a shack with the hillbillies in West Virginia.

[JMS]

I disagree as I think because of the strenght of the Baht many people now will find Thailand more expensive than their home country, but it is their choice where to live

[JSixpack]

Maybe, in a shack with the hillbillies in West Virginia.

I was gonna say trailer park.

[tropo]

It's actually cheaper to live in USA, Europe and Australaia at the minute compared to pattaya.

Are you serious?

Obviously imported food is going to cost you more here than it its country of origin. Isn't that basic commonsense?

If you can survive on a limited amount of imported food, living in Pattaya is far cheaper than in Europe, USA and Australasia.

Yes. Where I come from in the USA it is now cheaper the live there than in Pattaya.

Could you please be more specific. Where exactly do you live? What standard of accommodation do you live in? Do you live in a ghetto?

[Naam]

It's actually cheaper to live in USA, Europe and Australaia at the minute compared to pattaya.

Are you serious?

Obviously imported food is going to cost you more here than it its country of origin. Isn't that basic commonsense?

If you can survive on a limited amount of imported food, living in Pattaya is far cheaper than in Europe, USA and Australasia.

Yes. Where I come from in the USA it is now cheaper the live there than in Pattaya.

i don't doubt that this is a possible constellation, e.g. job lost due to crisis, IRS can't levy taxes, Obama's welfare cheques pay for basic living expenses, trailer rents affordable, a gallon of white lightning 10 dollars, and (assuming the poster is not married) no bar fines required for the 250 pound ladies in the neighbourhood.

[patrickinpattaya]

The cost of living may well of gone up in Pattaya, however it's still cheaper than the UK. I went into a dive of a pub today and ordered half a pint of Bitter and a Pint of Shandy it cost £6.00. I'm still gutted. I then had to pay 124.9p per litre of Diesel on the way home. My electric and Gas bill in the UK is around £110 per month.

Pattaya has a long way to go before it catches up with rip off Britain.

[JMS]

The cost of living may well of gone up in Pattaya, however it's still cheaper than the UK. I went into a dive of a pub today and ordered half a pint of Bitter and a Pint of Shandy it cost £6.00. I'm still gutted. I then had to pay 124.9p per litre of Diesel on the way home. My electric and Gas bill in the UK is around £110 per month.

Pattaya has a long way to go before it catches up with rip off Britain.

I was in the UK not long ago and a pint cost me 2.10 pounds which is 100 Baht. I agree on the petrol costs but besides that and taxi costs it is more expensive here. By the way my electric bill was 6200 Baht last month, 125 pounds and my Toyota 32000 (15000 in the USA)

[FarangBuddha]

To compare relative costs across various countries, let's pick some standardized units of measurement. I suggest people post the cost of the following items in their locations:

1. 500 ML bottle of drinking water *standard local brand...not fancy import)

2. Mc Donald "Big Mac Meal" or cost of a single Big Mac

3. Can of Coka Cola (12 oz) and/or 1 litre bottle

4. Local daily newspaper (not a standarized item but informative nonetheless)

5. 1 litre of diesel fuel

6. Base model of Toyota Camry (MSRP, no extras, before taxes)

Any others to suggest?

[dave2]

patrickinpattaya.

re ..... I then had to pay 124.9p per litre of Diesel

ehh ..... oohhhh ... ouch !

enjoy pics ? ... or cry ?

at chiang mai gas prices per litre on 8 april 10

or a large beer archa @ 34 baht yesterday

dave2

[craigt3365]

Add a mid-range dinner for 2, including drinks. Add going to the movie. Add car insurance. Add property taxes. And for some, add health care costs. Oh, add a night out partying at a decent club (not everyone's cup of tea, but for some, it is! And I don't mean a go-go bar...because you just can't compare here with there!)

I can't speak to other countries, but for the most part, all "western" countries will be pretty similar...with some differences like car costs in OZ, etc.

But for sure you can live cheap in the US. I did it for several years. Before you laugh, it was a great time. We had an RV. Decent Ford truck with a really nice trailer...top of the line. To live really cheap, we did "coyote" camping from time to time. Just park out in the desert or near some lake for free. We had a great generator, so still had AC, full satellite TV, Micro, etc.

