German Tourist Arrested For Killing Thai Motorcyclist In Drunk Driving

[neverdie]

I've had it before Nisa, where the ride towards me on the wrong side of the road & as they approach the go right, then left & you can't always be sure which side they're going to pass you on (& i always brake and slow as they approach, perhaps foolish might not) & sometime when they do this you are restricted by vehicular traffic on how far you can get away.

The two versions i described before did happen, exactly head on, one out of a side street and straight into the guy coming the wrong way (<deleted>? Apears nobody was looking ).

Also bikes coming towards you and they want to turn in front of you into a side street (in front of you of course, as opposed to waiting until youve passed) and the ride directly at you BANG - Head on.

Hence my questions to you before about riding here (often), I bet you will see what I describe, daily.

anyway, adios.

[neverdie]

... money! ... MONEEEEYYYY!

so very true!

[whybother]

Actually, not sure what you mean. First, when I say "head-on" I literally mean head-on (two bikes heading in opposite directions coming together). I personally have never seen it beyond when two people are screwing around on bikes (usually friends). Of course this is Thailand and bikes are driven very differently including on the sidewalk .. not to mention there is a whole bunch more of them.

Not to take away from the victim here but my first thought, beyond was he wearing a helmet (1st thought in every deadly crash), was why he let this drunk drive directly into him? Of course there are a number of scenarios such as they were between cars in traffic and possibly a some sort of turn immediately before. However when I hear the words "head-on" then I think of two vehicles traveling in opposite direction colliding front to front. I don't know the area or circumstances but just having a hard time visualizing this happening with two bikes ... this might be in part because being as a rider from the US (only driven here on rental bikes on the islands) I keep visualizing what I would do if another bike was coming at me but I am not visualizing being in traffic or that it is common for drivers to be on the wrong side of the road and move just before oncoming vehicles approach. I guess I just keep thinking I would see the other bike coming from a long distance away in a head on crash... again this might be my thinking too because in the US you always take note of another bike on the road or anybody type of vehicle approaching that appears to be driving erratically.

It is common practice for riders to ride down the wrong side of a divided road instead of riding down the correct side to find a U-turn location. Effectively, the lanes become bike-wrong way, bike-correct way, cars. The bikes (and sometimes cars) move out of the way of bikes coming in the wrong direction, and the bikes going in the wrong direction usually slow down (or stop) when there is traffic. This even happens on busy Bangkok roads.

Was there any suggestion that the German guy didn't have lights? (although it is usually automatically on these days).

[atyclb]

No...he is not under aged...he is a 60 year old man in a country that is not his birth place...he is meant to come from an educated society...driving drunk in a strange country u get what u deserve...driving drunk anywhere is a real no-no ...surely a man of that age should have more brains or did he leave them behind in Berlin

He's German, and not in his own country so he will get nailed for sure! And yes, say no to drunk driving! Agree wholeheartedly.

I agree 100% that drunk drivers must face the consequences, regardless of nationality.

One burning question in my mind is if the police tested that girl for alcohol/drugs ????? And if they did not, why ?

[RedNIvar]

If you are ever dumb enough to break Thai traffic laws, it is always better to be a 16 year old Thai girl than a 60 year old German man.If you're out drinking never drive. A Cab ride cost as much as another beer...... be smart.

[Nisa]

Was there any suggestion that the German guy didn't have lights? (although it is usually automatically on these days).

I don't think it is automatic on the bikes here. I don't believe I ever see bikes with their lights on during the day. I remember noticing this when I first came here as well as seeing bikes all the time with their lights off at night .. then again see lots of cars with one or both head lights out too at night. I actually think I have read it is against the laws here to drive with headlights on in the daytime. The street bikes I am familiar with (not what we call scooters you see here) have had lights hard wired to always be on for a long time. I can't recall older bikes but recall clearly my 82 or 83 Honda lights were hard wired on. So, it is surprising a safety feature like this being in place at least about 30 years has not spread to bikes here.

[atyclb]

Practicing drunks are the scum of the Earth, but they usually do not think so.

Sounds like this guy was done practicing and has now graduated.. So very sad for all those involved and their families. This guy may have been a great and caring person but now his life is sh@t and somebody else's brother, father and/or son is not coming home again. Alcoholism destroys so many lives and I would guess, based on this story, he was an alcoholic.

