Thai Army Tells Red Shirts To Disperse From Rally Base

[yoshiwara]

There is no Thailand if the government can't disperse a mob of 6000 armed rebels occupying an important district of the capital. No, it is not a game. It is about the very existence of Thailand as a nation. This is civilization vs. anarchy. Would the red thugs be tolerated for weeks in your country? You say yes? I don't believe you.

In Europe it would never be tolerated to have a PM and government that wasn't LEGAL. Freedom of speach and no weapons that's the issue. Abhisit is a laughing joke all over the WORLD, he has lost his face totally and his real support. The only supporters left are those who have a financial problem if a legal election and a new Parlement was to be the outcome of this TURMOIL. Some individuals hope for blood to be sheed, God bless those fools. Be sure of one thing Abhisit and those behind him are allready moving values and large amounts out of Thailand is this very moment!

Translation:

Last week we wanted blood to be shed, but this week we are on the defensive so lets accuse the other side. A trademark red flip-flop.

For the unintended hilarity of accusing others of shipping money out when Thaksin trumps everybody else combined in money laundering we should thank the above contributor.

God bless him. A man in turmoil.

[bkkjames]

MULTIPLE CHOICE QUIZ!

Okay what are the likely scenario(s) over the next few days?

A. multi-colored protesters and red shirts clash and all hel_l breaks loose

B. government troops and red shirts clash and fight till red shirts are dispersed

C. government troops and red shirts clash, but red shirts prevail and remain

D. Abhisit dissolve Parliament and abandons ship

E. Thaksin dies of cancer and everyone returns to their senses

F. nothing happens and we are either bored to death or die of old age

G. Red shirt leaders are arrested

H. Hillary Clinton offers to bring both parties to the table - for dinner

I. Liverpool offers free unsold Champions League 2010-11 kits to everyone who goes home

J. At this Sundays RBSC pony up, one jumps the fence and onto the red stage and declares himself not an ass.

[johncat1]

" The United States urged both sides to seek a peaceful resolution to the weeks-long crisis, which has shut down the Thai capital's retail and hotel heartland, worsening the damage to the economy of the tourist destination."

The Americans trying to control the world again !!

KEEP OUT of Thailands affairs and put you own house in order first This is not your country

[hardy1943]

6000 hard core reds. That sound manageable.

Pity they did'nt crackdown on the yellows previously, if they had of, maybe the reds would'nt have copied them. The two airports and government house were occupied without any resitance from the army or police. Double standards.

Thank you, the rest of world laughs and why take anything serious here. The cartoon goes on.

[jamieson]

Why are so men red-farangs unstable? The down and out in the west seethe with anger towards people with educations and blame everyone else for their problems. And when in Thailand they gravitate to the same ilk.

hailand is very liberal and welcomes all sorts of people, including weirdos, psychos and people who might be in jail in another country for their public behavior. Sad, but true...

brilliant deduction on thailand's liberal policy in welcoming one and all to her shores.......

heard of the story of two mad men in an asylum where one told the other that god spoke to him in his dream and the other mad man replied he did indeed appear in the first mad man's dream to speak to him???????

between the "educated" and the "uneducated" , who is more mad?????????

at first, i thought i was alone in observing the influx of weidos, psychos, etc.etc. flooding thailand....

thank you for confirming otherwise.....

now i am feeling not alone anymore and but wonder where we fit in........in this liberal policy paradigm of thai society.......

are not the uneducated entitled to be mad when they feel cheated and are the educated sometimes not very mad when they feel shortchanged at their work places?????

Edited April 22, 2010 by jamieson

[C3C4]

There is no Thailand if the government can't disperse a mob of 6000 armed rebels occupying an important district of the capital. No, it is not a game. It is about the very existence of Thailand as a nation. This is civilization vs. anarchy. Would the red thugs be tolerated for weeks in your country? You say yes? I don't believe you.

Good Point Jingthing, how would this be handled in let's say Holland?

It would never be necessary in Holland- people are enfranchised, well-educated, they have removed the priviledges of title and inheritance, they receive sufficient pay for their work, have more than adequate health care and welfare provision and have plenty of Heineken.

crap reply.....

holland may be enfranchised,blah,blah, blah......

