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Posted

To the OP, sounds like a personal problem or perhaps your associating with a low class ignorant group of Thais. I'm Black and I'm always referred to as Khun (my first name). Sure I hear the term Kak and farang banded about but it's only when they don't like that individual, not as a norm. LoL never any fun when the shoe is on the other foot is it.

Posted

Sorry, but i will never really get why anyone is offended by the term farang.. :blink: :blink:

Really, Its got me beat

If there is something added to the end of Farang..ie..farang kee nok..then OK be offended

Should an Asian or Japanese or whatever nationality be offended if they are referred to as a "forieghner" whilest in a western country???

I think they would be happy to be referred to as this, considering the alternatives that are often offered them

But i suppose this is Thaivisa and there will soon be someone come along and be offended at my spelling of the word :rolleyes:

How many times must we go over this; "farang" does not mean "foreigner" by any stretch of the imagination, Thais only say it does because even they know how bad the term sounds and is used.

Case in point; you will never ever never hear ANY person of Asian descent be referred to as "falang" regardless of what nationality they hold, nor peoples of African descent etc. It is reserved only for people of one race. For this reason, by definition, "falang" does not, never has, and never will be synonomous with "foreigner." There are other words for "foreigner" as others on this thread have pointed out; i.e. khon tang chart/chow tang chart.

khon tang chart/chow tang chart is far too formal for everyday conversational use. No Thai person I have asked has thought that the word farang sounds bad and none of them pretend it means foreigner. It is used by Thai people in all levels of society as an informal way to refer to caucasians. It might not be politically correct but then neither were the majority of people in the West a few years ago.

There really are a lot of very thin-skinned Westerners over here who seem hel_l bent on lecturing the natives on how to use their own language. When Thai people start spitting on you, beating you up or verbally abusing you for the colour of your skin then you might have something to complain about. Until then, stop moaning about such a trivial subject and trying to pretend that the West is a racially tolerant paradise where nobody ever does anything wrong.

Posted

by definition, "falang" does not, never has, and never will be synonomous with "foreigner."

It means WHITE foreigner. Who cares if they do not use the most polite term as long as they are not insulting us?

Posted
inthepink, on 2010-07-15 19:16, said:

I would say that the word farang is analogous to foreigner in English. You could say foreign person but usually we don't. Incidentally English could be construed as being ruder than Thai. Why do we say an Englishman and a Frenchman but an Italian and a Greek? Does that mean we don't consider Italians and Greeks to be people?

good to know that i am referred to in a polite way... i am a German. :lol:

by the way, in my [not so] humble opinion i conclude that all the threads and the complaints that Thais call us westerners "Farangs" originate from insecure persons who possess a wealth of inferiority complexes and/or are whingers and whiners. personally i give a flying fart what names a Thai or any other person calls me. that of course does not apply to our staff which calls me "Sir" but perhaps in their heart of hearts they think that my appropriate name should be "winer" B)

I agree with you but I would also add that they cannot adjust to the fact that they are a racial minority in this country and that everything does not revolve around them.

did everything revolve around them in their home countries? a good part of Farangs live in Thailand because they wouldn't be able to make ends meet in their country of origin. but instead of accepting some trouble and perhaps even some hardship they keep on whining and complaining even when it concerns trivial things which are none of their <deleted> business. i am a member of TV since nearly 4 years and have seen countless ridiculous complaints about things which do not affect a Farang's lifestyle in Thailand. for these people not only Thai but also Indian, Arab, African and dark skin in general bashing seems to be a dire necessity as it makes them feel superior even though most of them are nothing but dirt poor à........

Posted

To the OP, sounds like a personal problem or perhaps your associating with a low class ignorant group of Thais. I'm Black and I'm always referred to as Khun (my first name). Sure I hear the term Kak and farang banded about but it's only when they don't like that individual, not as a norm. LoL never any fun when the shoe is on the other foot is it.

Wow. Yet another poster has no understanding of the OP.

Amazing! :D

Posted

BTW, as the OP seemed to be a bit much for many posters on here to grasp, here it is again:

I've noticed that Thais generally only refer to Asians as people (khon) and not Caucasians or Indians. Why? Most blacks are referred to as Khon Africa, which appears okay, if not slightly ignorant, but Khon Europe would appear nicer than just farang without any khon in front of it.