Everything you wrote was good-agreed-then you spoilt it by guessing -"based on this story" he was an alcoholic. He is only to be charged with drink drive, He could have had a row with his Lady-got drunk

" Relief drinking", is a pathologic response to stress, and also seen in alcohol(ism) alcohol abuse/dependency. Can one conclude 100% the driver is alcoholic based on this information solely, NO.

Based on the given high % of foreign alcoholics in Pattaya and Thailand, his not having the awareness of being incapacitated to drive, and the description of his degree of intoxication, alcoholism certainly fits in the realm of plausibility.. If you add "relief drinking" as was theorized, it makes the case for alcoholism even stronger.

and sped off==speculation. An ALCOHOLIC.......is down a slightly different road--guessing. and WAS--or IS-he didn,t die. But I agree, if the story is correct (but how all these stories and incidents have a twist in the tail) it sure looks like he had to be in the wrong-----

[metisdead]

A derogatory comment has been removed from view.

[robblok]

Was there any suggestion that the German guy didn't have lights? (although it is usually automatically on these days).

I don't think it is automatic on the bikes here. I don't believe I ever see bikes with their lights on during the day. I remember noticing this when I first came here as well as seeing bikes all the time with their lights off at night .. then again see lots of cars with one or both head lights out too at night. I actually think I have read it is against the laws here to drive with headlights on in the daytime. The street bikes I am familiar with (not what we call scooters you see here) have had lights hard wired to always be on for a long time. I can't recall older bikes but recall clearly my 82 or 83 Honda lights were hard wired on. So, it is surprising a safety feature like this being in place at least about 30 years has not spread to bikes here.

I drive a bike and in both bikes it came on automatic. I almost never see bikes without lights. But im in BKK.

[Thongkorn]

He's German, and not in his own country...... They say drink blurs the mind so maybe he thought he was in Germany so was driving on the correct side..

I agree correct , but two wrongs dont make a right.

[ginjag]

Practicing drunks are the scum of the Earth, but they usually do not think so.

Sounds like this guy was done practicing and has now graduated.. So very sad for all those involved and their families. This guy may have been a great and caring person but now his life is sh@t and somebody else's brother, father and/or son is not coming home again. Alcoholism destroys so many lives and I would guess, based on this story, he was an alcoholic.

Everything you wrote was good-agreed-then you spoilt it by guessing -"based on this story" he was an alcoholic. He is only to be charged with drink drive, He could have had a row with his Lady-got drunk and sped off==speculation. An ALCOHOLIC.......is down a slightly different road--guessing. and WAS--or IS-he didn,t die. But I agree, if the story is correct (but how all these stories and incidents have a twist in the tail) it sure looks like he had to be in the wrong-----

Sorry but I would still speculate that the odds are much greater that he is an alcoholic (based on this report) than this being some one off instance.

However, I will admit that there was really no good reason for me have stated that as even if the odds are more than 50% he is, there is still a good chance he is not.

Whatever did happen will emerge, 1... was he overtaking- over the center line,to collide head on????-or 2..was he riding on the opposite side,, motorbike lane the wrong way, ????? or 3..was he in his own m/cycle lane/side---and the other driver was in the wrong lane, at fault-but normal here,, got killed ,but the German was plastered, so he,s nicked. which was the version ??? if he was stoned, then he will be done, for 1-2 or 3

[Beetlejuice]

I'm with you all the way on this one, neverdie, and I speak from experience.

No worries BJ, I will send out club membership forms, fill out the details, attach your cheque and you little chest plate, arm band and cap will be forwarded to you in the mail

I`ll follow you anytime neverdie, mineleader.

But don`t forget my badge and teeshirt.

[maxman71]

Not that this really has anything to do with the topic...at least not directly...but my Thai family and I went to Jomtien beach on New Years day. Some European looking Farang pulled out from a driveway into the oncoming traffic in front of us not far from the beach. He was riding a motorcycle and he came at least 2 meters out into the oncoming traffic before he was able to stop. Fortunately for him, the traffic was moving slowly, and my Thai son was driving. He is a good driver, his reaction time is fast, and he pays attention....so we were able to swerve and stop in time to avoid hitting the farang guy on that bike. But it was closer than I liked.

I was the front seat passenger, so I had a good view. He was trying to get over a speedbump in the driveway, so he gunned the bike to clear the speedbump...and then lost control of the bike when he cleared the bump. That's why he went out into the street as far as he did.

He was lucky that time. If we had been moving faster, if my Thai son hadn't been watching, or if his reaction time was slower....it could have been much worse.

At a driving safety class one time I heard this slogan, "Before putting your key in the ignition, put your mind into DRIVE."

