Thailand Imposes Curfew For Three More Nights

[kristophon]

I read in the New York Times that the four leaders who surrendered yesterday, before the greatest unrest and the fires, at the speaking platform inside the Red Shirts area pleaded with those there to just give up that day and to pick up later on, that they could carry on this struggle later on. However, the crowd booed them! The leaders then left to be tried for treason. I really do not believe that, in the hearts of those who lead these demonstrations, they were at all intent on violence; they wanted to peacefully achieve something that the crowd really wants: liberty, equality and fraternity, not the "peace and bread" offerred by the Bolsheviks before the 1917 Revolution. I am sure that these people really care more about Thailand and the future of Thailand than people here seem to give credit. Why are so many here not interested in the deeper ideas behind the protests of the Red Shirts? Is it that you have a "position" here that is comfortable and, of course, with a higher economic level than most Thais will ever enjoy and you are afraid to lose it? Is it that you are carrying with you a certain sense that you are of some higher class or ethnicity than most Thais?

When I move to Thailand in 2011, I know that I will be a guest there. I will act as a guest. I will, most certainly, develop friendships there as well with people of many "classes" as well. I would hope that we could discuss things that are happening in Thai social, political, economic and cultural areas openly and that they can educate ME. I will certainly not be there to dictate what the people want, need or do. When I was there for a month on Phuket, I was fortunate to make friends there and to be able, to this day, to ask questions honestly and to discuss them freely (of course there are some things forbidden and I will not go there with them at all as I respect that as a matter of course). As a "farang" myself, I will never stand in judgement of the actions of any group in Thailand for it is, most certainly, not my "place." Fortunately, you have this forum to talk in and to say as you please to the same extent as I have.

Please, tell me, politically, socially and economically, where the Red Shirts are "off base" here! Also, what are the goods as well as the negatives of BOTH the Red Shirts AND the Yellow Shirts. What are, as you see it, the platforms of each group and how do they mesh or not mesh with the current Thai political, social and economic structure. What are the "classes" in Thai society? Where are you in terms of this heirarchy?

Thank you so much. You may email me directly, if you wish to establish a dialog over time, at [email protected].

Take care. Hopefully, for now, this is settled. However, I am sure that this entire thing will be revisited in the not-too-distant future.

Glad to hear that after 1 month here, and with intention to move here next year, that you are so well informed on the social, political, and economic situation that you are able to advise all us long term expats how we should behave.

Thanks.

actually i think they are more interested in the Credit, bestowed on them by their great leader to win votes... credit that they never could or never even had the intention of paying back...

[kmj]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

The curfew is there to protect Bangkok and it's citizens - people like you and me.

The less people there are on the streets - the easier it is to distinguish between troublemakers with bad intentions and innocents.

So keeping us innocent bystanders inside will keep us safe and make the job of clearing up the troublemakers quicker and easier.

And then hopefully normality can return quickly and we can all stay out all night long again until the sun rises

yes but you see he dont get that. he has a learning disability; he was dropped on his head from the 2nd floor when he was an hour old. he did survive the drop but that's about it. Thank you though for trying to point out the common sense of the curfew. u r a noble man

And all this from a holocaust denier!! I've read your other posts... I think you're the one dropped on his head

[feesas]

Great news for Pattaya already on its knees, now this, way over the top

Nalak what's going on in Pattaya - out of touch with my old stomping ground for a couple of months .... Please let post back - would appreicate it. Thanks.

[ovaltina]

that has been my concern.

Have been to BKK for a few years and traveled to almost all parts of Thailand including North and North East.

I know many shop owners in my area, they are mostly Isaan, and many know me by name. I also shop at the local Thai market.

Lately,may be it's just me being paranoid, I have noticed some change in their attitude.

Nothing hostile but the smiles and overly friendly demeanor are gone.

It has not happened over night but has been going down for about a month or so.

In the beginning the feeling was like something was amiss, not right, not as usual but I could not put my finger on it at first.

Understandably, some of them if not all are upset by the latest events, but a little over a month ago there was no hint of things turning that nasty.

As a result I don't feel as comfortable as before going to a thai market, which was fun in the past when all was well.

Is it just my personal experience or there is something going on that I don't get?

I have never felt unsafe in BKK or in Thailand for that matter, now it is starting to change.

Let's wait and see.

I don't think you are being paranoid. I also don't think that the Thai have animosity towards you. Nonetheless I too have noticed in the last 12 years visiting & living in Thailand, a gradual change, each year a little further downhill.

I talk to my Bkk Thai friends about it and they say, its not directed at foreigners, it is a general feeling of unhappiness. The LOS wasn't just created for tourists, this land because of its climate and abundance actually had happy smiling citizens before that. But in the last 20 years, it has been going on the slide.