Why are we not referred to as people?

thread is talking about the lack of 'khon' being placed in front of the term for caucasians, 'farang'.

Thank you.

Posted

BTW, as the OP seemed to be a bit much for many posters on here to grasp, here it is again:

I've noticed that Thais generally only refer to Asians as people (khon) and not Caucasians or Indians. Why? Most blacks are referred to as Khon Africa, which appears okay, if not slightly ignorant, but Khon Europe would appear nicer than just farang without any khon in front of it.

Why are we not referred to as people?

thread is talking about the lack of 'khon' being placed in front of the term for caucasians, 'farang'.

Thank you.

And as I already said, the word person is not used with the word foreigner in the English language so what's the big deal? With plural forms it quite often isn't used with "Asian", African", "black" etc. either. Instead we can say Asians, Africans, blacks.

As an example: There are a lot of Asians living in Bradford OR "There are a lot of Asian people living in Bradford". I don't think the sentiment of the sentences are different and IMO people are getting upset about a grammatical point relating to the Thai language that is of little or no consequence.

Posted (edited)

BTW, as the OP seemed to be a bit much for many posters on here to grasp, here it is again:

I've noticed that Thais generally only refer to Asians as people (khon) and not Caucasians or Indians. Why? Most blacks are referred to as Khon Africa, which appears okay, if not slightly ignorant, but Khon Europe would appear nicer than just farang without any khon in front of it.

Why are we not referred to as people?

thread is talking about the lack of 'khon' being placed in front of the term for caucasians, 'farang'.

Thank you.

I always hear Thais use Khon in front of Falang, but usually when talking in the context of something that a group of foriegn people do, or like to do:

ie Khon falang chawb aharn thai...

To expect a Thai to use the word khon for one person walking down the street or to use it in conversation regarding one person is not really applicable is it?

I think many times us falang (oops-sorry) dont quite understand the limitations of the Thai language,as far as its translation in English. Maybe some people are offended by the abscence of certain words that we are used to hearing in English and take the thai context in the wrong way.

(consider the above sentance..to get my point...would it have sounded better if i had said this:

"I think many times us falang people dont quite understand the limitations of the Thai language"

Bit of a moot point dont you think?

Im not trying to be an apologist but I just dont think the average Thai would even remotely consider his use of the word farang without khon as being derrogatory in general conversation..

So maybe we shouldnt either ;)

edit: deleted sentance to try to be more applicable to OPs original point

Edited by ozzieovaseas
Posted (edited)

I dont think the average Thai would even remotely consider the use of the word derrogatory..

So maybe we shouldnt either ;)

Well, you're wrong about that but if it makes you feel better believing that, no point in bursting your bubble. It is not a polite word. It is not always derogatory but also depending on the CONTEXT quite often IS derogatory.

Edited by Jingthing
Posted

It's not a rude word either. It's just a word. Any such word can be derogatory depending on the context anyway. There are many nice foreigners living down my road OR I wish these f***ing foreigners would get out of my country, for example.

But, if you are happier believing it is an impolite word then that's fine with me. :)

Posted

I dont think the average Thai would even remotely consider the use of the word derrogatory..

So maybe we shouldnt either ;)

Well, you're wrong about that but if it makes you feel better believing that, no point in bursting your bubble. It is not a polite word. It is not always derogatory but also depending on the CONTEXT quite often IS derogatory.

JT..do you have a special TV filter that notifies you every time the word "apologist" appears in a post??:lol:

Posted (edited)

Ask some random HISO Thais if they think it is a polite word or not.

The average random hiso thai thinks knows that all us farangs are not polite

Anyway, not much use asking them, as far as they are concerned we are all drunks with to much money who prefer the rather unsavoury pooying dam dam (err...with the exception of falangs with alternate preferances of course) :whistling:

Edited by ozzieovaseas
Posted (edited)

Ask some random HISO Thais if they think it is a polite word or not.

I don't have to ask random ones I know plenty and they don't think it's a rude word.

They are well aware that we don't have "too much money" as well!

Edited by inthepink
Posted

Ask some random HISO Thais if they think it is a polite word or not.

I don't have to ask random ones I know plenty and they don't think it's a rude word.

They are well aware that we don't have "too much money" as well!

