Foreign Farang

[alobar]

So i'm passing through New York and hear some Thai being spoken. I naturally sidle up to them and exchange a few words, when one of them turned to another who was out of earshot and said; "Farang poot pasat Thai". I smiled and said half jokingly that 'I' was not the farang here.

I know there is much discussion regarding whether the word is derogatory, or just in the public domain as an easy reference point to refer to westerners, but it really did strike me odd to be referred to that way outside of Thailand. I also know that Thai's seem a bit embarrassed in general by the term, so I was wondering if anyone else has had similar experiences?

[tonywebster]

I thought it just meant 'westerner', even out of thailand we are still westerners to thais. It has never really bothered me to be honest as it is just a generic word in my opinion.

[Birdman]

"Farang" was never an insult, except sometimes later than the Farang masses came depending on the situation.

Didn't you know that?

[nam-thip]

The word farang can be used in an insulting manner depending on the tone in which the word is spoken.

Have you never been in hearing distance of an irate Thai female confronting a farang in an angry manner?

Even if you can speak no other words of Thai, most European and American visitors to Thailand will quickly become familiar with the Thai word farang (often mispronounced (even by Thais) as falang - farang with a slightly trilled 'r' is the correct pronunciation.) It's basically used to describe caucasians, though African-Americans will sometimes also be known as farang or as farang dam ('black farang'). Farang is also the Thai word for the guava fruit, so you can expect to hear farang eating farang 'jokes' if you happen to purchase any.

Other Asians are generally known by their country of origin (e.g. kon jeen - "Chinese people", kon yee-bpun - "Japanese people"), while people from the Indian Subcontinent are often known as kairk (which translates as "guest"). Kairk is used to describe even fluent Thai speakers of Indian descent who have been living in Thailand for generations and consider themselves as Thai - obviously being referred to as a 'guest' in these circumstances, while not particularly offensive, is not exactly complimentary either.

Some people get very offended at being called farang, but whether it's an insult should or not really depends on the context. A few Thais who are uncomfortable with using it will say kon dtahng bpra-tayt ('people from other countries') instead, but this is still pretty rare. Farang is basically a neutral word, but people who respect you (or who should respect you) will not use it - if you hear a work colleague, for example, refer to you as farang they probably mean it as an insult while a taxi driver or market vendor doing the same is unlikely to mean any offense at all.

[needforspeed]

"Farang" was never an insult, except sometimes later than the Farang masses came depending on the situation.

Didn't you know that?

When the french arrived in Thailand around 1680 the Thais called them Frang (French) there it all started.

No insult at all.

Still don't like the idea they call us all French

Edited June 1, 2010 by needforspeed

[StreetCowboy]

"Farang" was never an insult, except sometimes later than the Farang masses came depending on the situation.

Didn't you know that?

When the french arrived in Thailand around 1680 the Thais called them Frang (French) there it all started.

No insult at all.

Still don't like the idea they call us all French

A more entertaining entymology is that the word was inherited from Arab traders, who referred to people from the far side of the Mediterranean as Franks, and that the word substantially pre-dated the first contact with Europeans. On the grounds of its entertainment, and lesser involvement of the French, I prefer this story of origin, and therefore that is the one that I use.

SC

[mahtin]

During her 10 years in Germany my wife blithely continued to use the word, as did her Thai friends.

BTW farangsay is the Thai transliteration of francais

[NBD]

The version I heard was that the word came from Arabic traders who described westerners as Francs.

I don't find it rude in general but there's a few instances where I find it irritating.

When I'm with my girlfriend, I say something in Thai, I know they understand, and the Thai person will look at me like I'm standing my head, and then say to my girlfriend "ooh falang poot passa thai dai!" (foreigner can speak Thai). Invariably such people will then continue talking to my girlfriend as though I were not there. Or even more inanely one instance when I was eating sticky rice "fara ng gin khao ngiaow dai mai?" Confirming with my girlfriend that her eyes do not deceive her and I as a foreigner can indeed eat sticky rice. I never really got to the bottom of why I might be unable to eat sticky rice. Or when they insist that all farang are rich and hence will walk around taking pointless tuk tuk rides, buying lottery tickets, step ladders, baskets and any other junk they happen to be selling at the time. There's also the odd shouts of "hello farang" from a motorbike or something whcih can be irritating if I'm in the wrong mood.

It's more general (what I would consider) bad manners and ignorance than the word itself, but each time I hear the word "farang" in those circumstances I do feel my hackles rising a bit.

Most of the time though it doesn't bother me in the slightest, and I even quite like it.

[BigWheelMan]

"Farang" was never an insult, except sometimes later than the Farang masses came depending on the situation.

Didn't you know that?

It is an insult when you are addressed as a Farang rather than your name by Thais that know you.

