Pc Wakeup Problem

[opalhort]

Hi,

This will be a lengthy post but I have to explain details in the hope somebody can help me.

The PC is 4 years old (Intel P4 1.6GHz, 768MB RAM). Originally it had an Intel motherboard which quit (hardware problem). This was replaced in Jan.'05 with a new ASUS P4PE2-X motherboard and everything was re-formatted and WIN-XP-pro was installed by a qualified Computer shop.

This PC is on an UPS and AC power is always on, use only Win shutdown to have it off.

In the first month after the motherboard change everything was OK. Then after having been off for two days the PC did not want to wake up. Once I got it back to life by fumbling around with the plugs I left it running 24/7 (no shutdown - but occasional re-starts) for two months. Then set the BIOS to 'on after AC power restore'. This worked for a month (after AC power removed and restored even after a few days it did Boot OK).

Now again nothing works.

Three days ago I tried to start it - nothing, but left it with AC power on; after about six hours it woke up on its own but not a clean boot. Had to press the power button for a few sec to have it off and then press again and got a clean boot.

Now it is running again at 24/7, which is not a good idea considering "Toxin's" power saving campaign.

I'm aware that there could be conflicts between the BIOS and WIN-XP Power management set-ups. Tried to disable one or the other and yet did not solve the problem.

An interesting thing I observed is the system time:

It stops at the time the AC power is removed but does not reset, as would be the case with a dead CMOS Battery. After a successful boot the clock/date shows the time the AC power was last cut.

This PC belongs to my son and is basically a game PC and seldom used during the week (school days!).

Our Computer shop is at a complete loss as to what the problem is.

Anybody can help?

opalhort

[waldwolf]

opalhort - I suspect there may be a problem with either your Power Supply (PS), a ground on the motherboard or the power lead/connector from the PS to your motherboard, but first, try this as the problem you report can also occur in XP with some 3D Screen Savers.

a. Right click on your desktop window and select "Properties".

b. Click the "ScreenSaver" tab

c. Set screen saver to "None"

d. Click OK to close window.

If that doesn't solve the problem, and if your comfortable with opening the tower, unplug unit from mains and remove tower cover, and check the following:

1) All connectors from the powersupply to motherboard are firmly seated.

2) All connectors running from motherboard to hard drive(s) and CD or DVD-ROM's are firmly seated.

3) Plug unit back into mains and turn on. (Leave cover off)

4) Check visually that all cooling fans are working.

5) Post back your findings.

cheers

[opalhort]

opalhort - I suspect there may be a problem with either your Power Supply (PS), a ground on the motherboard or the power lead/connector from the PS to your motherboard, but first, try this as the problem you report can also occur in XP with some 3D Screen Savers.

a. Right click on your desktop window and select "Properties".

b. Click the "ScreenSaver" tab

c. Set screen saver to "None"

d. Click OK to close window.

If that doesn't solve the problem, and if your comfortable with opening the tower, unplug unit from mains and remove tower cover, and check the following:

1) All connectors from the powersupply to motherboard are firmly seated.

2) All connectors running from motherboard to hard drive(s) and CD or DVD-ROM's are firmly seated.

3) Plug unit back into mains and turn on. (Leave cover off)

4) Check visually that all cooling fans are working.

5) Post back your findings.

cheers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for your advise waldwolf.

Screen saver: no problem, not used

ground: everything is grounded in our place and ground goes into the PC where it should (checked with OHM meter), UPS is also OK.

all connectors are clean and well seated, also card contacts have been cleaned.

Since you mention the PS, here could be something. This PC is still using the original old 380W PS even with the new motherboard.

One other thing I observed is that the CPU temperature is 52-55ºC compared to the temp. of only 40-43ºC I have on the new PC (Pentium4 3.2Ghz).

Also the VGA card (G-Force2) gets very hot compared with the new PC's G-Force4 card, but all fans are working OK.

The harddrives (2 physical drives 40Gb each) are also too hot to touch!

Any more ideas?

opalhort

[Khutan]

Any more ideas?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Upgrade the BIOS to the latest level.

I have the exact same laptop as a friend - a very high end thing. They came out of the factory within weeks. My Suspend, Hibernate is fine, his just crashes the machine.

I have another High-end Laptop (different brand), nothing I can do will make it Hibernate or suspend properly, it always does wierd things. Even wentt to the manufacturer (household name) and they couldn't fix it.

I think it might be the luck of the draw.

[waldwolf]

......One other thing I observed is that the CPU temperature is 52-55ºC compared to the temp. of only 40-43ºC I have on the new PC (Pentium4 3.2Ghz).

Also the VGA card (G-Force2) gets very hot compared with the new PC's G-Force4 card, but all fans are working OK.