I don't believe you. Sorry. It isn't a polite word and real Hiso Thais wouldn't use that word to a European's face unless they were being impolite.

Posted (edited)

Ask some random HISO Thais if they think it is a polite word or not.

I don't have to ask random ones I know plenty and they don't think it's a rude word.

They are well aware that we don't have "too much money" as well!

I don't believe you. Sorry. It isn't a polite word and real Hiso Thais wouldn't use that word to a European's face unless they were being impolite.

I don't really care if you believe me or not. I'm just stating a fact. But just to be sure that we are on the same page, when you say using it to my face do you mean addressing me as farang or simply using the word in my presence?

And when you say "real" Hiso Thais, is a member of a certain very well known family that we are not supposed to talk about good enough for you?

Edited by inthepink
Posted

Ask some random HISO Thais if they think it is a polite word or not.

I don't have to ask random ones I know plenty and they don't think it's a rude word.

They are well aware that we don't have "too much money" as well!

Sounds like HISO you know not same same JT know :jap:

But yeah, i must say i am a little suprised with the stance JT has taken on this one and his steely resolve on the matter

Maybe its a demographic thing?

Are you still in Pattaya JT?

If i were a smart arse i would ask you if you met all these HISOs on the baht buses you often talk about......But errr....im not, so i won't ;)

Posted
inthepink, on 2010-07-15 19:16, said:

I would say that the word farang is analogous to foreigner in English. You could say foreign person but usually we don't. Incidentally English could be construed as being ruder than Thai. Why do we say an Englishman and a Frenchman but an Italian and a Greek? Does that mean we don't consider Italians and Greeks to be people?

good to know that i am referred to in a polite way... i am a German. :lol:

by the way, in my [not so] humble opinion i conclude that all the threads and the complaints that Thais call us westerners "Farangs" originate from insecure persons who possess a wealth of inferiority complexes and/or are whingers and whiners. personally i give a flying fart what names a Thai or any other person calls me. that of course does not apply to our staff which calls me "Sir" but perhaps in their heart of hearts they think that my appropriate name should be "winer" B)

I agree with you but I would also add that they cannot adjust to the fact that they are a racial minority in this country and that everything does not revolve around them.

did everything revolve around them in their home countries? a good part of Farangs live in Thailand because they wouldn't be able to make ends meet in their country of origin. but instead of accepting some trouble and perhaps even some hardship they keep on whining and complaining even when it concerns trivial things which are none of their <deleted> business. i am a member of TV since nearly 4 years and have seen countless ridiculous complaints about things which do not affect a Farang's lifestyle in Thailand. for these people not only Thai but also Indian, Arab, African and dark skin in general bashing seems to be a dire necessity as it makes them feel superior even though most of them are nothing but dirt poor à........

I have been a member for longer than 4 years and lived in Thailand since over 20 years and can tell you that the word, "farang" is indeed derogatory and often downright rude. Rascism is hardly a trivial thing and as long as you 'colonial' rich Pattaya sexpat types accept it the worse it will get.

Posted

Blacks are called Kuhn Tam of course. Caucasians Farang of course. Farangs who think it's an insult should rather ask themselves about that, 'cause generally it isn't.

Posted

I have been a member for longer than 4 years and lived in Thailand since over 20 years and can tell you that the word, "farang" is indeed derogatory and often downright rude. Rascism is hardly a trivial thing and as long as you 'colonial' rich Pattaya sexpat types accept it the worse it will get.

If that comment is supposed to incluce me then you know as much about me as you appear to have learnt about Thailand during your stay, i.e. absolutely nothing. Don't live in Pattaya and never have.

Posted

I have been a member for longer than 4 years and lived in Thailand since over 20 years and can tell you that the word, "farang" is indeed derogatory and often downright rude. Rascism is hardly a trivial thing and as long as you 'colonial' rich Pattaya sexpat types accept it the worse it will get.

If that comment is supposed to incluce me then you know as much about me as you appear to have learnt about Thailand during your stay, i.e. absolutely nothing. Don't live in Pattaya and never have.

Sorry not you - the other guy who thinks we 'farang' are all scum.