BUT, do you know they have global drug lords and leaders and what have you.......

again, what a crap reply......from a supposedly non-dutch trying to represent holland to the world.....

A bit of the line but I heard this in Holland, and I believe it is the thruth: Wooden shoes, wooden knees, wooden head, wouldn't listen!

[asiawatcher]

I have to walk through these red animals every day, currently they have piles of car tyres, soaked in petrol (i saw this with my own eyes), reinforced with sharpened bamboo sticks, piles of bamboo spears stacked near by. The red guards are now carrying pistols (cant confirm if its all of them or just a few - but i saw at least 2 guards armed with firearms) i tried to take a photo but they chased me off.

Still convinced the reds are the good guys?

From my own personal vantage point having spent the last 3 weeks going through their camp twice a day every day i can say, hand on my heart, these guys are pure and simply thugs. The military need to act and soon, yes people will get hurt, and yes people will die, but these reds have been warned multiple times already, if its red blood in the streets they have nobody to blame but themselves. Simple as that.

Totally agree - enough is enough. I have had a company here for 10 years and now yesterday informed the Revenue Dept I will not pay VAT or Withholding Tax until the Govt does something about protecting my business which has simply evaporated - same as last year, as all my business is international coming into Thailand. I refuse to pay towards Govt if there is no governance or law and order. Perhaps other businesses should do the same - then we may see some results. These Kwai Daeng (Red Buffaloes) need to be removed and now. Let the true democracy of Govt get on with the job. Everyone can vote their opinions next election and change then.

[templedog]

I have to walk through these red animals every day, currently they have piles of car tyres, soaked in petrol (i saw this with my own eyes), reinforced with sharpened bamboo sticks, piles of bamboo spears stacked near by. The red guards are now carrying pistols (cant confirm if its all of them or just a few - but i saw at least 2 guards armed with firearms) i tried to take a photo but they chased me off.

Still convinced the reds are the good guys?

From my own personal vantage point having spent the last 3 weeks going through their camp twice a day every day i can say, hand on my heart, these guys are pure and simply thugs. The military need to act and soon, yes people will get hurt, and yes people will die, but these reds have been warned multiple times already, if its red blood in the streets they have nobody to blame but themselves. Simple as that.

I couldn't agree more with you.

[cmsally]

I am surmising that the April 10 showdown was not rubber stamped by Anupong, but in fact by his dep., Prayuth and that little bundle of fun - Suthep.

The resulting mess led to Anupong being given Suthep's position on a booby trapped plate. Quite where Abhisit stands in all this is not totally clear. Is he on holiday or maybe interviewing for a job at on of the MNCs

Anupong probably doesn't want blood on his hands esp. being so close to retirement. Doesn't look good in the old memoirs.

Although we assumed that Prayuth pretty much had the job in the bag come September, I am beginning to doubt whether he would be Anupong's personal choice (personal as in singular opinion). There seem to be more extreme right wing factions behind him and if Anupong makes a wrong move he may not make it to retirement. So maybe damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Unfortunately for Anupong he has the little matter of that speech calling for house dissolution during PAD protests. What's good for the goose.. karma seems to have come back to haunt him.

Although the hawks are beginning to appear fairly obvious , it is less clear who the doves are. Does anyone dare to be a dove, maybe its not an accepted position.

If history is anything to go by there will be more strange factions appearing, after all the blame has to be appointed somewhere and there's nothing like trying to stick a label on custard which simply evaporates in the heat into a sticky mess that has lost its form and identity. How convenient.

[jamieson]

Why is this contiuing to be played out as a Hollywood Movie?

There will obviously be serious bloodshed if the Army or anyone else moves in, yet the answer to removing these People is absurdly simple and has been used many time in history.

Surround them with barbed wire to prevent escape and re-grouping then cut off all water, food and power. Within a few days and probably sooner in the heat of Bangkok the Red Shirts will be begging for unconditional surrender. Of course offer to extract the Mothers and Children.

Yes in a Hollywood movie this would work

You forget we are talking about the red shirts leaders who would be back in their hotel rooms

They would wait for the women and children to die

put them on the barb wire and shout

Double standards Double standards

wow, you should be a movie director and am sure you will win many accolades and academy awards........