I know plenty of people who live in double wide trailers. Before you laugh, they are not in a park and look pretty good. In our town you can get a double wide on 1.5 acres of land for about $80k. Since there are basically NO restaurants, theaters, clubs, etc....living there is cheap. But who would want to live there????

It's not always about just living cheap....right?

Now if you compare my apartment in New York City...and living in the city...well, costs were crazy expensive. Property taxes and maintenance on my small 1BR condo were well over $1400/month. Eating out was crazy. Just getting around the city was crazy expensive. I moved from NYC to Bangkok and it was like a 2/3rd reduction in my living expenses.

So, depends on where you live and what your lifestyle is like. You want to really live cheap here, head to the village!

[sarahsbloke]

So, depends on where you live and what your lifestyle is like. You want to really live cheap here, head to the village!

Very nice post.

[losworld]

Most go-go's now charge 120 B for a bottled beer.

Any comment would be superfluous. Tell them, if they really want to drink out, and no problem with that I rarely drink at home myself, a bottle of Singha at Wonderful bar (corner of soi Yamato and 2nd) is 45 Bahr daytime.

Prices are going up the world over, it's called inflation. No country is immune so why should the Thais put up with lower income just so foreign retirees can enjoy living the high life on the cheap?

I spent the better part of the past 6 years looking for a place to retire. When I met people in, say, Costa Rica...Panama...Argentina...USA...etc...they all said "you shoulda been here 15 years ago!". I can't tell you how many times I have heard that. Inflation is killing everybody. Prices are up world wide. And mostly due to higher energy and commodity prices (thanks, China!!!!). And people are traveling more...especially those from the developing countries (Eastern Europe, India, Brazil, China, etc). This drives up prices for sure...

Check out these sites for cost of living comparisons:

http://www.numbeo.com/common/

http://www.prosperity.com/default.aspx

Thailand is still among the cheaper places to live. And IMHO, much better than anywhere else in Asia....

It actually has very little to do with China but rather the change a few years ago to allow unregulated offshore trading of oil requiring no delivery of the actual product (Wall Street benefiting) plus couple this with a ridiculous speculative market in commodities and a declining US dollar. Commodities and oil should not be allowed to be played in the Casinos of Wall Street. People die when these prices go wild.

[Naam]

To compare relative costs across various countries, let's pick some standardized units of measurement. I suggest people post the cost of the following items in their locations:

1. 500 ML bottle of drinking water *standard local brand...not fancy import)

2. Mc Donald "Big Mac Meal" or cost of a single Big Mac

3. Can of Coka Cola (12 oz) and/or 1 litre bottle

4. Local daily newspaper (not a standarized item but informative nonetheless)

5. 1 litre of diesel fuel

6. Base model of Toyota Camry (MSRP, no extras, before taxes)

Any others to suggest?

your points are more or less irrelevant. a lot people never eat a Big Mac, never drink Coke or water, read newspapers online and hate diesel cars. one of the biggest cost factor in most countries is the roof of your and your family's head no matter whether you own it or rent it. the next (for some an even bigger cost factor) is income tax. if you can e.g. avoid income tax of up to 45% in "advanced" countries you care a sh*t how much a newspaper, a coke, drinking water or a burger is if you live tax free.

[craigt3365]

Most go-go's now charge 120 B for a bottled beer.

Any comment would be superfluous. Tell them, if they really want to drink out, and no problem with that I rarely drink at home myself, a bottle of Singha at Wonderful bar (corner of soi Yamato and 2nd) is 45 Bahr daytime.

Prices are going up the world over, it's called inflation. No country is immune so why should the Thais put up with lower income just so foreign retirees can enjoy living the high life on the cheap?

I spent the better part of the past 6 years looking for a place to retire. When I met people in, say, Costa Rica...Panama...Argentina...USA...etc...they all said "you shoulda been here 15 years ago!". I can't tell you how many times I have heard that. Inflation is killing everybody. Prices are up world wide. And mostly due to higher energy and commodity prices (thanks, China!!!!). And people are traveling more...especially those from the developing countries (Eastern Europe, India, Brazil, China, etc). This drives up prices for sure...