I know that there is a great deal of worry among common people about an eventual power vacuum at the top, and I'm not talking about the government. There is also inevitable dismay at the cyclic violent upheavals. When you have had military coups and fighting in the streets many times before, to see them re-appearing again in 2010 is a very wearying feeling for Thais. They don't blame foreigners though,they just feel that it is a lowering of standards within Thai society.

An example, one of my oldest and dearest friends is 70 year old Thai hotelier, who has worked in Bangkok since the 1950s. He started out as bellboy in hotel, and is now very high up in the echelons. Often when he's talking to me about Bkk he starts to cry, very strange to see a 70 year old in a smart suit just crying like that. He says it is education and kids, they don't have values of decency, honour and the value of a craftsman's trade.

Watching those juvenile red-shirt anarchists burning this beautiful city, that was built by poor working men from ages gone by, men who felt proud at their work & their noble city, I understand why Thais feel that it is a lowering of standards in the youth that is the cause.

[phuketsigel]

THAI GOVERNMENT IS A KINDERGARDEN!

Now the citiziens and businesses even in unaffected areas have to suffer from their incompetence! They should have cleaned up this mess the day the protests started. And the curfew what good is it outside bkk, udon, chiang mai? How many red shirt lootings has Pattaya and Chonburi had? Well, none but lets just impose a curfew, why not its kinda cool.

Yesterday they said one night. then its 3 more nights. probably 3 more weeks they way this incompetent bunch of idiots behaved since the start of the crisis.

Why do the citizens and businesses should follow these idiotic orders?? The red shirts were the ones hijacking and destroying property. They certainly did not follow any laws?! What good will come from that curfew outside of certain areas of BKK? Complete joke which makes thailand show its real face that of a coward incompetent nation with incompetent citizens to boot.

I ask all self thinking individuals NOT to follow this silly order!

do not spend even one unnecessary baht in this pathetic country! let them feel the full swing of low season, worldwide recession, terrible exchange rates and let them suffer for their increasingly bad service, corrupt police, hostile attidude, incompetent leadership, ridicoulous education and xenophobic, self-centered world view. RIP THAILAND. SOM NUM NAA

catch ya later. enjoy your trip back to wherever ya came from. you shant be missed

A fool`s paradise is the wise man`s hel_l

[My Friend Same]

Personally I disobey the curfew - I value my freedom more than anything else. There might be some risk associated with my attitude but I'm willing to take it. I spent a couple of hours last night just riding my motorbike all around Chiang Mai. With very few cars and bikes on the street it was great fun. Only saw a lonelz policeman on a bike and he didn't seem to be interested in me at all.

I think some of you are taking this curfew thing way to serious, but if you want to stay at home that is your call of course.

I'm so proud of you! You're so brave and so right too! Chang Mai? Come on down and start riding around Silom and Din Daeng you lousy chicken you. Once a pussy always a pussy

[jeepster]

When I,m over in Thailand ,I often look at FOX NEWS just to laugh at some of the redneck totally biased coverage given to world events . Coming on to this forum is a similar experience , depressing but habit forming . Good to laugh at the Colonel Blimp attitudes of the majority of posters putting self interest above the genuine grievances of the poorer sections of the populace . If you are so clever and have all the answers , what are you doing over there in the first place ? Surely you should be sorting out the mess in your own countries . We are the first to complain when foriegners come to the UK and tell us how to live, so why presume to tell the Thai people how to conduct their affairs . Maybe some of you should remember that your nightly bar bill far exceeds the wage of an Issan working man ...but that of course is why you are here in the first place

[My Friend Same]

I read in the New York Times that the four leaders who surrendered yesterday, before the greatest unrest and the fires, at the speaking platform inside the Red Shirts area pleaded with those there to just give up that day and to pick up later on, that they could carry on this struggle later on. However, the crowd booed them! The leaders then left to be tried for treason. I really do not believe that, in the hearts of those who lead these demonstrations, they were at all intent on violence; they wanted to peacefully achieve something that the crowd really wants: liberty, equality and fraternity, not the "peace and bread" offerred by the Bolsheviks before the 1917 Revolution. I am sure that these people really care more about Thailand and the future of Thailand than people here seem to give credit. Why are so many here not interested in the deeper ideas behind the protests of the Red Shirts? Is it that you have a "position" here that is comfortable and, of course, with a higher economic level than most Thais will ever enjoy and you are afraid to lose it? Is it that you are carrying with you a certain sense that you are of some higher class or ethnicity than most Thais?

