Thai Immigration Introduces Jail Time For Overstayers

[grahamhc]

Hello!

what whould happen,when someone,short before the visa is runing out and the person have to go to hospital?

same then normal overstaying,or how then will be the diffrence in the visa law?

who have the be informed first?

when it should not posible after a acsident or whatevver-?

In Pattaya, the Immigration Police have a outstation a day a week at "Bangkok Hospital Pattaya" to deal with the via needs of the patients and family.

No hospital in Thailand will take a patient without finances to support their stay, so a trip home would be cheaper. If you are Thai, you get the 30 baht treatment, but if not Thai, you are on your own. Nothing wrong with that - That is why I buy health insurance. And GENUINE TOURISTS buy Travel Insurance

Edited September 24, 2010 by grahamhc

[tomyummer]

I think neighboring countries will have another way for you to get visa on demand w/o a Thai exit stamp and just leave from there...Sure glad I don't have to go through immigration when I exit the U.S.

how do u leave thailand without passing immigration??

Is this a trick question? Hmmm.....I got it! In a coffin!

[jucel]

Bottomline is that the whole visa system is absurdly complicated in Thailand, and for a reason; how more compicated, how more people will do something wrong, how more (tea)money can be made.Just compare to the Philippines: you can stay there your entire life WITHOUT leaving the country, just go every 2 months to immigration. pay a fee, and you get your 2 months stamp.Or take a resident visa and no need to go to Immigration any more.Simple, no misunderstanding possible, and they make lot of money with the visa fees.Aside from that, in Thailand the average social/knowledge/language skills of the employees of any immigration office is blatantly low, add to this the complexity of ever changing( and mostly inconsistent and illogic) immigration laws and you get a perfect cocktail to discourage people from visiting the country for longer than 30 days.

Wouldn't it be in the interests of Thailand to enable people to extend their stay without having to leave the country? Simply turn up at immigration, pay a fee, get a new visa stamp and then return on the relevant date to do it again. Why waste peoples time by making them fly back to the UK or where ever, all the time spending money that could be kept in Thailand.

It just seems so absurd to require people to leave to country just in order to stay.

yes, especially as we take nothing out of thailand re welfare, hospitals fees etc etc. I always find it strange how the visa laws are so strict yet it is impossible for us to sponge from the govt (unlike UK). I know people work here illegally but they are normally doing jobs that a thai can't (ie teaching english etc).

[Tafia]

I'm amazed at some of the anti comments on here, this will only effect those who overstay deliberately long term and lets be honest, for those who do so unintentionally for a few days are very few and wont be affected by this, most of us try to live by the law.

I don't even think this is a 'new' law, imprisonment has always been part of the overstay penalty, just not used that often by immigration.

Remember it's always been that if caught outside the airport on overstay you would most certainly be arrested and imprisoned.

Thailand has every right to set its own visa conditions and enforce them as they see fit. all we have to do is comply, hardly rocket science, but as in most countries there are those who abuse and not comply making life more difficult for the rest of us and it is those who force the changes thereby making life more restrictive for those who do comply. Maybe with the penalty a little harsh, it may make some people sit up and consider their options....though I doubt it!!

Edited September 24, 2010 by Tafia

[philhal2]

A welcome move. Let us just hope they stick with it.

now....lets wait for the "if it wasn't for me, Thailand would fall in a heap" replies.

How about the " I REALLY AM JUST GETTING SENILE " Done it once , Booked airfare and arrive on Day 25 and Booked to leave on Day 25 UMMMMMM yes 30 days have Sept etc etc etc , Took so long to pay the fine I dam_n I nearly missed my plane and I was at airport 3 hours early , I am very careful now , I hope , But yes am also worried about the accident or sick in hospital thought .

Hope its tempered with some reality but also think it is fair that we should obey all foreign laws and respect their customs and wishes .

If you laughing , you die quickly

Philhal2

Edited September 24, 2010 by philhal2

[teatree]

Wouldn't it be in the interests of Thailand to enable people to extend their stay without having to leave the country? Simply turn up at immigration, pay a fee, get a new visa stamp and then return on the relevant date to do it again. Why waste peoples time by making them fly back to the UK or where ever, all the time spending money that could be kept in Thailand.

It just seems so absurd to require people to leave to country just in order to stay.

You can, it is called an extension of stay.

Someone on an 'O' visa can indefinitely extend their stay? I don't think so.