Check out these sites for cost of living comparisons:

http://www.numbeo.com/common/

http://www.prosperity.com/default.aspx

Thailand is still among the cheaper places to live. And IMHO, much better than anywhere else in Asia....

It actually has very little to do with China but rather the change a few years ago to allow unregulated offshore trading of oil requiring no delivery of the actual product (Wall Street benefiting) plus couple this with a ridiculous speculative market in commodities and a declining US dollar. Commodities and oil should not be allowed to be played in the Casinos of Wall Street. People die when these prices go wild.

100% correct! We all pay the price while some guys in a suit make big bucks.

[sarahsbloke]

your points are more or less irrelevant. a lot people never eat a Big Mac, never drink Coke or water, read newspapers online and hate diesel cars. one of the biggest cost factor in most countries is the roof of your and your family's head no matter whether you own it or rent it. the next (for some an even bigger cost factor) is income tax. if you can e.g. avoid income tax of up to 45% in "advanced" countries you care a sh*t how much a newspaper, a coke, drinking water or a burger is if you live tax free.

You are absolutely right.

I do like to drink Pepsi (but it's not essential), everything else on that list has no relevance to my life.

Edited April 26, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[Zstarx]

The cost of living may well of gone up in Pattaya, however it's still cheaper than the UK. I went into a dive of a pub today and ordered half a pint of Bitter and a Pint of Shandy it cost £6.00. I'm still gutted. I then had to pay 124.9p per litre of Diesel on the way home. My electric and Gas bill in the UK is around £110 per month.

Pattaya has a long way to go before it catches up with rip off Britain.

I was in the UK not long ago and a pint cost me 2.10 pounds which is 100 Baht. I agree on the petrol costs but besides that and taxi costs it is more expensive here. By the way my electric bill was 6200 Baht last month, 125 pounds and my Toyota 32000 (15000 in the USA)

Your lucky, I bought 2 pints of Heinekin last week from a pub in Perth, $17.50, which is about 525 baht

[witold]

To compare relative costs across various countries, let's pick some standardized units of measurement. I suggest people post the cost of the following items in their locations:

1. 500 ML bottle of drinking water *standard local brand...not fancy import)

2. Mc Donald "Big Mac Meal" or cost of a single Big Mac

3. Can of Coka Cola (12 oz) and/or 1 litre bottle

4. Local daily newspaper (not a standarized item but informative nonetheless)

5. 1 litre of diesel fuel

6. Base model of Toyota Camry (MSRP, no extras, before taxes)

Any others to suggest?

These are horrible points of comparison. These expenses are not representative of daily life or what most people's monthly budgets are mostly spent on. IMO, a better comparison would be something like:

1 - housing. rent example, house price example, and condo price example. Need to compare similar properties. It doesn't make sense to compare $350,000 Sukhumvit condo with a $35,000 ghetto condo in Washington, DC.

2 - transportation. Metro/bus. Car/Fuel. Thailand generally wins in public option and coverage, and loses in private options.

3 - Food. Cooking at home prices. Eating out cheap - for Americans, this would be McDonald's, but in Thailand, it would be 25baht road side stand, NOT Thai McDonald's.

4 - General entertainment. Club prices, regular bar prices, real restaurant prices. Bangkok really shines in here IMO because there are a lot of options available at the low end without feeling low end. Of course, there are plenty of options available that cost exactly the same or more as NYC.

5.Then you have some real life family expenses, like education, daycare, etc. These may be major expenses for some people that need to be compared.

In other words, it doesn't matter what something costs if you spend only 1% of your income on it every month or never buy it. These items are inconsequential to your financial well being regardless how overpriced they are.

[petermik]

Most go-go's now charge 120 B for a bottled beer.

Any comment would be superfluous. Tell them, if they really want to drink out, and no problem with that I rarely drink at home myself, a bottle of Singha at Wonderful bar (corner of soi Yamato and 2nd) is 45 Bahr daytime.

