Thailand, Cambodia Trade Accusations Of Cluster-Bomb Use

[webfact]

Thailand, Cambodia trade accusations of cluster-bomb use

By The Nation

The Army yesterday rejected Cambodian claims that Thai troops used cluster bombs in recent border clashes, saying it was in fact Cambodia that resorted to the controversial weapons.

Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd, Royal Thai Army spokesman, said a Cambodian cluster bomb attack killed Major Thanakorn Poonperm, deputy commander of the Paramilitary Rangers Company 2306.

Thanakorn sustained serious head injuries and was pronounced dead at hospital, Sansern said.

The Cambodians earlier accused Thailand of deploying cluster bombs during the border skirmishes, which began on Friday. Both countries have accused the other of firing first.

Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen on Wednesday described the border clashes as a "real war". "They launched a cluster bomb. Is that a clash?" he was quoted as saying by the Phnom Penh Post.

The claim was echoed by Cambodian army deputy chief General Hing Bunheang and the director-general of the government-run Cambodian Mine Action Centre, Heng Ratana.

However, a foreign expert cast doubts on the Cambodian claims.

Carl Thayer, a professor at the Australian Defence Force Academy, told the Phnom Penh Post, "From 2008 to now, they have always tried to grandstand on this issue … and paint Thailand in the worst possible light, so I would be initially suspicious."

Cluster bombs - also known as cluster munitions and submunitions - are an explosive weapon that can be dropped from the air or launched from the ground. The bomb ejects smaller munitions - clusters of bomblets.

Releasing many bomblets over a wide area, a cluster bomb poses risks to civilians both during and after attacks. During attacks, the weapon is prone to indiscriminate effects, especially in populated areas. Unexploded bomblets can kill or maim civilians long after a conflict has ended, and unexploded submunitions are costly to find and remove.

Thailand and Cambodia are not among the 43 countries that have ratified the Convention on Cluster Munitions, which took effect on August 1, 2010. The convention bans the stockpiling, use and transfer of existing cluster bombs and provides for the clearing up of unexploded munitions.

Many of the world's major military powers including the United States, Russia and China are not signatories to the treaty. These three countries have produced and stockpiled cluster munitions.

-- The Nation 2011-02-11

[siampolee]

Playground duty yesterday.

I was watching a spat develop twixt a small group of 5-6 year old primary children and it drove home to me in no uncertain manner that the behaviour patterns were identical to the behaviour patterns of the idiots involved in the ongoing border spat twixt Thailand and Cambodia.

My dad's bigger than your dad. My dad will beat your dad in a fight. My dad's a police man. My dad's in the army and he's got a gun, he'll shoot your dad. So it went on. "ad infinitum."

Enter the U.N. in the guise of the duty teacher, all told off problem solved all playing together within one minute.

Indeed the wisdom of our children far outweighs the idiotic logic of both the governments and military involved in the current fiasco concerning an Indian temple in Buddhist lands.

[asiawatcher]

No matter who did what first this is a mindless time bomb ticking. Cambodia really has nothing to lose as it lack a great deal of credibility but Thailand stands to lose a lot. You would think that would temper some of the 'negotiations'. Leaving an army to negotiate only ever has one result. Proof of strength over the lesser and then it becomes all out war.

[SomTumTiger]

No matter who did what first this is a mindless time bomb ticking. Cambodia really has nothing to lose as it lack a great deal of credibility but Thailand stands to lose a lot. You would think that would temper some of the 'negotiations'. Leaving an army to negotiate only ever has one result. Proof of strength over the lesser and then it becomes all out war.

That is why painting Cambodia as the innocent victim in this issue is completely disingenuous. Of course both sides bear responsibility. But if you read the comments on this board - Thailand is playing the role of bully, to Cambodia's wimpy kid. Nuts.

[Rhalovely]

No matter who did what first this is a mindless time bomb ticking. Cambodia really has nothing to lose as it lack a great deal of credibility but Thailand stands to lose a lot. You would think that would temper some of the 'negotiations'. Leaving an army to negotiate only ever has one result. Proof of strength over the lesser and then it becomes all out war.

FYI, with Kasit as foreign misniter Thailand already has zero credibility left on the international scene.

[SomTumTiger]

No matter who did what first this is a mindless time bomb ticking. Cambodia really has nothing to lose as it lack a great deal of credibility but Thailand stands to lose a lot. You would think that would temper some of the 'negotiations'. Leaving an army to negotiate only ever has one result. Proof of strength over the lesser and then it becomes all out war.

FYI, with Kasit as foreign misniter Thailand already has zero credibility left on the international scene.

He has more than you do

[Slip]

^^

Stop newbie baiting Tiger!

[SomTumTiger]

^^

Stop newbie baiting Tiger!

Sorry, but its funny to to realize that Kasit has changed so many times. First he was the Yellow "Golden Boy", now he is their worst enemy. Now he is the man with no credibilty, who still manages to be effective in his capicity as FM. He can't negotiate with Cambodia, because....this may come as a shock to you...they don't want to!!! lol

Countries have the obligation to protect their interests. History will judge who is correct. We don't have enough information now to know for sure.