[Mario2008]

Section 81 uses a conjunction "OR", does this mean that it still depends to the Immigration officers if they'd fine you a Bt20,000, or imprison you, or both... OR THEY COULD ASK FOR MORE IF YOU DON'T WANT TO GET IMPRISONED?? The new law, as usual, is not concrete.

It's really very sad that they always implement new rules that are vague and keep on changing. If they think this is a grave violation, they should use the conjunction "AND" instead.. which should be "a fine of 20,000 baht AND imprisonment". I think this would be more clear to us..

It is up to a judge to decide which sentence he gives. You can also have it handled by immigration, in which case you pay the fine, which should never be more than 20,000 baht.

It is not a new law. Only a change of policy by immigration on how to deal with people on overstay.

[Trapper]

Just follow the rules and you have no problem. Those that overstay know they are breaking the Law, now they may have to spend a couple of nights in detention before paying their fine.

No big deal really. What will hurt is if they are not allowed back i the country for a long period of time.

[tomyummer]

Well at least if they're going to throw us in jail, why not use us for some 'chain gang' chores?

Like parading us around the airport cleaning up the toilets and scrubbing the floors? At least that way they can send a warning to incoming visitors passing by to make sure they don't overstay.

Kill three birds with one stone. 1) Catch an offender, 2) get manual labor out of us before being deported, and 3) use us for marketing purposes to arriving guests.

Don't just throw us in jail and take our fines!

[Pui]

Whatever they decide is up to them but... The "Grey area" is obviously an opportunity for Tea Money and more corruption. Like many Thai laws the "Grey areas" are designed to supplement officials incomes. Pity they haven't decided to clean up these areas before so many others.

This just about sums it up. This is yet another means of leverage. So the corrupt official can blackmail foreigners with jail.

These jails lack basic human rights and while its difficult to sympathise with heroin traffickers and rapists I don't think over stayers need to be put in disgusting Thai jails.

Many of these unfortunate individuals have families here and have simply fallen into a bit of a rut.

If it was about law and order why don't they enforce some road laws. That kills people everyday.

The laws are in place to felicitate corruption.

Will people actually go to jail it will they marched to the ATM and relieved of thousands.

Edited September 24, 2010 by Pui

[Mario2008]

Someone on an 'O' visa can indefinitely extend their stay? I don't think so.

You can get yearly extensions of stay or apply for permanent residency. It is even possible to apply for Thai nationality.

[philhal2]

I think neighboring countries will have another way for you to get visa on demand w/o a Thai exit stamp and just leave from there...Sure glad I don't have to go through immigration when I exit the U.S.

how do u leave thailand without passing immigration??

Maybe he is able to teleport himself.

Can swim across the Mekong or boat it , or walk across the border in many places , Problem is what happens when you get picked up in a neighbouring country with no visa ???????????????????????????????????????????

Edited September 24, 2010 by philhal2

[Mario2008]

Well at least if they're going to throw us in jail, why not use us for some 'chain gang' chores?

Like parading us around the airport cleaning up the toilets and scrubbing the floors? At least that way they can send a warning to incoming visitors passing by to make sure they don't overstay.

Kill three birds with one stone. 1) Catch an offender, 2) get manual labor out of us before being deported, and 3) use us for marketing purposes to arriving guests.

Don't just throw us in jail and take our fines!

Now that is constructive thinking!

It might actually work.

[george]

Update:

Phuket tourists face jail for long immigration overstays:

Full story:

[Mario2008]

Can swim across the Mekong or boat it , or walk across the border in many places , Problem is what happens when you get picked up in a neighbouring country with no visa ???????????????????????????????????????????

You would be illegally in that country, what in almost any country is a crime. Don't try it with Burma. You might be worse off.

[Amras]

Hello!

what whould happen,when someone,short before the visa is runing out and the person have to go to hospital?

same then normal overstaying,or how then will be the diffrence in the visa law?

who have the be informed first?

when it should not posible after a acsident or whatevver-?

is a blacklist forever,or can also be removed,after a couple of years?

on internet i read some reports,that planing in the future,a visa for all countrys,like here in eu!

If you are genuinly in hospital you won't have a problem as the hospital will inform immigration.

What is "normal overstaying?" Is that like "normal burglary" or any other "normal" crime?

Thats not actually true.. It 'should be' but routinely immigration simply dont care about hospital letters and declarations that you are an inpatient.. Seen it myself.

I have an education visa. 90 days was up on a monday however monday is one of my assigned study days. Immigration is closed sat/sun. I went on tuesday, one day after with a letter from school. They did not care.

