Mother Of Girl Involved In Bangkok Tollway Accident Attends Funeral Of Victim

[Nisa]

Without going back to the news report, I believe the girls quotes stated the van was continuing to move back and forth between lanes. She signaled the van with her lights to pass (as is the practice here) and the van moved back into the other lane but as she began to pass the van came back into her lane and they collided.

When you say "as is the practice here", i know what sort of driving maneuver you are talking about. It usually involves driving up fast right onto the back bumper of another car, tailgating, and then flashing the headlights to intimidate the driver ahead to pull aside. I experience this practice almost everyday. Sometimes people even do it when i am sitting in traffic with cars ahead of me and to either side. Quite how they expect me to get out of their way, i have no idea. Levitation perhaps?!

Anyway, whether it be the practice here or not doesn't make it an acceptable way to drive. It's dangerous, arrogant and against the law.

It is common knowledge (and acceptable) here that flicking your lights indicates you want to pass. In the US flicking your lights often means you are giving permission to the car (usually a truck) in front of you to move into your lane. That was all I was saying.

To my knowledge it is not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances to flick your high beams at another driver to indicate your intentions.

Edited January 2, 2011 by Nisa

[ChiangMaiFun]

Without going back to the news report, I believe the girls quotes stated the van was continuing to move back and forth between lanes. She signaled the van with her lights to pass (as is the practice here) and the van moved back into the other lane but as she began to pass the van came back into her lane and they collided.

When you say "as is the practice here", i know what sort of driving maneuver you are talking about. It usually involves driving up fast right onto the back bumper of another car, tailgating, and then flashing the headlights to intimidate the driver ahead to pull aside. I experience this practice almost everyday. Sometimes people even do it when i am sitting in traffic with cars ahead of me and to either side. Quite how they expect me to get out of their way, i have no idea. Levitation perhaps?!

Anyway, whether it be the practice here or not doesn't make it an acceptable way to drive. It's dangerous, arrogant and against the law.

It is common knowledge here that flicking your lights indicates you want to pass. In the US flicking your lights often means you are giving permission to the car (usually a truck) in front of you to move into your lane. That was all I was saying but I would venture to guess that flicking your high beams under either scenario I just mentioned is acceptable behavior to drivers and to my knowledge not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances.

not arrogant? you're joking right?

[EyesWideOpen]

Just an act.....  But anyway, good to see that Hi-so Thais are at least worried enough about how their bizarre actions appears to regular people, that they would bother to even put on an act. I suspect that only a few years ago they would not have gone to the trouble of any act......

[rixalex]

Exactly! put it down to sheer selfishness - something happens to Thai's when they get behind the wheel or on a bike - no letting people out of soi's, no regarding for parking and no INDICATION which really pisses me off

Indeed. How do such gracious and considerate people turn into such selfish moronic monsters behind the wheel? I guess it comes down to road manners, which is something that really needs to be taught, otherwise people just think "why should i care about being rude to someone i don't know, can't see, and will probably never meet".

[rixalex]

To my knowledge it is not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances to flick your high beams at another driver to indicate your intentions.

It's not indicating an intention, it's indicating a demand, and that's why it is arrogant. And when it involves tailgating and speeding, which it invariably does, it is against the law.

[featography]

"I am sorry for losing my son who was a good man. You still have your child who joins you for dinner, but I no longer have any," she said."

Send a signal.

Certainly does & it is a very fair comment.

Since others are so quick to pull 'poor offender' card & look for excuses on how much everything else is to blame, HERE we have a poor innocent victim (A victims mother). Just stop and take a look at that poor woman, she's lost her only son & is now left with nothing. Now there is someone that gets my deepest sympathy.

One step further too, in this society, its the grown kids that are the security, and support for the parents in old age. This poor mother has lost her financial, emotional security, for all intent and purpose, her future has been torn away from her, as well as her son

[Nisa]

To my knowledge it is not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances to flick your high beams at another driver to indicate your intentions.

It's not indicating an intention, it's indicating a demand, and that's why it is arrogant. And when it involves tailgating and speeding, which it invariably does, it is against the law.

You might want to do an internet search for driving laws and tips for driving in Thailand. You will then find it is both acceptable and suggested to do this when passing for safety reasons,

Edited January 2, 2011 by Nisa

[somtampet]

I see a glimmer of hope for the young lady who caused the accident. She has a mother who has a lot of courage and a fair amount of compassion.

