Thai Forces Fire Warning Shots In Standoff With Red Shirts

[leon9mm]

its down to the poor against the rich,well thats what it seems to me now.

i am not a thai national but if its democracy they are after then call the elections

thaksin was sure as not honest but he knew how to run a country and i think also that some

people who comment here forget about the so called honest and democratic west,,ie ,bush against gore and

the uk ministers filling their pockets....i hope it dosent end up in a civil war and the only way to scale this down is call an election

and abide by the result,,,and this did all start over a coup by the army dont forget....

[lazurus]

TODAYS PICK: Kwanchai's escape to McDonalds: http://twitpic.com/1j2pkd (Photo by photo_journ)

Kwanchai may have been inspired to make up some new red slogans

We want democracy, and we want fries with that

Mcjobs for everyone

The revolution will be supersized

[Thai at Heart]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

Edited April 28, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[kratiam]

I am with you on this one. I have thought Christiane Amanpour is an appallingly bad journalist for some time now, and her interview with Abhisit proved it. CNN is a pathetic excuse for a news network (though not as awful as FOX). Everything on seems to be more about their celebrity journalists than the actual news.

They should organize a live conference with Larry King, at least he knows how to ask tough questions.

You won't ever see Abhisit on Larry King. Far too many challening and quick questions there. The army guys behind the camera won't have a chance to hold up the answers for Abhisit in time.

Prat

[MisterBeetle]

No matter who killed the solider in the end any violence from here on out in my opinion is RED. The government has bent over backwards to avoid conflict.

If the red shirts keep trying to block roads and reek havoc on citizens, they have to know the potential for violence, and cannot act innocent.

They could easily go home and start to prepare for elections in less than a year.

If the government remains passive for too long, innocent citizens become at risk.

Well said jingthing!

IMHO:

People have to remember none of this would ever have happened if the red shirts started the blockades in the first place ( which is an illegal act in its own right).

They have no right to take the law into their own hands!

I have heard too many stories about terrorized drivers being stopped by red shirt thugs driving to work.

When will this all end?

It will have an end when people like you are writing posts like that. Nobody really wants to know what you've heard.

Stop your posts and all will have an end.

There's not much difference between foreigners who might think they know all about the problems here, but after all they know nothing at all.

SisaketMike.. Obviously you must be trying to take the piss out of me right? "It will have an end when people like you are writing posts like that."

No...this will end sometime soon and none of us will know how and when.

Good night.

[Thai at Heart]

Both BBC and CNN have said that the soldier that died was shot from behind in the head by police forces.

A BBC reporter is stating that it "appears" a soldier died from friendly fire. That assumption is not supported by any facts. Until something is proven it still could be from either side.

Time for CSI Bangkok............

And so the media tide starts to turn against the government. They have missed their chance to clean this up weeks ago. They cannot hang onto this.

[jcbangkok]

By taking off their red shirts and continuing to pursue illegal and violent acts against the people of Thailand and those empowered to protect ... it would seem to me they are defining themselves as terrorists and getting away from just having terrorists within their group.

Taking off red shirts = automatically become terrorists? Where did you get that logic from?

Either you're a terrorist or you're not. A red shirt doesn't make you a terrorist, and a terrorist can wear any shirt he wants.

I think by taking off the red shirts, they want to make themselves less vulnerable to army attacks. Because the army won't know if they're shooting at a government supporter or at a UDD supporter.

There is a reason why there is a forum rule about editing posts you are responding to. Had you not edited my post, you would be able to answer your questions.

I didn't modify your post in any way. It's a direct quote from your post. Anyone can go back in your post history and look it up themselves.

When you pull one sentence from a multi-paragraphed post and reply to that post (making it look like that is all I said) then you edited the post. This is not debatable .. check with the mods or the forum rules.

[kratiam]

its down to the poor against the rich,well thats what it seems to me now.

i am not a thai national but if its democracy they are after then call the elections

thaksin was sure as not honest but he knew how to run a country and i think also that some

people who comment here forget about the so called honest and democratic west,,ie ,bush against gore and

the uk ministers filling their pockets....i hope it dosent end up in a civil war and the only way to scale this down is call an election

and abide by the result,,,and this did all start over a coup by the army dont forget....

Your naivety (not sure of spelling but I know what it means) is stunning!

[Jingthing]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

Does ANY Thai PM have the power to say yes or no to martial law? Similarly, a coup. That is a military decision here (etc.) ...

