Legal Will

[NancyL]

Oh dear, I didn't really want this thread to turn into a mud-slinging contest; I just wanted to share my experience in obtaining a Thai Will so that my husband would have immediate access to the 800,000 baht account that's solely in my name to fulfill retirement visa requirements. If some don't want to obtain a Will and use some other technique to insure that their heirs have access to their assets, then that's OK. I'm not their heir, so I really don't care.

I'm not going to post anymore about this topic. I've been attacked twice now. Most recently by Scorecard and previously by Irene in the thread I started about our experience at the Amphur office. Usually I have a pretty thick skin when it comes to comments on this forum, but all I'm trying to do is point out a low-cost way to obtain a Thai Will. If some people think they don't need or want one, then OK.

[Spaniel]

We (me & Thai wife) dont have a joint account. Since the bank, in this case Bangkok Bank, wont know that I have died why cant my wife just use my ATM card and withdraw all the money from my account?

[Langsuan Man]

Lots of good info. I have a will which covers all my assets in the USA. Here in Thailand the only thing I have is a condo in Pattaya an a account at Bangkok Bank. I would like to leave the condo to my now 20 year old son and the account to my Thai wife. Can I just write out a simple will saying I leave the condo to my son and the bank account to my wife? Then have it witnessed by two people a does it need to be translated into Thai? Must it be registered at the amphur? Do I really need a lawyer to make up such a simple document? Trying to keep it simple and legal.

Can I just write out a simple will saying I leave the condo to my son and the bank account to my wife? Yes, you can but if anyone were to contest the Will both your wife and son would have the burden of proving that this is what you wanted

Then have it witnessed by two people a does it need to be translated into Thai? Yes, any legal document must be witnessed (your not going to be here to say it was really you who signed it) do you think a Will in Thai would be accepted in England, you are in Thailand and the language is Thai

Must it be registered at the amphur? No, but that is the safest way and for 20 Baht can you argue with that

Do I really need a lawyer to make up such a simple document? Not if it is a simple Will and your description indicates that it is simple

[Mapguy]

Both NancyL and Scorecard are trying to be helpful. There are a number of ways to make a valid will in Thailand. And different banks might have somewhat different policies, some of which might be more cautious than the law requires, about accessing accounts.

Given NancyL and Scorecard's careful approaches, Spaniel has taken an entirely different approach by pointing out the expedient (and probably popular) ATM solution. By the way, all that is needed is a password for any passbook savings accounts, so watch out, folks, where you keep that lying around! An interesting point, however, was made somewhere along the line above about trust. If you trust someone enough to open a joint account, then why should you worry if that person has your password ?!

Frankly, it is my experience that the amphur approach isn't particularly helpful if a subsequent will is dully made unless you go through the same drill. Try that with a deathbed or oral will (acceptable under Thai law)! Perhaps it might hasten the court approval process a bit. The witness process at the amphur could be helpful. Witnesses with illegible signatures, particularly those who can not be tracked down, might be a point at issue if a will is challenged.

The big question is: Might a will be challenged? Given the nature of the many May-September (April-November ?!) marriages or romances in Thailand between Thai women and foreign men who have selfish children (or possibly others, such as current or former spouses) back "home," well, good luck! What can one say other than to have healthy relationships all round and make one's intentions quite clear.

All in all, it seems that NancyL apparently has had a very simple situation to deal with. She went one route, as she has pointed out, but not necessarily the only one that is valid so I hope she doesn't worry too much about the reality that there is more than one solution to the task and that her approach is not necessarily the most appropriate, nor her banker's advice/knowledge bang on.

There are a number of more complicated variants to NancyL's situation. For example, when there are Thai children with a foreign father. It could, of course, get more complicated than that. If the stakes are large enough, then better get a decent lawyer (!!!!).

In the meantime, folks, drive safely! Wear your helmets! Look to the right before turning right at intersections!

[scorecard]

Oh dear, I didn't really want this thread to turn into a mud-slinging contest; I just wanted to share my experience in obtaining a Thai Will so that my husband would have immediate access to the 800,000 baht account that's solely in my name to fulfill retirement visa requirements. If some don't want to obtain a Will and use some other technique to insure that their heirs have access to their assets, then that's OK. I'm not their heir, so I really don't care.

I'm not going to post anymore about this topic. I've been attacked twice now. Most recently by Scorecard and previously by Irene in the thread I started about our experience at the Amphur office. Usually I have a pretty thick skin when it comes to comments on this forum, but all I'm trying to do is point out a low-cost way to obtain a Thai Will. If some people think they don't need or want one, then OK.

Dear NancyL, "Attacked", well I did say before that i'm not intending to be critical or to be smart and I repeat the same words again here.

All of this is highly important to me and i'm sure to many other people, therefore I wrote my understanding of these subjects, backed up by checking again with my bank manager.

I said earlier that I'm trying to get my affairs into a picture whereby when I die my adult Thai son will not have too much of a nightmare in front of him. From my understanding (checked quite thoroughly) having funds in joint accounts ensures that the funds won't need to be subject to any form of frezing and/or probate of a Thai will.