OHHHHHHHHHHHHH cum on do gooder,she is so full of bullshit and 30,000 baht for a death is a pittance.She isnt a young lady she is a little spolit brat that has no compassion in her body,and the full force of the law should be applied to her and the mother and father,but i doubt it.

TIT

[shunima]

Let me share a personal story. friend of mine, 20 years ago on new years day. One car, one trailer, 9 friends. So how to put 9 in one car to drive home together. solution... 5 in the car, 4 in the trailer and off they go. for 30 mins... then, 'cause he hardly drove with a trailer in the back of a car, he lost control in a curve and the trailer hit a tree with around 60-70 miles an hour. 4 friends killed on the spot. What this guy needed was support not hatred.

Now...

regardless of what happened.

did that girl enter the car with the intention to kill others? no.

did she enter the car with thinking clearly. If something bad happens I do not care at all? no.

my best guess is that she believed that nothing will happen and as it seems she drove frequently before the crash the past validated that (her) assumption.

so please think before you insist on harsh punishment. it doesn't matter if her family is rich or not. how is it fair that the family status now becomes a disadvantage? Maybe it would be better to assign her to speak in front of youngsters caught with minor lapes and tell these guys how lucky they were that nothing serious happened. That would probably make other think.

maybe she's rich, maybe spoiled, maybe her parents aren't model citizens. But I truly believe that she did not open that car door and thought "well today I kill meself 9 people on the highway". and if this is so then she deserves a chance to proof that she can do better.

[howzat]

I see a glimmer of hope for the young lady who caused the accident. She has a mother who has a lot of courage and a fair amount of compassion.

Come on, I personally think it’s all an act. She’s just trying to save the family name and 30,000B compensation what a joke. I really do hope this underage teen driver gets what should be coming to her but I highly doubt she’ll get in any trouble. Imagine if that was one of you Sons or Daughters who died in such a way and some lady was offering 30,000B compensation. I would through it back in her face.

[featography]

"still being treated at hospital and was suffering from widespread social condemnation."

Is this a medical condition?

It is now.

[howzat]

How can this teenage brat be offered a glimmer of hope when she has committed manslaughter on such a grand scale and ruined so many families lives. 30000 baht compensation for what. Unbelievable

[lee68]

I see a glimmer of hope for the young lady who caused the accident. She has a mother who has a lot of courage and a fair amount of compassion.

All i see is somebody trying to buy there way out of the problem!. than style!

[ballpoint]

To my knowledge it is not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances to flick your high beams at another driver to indicate your intentions.

It's not indicating an intention, it's indicating a demand, and that's why it is arrogant. And when it involves tailgating and speeding, which it invariably does, it is against the law.

You might want to do an internet search for driving laws and tips for driving in Thailand. You will then find it is both acceptable and suggested to do this when passing for safety reasons,

In some countries it is considered polite and/or safe to flash your lights prior to pulling out to overtake the car in front of you. I believe it's even the law in some. This is by no means equivalent to racing up behind another vehicle on the motorway flashing your lights in a demand that they move aside and leaving no room for error should something go wrong, which is extremely arrogant and, as this young woman found out, extremely dangerous. It is similar to the practice of overtaking in the face of oncoming traffic and flashing your lights to tell them to move onto the shoulder and get out of your way.

[lannarebirth]

To my knowledge it is not against the law nor in my opinion arrogant in either circumstances to flick your high beams at another driver to indicate your intentions.

It's not indicating an intention, it's indicating a demand, and that's why it is arrogant. And when it involves tailgating and speeding, which it invariably does, it is against the law.

You might want to do an internet search for driving laws and tips for driving in Thailand. You will then find it is both acceptable and suggested to do this when passing for safety reasons,

You seem to have them all covered Nisa.

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/

Anthow you seem to introduce a lot of assumptions not in evidence. Let's take the "unsafe lane change" for instance. Suppose the van was changing lanes. If that circumstance was unsafe it could ce wholly attributed to the closing speed of a speeding car overtaking. The van driver might look in their mirror and see a group of cars well behind her indicating plenty of room to change lanes. What she wouldn't see (but what we see in the overhead video) is that the girls car was passing cars like they were standing still. If there was a lane change and if it was unsafe, it could be wholly attributible to the actions of the speeding girl.

[lannarebirth]

I see a glimmer of hope for the young lady who caused the accident. She has a mother who has a lot of courage and a fair amount of compassion.

All i see is somebody trying to buy there way out of the problem!. than style!