When I move to Thailand in 2011, I know that I will be a guest there. I will act as a guest. I will, most certainly, develop friendships there as well with people of many "classes" as well. I would hope that we could discuss things that are happening in Thai social, political, economic and cultural areas openly and that they can educate ME. I will certainly not be there to dictate what the people want, need or do. When I was there for a month on Phuket, I was fortunate to make friends there and to be able, to this day, to ask questions honestly and to discuss them freely (of course there are some things forbidden and I will not go there with them at all as I respect that as a matter of course). As a "farang" myself, I will never stand in judgement of the actions of any group in Thailand for it is, most certainly, not my "place." Fortunately, you have this forum to talk in and to say as you please to the same extent as I have.

Please, tell me, politically, socially and economically, where the Red Shirts are "off base" here! Also, what are the goods as well as the negatives of BOTH the Red Shirts AND the Yellow Shirts. What are, as you see it, the platforms of each group and how do they mesh or not mesh with the current Thai political, social and economic structure. What are the "classes" in Thai society? Where are you in terms of this heirarchy?

Thank you so much. You may email me directly, if you wish to establish a dialog over time, at [email protected].

Take care. Hopefully, for now, this is settled. However, I am sure that this entire thing will be revisited in the not-too-distant future.

Glad to hear that after 1 month here, and with intention to move here next year, that you are so well informed on the social, political, and economic situation that you are able to advise all us long term expats how we should behave.

Thanks.

Yes and didnt they make a movie about dudes like that. dam whats the name of that movie, it's on the tip of my tongue. Wait I got it, the movie was "Jackass 3"

[expat8]

that has been my concern.

Have been to BKK for a few years and traveled to almost all parts of Thailand including North and North East.

I know many shop owners in my area, they are mostly Isaan, and many know me by name. I also shop at the local Thai market.

Lately,may be it's just me being paranoid, I have noticed some change in their attitude.

Nothing hostile but the smiles and overly friendly demeanor are gone.

It has not happened over night but has been going down for about a month or so.

In the beginning the feeling was like something was amiss, not right, not as usual but I could not put my finger on it at first.

Understandably, some of them if not all are upset by the latest events, but a little over a month ago there was no hint of things turning that nasty.

As a result I don't feel as comfortable as before going to a thai market, which was fun in the past when all was well.

Is it just my personal experience or there is something going on that I don't get?

I have never felt unsafe in BKK or in Thailand for that matter, now it is starting to change.

Let's wait and see.

I don't think you are being paranoid. I also don't think that the Thai have animosity towards you. Nonetheless I too have noticed in the last 12 years visiting & living in Thailand, a gradual change, each year a little further downhill.

I talk to my Bkk Thai friends about it and they say, its not directed at foreigners, it is a general feeling of unhappiness. The LOS wasn't just created for tourists, this land because of its climate and abundance actually had happy smiling citizens before that. But in the last 20 years, it has been going on the slide.

I know that there is a great deal of worry among common people about an eventual power vacuum at the top, and I'm not talking about the government. There is also inevitable dismay at the cyclic violent upheavals. When you have had military coups and fighting in the streets many times before, to see them re-appearing again in 2010 is a very wearying feeling for Thais. They don't blame foreigners though,they just feel that it is a lowering of standards within Thai society.

An example, one of my oldest and dearest friends is 70 year old Thai hotelier, who has worked in Bangkok since the 1950s. He started out as bellboy in hotel, and is now very high up in the echelons. Often when he's talking to me about Bkk he starts to cry, very strange to see a 70 year old in a smart suit just crying like that. He says it is education and kids, they don't have values of decency, honour and the value of a craftsman's trade.

Watching those juvenile red-shirt anarchists burning this beautiful city, that was built by poor working men from ages gone by, men who felt proud at their work & their noble city, I understand why Thais feel that it is a lowering of standards in the youth that is the cause.

That's not happening just in Thailand.

[ovaltina]

Personally I disobey the curfew - I value my freedom more than anything else. There might be some risk associated with my attitude but I'm willing to take it. I spent a couple of hours last night just riding my motorbike all around Chiang Mai. With very few cars and bikes on the street it was great fun. Only saw a lonelz policeman on a bike and he didn't seem to be interested in me at all.

I think some of you are taking this curfew thing way to serious, but if you want to stay at home that is your call of course.

I'm so proud of you! You're so brave and so right too! Chang Mai? Come on down and start riding around Silom and Din Daeng you lousy chicken you. Once a pussy always a pussy

It's all Rock & Roll until you're waiting for the nurse to wheel you & your ventilator to the WC in the critical~care~ward.

[My Friend Same]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

The curfew is there to protect Bangkok and it's citizens - people like you and me.

The less people there are on the streets - the easier it is to distinguish between troublemakers with bad intentions and innocents.

So keeping us innocent bystanders inside will keep us safe and make the job of clearing up the troublemakers quicker and easier.