[traderjm]

In Europe it would never be tolerated to have a PM and government that wasn't LEGAL. Freedom of speach and no weapons that's the issue. Abhisit is a laughing joke all over the WORLD, he has lost his face totally and his real support. The only supporters left are those who have a financial problem if a legal election and a new Parlement was to be the outcome of this TURMOIL. Some individuals hope for blood to be sheed, God bless those fools. Be sure of one thing Abhisit and those behind him are allready moving values and large amounts out of Thailand is this very moment!

Honestly when you sober up and read what you vomited above you are going to feel like a knob....

[clockworkorange]

6000 hard core reds. That sound manageable.

Pity they did'nt crackdown on the yellows previously, if they had of, maybe the reds would'nt have copied them. The two airports and government house were occupied without any resitance from the army or police. Double standards.

Broken record.

Oh give over. But I suppose that there is nothing else that you can say when faced with irrefutable facts like the chronology of events.

You dismiss as irrelevant the fact that your PAD yellow heroes did indeed start this whole mob rule thing. I assume you knwo what the word 'start' means - just in case you don't, it means that the yellows took to the streets before the reds even existed. The yellows overthrew a democratically elected civilian government, and they were allowed to get away with it. People on the other side detest them for that, a hatred which is manifested in what is happening on the streets of Bangkok and elsewhere in Thailand at the moment.

Why doesn't Abhisit hold an election, get a legitimate public mandate, and then use it to confound the reds? I'll tell you why - he would lose an election, because people simply don't like him enough for him to keep his job democratically. He is seen by the majority (i.e. the whole country - not just Bangkok) as not understanding them and failing to represent their best interests, and they think he sucks for that.

The only way that Abhisit can keep the seat that he stole is by hiding like a craven-hearted coward, while killing his own people and splittig the country in half. I look forward to seeing him pay for it.

[yoshiwara]

" The United States urged both sides to seek a peaceful resolution to the weeks-long crisis, which has shut down the Thai capital's retail and hotel heartland, worsening the damage to the economy of the tourist destination."

The Americans trying to control the world again !!

KEEP OUT of Thailands affairs and put you own house in order first This is not your country

What the red cheerleaders demand is support for the Thaksin army as a liberation force.

Suggestions of peaceful resolution and negotiation infuriates them.

But the real reason for this anti-US tirade is that the US revealed that it had been tapping Thaksin's communications with the red leaders.

ie Thaksin secretly (or not so secretly) directing activities from outside the country.

This knowledge was so damaging to the red side that they organised a demo outside the US embassy.

Knowing that his communications with the red leaders is not 'safe' has Thaksin constantly flitting around to try to shake off any fixes on his comms.

meanwhile the anti-US gig plays well in populist circles.

[danc]

In Europe it would never be tolerated to have a PM and government that wasn't LEGAL.

The Abhisit government IS legal. Next ...

The problem here is one of perception, jingthing. As an exercise, let's assume you are right - I know I am right, I can hear you saying...but bear with me. Assuming you are right and there are many many people of the same opinion, there are equally many many of the opinion that something is rotten in the "State of Denmark" - both on a national and dare I say it, international stage. For those that do not have the unique wisdom of the posters here on this forum, the perception is that the Abhisit government has arrived at this point following a coup, international airport closures that resulted in literally tens of thousands of stranded foreigners and a few other shenanigans besides, those probably more of relevance here in Thailand, disqualifed parties, red cards, yellow cards etc etc. If I was to sit down with my father or brother or my mates from the pub and say the present government is legal, they would say "get out of here, there the ones who did this this and this......leaving my Aunt Mo not able to get back for little Johnny's christening"...So, whilst I might agree with you, it is equally good reasoning to see the other side of the coin too...

It is part of the reason why one cannot see this problem just fading away if they all packed up and went home this evening...

[clausewitz]

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/...e-30127520.html

By Pravit Rajanaphruk

The Nation

Published on April 21, 2010

On Monday evening, this writer ran into a fellow journalist from a major newspaper at the red-shirt rally site and we shared our views about the protest. Here are some excerpts of the conversation:

]She: Most protesters are from the provinces and likely paid if not "organised" into coming to Bangkok.