[lazurus]

its down to the poor against the rich,well thats what it seems to me now.

i am not a thai national but if its democracy they are after then call the elections

thaksin was sure as not honest but he knew how to run a country and i think also that some

people who comment here forget about the so called honest and democratic west,,ie ,bush against gore and

the uk ministers filling their pockets....i hope it dosent end up in a civil war and the only way to scale this down is call an election

and abide by the result,,,and this did all start over a coup by the army dont forget....

Actually it's the rich against the rich, using the poor as pawns.

It's not so much democracy but a ticket on the gravy train.

An election will only be helpful if they abide by the electoral rules.

The coup wasn't the start, it was a reaction to injustice and massive corruption.

Whatever the result protests and terrorism will be used to undermine the next government too.

[elcent]

anyway ...

I see the present situation for common folks in a state shock, which it is. The pain comes later, that how it works in physical and spiritual realms. The pain will be extreme. No more smiles, more hatred, more lawlessness will follow.

Both red and yellow got a great deal of exposure of their miserable characters. and greed. The country will be falling into a second shock due the hard pain. Circle of life and death in Thailand, well scripted by a few.

[Jingthing]

When you pull one sentence from a multi-paragraphed post and reply to that post (making it look like that is all I said) then you edited the post. This is not debatable .. check with the mods or the forum rules.

Actually, I think you're wrong. No such rule.

[Thai at Heart]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

Does ANY Thai PM have the power to say yes or no to martial law? Similarly, a coup. That is a military decision here (etc.) ...

I don't know about the why's and wherefore's of issuing martial law. Have never done it myself. Presumably, in most parts of the world, the civilian government issues martial law in a country. This is on the BBC going to the world, not reserved for the ears of Thailand alone.

I just thought it was a great quote. "The people who HAVE THE POWER, have no intention of issuing martial law."

[jcbangkok]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

nor·mal·cy   [nawr-muhl-see] –noun

the quality or condition of being normal, as the general economic, political, and social conditions of a nation; normality: After months of living in a state of tension, all yearned for a return to normalcy.

See: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/normalcy

FYI: this is a BBC interview from earlier today. He seemed in my opinion and everything I have heard to look and sound good.

[jdinasia]

By taking off their red shirts and continuing to pursue illegal and violent acts against the people of Thailand and those empowered to protect ... it would seem to me they are defining themselves as terrorists and getting away from just having terrorists within their group.

Taking off red shirts = automatically become terrorists? Where did you get that logic from?

Either you're a terrorist or you're not. A red shirt doesn't make you a terrorist, and a terrorist can wear any shirt he wants.

I think by taking off the red shirts, they want to make themselves less vulnerable to army attacks. Because the army won't know if they're shooting at a government supporter or at a UDD supporter.

There is a reason why there is a forum rule about editing posts you are responding to. Had you not edited my post, you would be able to answer your questions.

I didn't modify your post in any way. It's a direct quote from your post. Anyone can go back in your post history and look it up themselves.

Hmmm I looked ... you modified it. You deleted about 75% of his post and only quoted a partial paragraph. Deleting sections of a post is in fact modifying it ... if you did not modify it then the whole/entire post would be in your quote.

[deadsnoopy]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

Says it all, doesn't it? When the Prime Minister admits to the world on BBC that he doesn't have any power.

[animatic]

It actually does look like friendly fire, and the fact that the army have confirmed that it was friendly fire makes it quite unnecessary to stir up any rumors. We all know the army is doing their best to blame everything on the red shirts, so for the army to come out and actually admit something must mean that there's really no doubt.

I have assumed this to be the case but when did the army confirm this? Do you know if it was army friendly fire or from police? My guess is an accident but wouldn't be surprised if in the heat of things a soldier could be mistaken for a red since I saw many today wearing military fatigues.

Interesting too for any that want to believe this is some kind of civil war because the rules of war make it clear you need to have an identifiable uniform. In actual war you can be shot as a spy for not having on your uniform while performing duties or if trying to pretend to be a civilian or wearing the uniform of the other side. By taking off their red shirts and continuing to pursue illegal and violent acts against the people of Thailand and those empowered to protect ... it would seem to me they are defining themselves as terrorists and getting away from just having terrorists within their group.

A very strong point also.

And it would seem since they do not have the liveried uniform numbers in red to actually call this

a real civil war they remove the red shirts. But that does leave them as 'out of uniform'

and thus insurgent guerrilla terrorists. It really seems they have a propensity to not fully

understand the gravity of their actions, and that has left them with a continuous escalation of tactics,

that leaves them farther and farther from the main stream Thais they IMAGINE that they represent.