And then hopefully normality can return quickly and we can all stay out all night long again until the sun rises

yes but you see he dont get that. he has a learning disability; he was dropped on his head from the 2nd floor when he was an hour old. he did survive the drop but that's about it. Thank you though for trying to point out the common sense of the curfew. u r a noble man

And all this from a holocaust denier!! I've read your other posts... I think you're the one dropped on his head

So this is your #2 ID out of how many? Nice that you come out and acknoweldge your other IDs.

[feesas]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

yeah, just what the soldiers need is jackasses out and about during the curfew.

Bangkok is a huge city with many exciting & colourful corners, and even in peaceful pre-Red times, going out at night thinking "I have nothing to fear in Bangkok" is very quaint. There's exotic and interesting gang areas and places where they wouldn't even find your dainty little slippers for months.

Now with the hardcore Reds, who have automatic weapons, grenades, are high on Meth and have showed repeatedly they are more than happy to kill anybody,if you go skipping around at night out there you are incautious.

many people doesn't figure out yet that the land of smile (LOS) doesn't exist anymore and it changed into land of fire (LOF)

I FIGURED THAT OUT 20 ODD YEARS AGO OR SO! HOW DO YOU THINK THAILAND STAYED 'UNCOLONIZED' AMONGST THE OTHER S.E. ASIAN COUNTRIES? PURE GUILE WITH A SMILE AND FIRE WITHIN THE BELLY! NEVER BE FOOLED WITH A SMILE AND NEVER TRUST ALL THOSE WHO GIVE YOU A SMILE. TAKES A LONG TIME TO FIND THE GENUINE SMILE, THE GENUINE FRIEND. BUT NO, LOS WAS A MYTH OF TRAVEL AGENTS/GOVT. AUITHORITIES!! VERY GOOD SELLING POINT - WORKED FOR DECADES!

[kissrev1]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

So your solution is that everyone that looks like a farang should be able to be out and about? And where exactly should we go since the rest of the millions of people are restricted to their homes? A taxi driver and "normal" people (whatever that means) that are breaking curfew is your reasoning for breaking the curfew as well? The vast majority of Red's are regular people that are fighting for something they believe in, but there is an element (obviously) in that group that would love to take this to another level with guns, bombs, fires and other destructive measures. They have already been named terrorists and if caught will be executed. What is there to lose now? You are foolish to act as though this curfew is an inconvenience when in all practicality YOU the foreigner is a prime reason why the curfew was put in place to begin with. How do you think it is going to play to the rest of the world when the first TOURIST from the UK or USA is blown away by a grenade while they are taking a stroll out on the street? The Red's did not get their way... what makes you think that moving them out of the downtown has broken their resolve? Stop crying about a few days of curfew and wake up to the fact that this isn't the typical "coup" scenario that we've seen in the past with the Thai government. This is a movement that has a strong support structure made up of (to use your description) "normal" Thai people. I hope that the radical element in that group does not go to new tactics including bombing locations where foreigners go so that they completely cripple this government. A curfew is small price to pay to help enable the military and police to stop, detain and disrupt the Red's that intend harm to society. Get a grip.

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

[ovaltina]

that has been my concern.

Have been to BKK for a few years and traveled to almost all parts of Thailand including North and North East.

I know many shop owners in my area, they are mostly Isaan, and many know me by name. I also shop at the local Thai market.

Lately,may be it's just me being paranoid, I have noticed some change in their attitude.

Nothing hostile but the smiles and overly friendly demeanor are gone.

It has not happened over night but has been going down for about a month or so.

In the beginning the feeling was like something was amiss, not right, not as usual but I could not put my finger on it at first.

Understandably, some of them if not all are upset by the latest events, but a little over a month ago there was no hint of things turning that nasty.

As a result I don't feel as comfortable as before going to a thai market, which was fun in the past when all was well.

Is it just my personal experience or there is something going on that I don't get?

I have never felt unsafe in BKK or in Thailand for that matter, now it is starting to change.

Let's wait and see.

I don't think you are being paranoid. I also don't think that the Thai have animosity towards you. Nonetheless I too have noticed in the last 12 years visiting & living in Thailand, a gradual change, each year a little further downhill.

I talk to my Bkk Thai friends about it and they say, its not directed at foreigners, it is a general feeling of unhappiness. The LOS wasn't just created for tourists, this land because of its climate and abundance actually had happy smiling citizens before that. But in the last 20 years, it has been going on the slide.

I know that there is a great deal of worry among common people about an eventual power vacuum at the top, and I'm not talking about the government. There is also inevitable dismay at the cyclic violent upheavals. When you have had military coups and fighting in the streets many times before, to see them re-appearing again in 2010 is a very wearying feeling for Thais. They don't blame foreigners though,they just feel that it is a lowering of standards within Thai society.