Posted (edited)
I have been a member for longer than 4 years and lived in Thailand since over 20 years and can tell you that the word, "farang" is indeed derogatory and often downright rude. Rascism is hardly a trivial thing and as long as you 'colonial' rich Pattaya sexpat types accept it the worse it will get.
If that comment is supposed to incluce me then you know as much about me as you appear to have learnt about Thailand during your stay, i.e. absolutely nothing. Don't live in Pattaya and never have.
Sorry not you - the other guy who thinks we 'farang' are all scum.
Woops, sorry then. I still disagree with your opinion about the word farang but I think we need to clarify whether people are talking about being addressed as "farang" or just the word itself being used in general conversation because there's a world of difference IMO. Edited by inthepink
Posted

by definition, "falang" does not, never has, and never will be synonomous with "foreigner."

It means WHITE foreigner. Who cares if they do not use the most polite term as long as they are not insulting us?

I suppose you are right, I feel the same way about black people; shame on them for being offended when I call them ni$%ers!

Posted

In my experience "khaek" (which I often hear) or sometimes "khon khaek" is used as a derogatory term for indians and arabs. The real meaning of the word is "visitor" you may hear staff in an empty resturaunt say "mai mee khaek" meaning there are no customers but when using it to refer to the above mentioned peoples it is not very nice and I would attempt to argue that most people would put them on a level lower than "falang" whether or not the word "khon" accompanies it or not. I have even seen Thais hold their noses when Indians or Arabs are nearby.

The term "Farang" was originated from "Farangi" or " invaders".

The Indian Khaegs use this term in hate for their English occupiers.

When these Khaegs traveled in south east Asia like Burma, Malaysia and Thailand they use this term when ever they saw a white man regardless of their nationalities gradually in Thailand the Thais pick the term and the term they pronounced is "Farang":jap:

Posted

In my experience "khaek" (which I often hear) or sometimes "khon khaek" is used as a derogatory term for indians and arabs. The real meaning of the word is "visitor" you may hear staff in an empty resturaunt say "mai mee khaek" meaning there are no customers but when using it to refer to the above mentioned peoples it is not very nice and I would attempt to argue that most people would put them on a level lower than "falang" whether or not the word "khon" accompanies it or not. I have even seen Thais hold their noses when Indians or Arabs are nearby.

The term "Farang" was originated from "Farangi" or " invaders".

The Indian Khaegs use this term in hate for their English occupiers.

When these Khaegs traveled in south east Asia like Burma, Malaysia and Thailand they use this term when ever they saw a white man regardless of their nationalities gradually in Thailand the Thais pick the term and the term they pronounced is "Farang":jap:

You are really off base; "farang" comes from the French "falangset" (thai pronounciation of francais, and khaek comes from the thai word for "visitor." Perhaps you are referring to Star Trek.

Also the term Khaek is spelled and means the same thing for visitor as well as Indian/arab as someone posted before that it did not, I have clarified that. To use the term for customer though, is rude although it is used; the correct term would be luk kaa.

And by the way; my previous post was tongue in cheek, I certainly hope no people of African descent were offended, it was merely said to prove a point i.e. a racial term is a racial term and does offend people regardless of whether it is a cultural norm or not, such as "falang" in Thailand now or the n word in the US in the past.

Posted

That old falangset wives tale is by no means confirmed definitively. I really wish people would stop repeating that one theory as fact, because it is not a fact, only one theory.

Posted

by definition, "falang" does not, never has, and never will be synonomous with "foreigner."

It means WHITE foreigner. Who cares if they do not use the most polite term as long as they are not insulting us?

I suppose you are right, I feel the same way about black people; shame on them for being offended when I call them ni$%ers!

Do you really think that the term "farang" is anything like calling black people people n_____s?   :rolleyes:
Posted (edited)

Yeah, bit of a silly comparison. I like the way people leave their home country behind and criticise everything about Thailand, saying that any of us who don't agree with their point of view are looking at Thailand through rose-tinted glasses when this is exactly what they are doing with their home country.

I mean, I don't find the word farang offensive (and yes Tomo I know we are straying ever so slightly from the topic of the OP) but I can see it might appear a little backward to some people. But if Thailand is 20 or 30 years behind the West in being politically correct then so what? It's mainly a facade in the developed world anyway. There are still plenty of people with deep-seated prejudices, they just hide it a bit better. It wasn't so very long ago that English football fans used to throw bananas at black football players and I believe a judge in the USA had to order schools in Mississippi to stop segregation as late as 1970....

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Edited by inthepink
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