Prices are going up the world over, it's called inflation. No country is immune so why should the Thais put up with lower income just so foreign retirees can enjoy living the high life on the cheap?

A BIG bottle of Leo beer is 55baht at Kateseree House on soi buakhow

[SantiSuk]

Pensioners the world over grumble about the rising cost of living. Always have done always will. Pensions increases do not keep pace with earnings rises and pensioners have no political power compared with earners

[craigt3365]

Here are a few websites that compare cost of living among various countries:

http://www.numbeo.com/common/

Mercer City Cost of Living Index 2008

I also find this one interesting...in terms of how countries rank according to various "quality of life" categories:

http://www.prosperity.com/rankings.aspx

Thailand ranks 81st in terms of Democratic Institutions...bet it is down even lower now!

[craigt3365]

oops...I already posted this....sorry! We are in the final stages of dealing with the build out of the house. Man, it ain't easy.

Apologies....

[Tolley]

Some people here seem confused between living and existing.

You can exist on very little in many countries but that is not living and most of us aspire a little higher than existing.

Pattaya has plenty to offer the expat and price is still a major factor in many expats deciding to live there.

Again it is not as cheap as years ago but you get a lot more these days and the trend is set to continue.

THere may well be a time in the future where the working class man from the west will find THailand not so attractive anymore due to higher prices but that time is still a few years off yet.

[simoncnx]

bali is way more expensive that chiang mai. pattaya is on a par with bali

[musiclover]

The cost of living may well of gone up in Pattaya, however it's still cheaper than the UK. I went into a dive of a pub today and ordered half a pint of Bitter and a Pint of Shandy it cost £6.00. I'm still gutted. I then had to pay 124.9p per litre of Diesel on the way home. My electric and Gas bill in the UK is around £110 per month.

Pattaya has a long way to go before it catches up with rip off Britain.

Its all personal experience! My elec bill monthly in Pattaya is well over £200 !! Id love to have a bill of only £110 pm! This includes a pool and good use of an oven but average aircon use. 3 phase elec too, but only £110 pm for elec and gas?! I wish!!

[sarahsbloke]

5.Then you have some real life family expenses, like education, daycare, etc. These may be major expenses for some people that need to be compared.

The Kings school is free, just a few snack expenses say 20bht a day (lunch free)

Adult education is free, sending the wife to high school class (every Sunday for 3 years)

Not sure about University fees yet, Chiang Mai University is less than 2000USD a year (but I'm told that might be free as well).

[wolf5370]

These are horrible points of comparison. These expenses are not representative of daily life or what most people's monthly budgets are mostly spent on. IMO, a better comparison would be something like:

1 - housing. rent example, house price example, and condo price example. Need to compare similar properties. It doesn't make sense to compare $350,000 Sukhumvit condo with a $35,000 ghetto condo in Washington, DC.

2 - transportation. Metro/bus. Car/Fuel. Thailand generally wins in public option and coverage, and loses in private options.

3 - Food. Cooking at home prices. Eating out cheap - for Americans, this would be McDonald's, but in Thailand, it would be 25baht road side stand, NOT Thai McDonald's.

4 - General entertainment. Club prices, regular bar prices, real restaurant prices. Bangkok really shines in here IMO because there are a lot of options available at the low end without feeling low end. Of course, there are plenty of options available that cost exactly the same or more as NYC.

5.Then you have some real life family expenses, like education, daycare, etc. These may be major expenses for some people that need to be compared.

1. Last rent I paid in the UK (about 7 years ago) was 1,500 quid (sorry no pound sign on the keyboard) - That was for a 5 bed house with good sized garden. Most expensive I have rented here matches pretty much (5 beds - big garden - close to town - etc) and cost me 18K Baht (about 350 quid at the time)

2. Petrol/Gas for my 4X4 in the UK (3ltr gas guzzller Shogun took unleaded @ one pouid a litre last time I was there cost me about 200 pounds a week, but I claimed this back from tax). Unleaded a quid last time I was there (49 Baht) - here I can get for about 32 baht - but it has gone up some 20% here over the last year, no idea how its risen in old Blighty! My car cost me about 1,000 Baht a week, now I use a bike and it costs me 100Baht a week (plus 110Baht every 3 weeks for a new inner-tube due to punctures!)