An example, one of my oldest and dearest friends is 70 year old Thai hotelier, who has worked in Bangkok since the 1950s. He started out as bellboy in hotel, and is now very high up in the echelons. Often when he's talking to me about Bkk he starts to cry, very strange to see a 70 year old in a smart suit just crying like that. He says it is education and kids, they don't have values of decency, honour and the value of a craftsman's trade.

Watching those juvenile red-shirt anarchists burning this beautiful city, that was built by poor working men from ages gone by, men who felt proud at their work & their noble city, I understand why Thais feel that it is a lowering of standards in the youth that is the cause.

That's not happening just in Thailand.

I know. But this is a Thai forum.

[My Friend Same]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

So your solution is that everyone that looks like a farang should be able to be out and about? And where exactly should we go since the rest of the millions of people are restricted to their homes? A taxi driver and "normal" people (whatever that means) that are breaking curfew is your reasoning for breaking the curfew as well? The vast majority of Red's are regular people that are fighting for something they believe in, but there is an element (obviously) in that group that would love to take this to another level with guns, bombs, fires and other destructive measures. They have already been named terrorists and if caught will be executed. What is there to lose now? You are foolish to act as though this curfew is an inconvenience when in all practicality YOU the foreigner is a prime reason why the curfew was put in place to begin with. How do you think it is going to play to the rest of the world when the first TOURIST from the UK or USA is blown away by a grenade while they are taking a stroll out on the street? The Red's did not get their way... what makes you think that moving them out of the downtown has broken their resolve? Stop crying about a few days of curfew and wake up to the fact that this isn't the typical "coup" scenario that we've seen in the past with the Thai government. This is a movement that has a strong support structure made up of (to use your description) "normal" Thai people. I hope that the radical element in that group does not go to new tactics including bombing locations where foreigners go so that they completely cripple this government. A curfew is small price to pay to help enable the military and police to stop, detain and disrupt the Red's that intend harm to society. Get a grip.

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

I'm proud of you, so proud. You are my hero

[feesas]

that has been my concern.

Have been to BKK for a few years and traveled to almost all parts of Thailand including North and North East.

I know many shop owners in my area, they are mostly Isaan, and many know me by name. I also shop at the local Thai market.

Lately,may be it's just me being paranoid, I have noticed some change in their attitude.

Nothing hostile but the smiles and overly friendly demeanor are gone.

It has not happened over night but has been going down for about a month or so.

In the beginning the feeling was like something was amiss, not right, not as usual but I could not put my finger on it at first.

Understandably, some of them if not all are upset by the latest events, but a little over a month ago there was no hint of things turning that nasty.

As a result I don't feel as comfortable as before going to a thai market, which was fun in the past when all was well.

Is it just my personal experience or there is something going on that I don't get?

I have never felt unsafe in BKK or in Thailand for that matter, now it is starting to change.

Let's wait and see.

I don't think you are being paranoid. I also don't think that the Thai have animosity towards you. Nonetheless I too have noticed in the last 12 years visiting & living in Thailand, a gradual change, each year a little further downhill.

I talk to my Bkk Thai friends about it and they say, its not directed at foreigners, it is a general feeling of unhappiness. The LOS wasn't just created for tourists, this land because of its climate and abundance actually had happy smiling citizens before that. But in the last 20 years, it has been going on the slide.

I know that there is a great deal of worry among common people about an eventual power vacuum at the top, and I'm not talking about the government. There is also inevitable dismay at the cyclic violent upheavals. When you have had military coups and fighting in the streets many times before, to see them re-appearing again in 2010 is a very wearying feeling for Thais. They don't blame foreigners though,they just feel that it is a lowering of standards within Thai society.

An example, one of my oldest and dearest friends is 70 year old Thai hotelier, who has worked in Bangkok since the 1950s. He started out as bellboy in hotel, and is now very high up in the echelons. Often when he's talking to me about Bkk he starts to cry, very strange to see a 70 year old in a smart suit just crying like that. He says it is education and kids, they don't have values of decency, honour and the value of a craftsman's trade.

Watching those juvenile red-shirt anarchists burning this beautiful city, that was built by poor working men from ages gone by, men who felt proud at their work & their noble city, I understand why Thais feel that it is a lowering of standards in the youth that is the cause.

Thank you for posting this. It was very touching and a different viewpoint to what I thought about the LOS - so educational too. Isn't this lower of standards throughout the world and the attitude of the young towards honour and craft etc. and yes, value of culture and what it really means etc. It's the fast buck syndrome again isn't it. Your friend must be a fascinating man to talk. The feeling of weariness must also be the lack of enough change that they experience with each cycle of violence and coup d'etat also. there is no tangible change for the poor.

Need more great postings like these - more people need educatin'!