In addition, at the end of my all day adventure at chaeng wattana upon receiving my passport I found my change was not given to me. Change was 100 baht; 1900 visa extend + 500 overstay =2400, paid with 2500. The lady that gave me my passport did walk away rather fast.

Very very disheartening to experience this lack of integrity and blatant attempt hoping I would not notice and walk away, after which time it would be too late to say anything. Just for 100 baht makes me not hold these people with much esteem.

Would it not be better to simply charge in advance for 4 extensions on an ED visa instead of giving them more work and causing people that are supposed to be at school to lose an entire day.

I consider myself objective and open minded but my perception of much of the immigration dept rules are designed for self enrichment.

So why not go on a Friday? It's only 3 days before. It is not Immigrations fault/problem that you are busy on Monday when you have to report.

Why do so many people think that rules need to be bent for them.

The law is the law.

So many people get all high and mighty, I bring money into this country blah blah blah. Yes you probably do, but so what. It doesn't mean your entitled to stay. We're visitors and should respect the laws that govern this country. Yes corruption exists and how many people benefit from it and support the existance of corruption! Doing the right thing will mean you don't have to participate in it and maybe this will help Thailand to move away from this path.

How do you feel about those coming from China etc to yoru hoem country (usually Australia, UK and USA) with a TON of money, get into University, stay there etc because they have the cash? Most don't think its right, yet people believe in Thailand everything should be different and they should be granted 'special' privilages because they are injecting money into Australia. What such an elitest attitude.

Same s*** diff smell. Foreigners bring in a lot of money to many countries, through business investment tourism etc. It is not just Thailand. Even Australia has around 4% of income from tourism. 1/25th of our money comes from overseas visitors.

Sure there can be often extenuating circumstances that may result in you overstaying, but half of the posts here act as if that is the norm. If it is, it shouldn't be, it should be the exception and thats the problem. If people were doing the right thing, this wouldn't be an issue. But clearly so many don't and then get ina s*** because Thailand wants to start moving in the right direction. Yes Thailands immigration and Visa laws may be difficult/hard to get for long term. But honestly they aren't any more difficult and time consuming then getting ones/moving to Australia. Thailand has a huge population and needs the infastructure to support it. It can't afford to be 'willy nilly' about immigration policy like it has been. Why do you think so many other countries curb numbers of migrants. Its often about infastructure among other things.

Maybe so many of you have forgotten that there is often more to it than just trying to get money out of foreigners, because you've been out of your home country for so long or you really believe that things are so black and white.

[Basil B]

Just some bullet points...

• If Thailand do not wish people overstaying why do they let them back in?
• Would like to think that if there is going to be a tightening of the rules there would be an amnesty first, though I doubt that it will make much difference as I suspect that many of the over-stayers do not have the money for a plane ticket or to pay the fine.
• Would like to see rules on visas more reciprocal especially where it involves marriage.
• Think that prison time should also be applied to illegal foreign workers from Laos, Cambodia, Myanmar, etc.
• Seems only one sorce for this information, is there any collaboration on the story? (nothing like shoving a big sick in a cesspool and steering to get attention).

[tomyummer]

And the saddest thing about this change in laws? I only get it from ThaiVisa.com. Even my own lawyer cannot keep up with the ever changing immigration laws that seem to change a few times a year.

I would never complain about immigration laws and abiding by them, but only first if I know about them. Maybe the Thai government should work with the airlines to have a warning cards in each seat stating the current immigration laws and results of violations. Similar to the Singaporean 'We execute drug traffickers' airline cards.

[wolf5370]

Seems to me to be no incentive to long term over stayer to actually go home. In fact it would put off any that had given up and decided to do just that. So, is the point to get rid of overstayers, try to act as a deterant or just a way of upping the undert-the-table price of freedom?

The only way it could act other than for teamoney (which I doubt would work anyway - how many long term overstayers are wealthy - very few I'd suggest otherwise they would have visas!) is to make a big song and dance about it and bring it in in 3 months - giving those in fear a chance to scramble together airfare and run rather than locking them into staying forever.

Policy with out thought as usual.

Edited September 24, 2010 by wolf5370

[SanSaiExPat]

I'm sure everyone on this board would agree that the United States of America should institute a similiar policy with it's neighbors, especially Mexico and even it's other international friends. Right?

[wintermute]

How is anyone defending overstayers is beyond me and patently ridiculous. The 20,000 baht loophole has been around for awhile and abused by individuals who don't want to get or can't qualify for a proper visa and want to stay indefinitely. They are finally closing it up, after years, and are addressing the abuse. There are so many other options out there to get a legal visa there's no reason to do this sort of thing.