3. Groceries for my family and me, was around a hundred pounds a week. We ate out once a month somewhere fancy for about the same (100 quid) and when shopping at weekends we would often do fifty quid at a cafe (four meals plus shakes - not in Mc,BK or KFC!). Here I buy about 50 pounds a month on groceries and eat out often for around 500 baht all told (again family). I would suggest I spend less than 1/5 of the money I used to on food on average.

4. This is more difficult for me. In the UK going out for a beer was a special occasion for me - birthday, leaving do, etc. However, I guess a round would set me back about 20 quid (around 3 quid a pint - London prices - I have never paid 6 pounds, ever, like someone said they did in the UK!). Here I go out to socialise more often. I go to an expoat pub mostly and chat with friends probably once a week - beer is about 90 baht for a large Leo. So, though its much cheaper here IMHO, I tend to do it more often and drink more when I do go out - so it is actually a -ve on my CoL, but a +ve on Thailand's CoL.

5. My two girls went to private schools in the UK until we moved here. The school fees were around 15,000 a year. Here they go to a good Thai private school (Bi-Lingual) and its capped (Government cap) at 80,000 Baht (a little over 1,500 pounds). I guess the quality isn't the same (though the class sizes are - about 16!). So its possibly not a like 4 like, but that's a 90% drop! The Thai school sees to have new uniforms almost monthly, but these are still cheaper than the long-coats and wicker boater that I had to pay for in the UK, let alone all the other summer/winter uniforms, blazers, hockey sticks, musical instruments and so on.

I must say I don't live in Pattaya, but I do live in a major city here (Chiang Mai). Thailand can be done in fair luxury much cheaper outside of Patters/Bangers/Phuket/Islands without having to castrate oneself from civilisation or western comradeship.

[tropo]

3 - Food. Cooking at home prices. Eating out cheap - for Americans, this would be McDonald's, but in Thailand, it would be 25baht road side stand, NOT Thai McDonald's.

Unless you have a cast iron stomach, I wouldn't bring road side stand food into the comparison. Minimum eating out food would be at least 80 baht per dish.

[musiclover]

[

1. Last rent I paid in the UK (about 7 years ago) was 1,500 quid (sorry no pound sign on the keyboard) - That was for a 5 bed house with good sized garden. Most expensive I have rented here matches pretty much (5 beds - big garden - close to town - etc) and cost me 18K Baht (about 350 quid at the time)

3. Groceries for my family and me, was around a hundred pounds a week. We ate out once a month somewhere fancy for about the same (100 quid) and when shopping at weekends we would often do fifty quid at a cafe (four meals plus shakes - not in Mc,BK or KFC!). Here I buy about 50 pounds a month on groceries and eat out often for around 500 baht all told (again family). I would suggest I spend less than 1/5 of the money I used to on food on average.

I must say I don't live in Pattaya, but I do live in a major city here (Chiang Mai). Thailand can be done in fair luxury much cheaper outside of Patters/Bangers/Phuket/Islands without having to castrate oneself from civilisation or western comradeship.

Are you serious? A 5 bed house with big garden close to town for 18K? More like 45k pm and up on Darkside of Pattaya! Depends on size I suppose

2500 baht per month groceries for your family? Thats impossible in Pattaya unless yourre on subsistence level and not at Foodland or Carrefour! Im trying to imagine what you could be eating for that and what about ordinary household necessites?

[Ulysses G.]

Are you serious? A 5 bed house with big garden close to town for 18K? More like 45k pm and up on Darkside of Pattaya! Depends on size I suppose

2500 baht per month groceries for your family? Thats impossible in Pattaya unless yourre on subsistence level and not at Foodland or Carrefour! Im trying to imagine what you could be eating for that and what about ordinary household necessites?

Perhaps move somewhere nice that you can afford - like Chiang Rai or Chiang Mai. If one lived on the French Riviera they would have to expect it to be much more expensive than out in the country.