[Brewsta]

Great news for Pattaya already on its knees, now this, way over the top

I hate to break this news to you, but the entire country is on its knees. I am taking it that being 'way over the top' that you're upset you will be able to perch your bottom on a bar stool only until 9pm?

There is a country to fix in case you hadn't noticed.

Yeah , good point, all I have seen is a whole lot of Frangs moaning about curfews, lets get to the medical side of things and give that Liver and Kidneys a rest, do most of you the world of good.

If ones own home country was in flames, would pub opening hours be high on or top of your list of worries- not me.

Thailand is 'breaking its social mould (? sic?) IMHO and People before Pints is my personal concern......follow your heart, I guess?

A sobering point of view maybe, but as I sit here in Arabia, 3500 miles away from my wife and kids in LOS, I am not sleeping so well at night.

Stay safe All,

Brewsta

[Bobsufc]

Great news for Pattaya already on its knees, now this, way over the top

Three nights of Curfew will make little difference to Pattaya's problems but they may make a big diffence to Thailand as a whole. Do you want take the chance of having burning buildings in Pattaya. That would be more economically damaging.

[HardenedSoul]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

So your solution is that everyone that looks like a farang should be able to be out and about? And where exactly should we go since the rest of the millions of people are restricted to their homes? A taxi driver and "normal" people (whatever that means) that are breaking curfew is your reasoning for breaking the curfew as well? The vast majority of Red's are regular people that are fighting for something they believe in, but there is an element (obviously) in that group that would love to take this to another level with guns, bombs, fires and other destructive measures. They have already been named terrorists and if caught will be executed. What is there to lose now? You are foolish to act as though this curfew is an inconvenience when in all practicality YOU the foreigner is a prime reason why the curfew was put in place to begin with. How do you think it is going to play to the rest of the world when the first TOURIST from the UK or USA is blown away by a grenade while they are taking a stroll out on the street? The Red's did not get their way... what makes you think that moving them out of the downtown has broken their resolve? Stop crying about a few days of curfew and wake up to the fact that this isn't the typical "coup" scenario that we've seen in the past with the Thai government. This is a movement that has a strong support structure made up of (to use your description) "normal" Thai people. I hope that the radical element in that group does not go to new tactics including bombing locations where foreigners go so that they completely cripple this government. A curfew is small price to pay to help enable the military and police to stop, detain and disrupt the Red's that intend harm to society. Get a grip.

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

[ovaltina]

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

It's a beautiful sunny day because it is Thailand in the summer.

It's quiet / not untoward today because there is school holidays, bank holiday, and emergency services trying to restore essential infrastructure.

There are not gangs of AK-toting thugs chasing you down the road, because it is day time and they prefer the cover of darkness. You can see this in recent events, they were generally resting in the days.

The sky isn't falling, but a lot of hard working Bangkok families have lost jobs, income and sometimes sons & daughters because of the criminal Red murderers.

This government is not crippled. It is the acceptable face of corporate SEA, it will stay until such day that Glaxo, Sanofi, Shell and all the others decide to put a new pretty face infront of the cameras.

All in all, a lot of broken hearts around today, disheartened people picking up the pieces, like a bar-owner does the day after his family-friendly bar got invaded by a huge gang of drunken hillbillies.

[landofthefree]

Great news for Pattaya already on its knees, now this, way over the top

I hate to break this news to you, but the entire country is on its knees. I am taking it that being 'way over the top' that you're upset you will be able to perch your bottom on a bar stool only until 9pm?

There is a country to fix in case you hadn't noticed.

Yeah , good point, all I have seen is a whole lot of Frangs moaning about curfews, lets get to the medical side of things and give that Liver and Kidneys a rest, do most of you the world of good.

Why didn't I think of that? UnfortunatelyI have just stocked my apartment fridge with a case of Chang beer and the temptation to while away the hours of imprisonment with my old friend Dr. Chang will be irresisitable! Doh!

[Brewsta]

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

It's a beautiful sunny day because it is Thailand in the summer.

It's quiet / not untoward today because there is school holidays, bank holiday, and emergency services trying to restore essential infrastructure.

There are not gangs of AK-toting thugs chasing you down the road, because it is day time and they prefer the cover of darkness. You can see this in recent events, they were generally resting in the days.

The sky isn't falling, but a lot of hard working Bangkok families have lost jobs, income and sometimes sons & daughters because of the criminal Red murderers.

This government is not crippled. It is the acceptable face of corporate SEA, it will stay until such day that Glaxo, Sanofi, Shell and all the others decide to put a new pretty face infront of the cameras.

All in all, a lot of broken hearts around today, disheartened people picking up the pieces, like a bar-owner does the day after his family-friendly bar got invaded by a huge gang of drunken hillbillies.

Bar-owner !! More booze examples!!