So as they put out much of the largest city in their world, and alienate those working best they can for a better life,

they increasingly move away from those who here to for might have been sympathetic, and into the realm of

an isolated group of zealots, wreaking hgavoc across the greater part of the nation.

So telling that some of the main defenders here use images of

Che Guevara, Amadinajin, Carlos The Jackel, pure red block, Mao himself, evil looking canines, dead bodies,

and assorted faceless newbie dogsbodies all with the same exact message.

And many noting what long time posters said years back as if they were

'never bothering to post, but watched and recoded avidly many of our comments to pull up later... '

when they decided to join and post repeatedly the same boiler plate and occasional specific targeted attack of discrediting.

Yeah, Righty O... no conspiracy tin hat needed to see this pattern unfolding.

[lazurus]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

I guess you didn't learn the word normalcy at whatever school you may have attended. All you would need though is a dictionary.

nor·mal·i·ty play_w2("N0153800") (nôr-ml-t)n.1. The state or fact of being normal; normalcy.

A simple check would have told you that they mean the same thing. Problem is too many people here are so sure of being right they don't bother to check their facts.

[BNZ]

I am with you on this one. I have thought Christiane Amanpour is an appallingly bad journalist for some time now, and her interview with Abhisit proved it. CNN is a pathetic excuse for a news network (though not as awful as FOX). Everything on seems to be more about their celebrity journalists than the actual news.

They should organize a live conference with Larry King, at least he knows how to ask tough questions.

1. Fox News is only 5 mins of news and 23 hrs and 55 mins of 'opinion' (give or take a few mins). Celebrity journalists can build 'ratings' and ratings are ad revenue that's what it's about ! 

It's not about news hence my term Childrens Network News. It's puerile drivel, Ted Turner started it with pure intentions but now that it's owned by Warner it's a dumbed down profit center.

2. The decrepit, cadaverous, hunchback Larry King is a male Baba Walters and his 'tough questions' now are....

"Are you still on the line Arkansas ? "

[Jingthing]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

Does ANY Thai PM have the power to say yes or no to martial law? Similarly, a coup. That is a military decision here (etc.) ...

I don't know about the why's and wherefore's of issuing martial law. Have never done it myself. Presumably, in most parts of the world, the civilian government issues martial law in a country. This is on the BBC going to the world, not reserved for the ears of Thailand alone.

I just thought it was a great quote. "The people who HAVE THE POWER, have no intention of issuing martial law."

HUH?!?

If you are going to call Abhisit exceptionally weak in relation to this martial law powers you need to compare him to other THAI PM's. How things work in other countries is irrelevant to that point.

[deadsnoopy]

Hmmm I looked ... you modified it. You deleted about 75% of his post and only quoted a partial paragraph. Deleting sections of a post is in fact modifying it ... if you did not modify it then the whole/entire post would be in your quote.

Do you know the definition of a quote? A quote doesn't repeat the entire speech. It's a quote.

[asiawatcher]

Both BBC and CNN have said that the soldier that died was shot from behind in the head by police forces.

A BBC reporter is stating that it "appears" a soldier died from friendly fire. That assumption is not supported by any facts. Until something is proven it still could be from either side.

Time for CSI Bangkok............

More like Blackwater mercenaries...

[keepsamuiclean]

I'm a little sick of hearing the redshirts this and the redshirts that. This is democracy in motion. If a ruling party refuses to openly compromise then the outcome can be violent. People here are passionate about their country. I admire them for that. They are willing to give their life for what they believe in. You whiners that think your opinion matters are just adding to the problem. The Thai people have a leader they believe is illegitimate and they are acting as such.

Many years ago our countries did the same thing the Thai are doing now. GIVE THEM SOME SLACK!!! Your opinion as a farang means nothing but your trivial rhetoric may create discontent that isn't needed. We are bystanders. Pay some respect and allow the process to come to it's conclusion. It is coming soon. I believe we will have a better country that we are visiting than the one that exists now.

I couldn't agree with you more - and before the rest of you start with your nonsense about my maiden posting let me say that I have been reading this website for a considerable time and been appalled by the political naivete (and the grammar/spelling) of an apparently European/American/Australian website. I am not in any way an expert in Thai politics or history but it is obvious that we are witnessing a similar uprising (led by equally suspect demagogues) to that in Tsarist Russia where the people merely wanted a more equal society and the Bolsheviks claimed to want social revolution. Everyone knows how the Russian experiment with Socialism failed because of the corrupt politicians that too little democracy allows; what I believe could happen in Thailand is that somewhere down the line when the people realise that most politicians are not really interested in their concerns then they will wake up to the idea that universal suffrage means that they have a right to choose. At that point, as in our older democracies and with the same failings, a new political movement may arise led by a new generation of honest men and women of genuine conviction and integrity.