What you're seeing is hundreds of years of Thai culture on exhibit. Everyone has a role to play and an expectation of behaviour based on their place in society. Soon you'll be seeing Facebook groups calling the families "greedy" and "vengeful" if they don't rollover and play their expected part in the drama playing out.

[Wellington]

This is a typical act of a hi-so family,so far up their own <deleted> nothing seems to be beyond them,time and time again we see this and thats why i hope hi-so,s rot in hell

Yours is a typical act of jealousy and talking out of your ar#e. Being in Thailand for 8 years and married to a pretty countryside girl I have met a PM (don't tell you whom :-), a foreign minister, a finance minister and met a lot of the so called hi-so people. Surprise surprise... the majority of it is pretty likeable. Nice folks, grounded, sense of humor and not arrogant at all. They know that I haven't their status but meet them for business only. Nonetheless they treat me and my colleagues with respect.

And then... yes then there's this small group that is not bearable to be with in the same room. The hi-so people you don't want to know.To ignore them is the easiest way to handle this group.

And now comes the biggest surprise. When I visit the village of my wife I find exactly the same situation. Loads of people I love, like and respect and so they do (I hope). And the village has also the few <deleted> you probably find everywhere. To ignore them is working on this level as well quite good.

What do we learn... we come closer to each other when we decide to listen and to be open instead of insulting each other. Happy new year !!!

I have lived in Thailand for nearly 8 years also,and to be honest you only talk out of your ARXXXE NID NOI.The hi-so are arrogant,racist and horrible people,my view,up to you for your view,but dont tell me you are an expert fella

Beginning to sound like you have a very big log on yr. shoulder

Better to stick to the topic

[metisdead]

A number of posts have been removed from view, lets stop the personal attacks.

Mother Of Girl Involved In Bangkok Tollway Accident Attends Funeral Of Victim is on topic to this thread.

[BanTamo]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

[DLock]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Ummm...what?

[Nisa]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Same to you and thanks for sharing your experiences. I am glad that more people are starting to join and post more rational thoughts (regardless if they differ from my opinions) and hopefully this will help avoid more people from jumping on the lynch mob band wagon we have seen so much on the internet regarding this tragic accident.

[whybother]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Ummm...what?

Can you extrapolate? What's your problem with BanTamo's post?

[lannarebirth]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Could you expound please on the portion of your post I have highlighted? I think it is an interesting comment that is worthy of some further detail. As an aside, couldn't it also be possible that this tragic incident might have the potential to create positive change as opposed to the "grave damage" you forsee? Or most likely, no change at all.

Edited January 2, 2011 by lannarebirth

[Nisa]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Could you expound please on the portion of your post I have highlighted? I think it is an interesting comment that is worthy of some further detail.

Just curious, do you not understand what he/she is referring to or are you bating him to speak more so you can debate this?

I only ask because it seems to be the most intelligent well thought and from the heart posts I have seen in this thread. To expound on it would only seem to take away from its perfect and non-biased concerned. Sometimes things are just so eloquently stated that expanding on it only causes it to lose its meaning or find ways to pick it apart.

Edited January 2, 2011 by Nisa

[lannarebirth]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Could you expound please on the portion of your post I have highlighted? I think it is an interesting comment that is worthy of some further detail.

Just curious, do you not understand what he/she is referring to or are you bating him to speak more so you can debate this?

I only ask because it seems to be the most intelligent well thought and from the heart posts I have seen in this thread. To expound on it would only seem to take away from its perfect and non-biased concerned. Sometimes things are just so eloquently stated that expanding on it only causes it to lose its meaning or find ways to pick it apart.

No, I don't understand what he is talking about. That's whay I asked for further clarification. You may think it intelligent and well thought out but it left me unclear as to what was said. That's why I asked for an expansion of the poster's thoughts.

[jayboy]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Could you expound please on the portion of your post I have highlighted? I think it is an interesting comment that is worthy of some further detail.

Just curious, do you not understand what he/she is referring to or are you bating him to speak more so you can debate this?

I only ask because it seems to be the most intelligent well thought and from the heart posts I have seen in this thread. To expound on it would only seem to take away from its perfect and non-biased concerned. Sometimes things are just so eloquently stated that expanding on it only causes it to lose its meaning or find ways to pick it apart.

Personally I thought it complete balderdash - sloppy,emotional and devoid of any real meaning - and <deleted> is the "emerald Triangle"?

And as for you, I think you have made your point very clearly, namely that the girl concerned should not be condemned or prejudged because of her background.I agree and I agreed the first of the numerous times you made it.