This ain't no rhetorical industry-specific trauma....there ARE thousands of ALL kinds of businesses, 'picking up the pieces' as you say.

Your points are well-made and pertinent, but why does this this obsession, generally, about how the alcohol culture obsesses the farang(only?) , repeatedly rear its head and seems to invade so many aspects of our discussion?

Brewsta

Edited May 20, 2010 by Brewsta

[Brewsta]

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

It's a beautiful sunny day because it is Thailand in the summer.

It's quiet / not untoward today because there is school holidays, bank holiday, and emergency services trying to restore essential infrastructure.

There are not gangs of AK-toting thugs chasing you down the road, because it is day time and they prefer the cover of darkness. You can see this in recent events, they were generally resting in the days.

The sky isn't falling, but a lot of hard working Bangkok families have lost jobs, income and sometimes sons & daughters because of the criminal Red murderers.

This government is not crippled. It is the acceptable face of corporate SEA, it will stay until such day that Glaxo, Sanofi, Shell and all the others decide to put a new pretty face infront of the cameras.

All in all, a lot of broken hearts around today, disheartened people picking up the pieces, like a bar-owner does the day after his family-friendly bar got invaded by a huge gang of drunken hillbillies.

Bar-owner !! More booze examples!!

This ain't no rhetorical industry-specific trauma....there ARE thousands of ALL kinds of businesses, 'picking up the pieces' as you say.

Your points are well-made and pertinent, but why does this this obsession, generally, about how the alcohol culture obsesses the farang(only?) , repeatedly rear its head and seems to invade so many aspects of our discussion?

Brewsta

To clarify my irritation, Ovaltina, this is not a personal pop against you, but a general boredom of booze being such a common thread in many replies over the many years (15 years in Thailand in total so far) that I have loved to live in LOS.

Have Peace Everyday,

Paul

Edited May 20, 2010 by Brewsta

[Grey11]

not happy about this curfew going on for 3 more nights. that leaves the weekend in ruins. anyone know if its still possible to go out for a few drinks in bangkok anywhere at all?

Why can't you drink at home for a few night? Look how much money you can save. You can get a female for entertainment if you like and play some music on the stereo, will not be nearly as loud. You may even want to partake in a conversation with the young lady. Not the end of the world.

[pkspeaker]

oh please shut up and stop whining, this is so more people don't get murdered and have their properties destroyed by terrorists, it has nothing to do with you personal safety, i assure you no-one cares.. these terrorists blend in with the local population and then strike, the police need a few more days to track them down if thats ok and other farangs who just have to get drunk everynight at a bar and can't doit at home 1 or 2 freken days

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

[MuuDaeng]

Is it really impossible to have any conversation without quoting whole thread in every-single-answer. If there is pictures they are also "quoted" sometimes even three...four or more on same page. What is wrong with you people, don't you really know what is thread about without quoting every answer in every your answer, less would be ok (just few words, or line or thing you're answering about, if really needed).

Quoting all shit makes reading/answering threads really, hmm..., shitty. Especially with low speed net, waiting quotes after quotes appearing. Oh my Buddha.

Edited May 20, 2010 by MuuDaeng

[Netfan]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

So your solution is that everyone that looks like a farang should be able to be out and about? And where exactly should we go since the rest of the millions of people are restricted to their homes? A taxi driver and "normal" people (whatever that means) that are breaking curfew is your reasoning for breaking the curfew as well? The vast majority of Red's are regular people that are fighting for something they believe in, but there is an element (obviously) in that group that would love to take this to another level with guns, bombs, fires and other destructive measures. They have already been named terrorists and if caught will be executed. What is there to lose now? You are foolish to act as though this curfew is an inconvenience when in all practicality YOU the foreigner is a prime reason why the curfew was put in place to begin with. How do you think it is going to play to the rest of the world when the first TOURIST from the UK or USA is blown away by a grenade while they are taking a stroll out on the street? The Red's did not get their way... what makes you think that moving them out of the downtown has broken their resolve? Stop crying about a few days of curfew and wake up to the fact that this isn't the typical "coup" scenario that we've seen in the past with the Thai government. This is a movement that has a strong support structure made up of (to use your description) "normal" Thai people. I hope that the radical element in that group does not go to new tactics including bombing locations where foreigners go so that they completely cripple this government. A curfew is small price to pay to help enable the military and police to stop, detain and disrupt the Red's that intend harm to society. Get a grip.