[DP25]

^^

Stop newbie baiting Tiger!

That's no newbie

[londonthai]

"Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd, Royal Thai Army spokesman, said a Cambodian cluster bomb attack killed Major Thanakorn Poonperm, deputy commander of the Paramilitary Rangers Company 2306."

it should be pointed out immediately after it happened, on sunday morning. Collect evidence, bring international journalists, observers and mediators from asean counties and un, publicise internationally.

now, after cambodia raised the issue, thailand doesn't that much credibility, ball is on their pitch and have to defend themselves from the accusations.

still, any of the sides did not sign treaty, so they might have cluster bombs in their arsenal and might be using them.

[WhySoSerious]

With the sad history this region has with this kind of munitions, if being used, it only adds to the insanity of this conflict.

With people still being killed and maimed on a daily basis by Vietnam war era bomblets, one should think that Cambodia and Thailand would be among the first to ratify the Oslo Convention on Cluster Munitions.

So far in this region only Laos has.

Any nation claiming to be or ever hoping to be civilized should sign and ratify the Convention.

[LikeHeat]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

[SomTumTiger]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

I have said that repeatedly. Thaksin's Black Shirts have grenades, and RPG's. I would not put it past them to fire a few off on either side of the border, to escalate tensions. He is determined to cause trouble, any way he can.

[Rhalovely]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

I have said that repeatedly. Thaksin's Black Shirts have grenades, and RPG's. I would not put it past them to fire a few off on either side of the border, to escalate tensions. He is determined to cause trouble, any way he can.

Where have you seen Black Shirts at the border , except in your apparently limitless imagination ?

[tigermonkey]

^^

Stop newbie baiting Tiger!

Sorry, but its funny to to realize that Kasit has changed so many times. First he was the Yellow "Golden Boy", now he is their worst enemy. Now he is the man with no credibilty, who still manages to be effective in his capicity as FM. He can't negotiate with Cambodia, because....this may come as a shock to you...they don't want to!!! lol

Countries have the obligation to protect their interests. History will judge who is correct. We don't have enough information now to know for sure.

" History will judge who is correct. " Quite the contrary ! History has always been rewritten to the benefit of the teller, especially in armed conflicts. This debate could last forever -- only the future debate will be whether Cambodia's history is correct or whether Thailand's history is correct.

[WhySoSerious]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

I have said that repeatedly. Thaksin's Black Shirts have grenades, and RPG's. I would not put it past them to fire a few off on either side of the border, to escalate tensions. He is determined to cause trouble, any way he can.

Nonsense

[BarnicaleBob]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

Speaking of a third party; Why not bring in some Indian troops and give them the whole temple including the gateway on the Thai side. Then they can make it an Indian consulate slash Indian tourist site that can be entered from both sides. That way both sides can set up their tourist concessions on each side of the temple and the Indian government can collect fees for visitors to see the temple their forefathers built. That way everyone gets a piece of the action and the Indians will have the authority to keep the peace.

[Robby nz]

I suspect proof will emerge soon.

These things leave bit of themselves that can be easily identified whether exploded or not.

Any nation claiming to be or ever hoping to be civilized should sign and ratify the Convention.

You realise that amoung others the USA has not signed?

But then you could be right.

[dighambara]

Playground duty yesterday.

I was watching a spat develop twixt a small group of 5-6 year old primary children and it drove home to me in no uncertain manner that the behaviour patterns were identical to the behaviour patterns of the idiots involved in the ongoing border spat twixt Thailand and Cambodia.

My dad's bigger than your dad. My dad will beat your dad in a fight. My dad's a police man. My dad's in the army and he's got a gun, he'll shoot your dad. So it went on. "ad infinitum."

Enter the U.N. in the guise of the duty teacher, all told off problem solved all playing together within one minute.

Indeed the wisdom of our children far outweighs the idiotic logic of both the governments and military involved in the current fiasco concerning an Indian temple in Buddhist lands.

Not an "Indian Temple", a Hindu Temple built by the ancient Khmer. Not "Buddhist lands", because a majority of Buddha's instructions are purposely ignored - #1 being 'make no images', #2 being 'make no temples', #3 'Monks use nothing of this world' (cigarettes, telephones, TV, money)... Then if one bothers to examine most shrines immediately see that they are Hindu shrines and not Buddhist.

YEP, Thailand and Cambodia are about as Buddhist as my Aunt Eileen; drinks, smokes, watches TV, has money...

Edited February 11, 2011 by dighambara

[hanuman1]

I am surprised that nobody is able to think of a third party launching cluster bombs at both Cambodian and Thai troops. Maybe they are both right and neither one fired first. It could be that "someone" is having a good laugh that both countries are blaming the other and ready to start a war, which will not benefit either country.

I have said that repeatedly. Thaksin's Black Shirts have grenades, and RPG's. I would not put it past them to fire a few off on either side of the border, to escalate tensions. He is determined to cause trouble, any way he can.

Oh dear.