I really doubt people complaining about this would appreciate illegals coming in, working and staying for nearly a year at a time in their own countries.

Also ignorance of the law is never an excuse. Silly reasons like "I can't remember dates" or "I have a kid" is just total b.s.

Edited September 24, 2010 by wintermute

[lazygourmet]

Hello!

what whould happen,when someone,short before the visa is runing out and the person have to go to hospital?

same then normal overstaying,or how then will be the diffrence in the visa law?

who have the be informed first?

when it should not posible after a acsident or whatevver-?

is a blacklist forever,or can also be removed,after a couple of years?

on internet i read some reports,that planing in the future,a visa for all countrys,like here in eu!

You just get a note from the hospital telling how long you stayed there and how long recovery time you need before you can leave the country... This you show to the immigration and end of problems...

That happened to me a decade ago...

Septicemia, blood change and nearly three months under massive antibiotics at Burumgrad.

My minor problem was how to handle my immigration case!

Problem which the staff at the hospital and immigration did properly by giving me two times three months extension.

Even if I didn't ask for the second extension, they provided it to me just in case I would have be to weak to travel abroad.

[Eff1n2ret]

Just some bullet points...

Would like to see rules on visas more reciprocal especially where it involves marriage

So spouse settlement visas to the UK (or anywhere else) should be renewed annually showing continued sponsorship, funds in the bank or appropriate level of income from abroad, report every 90 days, and permanent residence/citizenship rarely granted?

Yes, I'd give that a try.

[Pattaya46]

These jails lack basic human rights and while its difficult to sympathise with heroin traffickers and rapists I don't think over stayers need to be put in disgusting Thai jails.

They are not in "disgusting Thai jails" but in the Immigration Detention Centre (IDC),

and according to witness it's not so bad as a prison.

Someone on an 'O' visa can indefinitely extend their stay? I don't think so.

You can get yearly extensions of stay or apply for permanent residency.

You can may get yearly extensions...

but only if you are in one of some categories, like Thai wife, Thai children, retired,...

Not every one who get a O visa can get yearly extensions

[beechguy]

And the saddest thing about this change in laws? I only get it from ThaiVisa.com. Even my own lawyer cannot keep up with the ever changing immigration laws that seem to change a few times a year.

I would never complain about immigration laws and abiding by them, but only first if I know about them. Maybe the Thai government should work with the airlines to have a warning cards in each seat stating the current immigration laws and results of violations. Similar to the Singaporean 'We execute drug traffickers' airline cards.

You should get a better lawyer, there actually hasn't been that many changes, last one of any significance I remember was November, 2008.

[Darkling]

Ah I see now they put "Teeth" in to the old saying "Money Talks"

that comment deserves Quote of the week award.

[sausageandmash]

I suppose you would also recommend concentration camps and gas chambers. Or how about just publicly beheading them?

It's long past due that the authorities started putting more teeth into enforcement of immigration law. Hopefully they'll also find the manpower to start doing some extensive sweeps and passport checks and round them up by the bus load.

[Mario2008]

These jails lack basic human rights and while its difficult to sympathise with heroin traffickers and rapists I don't think over stayers need to be put in disgusting Thai jails.

They are not in "disgusting Thai jails" but in the Immigration Detention Centre (IDC),

and according to witness it's not so bad as a prison.

Someone on an 'O' visa can indefinitely extend their stay? I don't think so.

You can get yearly extensions of stay or apply for permanent residency.

You can may get yearly extensions...

but only if you are in one of some categories, like Thai wife, Thai children, retired,...

Not every one who get a O visa can get yearly extensions

Nor would you in a lot of other countries. Just as in other countries, you must have a valid reason and meet certain criteria.

While the law is not perfect, it is also not that bad compared to other countries.

[davee58]

Crazy!

They need to Boost tourism rather than discourage those who want to stay a bit longer.

Why not charge fines for those who Understay their visa.

A two week detention order for attempted early departure.

Instead of a jail term the "runner" pays for a hotel of his own choice so there is no cost to the Thai taxpayer.

Everybody Wins!!

[wintermute]

Crazy!

They need to Boost tourism rather than discourage those who want to stay a bit longer.

Why not charge fines for those who Understay their visa.

A two week detention order for attempted early departure.

Instead of a jail term the "runner" pays for a hotel of his own choice so there is no cost to the Thai taxpayer.

Everybody Wins!!

Overstayers who can't be bothered with following things such as basic laws shouldn't be welcome.