Me: Yes, there are many rural poor people, but there is no proof as to whether they've been paid. They mostly forged an alliance by relying on politicians to advance their political cause. It's not that different from the yellow-shirt middle class, who depended on the discourses of the old elite, the army and royalist ideology to advance their political agenda. Both groups forged alliances, period.

As for allegations that the red shirts are a "hired mob", would you be willing to risk death by clashing with armed soldiers for Bt500 or Bt1,000 a day?

What's more, there are many reds in Bangkok and its vicinity. Observe the hundreds if not thousands of motorcycles parked at the protest site and dozens upon dozens of trucks and cars all with Bangkok licence plates. Notice how many red-shirt Bangkokians are sitting inside the McDonald's at Erawan Building near the Rajprasong intersection munching on Big Macs.

Also note how the red-shirt crowds swell when Bangkokians join the protest after work. Recently, no less than 50 red shirts were seen on a Skytrain leaving the protest site at 11.30pm.

She: The red shirts are "brainwashed" and "victims" of propaganda and so shutting down their media outlets was necessary.

Me: I think people, whether they wear red or any other colour, are mature enough to decide what constitutes propaganda. Look around, isn't Thailand full of propaganda anyway? The only way out is to support greater media literacy and allow people to think beyond the "propaganda" - be it red or yellow.

We cannot keep babysitting the population and keep warning them against watching or reading this or that. Such patronising attitude is making this society less democratic and immature.

Instead of trying to "save" them from "propaganda", these people should protect themselves from patronising attitudes that are detrimental to a free, open and democratic society.

Also, why should Abhisit Vejjajiva, who ordered the shutting down of red media, whine about "widespread rumours" now?

She: The red shirts posted near the Saladaeng intersection next to Silom - who have sharpened bamboo sticks - are better armed than soldiers.

Me: Are you kidding? I walked among both sides on Monday and found the soldiers armed with plenty of semi-automatic rifles with bullets that can reach a distance of 3,000 metres. Five soldiers died during the April 10 clashes, but four times more civilians, 21 of them, were killed. Even as we continue to argue about who was really behind the deaths, the red shirts are preparing to fight soldiers again in the foreseeable future and I consider arming oneself with sharpened bamboo as rather "sane" even if you do not wish to condone it.

On April 10, armoured vehicles were used. Teargas was fired from helicopters, crowd dispersal continued well into the night and although the army earlier claimed no heavy weapons were used, they are now saying that some heavy artillery has gone missing.

She: What the red-shirts are fighting for will not bring about democracy.

Me: Wait and see.

This may be step one, but any move that encourages a huge number of poor people to demand equal political rights is a good beginning, even if they align themselves with Thaksin Shinawatra - a man loathed by many middle-class people and the elite.

[rabo]

" The United States urged both sides to seek a peaceful resolution to the weeks-long crisis, which has shut down the Thai capital's retail and hotel heartland, worsening the damage to the economy of the tourist destination."

The Americans trying to control the world again !!

KEEP OUT of Thailands affairs and put you own house in order first This is not your country

The US and Thailand are strong friends and allies, always have been.

You! Keep Out!

[yoshiwara]

6000 hard core reds. That sound manageable.

Pity they did'nt crackdown on the yellows previously, if they had of, maybe the reds would'nt have copied them. The two airports and government house were occupied without any resitance from the army or police. Double standards.

Broken record.

Oh give over. But I suppose that there is nothing else that you can say when faced with irrefutable facts like the chronology of events.

You dismiss as irrelevant the fact that your PAD yellow heroes did indeed start this whole mob rule thing. I assume you knwo what the word 'start' means - just in case you don't, it means that the yellows took to the streets before the reds even existed. The yellows overthrew a democratically elected civilian government, and they were allowed to get away with it. People on the other side detest them for that, a hatred which is manifested in what is happening on the streets of Bangkok and elsewhere in Thailand at the moment.

Why doesn't Abhisit hold an election, get a legitimate public mandate, and then use it to confound the reds? I'll tell you why - he would lose an election, because people simply don't like him enough for him to keep his job democratically. He is seen by the majority (i.e. the whole country - not just Bangkok) as not understanding them and failing to represent their best interests, and they think he sucks for that.

