Losing Respect

[ChiangMaiFun]

I have no intention at all to change the rule breaking monks behaviour.

There is probably not even one reading this forum.

I, for one, see some real benefits in the rules being reviewed and monks valued more for their practice of Dhamma and their ability to inspire others with the values exemplified by the Buddha than for their elite untouchability and social dependence. They would serve the community better as "Boon-makers" than "Boon-receivers". Having said that, I'm sure there are many who are already exemplary, and a change of rules may not make much difference to them. It may liberate them though to be a brighter light on the hill for Thai society instead of the entrenched hieratic slew they occupy now.

The Sangha in Thailand is a self-serving elite kept in place by elite-loving Thais who in former times genuinely respected and loved the monks because they contributed to village life in many ways - in many cases by breaking the rules. Those times, captured by writers like Sulak Sivaraksa and Kamala Tiyavanich, are no longer with us and cannot be retrieved. The new era requires a broader sangha - male and female, monastic and lay - and a focus on mutual support and shared productivity based on a simple lifestyle together with vigorous teaching and self-education programmes for adults and children.

Phra Photiraksa and his Santi Asoke movement is a good example of what a blend of traditional monastic vinaya and authentic Buddhist practice can be, but it's too strict for most people (though one doesn't have to be a full member). Santi Asoke, however, has been ostracised by the official Sangha in Thailand (after initial attempts to criminalise it by invoking state power as the legitimising agent for Thai Buddhism). To practise Dhamma in an authentic, generous-spirited and inclusive manner in this country is to invite legal sanctions and contempt, as experienced by Samanera Photiraksa and Dhammananda Bhikkhuni (head of the community of nuns in Nakhorn Pathom). Even conservative abbots like Ajahn Brahm in Perth have been excluded from the Ajahn Chah network for ordaining bhikkhunis, thereby "breaking the rules".

It's very hard for intelligent monks with insight and foresight to break through the stultifying structures and archaic rules of current fossilised Thai Buddhism. They can do it if they have some charisma and a gift for teaching and writing, but how much more creative and influential they could be if there were some loosening of the reins.

but how much more creative and influential they could be if there were some loosening of the reins.

good post

ok, heres my position....

according to the pali scriptures

the buddha said

if the king is bad

the ministers become bad

the whole country becomes bad

(or words to that effect)

using that as criterion....

dont blame society for the current state its in

blame the government

dont blame the monks for their

slack ways

blame the sangharaja and his (ministers)

the elite ruling monks that contribute their votes

to any major change

its my opinion that they are kept tightly reigned in

they are instructed to leave things the way they are

you have to use inference to determine why

my inferential conclusion would not go down

very well on this forum

but ill give it if im really pushed

I believe this is partly right but each and every monk IS responsible for his behaviour and personal karma - not some hierarchy within the Sangha. It is not true to say that the hierarchy lead by bad example and hence monks just 'copy' - change can come from 'down there' as with Ghandi etc. I must say I agree that the Sanghas 'attachment' to certain areas of Thai society does it a great dis-service.