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

glad you are happy. two major shopping malls near me are closed - and i am not near any hot zones. how about the normal thai people who work or own shops in those malls? the clerks, food service people, cleaning staff? the ones who own food stalls outside? just like the red leaders - think of yourselves and no one else, least of all the hard working law abiding thai people who refused to get sucked into the bullsh*t rhetoric of the red shirts. i'm sure they would be happy to know you're having a wonderful day

Edited May 20, 2010 by Netfan

[bluecheesefan]

Completely absurd! I am an adult with little to fear from the Red Shirts, or anyone else in Bangkok. Once again, the Thai government chooses to treat its citizenry and the others living here as if we are all 12 years old. Why is it that every "solution" from these guys tends towards the lose- lose category? Incidentally, I walked around last night at 10PM. It was quiet, but there were still normal people out and about. One taxi even tried to pick me up for a fare.

So your solution is that everyone that looks like a farang should be able to be out and about? And where exactly should we go since the rest of the millions of people are restricted to their homes? A taxi driver and "normal" people (whatever that means) that are breaking curfew is your reasoning for breaking the curfew as well? The vast majority of Red's are regular people that are fighting for something they believe in, but there is an element (obviously) in that group that would love to take this to another level with guns, bombs, fires and other destructive measures. They have already been named terrorists and if caught will be executed. What is there to lose now? You are foolish to act as though this curfew is an inconvenience when in all practicality YOU the foreigner is a prime reason why the curfew was put in place to begin with. How do you think it is going to play to the rest of the world when the first TOURIST from the UK or USA is blown away by a grenade while they are taking a stroll out on the street? The Red's did not get their way... what makes you think that moving them out of the downtown has broken their resolve? Stop crying about a few days of curfew and wake up to the fact that this isn't the typical "coup" scenario that we've seen in the past with the Thai government. This is a movement that has a strong support structure made up of (to use your description) "normal" Thai people. I hope that the radical element in that group does not go to new tactics including bombing locations where foreigners go so that they completely cripple this government. A curfew is small price to pay to help enable the military and police to stop, detain and disrupt the Red's that intend harm to society. Get a grip.

I didn't say anything about everyone who looks like a farang should be out and about. Those are your words not mine, chief. Normal people means motorcycle taxi drivers, street vendors, old men, young ladies, etc. Don't kid yourself for a minute that I, or any other foreigners in Thailand are the Prime reasons the curfew was put in place. Quite frankly, your concerns about how it would play to the rest of the world if a foreigner were hurt or killed is moot. Thailand has never shown much concern over that. My whole point. Beginning to end through this whole thread, is that the Thai government knee jerked an over the top reaction. They did. Full stop. The lack of any breaking news today, thus far at least, is just proving that point> I don't know why there are so many on here that are so adamant about railing against someone with an opinion. Have you been out today? I have. I drove through six postal codes in central Bangkok. It's a beautiful sunny day, and there is nothing untoward going on. Pull your heads out of the sand. The sky isn't falling, and as far as crippling this government goes, that has been pretty much achieved.

You didn't say it, but it is implied that YOU should not be one that is touched by the laws of the land... a curfew is a law btw. And those "normal" people you list are only "normal" because you don't see them wearing red. What color do you think the Red's are wearing today??? RED??? The faction that is causing the problems are now considered terrorists and sticking out like a sore thumb wearing red is probably not their agenda today. Blending in is much wiser on their part. Are you just a complete dolt or what? What other reason than the protection of the city, the people and yes the farang would there be for calling a curfew? Certainly you don't believe that they did it to cause more pain to the economy do you? What reason could they have for keeping law abiding (you are not included here) people safe? Breaking the curfew is breaking a law. If IF IF... they had time to deal with your ridiculous axx they would have every right to jail you on sight... and as others have said... shoot to kill if they want. WHAT IS A CURFEW ABOUT ANYWAY? This is not the USA or UK where if a curfew is called and you are caught... the nice policeman calls your momma. As for knee jerking reactions... people burning down the stores and buildings in the downtown is not a big deal to you? Billions of baht in damages is not a big deal to you? Thousands of people out of work is not a big deal to you? You don't deserve to be in this country. You do not respect it or the people. No wonder the Thai people look at farang more and more like bad house guests. GROW UP. A curfew isn't a suggestion. It is a law. But on the other hand, don't take this advice... please go ride down to silom area tonite around 11 o'clock. Wear a helmet and wear Red. Lets see how far that gets you.

Edited May 20, 2010 by bluecheesefan

[QED]

Is it really impossible to have any conversation without quoting whole thread in every-single-answer. If there is pictures they are also "quoted" sometimes even three...four or more on same page. What is wrong with you people, don't you really know what is thread about without quoting every answer in every your answer, less would be ok (just few words, or line or thing you're answering about, if really needed).

Quoting all shit makes reading/answering threads really, hmm..., shitty. Especially with low speed net, waiting quotes after quotes appearing. Oh my Buddha.

Sorry about that, will try and refrain in future.

Darn....done it again

[Rucharee]

Bangkok = 3 southern provinces.

Curfew looting arson robbing.

please stop all these.