It is now for you to reflect (since you seem to have no idea) why there is so much anger about this case.Of course the girl's rights must be respected but your posts are ridiculously out of balance.It's not really about class envy at all but rather a widespread rage that the elite in this country get away with crimes and abuse through the exercise of influence and money.Whether this is relevant here or will be a factor in this case remains to be seen.So far so good.

Edited January 2, 2011 by jayboy

[BanTamo]

I'll try, lannarebirth (and by the way, your thoughtful post came whilst I was laboring over my own or I would have thanked you as well) but its not really my area of expertise. I'd much prefer to hear Chris Baker's take. But its a fair request.

The forces unleashed on Thai society in the last decade are dramatic and polarizing. From my humble, benighted perspective, we're witness to a very risky stage in the evolution of this ancient Kingdom. It seems to me that things could easily go badly wrong. Or not. The blood-lust for the badly-behaved, privileged few is hardly surprising, nor without merit. But it is still a passion and therefore problematic in a Buddhist culture. Which, for all its failings, Thailand still is. And I, for one, hope it remains.

If this thing gets out of control, or is used by one or another of the 'black hands' currently manipulating the political situation, it could be incendiary. And there's more than enough tragedy in it without that happening.

I don't mean to take anything away from the dignity of what we see unfolding; quite the contrary. But alas I sense the potential. Hopefully I'm just paranoid.

[Nisa]

Rexalex, shunima, Nisa - your calm and balanced postings, the civility of your disagreements, are so appreciated. So much of what I've read in this thread is just sad. Twenty-two years and a fair number of miles into my life in Thailand, with Thais, and still I have often to cringe at the utter ineptitude of so many, both Thai and non-Thai, both hi and loso, who have every preparation to do (and say) so much better than they have here. As a foreigner who's had the privilege of receiving a master degree from Chulalongkorn, and the very personal royal blessings that come with that, and also of living and working for several years among the subsistence rice farmers of the Emerald Triangle, I have some experience of both worlds. Thai civil society is at such a delicate stage of development right now, and this tragedy has the potential to become something of far greater proportions, and to result in grave damage to the place many of us love deeply. It seems to me to merit a higher level of discourse and I'm grateful for your contributions.

Could you expound please on the portion of your post I have highlighted? I think it is an interesting comment that is worthy of some further detail.

Just curious, do you not understand what he/she is referring to or are you bating him to speak more so you can debate this?

I only ask because it seems to be the most intelligent well thought and from the heart posts I have seen in this thread. To expound on it would only seem to take away from its perfect and non-biased concerned. Sometimes things are just so eloquently stated that expanding on it only causes it to lose its meaning or find ways to pick it apart.

No, I don't understand what he is talking about. That's whay I asked for further clarification. You may think it intelligent and well thought out but it left me unclear as to what was said. That's why I asked for an expansion of the poster's thoughts.

No problem. The poster did a good job explaining above but I just was concerned that expounding on it too much could help propel it becoming the face of a political party's agenda as opposed to being what it was ... a car accident involving an underage driver that had horrific results and whose victims and the accused could have come from any political party or social class in Thailand.

Edit: as you can see this is already happening.

Edited January 2, 2011 by Nisa

[Heng]

You can't make everyone happy. I would bet that there are a good number of families that would only send representatives.

[Nisa]

It is now for you to reflect (since you seem to have no idea) why there is so much anger about this case.Of course the girl's rights must be respected but your posts are ridiculously out of balance.It's not really about class envy at all but rather a widespread rage that the elite in this country get away with crimes and abuse through the exercise of influence and money.Whether this is relevant here or will be a factor in this case remains to be seen.So far so good.

So basically this incident, that you admit has gone (handled) good so far, should be justification for anger DIRECTED AT THIS MINOR because other people of influence and/or money have got away with things in the past?

In fact, things have not only gone good so far in terms of the handling of the events in the aftermath but because of the name she was born with she has already had to endure death threats, her name being released by police as well as photos being published (both illegal when a minor involved in a crime). The victims family are already receiving token payments and am sure there will be much more to come given this family does appear to have the resources as opposed to a poor person.

I have no idea how rich this family is but it is simply a matter of fact that the rich and/or connected often have the ability to buy their way out of problems all over the world. It is not unique to Thailand. Though this certainly doesn't mean that Thailand doesn't need to properly address social inequality and corruption.

Personally I find it illogical, ignorant and disregardful to those killed and injured to try to make this girl the focus of anger regarding issues that have happened in the past or because of the type or name of the family she was born into.

Edited January 2, 2011 by Nisa