" a new generation of honest men and women of genuine conviction and integrety." You are getting 99 points! Abhisit is the new generation! A man who is not interested in money. Do you think that Thaksin would have left his bank card lying around with the safety no. so that the maid could steal money? No, but T. transferred millions to a secretary by share transfer on paper. I could go on and on - but it's your maiden post...

[Thai at Heart]

Everyone who has it.

Put on BBC now.

Poor Abhisit is tying himself in a wonderful knot trying to make the world understand what is going on in Thailand.

He makes himself look very very weak. "I do not have the power to issue martial law".

"The people who have the power, have no intention of issuing martial law". He is trying to skirt around the issue that he doesn't tell the army what to do, whilst not admitting it to the world. How wonderfully Thai.

I am sure he didn't learn the word "normalcy" at Eton. He is obviously reading the papers too much. I am sure it is "normality".

nor·mal·cy   [nawr-muhl-see] –noun

the quality or condition of being normal, as the general economic, political, and social conditions of a nation; normality: After months of living in a state of tension, all yearned for a return to normalcy.

See: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/normalcy

FYI: this is a BBC interview from earlier today. He seemed in my opinion and everything I have heard to look and sound good.

I disagree that it looked and sounded good. In so many ways he just doesn't look like he really believes in what he is doing. He comes across as a bureaucrat not a leader.

He is good, but not great at conveying his point. Reading between the lines, as I quoted before, he doesn't make himself look like he is the sole man in control. Now this might not be 100% relevant in Thailand, but on an international stage like the BBC it is important.

Normalcy vs. normality

The word “normalcy” had been around for more than half a century when President Warren G. Harding was assailed in the newspapers for having used it in a 1921 speech. Some folks are still upset; but in the US “normalcy” is a perfectly normal—if uncommon—synonym for “normality.”

As I said, I don't believe he learnt it at Eton. I believe they learn English English there.

http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/nonerrors.html

If its good enough for Washington State its good enough for me.

He didn't pull it off.

Edited April 28, 2010 by Thai at Heart

[whiterussian]

Martial law! Hahahaaa!! like they have any more tricks up their sleeves!

How can it be any different than it is now!?

(I hope i'm not wrong and martial law actually means shoot on sight!)

Mr A in the Hardtalk interview..."would you step down?" .. GULP ...

Go Mr A. Come back another day.

[Jingthing]

Hmmm I looked ... you modified it. You deleted about 75% of his post and only quoted a partial paragraph. Deleting sections of a post is in fact modifying it ... if you did not modify it then the whole/entire post would be in your quote.

Do you know the definition of a quote? A quote doesn't repeat the entire speech. It's a quote.

Such "modification" as described is 100 percent legit here. You cannot, however, alter the actual words of the quoted writer.

Edited April 28, 2010 by Jingthing

[deadsnoopy]

" a new generation of honest men and women of genuine conviction and integrety." You are getting 99 points! Abhisit is the new generation! A man who is not interested in money.

Is that why he as the party chairman and his Democrats are currently on trial for corruption charges? Because he's a honest man? A new generation? Not interested in money? (Except for the 258 million Baht in donations they took illegally).

Edited April 28, 2010 by deadsnoopy

[jcbangkok]

MP3 of entire BBC Interview with the PM

Part 1

Part 2

Part 3

[george and dragon]

Channel 3 news just reported that the person that run and left the grenades on the motorcycle left an ID card, The ID card is that of a police man. they are now looking to question such person.

And the hospital in Bangkok that treated the recent injured has now stated they will no longer treat the injured red shirts due to being subjected to searches and abuse from the reds..??

Not entirely sure how true these statements are but interesting news anyway....

[jdinasia]

Hmmm I looked ... you modified it. You deleted about 75% of his post and only quoted a partial paragraph. Deleting sections of a post is in fact modifying it ... if you did not modify it then the whole/entire post would be in your quote.

Do you know the definition of a quote? A quote doesn't repeat the entire speech. It's a quote.

didn't modify your post in any way

Answer --- yes you did you deleted over 75% of the post in your quote. Unmodified = remains as printed. You deleted 75% of it.