My mother in law used to try that old put me down, until one day she needed 18000 baht for a hospital operation, then suddenly she remembered my name and I have been her son in law with a real name ever since.

Well, she never knows when the next emergency may arise.

[lazygourmet]

"Farang" was never an insult, except sometimes later than the Farang masses came depending on the situation.

Didn't you know that?

When the french arrived in Thailand around 1680 the Thais called them Frang (French) there it all started.

No insult at all.

Still don't like the idea they call us all French

French also brought guava from their West Indies colonies which is named farang as well here.

But there is another "school' who say that farang is coming from the Persian (first traders with Siam) word ferangsi which means alien...

[Birdman]

I would say that Thais saying that: "ooh falang poot passa thai dai!" is in most cases a polite expression for a Farang who can speak a bit basic Thai. All that about food and weather and traffic and so on.

But certainly not an acknowledgement, that a Farang is fluent in Thai regarding all matters. Most Thais would acknowledge that by surprise and than by speaking Thai like they do to other Thais.

[NBD]

I wouldn't claim to be fluent, but I can hold a conversation and since I am making a hel_l of a lot of effort with the language appreciate at least getting the opportunity to try rather than getting the sort of comment one might make about a talking dog, before being completely ignored!

Incidentally, most Thais do respond as you mentioned, it's only a small number who respond as I described earlier.

Edited June 1, 2010 by NBD

[IMA_FARANG]

I never even let it bother me..why should I? The Thais who know me, my close friends and family, don't call me farang (except my girlfriend who jokingly refers to me like this, "Hey, fat farang, what you want to eat for dinner"). The ones who don't know me, if they intend it as an insult to me, that doesn't work...because I simply don't care about their opinion anyhow.

(By the way, I call my girlfriend, who has a grand daughter as "granny" when she refers to me as "fat farang").

I even picked my name on TV as ima_farang (i'm a farang) just for that reason.

I've always believed that farang is from Farangi (foriegner). I don't think the term farang is even Thai. There is a beach in Penang known as Batu Farangi...simply bcause it started out as a beach for foriegners. I've always assumed that farang is just a Thai pronunciation of Farangi with the i left off.

[elliss]

It is an insult when you are addressed as a Farang rather than your name by Thais that know you.

My mother in law used to try that old put me down, until one day she needed 18000 baht for a hospital operation, then suddenly she remembered my name and I have been her son in law with a real name ever since. quote,

on overhearing a conversation @ mare,s barn .

i picked up on farang sam ,, on asking thai gf , about it .

both her sisters , have farangs , supporting them .

and i am the third farang in the family circle .

therefore , i know refer to myself as farang sam ,in family chat ..

what,s in a name ..

[Chunky1]

anyone who knows your name should not be calling you farang. if they are, you can consider it an insult.

[tonititan]

It doesn't bother me one bit to be called "farang" in Thailand. It has never happened to me outside of Thailand, but I wouldn't be offended, and I certainly wouldn't tell a Thai person that they were the farang. I don't consider it an insult, just a descriptive term, like if I were to refer to a Thai person as an "Asian." My Thai friends will use the word "farang" when talking about me to other Thais, and I know they do not mean anything offensive.

One of my favorite things is when I'm out shopping or sightseeing (especially in small towns) and a small child gets excited and starts pointing and shouting "Farang, farang!" I think it's cute. And the parents don't seem embarrassed - they usually make the child wave at me western style or try to say "hi."

[Loz]

If I met a Thai in England and he called me a farang I'd smack his teeth in and then tell him clearly that I know big polit, and will make big ploblem for thai kee nok! then I'll sell him something he doesn't need for twice the price and put him in a taxi after telling the driver to double the fair and give me a kick back next time I see him.

Oh, I'll make sure the taxi driver takes him to a few soup kitchens and tell him it "Falang Culture" to give money to poor people if you have big money. You Somchai come to England, must have big money! You no like farang culture, get out!!!

[Soutpeel]

If I met a Thai in England and he called me a farang I'd smack his teeth in and then tell him clearly that I know big polit, and will make big ploblem for thai kee nok! then I'll sell him something he doesn't need for twice the price and put him in a taxi after telling the driver to double the fair and give me a kick back next time I see him.

Oh, I'll make sure the taxi driver takes him to a few soup kitchens and tell him it "Falang Culture" to give money to poor people if you have big money. You Somchai come to England, must have big money! You no like farang culture, get out!!!

On a trip home a few years ago...actually said to Mrs Soutpeel that she was the farang and not me, and she was p*ssed with me, which lead me to believe "farang" is an insult of sorts and at the very least patronising...was convinced it was an insult when a Thai lady engineer I used to work with told me it is intended as an insult...

[Chunky1]

if that is the way u r treated why r u here? go back to the wonderful land of gold known as the uk

[Soutpeel]

if that is the way u r treated why r u here? go back to the wonderful land of gold known as the uk

Who me ??.......I am here because I make heaps of money here, I personally couldnt care less what Thai's think of me or call me, I am not that insecure to have to be at one with my "Thainess" and seek constrant approval/acceptance....