Well said and wholeheartedly agreed. I drive a subcompact sports wagon here in the LOS, and whenever I get behind the wheel, I force myself to remember I am driving in a foreign country with dodgy law enforcement that typically is tougher on foreigners than locals, as foreigners represent a much better chance for involved parties to line their pockets. I figure if a farang gets into an accident with a Thai, the farang stands a good chance of getting tagged with being at fault regardless of the facts at hand. So I drive cautiously, conservatively and defensively.

[whybother]

Whatever did happen will emerge, 1... was he overtaking- over the center line,to collide head on????-or 2..was he riding on the opposite side,, motorbike lane the wrong way, ????? or 3..was he in his own m/cycle lane/side---and the other driver was in the wrong lane, at fault-but normal here,, got killed ,but the German was plastered, so he,s nicked. which was the version ??? if he was stoned, then he will be done, for 1-2 or 3

From what I understand, it's number 2. A common occurrence here, but given he was drunk, he probably didn't slow down or keep out of the way when the other rider came along.

[ginjag]

Whatever did happen will emerge, 1... was he overtaking- over the center line,to collide head on????-or 2..was he riding on the opposite side,, motorbike lane the wrong way, ????? or 3..was he in his own m/cycle lane/side---and the other driver was in the wrong lane, at fault-but normal here,, got killed ,but the German was plastered, so he,s nicked. which was the version ??? if he was stoned, then he will be done, for 1-2 or 3

From what I understand, it's number 2. A common occurrence here, but given he was drunk, he probably didn't slow down or keep out of the way when the other rider came along.

Thanks whybother, I had the idea is was 2. and agree, vision blurred, reaction time greatly reduced, Difficult to imagine the millions here Thai and farrang-who get into,or on motor vehicles drunk-or near--and attemp to drive. In my village N/E. you see the m/cyclist fall off the bike when they mount it because they are so drunk, amazing.

[Rimmer]

UPDATE

Old Drunk German Motorcyclist Causes Death In Serious Accident

PATTAYA: -- In the early hours of Monday morning an elderly drunk German motorcylist collided with another motorbike resulting in the death of its Thai driver.

Pattaya, 3rd December 2011 [PDN]: At 4.00 am Police Lieutenant General Poompipad Naamputha, was notified about an accident involving 2 motorbikes, killing one person and seriously injuring another. The incident occured at Soi Naklua 6 near the Potisampan Pittiyakarn grade 11 school.

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[RED21]

Where they wearing helmets? I guess the guy who croaked probably didn't...

[moskito]

UPDATE

Old Drunk German Motorcyclist Causes Death In Serious Accident

PATTAYA: -- In the early hours of Monday morning an elderly drunk German motorcylist collided with another motorbike resulting in the death of its Thai driver.

Pattaya, 3rd December 2011 [PDN]: At 4.00 am Police Lieutenant General Poompipad Naamputha, was notified about an accident involving 2 motorbikes, killing one person and seriously injuring another. The incident occured at Soi Naklua 6 near the Potisampan Pittiyakarn grade 11 school.

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

Was it important that he is german?

Just wonder if the bib took him to hospital first or directly in monkeyhouse.

However, when he was drunk he should face a trial. I suggest Khun Abhisit and his bib start asap to force law on roads. We are tired to learn about terrible accidents on a daily basis here in LoS

[JetsetBkk]

<snip>

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

The PDN page doesn't show the story when I view it in Firefox, but it's OK in Internet Explorer.

If PDN don't get their act together (i.e. get some skilled web page programmers), they won't get far in this business.

[Nisa]

Was there any suggestion that the German guy didn't have lights? (although it is usually automatically on these days).

I don't think it is automatic on the bikes here. I don't believe I ever see bikes with their lights on during the day. I remember noticing this when I first came here as well as seeing bikes all the time with their lights off at night .. then again see lots of cars with one or both head lights out too at night. I actually think I have read it is against the laws here to drive with headlights on in the daytime. The street bikes I am familiar with (not what we call scooters you see here) have had lights hard wired to always be on for a long time. I can't recall older bikes but recall clearly my 82 or 83 Honda lights were hard wired on. So, it is surprising a safety feature like this being in place at least about 30 years has not spread to bikes here.

I drive a bike and in both bikes it came on automatic. I almost never see bikes without lights. But im in BKK.

I just stepped out on my balcony (in BKK) and waited for 10 bikes to ride by. Only 1 had its lights on and that one looked like a brand new bike. It would not surprise me if the owners disable this safety feature ... especially the mo-cy taxis.