The only way that Abhisit can keep the seat that he stole is by hiding like a craven-hearted coward, while killing his own people and splittig the country in half. I look forward to seeing him pay for it.

The droog speaks.

There will be an election but maybe not when Thaksin wants it.

Splitting the country in half? Ah the regionalist nonsense now being pushed out from the red centre now.

Seems like the class war rhetoric is being dumped, at least for a few days anyway.

As for your thinly disguised support for personal violence against the PM.

Well it goes with your image.

[angmo]

Oh give over. But I suppose that there is nothing else that you can say when faced with irrefutable facts like the chronology of events.

You dismiss as irrelevant the fact that your PAD yellow heroes did indeed start this whole mob rule thing. I assume you knwo what the word 'start' means - just in case you don't, it means that the yellows took to the streets before the reds even existed. The yellows overthrew a democratically elected civilian government, and they were allowed to get away with it. People on the other side detest them for that, a hatred which is manifested in what is happening on the streets of Bangkok and elsewhere in Thailand at the moment.

Why doesn't Abhisit hold an election, get a legitimate public mandate, and then use it to confound the reds? I'll tell you why - he would lose an election, because people simply don't like him enough for him to keep his job democratically. He is seen by the majority (i.e. the whole country - not just Bangkok) as not understanding them and failing to represent their best interests, and they think he sucks for that.

The only way that Abhisit can keep the seat that he stole is by hiding like a craven-hearted coward, while killing his own people and splittig the country in half. I look forward to seeing him pay for it.

Clockworkorange. Finally a comment from someone with a brain. Thanks.

[Jonathanpattaya]

Let's hope so and let's hope they don't make a hash of it!

[grumpyoldman]

" The United States urged both sides to seek a peaceful resolution to the weeks-long crisis, which has shut down the Thai capital's retail and hotel heartland, worsening the damage to the economy of the tourist destination."

The Americans trying to control the world again !!

KEEP OUT of Thailands affairs and put you own house in order first This is not your country

The US and Thailand are strong friends and allies, always have been.

You! Keep Out!

Johncat1's post amazed me too, Americans call for a peaceful resolution and the conclusion is they are trying to control the world "again".

Terrible Americans, how dare they ask for a peaceful resolution, Johncat1 wants some blood!

[ozzieman05]

Forget the airport closure, WHY????? no don't tell me. lol

Cos it was the RED GOVERNMENT that <deleted>*ked up there, not the current one.

Common sense is not from the brain of some people who visit Thailand

the brain was left in a locker at the airport

Some even forget to pick it up when they depart

Not that I would say this about our present red supporter

then again maybe I would

[clockworkorange]

Honestly when you sober up and read what you vomited above you are going to feel like a knob....

Please keep these comments coming TJ. I'm sure that I speak for all here, in saying that your visionary responses and brilliant intellect help us all to understand the true reasoning that underpins the yellow philosophy.

Now may I humbly submit this to your kind consideration: In making the above statement, was I:

a) complementing you on your incisive wit and uncanny ability to get straight to the point? or,

c) pointing out that your arguments might lack substance? or

d) telling you that you come across like an inarticulate oaf - that your shouting down of others while offering nothing sensible in return is a good eaxmple of how the yellow mentality of coercion works?

Edited April 22, 2010 by clockworkorange

[cmsally]

I know linking to blogs is not allowed. But do a search for Nirmal Ghosh - Flashpoint Silom, an interesting account.

There is also a brilliant dissertation from Puey Ungpakorn about 1976 - probably best not to link but do a search for Puey Ungpakorn 1976 coup in thailand.

Edited April 22, 2010 by cmsally

[ozzieman05]

The Thai government has gone out of their way to accomodate these red thugs.....regardless of what I have read on this blog NO government would have put up with this nonsense as long as the Thai government has. It says alot for their desire to compromise if such a miniscule percentage of the country's population has as much of a voice as the reds have. But the protesters are certainly delusional if they don't see that the end is near.......

...as for Thaksin...a coward who contributes to the risk faced by his supporters by inciting (and paying for) this protest while he is safe and comfortable in one resort destination after another. The greed, arrogance and ego of this man is shameful and he is not worthy of calling himself 'Thai'.....

