PAD Rally Will Only Complicate Matters: PM Abhisit

[webfact]

PREAH VIHEAR DISPUTE

PAD rally will only complicate matters: PM

By The Nation

If the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) held a rally on Saturday, it would only make the Preah Vihear temple issue more complicated, Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva said yesterday.

"Frankly speaking, the rally could make the situation more complicated, but if they really want to hold the demonstration, it should be done in accordance with the law," he said.

PAD leader Chamlong Srimuang has called for a demonstration in front of the prime minister's office on Saturday to demand the government revoke the memorandum of understanding on boundary demarcation signed with Cambodia in 2000.

The MoU, which recognises the Siam-French demarcation map, would allow Cambodia to claim Thai territory, Chamlong said.

"As Thai citizens, we have the duty to protect our sovereignty," he said.

With Bangkok still under a state of emergency, any public gathering of more than five people is prohibited. However, Abhisit declined to say if the emergency law would be enforced to block the PAD protest.

The PAD is a government ally, but it seems to have turned against Abhisit due to a difference in opinion over Preah Vihear. The nationalist group was against the Hindu temple getting World Heritage status, and demanded the government fight it too, as well as use force to exercise Thai sovereignty in the area adjacent to the temple.

The Preah Vihear, according to a ruling by the International Court of Justice in 1962, is on territory under sovereignty of Cambodia. Thailand says the court had only ruled on the ruins, not the surrounding area, which is Thai territory.

Abhisit, however, cannot cede to PAD's demands because the Democrat-led government under Chuan Leekpai had signed the 2000 MoU. Instead he is urging the PAD and other groups raising concern over the Preah Vihear issue to help the government come up with solutions.

Chamlong said he wanted to know if the government had a solid plan about what it should do in a year from now, when the World Heritage Committee considers Cambodia's temple management plan.

The Thai delegation managed to convince the panel to consider the management plan during its next session in 2011, but there are no clear ideas on what Thailand would do next.

Preah Vihear was made a World Heritage Site in 2008, obliging Cambodia to produce a management plan for the committee's consideration.

Even though the plan has been delayed by a year, Cambodia says it can still implement the plan. A statement from Phnom Penh said several jobs, such as the enlargement of the buffer zone to the south of the property, have been completed so far.

Meanwhile, despite the hot debate on the temple, the situation along the border province of Si Sa Ket remained calm. However, the situation might get heated as another PAD member Veera Somkwamkid is planning to take a group of protesters to the temple this weekend.

His plan is to disturb the peace of villagers in Ban Phum Srol for clashing with his group in 2008.

However, police and local authorities said yesterday they were ready to control the situation, adding that Ban Phum Srol residents were mostly Khmer natives and wanted no confrontation.

Meanwhile, Thippong Thipkesorn, sub-district police chief for Bung Malou, urged Veera to adjust his plan and seek opinions from local people.

-- The Nation 2010-08-06

[Thai at Heart]

Unless the PAD protest with less than 5 people in a province without the SOE in force, they are BREAKING THE LAW.

I thought when Abhisit came along, the least we could expect is someone who would uphold the law. The PAD's protest last week was illegal, and I expect them to once again be allowed to get away with breaking the law. This issue runs right to the heart of one of the major problems in Thailand today (and in times past) and should not be tolerated.

[RedNIvar]

PAD is the law, by virtue of putting the PM where he is today.

[taurus88]

The PAD is seizing this oportunity to embarass and replace the Democrat Party as the dominant representative in urban Bangkok and the South. Coming so close to the election, this a chance for positioning the NPP at the expense of the inefficient Democrat Party.

[Insight]

PAD is the law, by virtue of putting the PM where he is today.

And what will you say if the police do clamp down on the PAD's protest tomorrow?

/edit wrong date

Edited August 6, 2010 by Insight

[RedNIvar]

PAD is the law, by virtue of putting the PM where he is today.

And what will you say if the police do clamp down on the PAD's protest tomorrow?

/edit wrong date

I would then have to serve myself a dish of humble pie.

[march]

Unless the PAD protest with less than 5 people in a province without the SOE in force, they are BREAKING THE LAW.

I thought when Abhisit came along, the least we could expect is someone who would uphold the law. The PAD's protest last week was illegal, and I expect them to once again be allowed to get away with breaking the law. This issue runs right to the heart of one of the major problems in Thailand today (and in times past) and should not be tolerated.

It would be a "double standard" if they stop the yellows protesting tomorrow when the the reds were "BREAKING THE LAW" during their protest just 5 days ago.

An anti-government protester from the Red Sunday group rallies at the Democracy Monument in Bangkok August 1, 2010.

Reuters

Edited August 6, 2010 by march

[way2muchcoffee]

Double standards? Hmmm.