[submaniac]

I think that that the Thai was either not wearing a helmet or, if he was, only a half helmet. From the damage to the bikes, it does not look like a real "high speed" collision. A true high speed collision would have made the bikes look like they have exploded. The honda waves ain't real "fast bikes" to begin with. The injury came primarily from falling off the bikes. The German survived. I think if the Thai had been wearing a decent full face helmet, he may have too. Of course this is not to condone in any way drunk driving. Rather this is said to the other bikers out there: "wear good gear".

[moskito]

<snip>

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

The PDN page doesn't show the story when I view it in Firefox, but it's OK in Internet Explorer.

If PDN don't get their act together (i.e. get some skilled web page programmers), they won't get far in this business.

Morning JesTer and a happy new year to you.

Just tried it with Opera and Firefox, no problem here. When have you updated your Firefox last? Anyway, I always use Opera, check it out, after a day you will see, things are much easier with a proper Browser ^^

[harrry]

I notice in the photos the all black clothes of the Thai rider. I wonder if the headlight is black too. This in no way condones drunk driviving which needs to be heavily controlled.

[Buchholz]

<snip>

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

The PDN page doesn't show the story when I view it in Firefox, but it's OK in Internet Explorer.

If PDN don't get their act together (i.e. get some skilled web page programmers), they won't get far in this business.

In order to view PDN on Firefox, you have to disable your Ad Blocker.

[Buchholz]

I just stepped out on my balcony (in BKK) and waited for 10 bikes to ride by. Only 1 had its lights on and that one looked like a brand new bike. It would not surprise me if the owners disable this safety feature ... especially the mo-cy taxis.

And why not disable the automatic-on in order to extend the life of the light?

I recently had to replace a burned out bulb on my bike and it cost 21 baht.

Disclaimer: Facetiousness remains intact.

[NoBrainer]

The problem with Firefox on PDN is the AdBlock. Set a rule in your AdBlock not to block ads on PDN (Exclude PDN)and it works fine.

As for the accident it would be usefull to have more details before forming an opinion, Like was the deceased wearing a helmut and was the deceased also under the influence of alchohol or other substances.

The full update on the story is HERE

PATTAYA DAILY NEWS 2011-1-04

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

The PDN page doesn't show the story when I view it in Firefox, but it's OK in Internet Explorer.

If PDN don't get their act together (i.e. get some skilled web page programmers), they won't get far in this business.

[Nisa]

Officials confiscated both bikes and took them for repair before contacting relatives to collect them later.

I assume this is a typo and they took them for further examination and not for repair.

Should we assume the German had no DL since the photo they are using appears to be from his passport.

And what is the point of listing the Lic. # of the bikes? I see news reports do this all the time here. The only time it would seem to be logical is if they wanted the public to be on the lookout for this vehicle such as in a hit and run.

Old Drunk German Motorcyclist Causes Death In Serious Accident

I guess the media doesn't believe in presumed innocence here ,,, but was there a need call him "Old" as opposed to say "60 Years Old" or if they are concerned with space "German 60,"

He may be old to a young person but he is too young to collect social security.

Edited January 4, 2011 by Nisa

[Buchholz]

Should we assume the German had no DL since the photo they are using appears to be from his passport.

With all your other valid points regarding the news reporting, it should be clear that in regards to "assuming" anything, you run a high risk of being incorrect.

p.s. Could you please just use the normal default font that everyone else uses when posting? It detracts from its readability a great deal. Thanks.

Edited January 4, 2011 by Buchholz

[JetsetBkk]

Morning JesTer and a happy new year to you.

Just tried it with Opera and Firefox, no problem here. When have you updated your Firefox last? Anyway, I always use Opera, check it out, after a day you will see, things are much easier with a proper Browser ^^

And a Happy New Year to you too, moskito!

"Proper browser"? Cheeky bugger!

I was thinking it was one of my 94 extensions that was doing it, and it looks like Joh Buchholz has the answer!

Edited January 4, 2011 by JetsetBkk

[JetsetBkk]

In order to view PDN on Firefox, you have to disable your Ad Blocker.

Thanks Buchholz - you are spot on! :jap: (And Nobrainer - but Buch beat you to it!)

And I must apologise to the PDN web programmers because they are so clever that they force people to allow ads in order to view the pages.

Lets hope that doesn't catch on...

Edited January 4, 2011 by JetsetBkk