I might add that I've had poor advice before from bank managers and (with all respect to TV members and to NancyL) there are many comments on this webboard (all webboards) which are generated by heresay, third hand information, and generated by what the poster would like to see /like to have.

NancyL, sorry if I have upset you, I certainly had to intent to do that, and I say again, this is a serious subject and if a member has different information then surely it's worthwhile, for all members, to share the information.

[amexpat]

Do we need some more confusion here? OK, here's my contribution.

A Thai lawyer (one mentioned on TV.com) told me over the phone that my will should be written in English, my native language, and it would be translated when executed.

On another matter, is it legal to access a deceased person's bank account with their ATM? I doubt it as the money in the account is part of the estate to be distributed.

[Spaniel]

Do we need some more confusion here? OK, here's my contribution.

A Thai lawyer (one mentioned on TV.com) told me over the phone that my will should be written in English, my native language, and it would be translated when executed.

On another matter, is it legal to access a deceased person's bank account with their ATM? I doubt it as the money in the account is part of the estate to be distributed.

I agree that it probably is illegal to use a deceased persons ATM. I and wife arn't worried about it in our particular case. Their is no one that would contest the will so she will just drain the account to zero then the bank will eventually declare it a dormant account and close it. I'm not talking about a large account. At most their is usually no more then B200,000 or thereabouts in it.

[huli]

following up on Nancy L, my wife and I had the following experience. Bangkok Bank said yes our joint acct would be frozen in the event of my death, so no point in adding her name to that. We were advised to go to the Amphur and make a will covering this acct, as has been mentioned already. Jade them did their number with us with the ultimate sealed envelope in our hands to give to the bank should the time come.

Coments, only the said bank acct was allowed on the will, nothing else. Since I have a yellow book, I was advised to get my mental competency paper at the government hospital, and not at Ram where I usually go for stuff. I was directed to go to the govt hospital by Wararot Market, did so, waiting an hour, got the aper for 50 baht. I had to pay 250 baht to the Amphur for the will, which I think was a discount due to having a yellow book. They wouldn't give us any copies, just the sealed envelope, for some reason. The service at the Amphur was great. It's a good idea to be able to sign your name in Thai as well as English. I'm all set for 300 baht.

[JeffreyMcCollum]

Father died just over a year ago here in Thailand in a motorbike accident.

No will here or in Hawaii

A few homes here as well as Hawaii.

Everything turned over to my brother (His real son) with out much problem and no Tax

Court transfered the Home (condo) deeds over to his name as well as his bank accounts and autos etc.

in all everything took about a week of running around

[scorecard]

SM7WGP, what if you and your wife should go at the same time, in a tragic accident? A Will would address that situation. Also, are any of your accounts held jointly? Our local bank manager really shook me up when he said that my husband's and my joint bank account would be frozen upon his death while the Thai courts sort out the situation if we didn't have a Thai Will. Of course, the Thai courts don't do this overnight!

Edited August 5, 2011 by scorecard

[true blue]

ive given my wife instructions on how to transfer any money from my account to hers through internet banking,takes about 2 minutes to do,

[elektrified]

Does anyone know if using the procedure outlined above by NancyL, I could include a brokerage account held in Europe as part of my estate in this simple Amphur Will procedure? Or would the Thais at the Amphur reject anything that is not a Thailand-based asset?

I asked the bank in Europe what they would need in the event of my death in order for my son to access my account and they said "a death certificate and a Will".

[sbk]

An inflammatory rude and insensitive post has been deleted. If you don't have anything to contribute then best not post at all.

[NancyL]

Elektrified -- perhaps you should clarify with your brokerage company what languages they'll accept for a Will. For example, here in Thailand they require that English-language wills be translated and perhaps go thru the court system before being accepted. As for whether the Amphur will add an out-of-country account -- just go and ask them. They were very easy to work with, once we got past the language problems. You don't learn terms like "beneficiary" in the AUA/YMCA classes. I brought 2 books, each very large and complete -- an English/Thai dictionary and a Thai/English dictionary. The nice lady at the Amphur office used one and I used the other, pointing at words we didn't know in the other's language.

Jingjoke -- I hadn't really thought of adding my friend-in-need to our will. I checked the Amphur form and, sure enough, you can name two people as beneficiaries, but I don't think that's really the answer to the lady's problems. It very likely that she'll pre-decease us and besides she needs help before our anticipated deaths (unless you know something I don't)

As for referring to my husband as Hubby -- we'll you're not the first person to be annoyed with that term. Or maybe it is just you complaining numerous times. I don't really want to be bothered doing that research. Abbreviations are commonly used here, like TGF, TW, even TBF and no one seems to mind. On other internet forums (like a gardening one I like), ladies refer to their husbands as DH. I've never seen that abbreviation used here. Do you think the TV users would understand that I'm talking about Hubby if I use the term DH or maybe (knowing this crowd) they might think that DH refers to a perjorative, in which case they'll think I'm talking about you!

Edited August 6, 2011 by NancyL