For there to be double standards on the part of the government several things must happen at tomorrow's demonstration. The protesters will have to do the following things before the can be dispersed.

1) They must refuse to leave

2) They must dump biohazards at various locations.

3) They must make death threats towards politicians.

4) They must set up barricades of tires and bamboo stakes.

5) They must attack police and security forces with bamboo stakes, rocks, slingshots, fireworks, and molotov cocktails.

6) They must engage in a bombing campaign throughout the city.

7) They must take over a large area of town (two areas really).

8) They must assassinate military personnel.

9) They must kidnap an executive of a private company.

10) They must invade hospitals (three of them)

11) They must shut down public transportation including the BTS and MRT.

12) They must conduct illegal search and seizures on private citizens.

13) They must throw grenades at the BTS.

14) They must use snipers and war weapons against security forces.

They must be allowed to do all this for a period of 2 months. Then, and only then, should the government move in to contain the protesters and do what is necessary to disperse them and arrest the leaders.

If the government moves in to disperse tomorrow's protest before any of the above has occurred then they will be guilty of having double standards. If, instead, they allow the protest to go on tomorrow unimpeded then there are no double standards whatsoever.

Edited August 6, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[SamritT]

PAD already broke the law by camping infront of UNESCO and block the traffic for a few days. No arrest. No double standard. In fact, the protest is just next to the police box with many traffic police in it.

[LomSak27]

One wonders where all this will end? PAD created the PV Temple controversy as a political issue to discredit Thaksin and the TRT but the longer it runs the more chance for it to spiral out of control. You would think the remark by the Thai actress about Angkor which caused the rioting in PP years back would act as a bucket of cold water on the dangers of playing with this, but no.

As someone here will post Cambodia has far more to lose if we see a repeat and or military confrontation, but when you have little you don’t seem to care as much. I have this ugly feeling that this issue will spiral out of control and it will hit the fan. At which point all parties will cry out ‘it wasn’t our fault’ whaa whaa whaa. The Nation will blame it on ‘outside influences’ IE Thaksin.

Tragedy as Farce

[SamritT]

PAD help the power struggle, hence PAD must be above law. Common sense.

[LomSak27]

“The events are in the saddle and ride mankind,”

[animatic]

PAD should not get to rally. Simple as that.

Not during the emergency, and if they must be moved,

let them whine. The law must be upheald and SEEN to be upheld.

[webfact]

Preah Vihear Protest to Take Place at Govt House Tomorrow

The 'Love the Nation' network has affirmed its protest on the Preah Vihear issue at Government House tomorrow, starting at 8 A.M.

People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) core leader Sondhi Limthongkul said the PAD supports the activities of the 'Love the Nation' network but is not the organizer of tomorrow's protest at Government House.

PAD core leader Chamlong Srimuang added he is joining this movement on a personal level but he's being touted as the group's leader due to his age and experience.

He invited Thais to join the gathering at Government House at 8 A.M. tomorrow to ask about the updates on the 4 demands issued by the group, which includes:

1. cancel Memorandum of Understanding from year 2000

2. chase out Cambodians from Thai territory

3. take back Preah Vihear Temple

4. have Thai representative take part in managing disputed area.

Chamlong said the group will send a representative to Government House to meet with the administration this evening.

Chamlong said he is not concerned that the gathering will be a violation of the state of emergency as any arrests will have to consider the intent of the person who violated the law.

-- Tan Network 2010-08-06

[SomTumTiger]

Yawn

[animatic]

Clearly PAD does NOT understand what the facts of the arguments are.

Point 1 Cancel the memorandum of understanding,

would remove the ONLY world recognized legal leverage Thailand still has over the issue.

Nationalist claptrap and not much more.

Points 2+3 essentially create a new war zone.

With 1+2+3 there is no need of point 4,

there would either be a war with many dead, and so no need for a Thai rep.

Edited August 6, 2010 by animatic

[Insight]

PAD should not get to rally. Simple as that.

Not during the emergency, and if they must be moved,

let them whine. The law must be upheald and SEEN to be upheld.

Fully agree. It's known this is down to Honest John Noppadon - let the govt handle it through the normal diplomatic channels. A rally won't solve anything and only stir the pot.

[yellow1red1]

It's just a pile of rocks for chris sake! real hindoos and buddhists would let the jungle take it over, impermenence.

preservation does not exist, only delay the inevitable.

PAD complicate things - who woulda thunk? they love the nation just like the reds do! why the fight?

[yellow1red1]

Both sides 'Love the Nation' let them both incite disorder.,

Where the multi colored when Thailand needs them?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/387072-chiang-rai-students-charged-with-inciting-disorder/page__hl__students

Chiang Rai Students Charged with Inciting Disorder

Chiang Rai police have charged five Students with stirring chaos for holding a gathering in violation of the emergency law.