The harddrives (2 physical drives 40Gb each) are also too hot to touch!

Any more ideas?

opalhort

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Your 380 watt PS should be sufficent.

In general, when it comes to CPU temperatures, the first question is, how are those temperatures measured? Internal or surface. Some CPU do not have internal diodes, so only surface temperatures can be measured. (In general, motherboard/software temperature readings are not very accurate.)

Now comes the question: Were the CPU temperatures you indicated taken (1) while the CPU was "at rest" or (2) when the CPU was running at "max speed"? The 52-55ºC, on average, would be extremely high for most P4's during idle, but a little below max temp when processing at full speed. (All this assumes of course, approved cooling is in place and working.)

Then there is the question of support chips, which are somewhat less tolerant of excess heat than the CPU itself. It is desireable that any electronics, be it your computer, the TV, HiFi system, etc., have a maximum internal operating temperature of 10ºC or less above ambient. (Ambient being the surrounding air temperature.)

I would suggest you try running your sons computer with the tower's cover removed. If the room itself is very warm and humid, try placing a small fan so it is blowing directly on as much of the motherboard, as possible. If the tower sits inside any enclosure, move it to an area where air is free to flow in and around it.

Until your able to determine the exact cause of these problems, would strongly recommend shutting down the system, when not in use. The excessive heat you report for the hard drives, can greatly shorten their lives, and I'm sure the last thing you need right now to have one or both drives crash.

Good luck & post back your findings.

cheers

[francois]

hi'

just thought about a MB which wouldn't boot with an usb ext drive attached to it, when not plugged-in, normal boot an else, when on problems ...

it was an old MB but now, I think that you can find in the bios the menu where you can enabled the boot from "other devices" ans all usb support ...

check this out ...

francois

[waldwolf]

opalhort - A couple of additional thoughts come to mind, which you may wish to try, to further diagnois the problem. (I still believe your root problem is caused by excessive internal heat, but perhaps these added items may give us a clearer picture at to the extent of the problem and possible damage.)

1. If/when you can get to the desktop, right click and go to properties, then power settings. Make sure the settings are set to "Always On and "Never" for individual unit shutdown. (These settings in Windows are mainly for laptops, to preserve battery power. With desktops, the only one that maybe of some use, is the "Turn off Monitor", however if the system will not be used again for several hours, best to just shutdown everything.)

2. On occassion, the arm within a hard drive may "stick", especially with age. The next time you see the system fail to boot, give the main hdd a light tap with your finger or the eraser-end of a pencil. If the arm is sticking, this may be enough to release it. If the system now starts normally, then it is likely that hdd is nearing its useful life, and data backup should be done, without delay.

cheers

[opalhort]

Hi,

thanks for all your replies.

CPU temp is internal at the time of restart. can only get a reading from within the BIOS since I've not yet figured out how to get a reading from within Win XP.

Temperature may be a problem when PC is running but it should not be an issue when the PC is started since everything is cold.

The cover has been removed already for some time and an additional fan placed nearby. One thing I just found is that the heat-sink of the CPU just below the fan is cloged with dust and so is the VGA card fan. Will have to clean them.

Also when the shop installed the new MB they apperenly removed the heat-sink form the CPU and reattached it without any heat conducting paste as a result the heat conduction from CPU to sink may not be optimal.

HDD arm stuck is unlikely since the C drive is brand new.

Power settings are already as you sugested and no problem with monitor since it is a LCD with backlight off and uses only 5W.

The problem is that absolutely nothing happens when power is switched on, no power light and no HDD access light comes on.

I think the clue lies in the fact that the internal clock gets stuck but does not reset when AC power is cut as would be the case with a dead CMOS battery, but I have no idea what this clue could lead to.

(any Sherlok Holmes for PCs out there?)

For now this PC is shutdown with AC power connected. Can only work on it again next weekend due to work.

since our son can not play more than one hour on school days anyway I can let him have his fun on one of my PCs during the week.

BIOS is up-to-date, and hybernate, suspend is not used, only WIN shutdown and wake-up by pressing the power button is used.

again, thank you very much for your help.

opalhort

[waldwolf]

opalhort - The silicon compound between the heat sink and CPU is critical for proper heat transfer. Would not run the system until this has been corrected. Damage to or failure of your CPU from such improper installation, will void any warranty.

cheers

[francois]

opalhort - The silicon compound between the heat sink and CPU is critical for proper heat transfer. Would not run the system until this has been corrected. Damage to or failure of your CPU from such improper installation, will void any warranty.

cheers

dito

and think about to let air circulating inside the case ...

have you got some fan inside to push some hot air out?

francois