My friend you are a newbie

when you have been in Thailand for a while you will possibly learn one of two things

Most Thais hate being told what to do

and Most Thais hate confrontation

Thats the anser in a nut shell

[anthonyr]

I have to walk through these red animals every day, currently they have piles of car tyres, soaked in petrol (i saw this with my own eyes), reinforced with sharpened bamboo sticks, piles of bamboo spears stacked near by. The red guards are now carrying pistols (cant confirm if its all of them or just a few - but i saw at least 2 guards armed with firearms) i tried to take a photo but they chased me off.

Still convinced the reds are the good guys?

From my own personal vantage point having spent the last 3 weeks going through their camp twice a day every day i can say, hand on my heart, these guys are pure and simply thugs. The military need to act and soon, yes people will get hurt, and yes people will die, but these reds have been warned multiple times already, if its red blood in the streets they have nobody to blame but themselves. Simple as that.

[anthonyr]

I have to walk through these red animals every day, currently they have piles of car tyres, soaked in petrol (i saw this with my own eyes), reinforced with sharpened bamboo sticks, piles of bamboo spears stacked near by. The red guards are now carrying pistols (cant confirm if its all of them or just a few - but i saw at least 2 guards armed with firearms) i tried to take a photo but they chased me off.

Still convinced the reds are the good guys?

From my own personal vantage point having spent the last 3 weeks going through their camp twice a day every day i can say, hand on my heart, these guys are pure and simply thugs. The military need to act and soon, yes people will get hurt, and yes people will die, but these reds have been warned multiple times already, if its red blood in the streets they have nobody to blame but themselves. Simple as that.

[termad]

0.009% if the population. Sounds like they have alot of support

I'm a bit confused if you are you saying that the Redshirts are only 0.009% of the population because the population of Isaan alone is about 30% of the total Thai population.

So based on your figure of 0.009% what do you think is the figure for the population of Thailand?

[ozzieman05]

In Europe it would never be tolerated to have a PM and government that wasn't LEGAL.

The Abhisit government IS legal. Next ...

Most interesting

Now can you please show me in a Government statement a country in Europe that states that the Thai government is not legally elected

[traderjm]

The problem here is one of perception, jingthing. As an exercise, let's assume you are right - I know I am right, I can hear you saying...but bear with me. Assuming you are right and there are many many people of the same opinion, there are equally many many of the opinion that something is rotten in the "State of Denmark" - both on a national and dare I say it, international stage. For those that do not have the unique wisdom of the posters here on this forum, the perception is that the Abhisit government has arrived at this point following a coup, international airport closures that resulted in literally tens of thousands of stranded foreigners and a few other shenanigans besides, those probably more of relevance here in Thailand, disqualifed parties, red cards, yellow cards etc etc. If I was to sit down with my father or brother or my mates from the pub and say the present government is legal, they would say "get out of here, there the ones who did this this and this......leaving my Aunt Mo not able to get back for little Johnny's christening"...So, whilst I might agree with you, it is equally good reasoning to see the other side of the coin too...

It is part of the reason why one cannot see this problem just fading away if they all packed up and went home this evening...

I would ask one simple question. The TWO gov't before the current one obtained their power under the exact same rules. I did not see the REDS crying then about democracy. Did you?

Regardless of whether you believe those two were ousted via the courts or political games, it does not change that they STARTED in exactly the same way AFTER elections AFTER the coup... so why pray tell did the REDs not complain then???

[koosdeboer]

There is no Thailand if the government can't disperse a mob of 6000 armed rebels occupying an important district of the capital. No, it is not a game. It is about the very existence of Thailand as a nation. This is civilization vs. anarchy. Would the red thugs be tolerated for weeks in your country? You say yes? I don't believe you.

Good Point Jingthing, how would this be handled in let's say Holland?

It would never be necessary in Holland- people are enfranchised, well-educated, they have removed the priviledges of title and inheritance, they receive sufficient pay for their work, have more than adequate health care and welfare provision and have plenty of Heineken.

What do you know? You must be red. Ever heard Holland has a queen? Talking about privileges, of title and inheritance