[mca]

Basically the person was saying that the westerner can speak Thai. What was he or she was supposed to say? " That guy who is possibly American but I can't be sure can speak Thai" ?

[Loz]

if that is the way u r treated why r u here? go back to the wonderful land of gold known as the uk

Who me ??.......[edit] I personally couldnt care less what Thai's think of me or call me, I am not that insecure to have to be at one with my "Thainess" and seek constrant approval/acceptance....

PLus 1

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Oh no not AGAIN this discussion.

OP: You are Farang wherever you go, just like they are Thai wherever they go. Your comment on not being 'Farang' is silly. A spade is a spade wherever it goes.

[StreetCowboy]

Oh no not AGAIN this discussion.

OP: You are Farang wherever you go, just like they are Thai wherever they go. Your comment on not being 'Farang' is silly. A spade is a spade wherever it goes.

I think its better to use the plural when trying to avoid sexism "wherever they go". Anyway, some people find offence at calling a spade a spade, though I prefer to take humour, although I appreciate that it is rude to take whatever was not offered.

On the subject of racism,

SC

[NaiGreg]

If I met a Thai in England and he called me a farang I'd smack his teeth in and then tell him clearly that I know big polit, and will make big ploblem for thai kee nok! then I'll sell him something he doesn't need

You shall not be called farang anymore. We (collectively) have a new name for you. Einstein the Benevolent. Hope that will not be a big ploblem for you.

[kikoman]

That term has never bothered me and never will, I never look for Negatives in any relationship or harbor any complexes.

Cheers

[needforspeed]

If I met a Thai in England and he called me a farang I'd smack his teeth in and then tell him clearly that I know big polit, and will make big ploblem for thai kee nok! then I'll sell him something he doesn't need for twice the price and put him in a taxi after telling the driver to double the fair and give me a kick back next time I see him.

Oh, I'll make sure the taxi driver takes him to a few soup kitchens and tell him it "Falang Culture" to give money to poor people if you have big money. You Somchai come to England, must have big money! You no like farang culture, get out!!!

Coudn't stop laughing this morning, very good.

Start the day with a laugh

Thanks

[MAJIC]

If I met a Thai in England and he called me a farang I'd smack his teeth in and then tell him clearly that I know big polit, and will make big ploblem for thai kee nok! then I'll sell him something he doesn't need for twice the price and put him in a taxi after telling the driver to double the fair and give me a kick back next time I see him.

Oh, I'll make sure the taxi driver takes him to a few soup kitchens and tell him it "Falang Culture" to give money to poor people if you have big money. You Somchai come to England, must have big money! You no like farang culture, get out!!!

Unfortunately in spite of those that do not think Farang can be derogatory,try as I have done in England to educate a

Thai Lady married to an englishman,that calling a englishman Farang in his own country (me) is insulting.

To which she replied"I am Thai I can never be Falang" the rest of the conversation went like this:

Me.....I cant be a Farang i'm in my own country

Her....You Falang

Me.....No you are in my country you are Falang! (raised voice for emphasis)

Her....I can never be Falang

Me.....You are now

Her....never! never!

I once asked my Ex Thai Teacher G/F and her Civil Servant friend a few years ago the same question:If you were both

to come to England would you be the Farang? To which their replies were a profusion of: no no no I am Thai!

So in spite of the many theories of the origin of the word,I'm taking it that the word must be derogatory,if they dont

want the label themselves either??

At the very least its not meaning merely a Foreigner, in their eyes.

[Soutpeel]

Unfortunately in spite of those that do not think Farang can be derogatory,try as I have done in England to educate a

Thai Lady married to an englishman,that calling a englishman Farang in his own country (me) is insulting.

To which she replied"I am Thai I can never be Falang" the rest of the conversation went like this:

Me.....I cant be a Farang i'm in my own country

Her....You Falang

Me.....No you are in my country you are Falang! (raised voice for emphasis)

Her....I can never be Falang

Me.....You are now

Her....never! never!

I once asked my Ex Thai Teacher G/F and her Civil Servant friend a few years ago the same question:If you were both

to come to England would you be the Farang? To which their replies were a profusion of: no no no I am Thai!

So in spite of the many theories of the origin of the word,I'm taking it that the word must be derogatory,if they dont

want the label themselves either??

At the very least its not meaning merely a Foreigner, in their eyes.

My opinion as well....based on the reaction of Mrs Soutpeel when I called her a Farang on a trip outside of Thailand...

[Birdman]

how can she be a Farang, if Farang means Caucasian??

e.g. for better understanding: Let's say a Caucasian was born and raised in Thailand and never left the country and has Thai citizenship he is still a Farang.