Chiang Rai's Maung District acting police chief Police Lieutenant Colonel Banyat Thamthong said five university Students who recently demonstrated with posters ridiculing the declaration of a state of emergency in the northernmost province have been charged with disturbing social order and national security and distortion of information.

Banyat said all five Students denied the allegations against them and were released after reporting to investigators.

[SamritT]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

[rubl]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

What is it that makes Thai think they know their borders (boundaries)?

What Thai seem to forget is that an International court of Justice decision in 1962 awarded to Preah Vihear temple to Cambodia. A French map of 1907 was used in the argumentation. This map may have been incorrect, but was accepted by the Siam authorities and even used by them for a long time. As Thailand has never been colonialized, don't blame farang.

[RedNIvar]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

What Farang understand is that Thai will kill Thai with nothing to do with losing of land to Cambodia. Thai form of diplomacy and avoiding colonization is by giving away land that it taken away from others over many hundred years. I think many people have address this bigoted statement of yours in s different forum. You seem fixated on this concept that everything belongs to you.

FYI: I just asked about 10 of my Thai friends and not a single one is willing to die for the land around the PV temple. I guess only the PAD are willing to die then for the land is question,huh? About time, I suggest all PAD members should unite, get armed, and raid Cambodia, Burma, Malaysia and claim back PV, Angkor Wat,Penang, Langkawi, the Great Wall of China (that is yours as well, right?), and everything else that you think has been wrongfully taken from you. I will support your effort 100%,I will also offer to buy you some bullets.

Show us you're willing to walk the talk, go put your life on the line. Go get yourself ready to die for an inch of land, scream on top of your lungs "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH".

BTW, I think you're the Troll Peingrudee. She stops posting and you go on a posting crazy.

[groovyc]

PAD is the law, by virtue of putting the PM where he is today.

at least one poster's got some sense and better than average IQ...

[rubl]

PAD is the law, by virtue of putting the PM where he is today.

at least one poster's got some sense and better than average IQ...

At least two posters with no sense. PAD is NOT the law, they may think so, have tremendous influence, but ARE NOT above the law either. PM Abhisit is walking a very tight line between UDD and PAD. Justice will triumph eventually if enough people care to co-operate.

[SamritT]

PAD is the master. Dems is the slave.

[ridgydidge]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

If that's true why did the Thai people just lay down and let the Japanese invade during WW2?

[SamritT]

This is a fight between Siam & Khmer. All others, please keep out. Is this too much to ask for?

[DickFarang]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

Here is what The Phnom Penh Post (not the sister in Bangkok) has to tell:

Emerging from the chaotic political situation that has disrupted Thai community life since the 2006 coup, strong chauvinistic statements have been desperately disseminated with the purpose of recreating the unity of a deeply divided society.

Once again, nationalism is the tool used by Thai government authorities, senior officials and political leaders who face internal social division, disorders and protests that are self-inflicted by their own miscalculated policies.

Typical of the ultranationalist Thai political leaders, whether they are in the government or not, they saved their days, swept their mistakes under the rug and glorified their obvious failures by shifting Thai people’s attention in the direction of Cambodia. The target of their uninterrupted attacks against Cambodia is the inscription of the Temple of Preah Vihear on the UNESCO World Heritage List. More and more, it is said and written intentionally but falsely by Thais that the temple and its vicinity belong to Thailand. Even more, in trying to justify armed violations of Cambodian territories in various places, Thai political leaders have ostensibly created out of their Machiavellian schemes what they call the “disputed” frontier line. In fact, there is an indisputable internationally recognised frontier line between Cambodia and Thailand.

[DickFarang]

What Farang don't understand is that Thai people would rather die in war then to loose 1 square inch to Cambodia, AGAIN. Isn't 3 provinces and Angkor Wat enough? Someone have to stand up and say enough is enough.

What is it that makes Thai think they know their borders (boundaries)?

What Thai seem to forget is that an International court of Justice decision in 1962 awarded to Preah Vihear temple to Cambodia. A French map of 1907 was used in the argumentation. This map may have been incorrect, but was accepted by the Siam authorities and even used by them for a long time. As Thailand has never been colonialized, don't blame farang.

Was The Kingdom of Thailand/Siam not colonised by the Empire of Japan/Nippon during the Second World War ?

[bassep]

its a shame the two countries can not use this issue as a catalyst for peacful cooperation. why not create an international zone of nuetrality around the temple that in esence belongs to no one. After all we are just talking about a bunch of dam dirt.

until humans can get past these super petty and stupid disputes we are doomed to live in conflict for eternity (or at least until we make the species extinct)

but then again TIT so that wont happen!