Aussie Disability Pensions Stopped

[terrychris]

Sorry to say,all you Australian citizens on Disability pensions for your sore backs,Depression,fatigue,sore necks etc,will be now forced to come back to Australia to be given another medical and possibly work 15 hours a week.

You will be re assessed by a private medical company contracted by Centrelink Australia/Social Security Dept and see if new training can help you work up to 15 hours a week.

The Federal Budget is released tonight in Australia and unless you are a Blind Disability pensioner then you will not be paid if you are overseas,I dont know when this starts.

There will be many Aussie bar owners worried im sure.

I do feel very very sorry for those guy in their 50s who have thai wives and children in Thailand but you will have to come back.and i guess WITH them?

The Govt need to save money as we are accepting 4000 refugees this week,Yes This week alone.

There is light at the end

of the tunnel,in the budget today was a free set top box DVD for every pensioner to be given out this year and i am not joking.

Edited May 10, 2011 by terrychris

[lovelomsak]

Well that isnot good news for a few Aussie I think. Do you think there is any hope that Britain make do the same? We can only hope.

[zzaa09]

Well that isnot good news for a few Aussie I think. Do you think there is any hope that Britain make do the same? We can only hope.

I believe this looks to be growing trend as it applies to those countries in question.

[Godolphin]

I didn't realise you could get an Oz Disability Pension in Thailand.

I think one guy (in the last few years) actually took the government to the High Court in order to receive his entitlements in Thailand. He lost.

There is also an extensive thread on this forum regarding Oz Old Age Pensions and Thai residency -- most don' t receive it.

[Sing_Sling]

The Govt need to save money as we are accepting 4000 refugees this week,Yes This week alone.

I believe you are referring to the 800/4000 swap with Malaysia. If so then the 4000 new refugees will be taken in over the next four years. The background checks on them have been completed by the UNHCR.

Facts are a bummer, aren't they terrychris!

[terrychris]

They must have failed to do background checks in the past obviously.

I doubt any backgrounds checks were done.

Most lose their identification.

Do you work the Govt,I do,I can assure you there is far far more corruption than what you will believe,not only on the Local level but Federal as well.

Australia is becoming like the UK,a shit country.

Anyway this thread is about those on the Disability Support Pension living overseas .

Edited May 10, 2011 by terrychris

[harrry]

People who left before 2004 were not covered by the 13 week changes as they left when they could leave permanently. It is probable that those in that category will retain their status.

[Sing_Sling]

They must have failed to do background checks in the past obviously.

Obviously? How so? Which ones? The 800 or the 4000?

I doubt any backgrounds checks were done.

Your basis for that assumption is???? Do you know what the UNHCR does in those camps?

Most lose their identification.

Do you work the Govt,I do,I can assure you there is far far more corruption than what you will believe,not only on the Local level but Federal as well.

And this has to do with your statement . . . what? Throwing another red herring into the works? Are you a westie?

Australia is becoming like the UK,a shit country.

Really? Don't fret, we have better weather

Anyway this thread is about those on the Disability Support Pension living overseas .

So why did you post your inaccurate statement about 4000 refugees coming to Oz in one month when it is a refugee swap over a period of four years, in the first place?

Facts not a strong point, perhaps?

People who left before 2004 were not covered by the 13 week changes as they left when they could leave permanently. It is probable that those in that category will retain their status.

I think you may be right there, retroactive legislation can always be challenged in the courts, and in cases like this would be by the pensioners groups

[beano2274]

British Disability Allowance can only be received if you are in the UK or some countries, unlucky for some that Thailand is not amongst those listed. However, some people get around this fact and still claim it, I think the Australian Government is trying to save money for those people who really need it and not those who cheat the system.

[harrry]

It appears this topic is misnamed and totally inaccurate.

THe following is from an Australian Minister. I hqave quoted the whole of it as it is of signifigence.

http://www.jennymacklin.fahcsia.gov.au/mediareleases/2011/Pages/b05_10052011.aspx

quote

Releases > 2011

Media Releases

Supporting Australians with disability into work

Date: 10/05/2011

Joint Media Release with:

Senator Chris Evans, Minister for Tertiary Education, Skills, Jobs and Workplace Relations

Senator Jan McLucas, Parliamentary Secretary for Disabilities and Carers

Kate Ellis MP, Minister for Employment Participation

The Gillard Government is improving support for Australians with disability to help them into work where possible, while providing an essential safety net for Australians unable to work.

Reforms in the 2011-12 Budget will:

•Introduce new participation requirements for disability support pensioners under the age of 35 with some capacity to work;

•Fast track new rules that require new disability support pension (DSP) applicants to get employment assistance to try and get back to work before they can apply for DSP;

•Provide more generous rules for existing disability pensioners to encourage them to work more hours; and

•Support employers to take on more disability pensioners through new financial incentives.

In 2009, the Australian Bureau of Statistics found that the workforce participation rate of people with a disability was 54 per cent, compared to 83 per cent for people with no reported disability. Fewer than nine per cent of DSP recipients have income from employment.

The Government believes we can do better than a lifetime spent on income support for Australians who have some capacity to work. That’s why we are taking steps to make it easier for people on disability pensions to get and keep a job.

We know that many people with disability want to work if they can, but that they may need extra support. Employers may also need incentives to encourage them to employ people with disability.

Reforming the disability support pension

Over the last three Budgets, the Government has initiated a series of reforms that are fundamentally overhauling key aspects of the disability support pension.

The Government is developing new DSP Impairment Tables, to better target the DSP towards individuals with genuine needs. These changes, announced in the 2009-10 Budget, will ensure the impairment tables are in line with contemporary medical and rehabilitation practices and modern expectations about functional ability. The tables are used to measure how a person's impairment affects their ability to work. The new tables will be implemented from 1 January 2012.

Once completed in 2012, the Government’s reform program will have fundamentally reshaped many aspects of the disability pension, including:

•Fast tracking claims for manifest and severely disabled applicants so they get support quicker;

•Improving the adequacy of the base pension, especially for singles;

•Increased incentives to give work a try by removing punitive rules that discourage use of disability employment services;

•Removing waiting lists for access to disability employment services by uncapping places; and

•Establishing a new Health Professional Advice Unit within Centrelink to give DSP assessors independent advice on medical issues in DSP assessments.

The 2011-12 Budget will continue these reforms with the introduction of important new requirements to encourage greater engagement in support services by DSP recipients.

More support for disability support pensioners to participate in work

The Government is investing $92.8 million over the next four years in new requirements for disability support pensioners to increase their participation, including $30.4 million in additional employment services for people with disability.

The DSP currently has no ongoing requirements on recipients, and many people are simply left on DSP with no support or encouragement to participate in the economic and social life of the community.

For the first time, from 1 July 2012, DSP recipients under the age of 35 with some capacity to work will be required to attend regular participation interviews to engage with Centrelink to develop participation plans, tailored to their individual circumstances.

Participation plans could involve working with employment services to improve job readiness, searching for employment, undertaking training, volunteering or rehabilitation. These are different from the requirements that apply to other income support recipients, such as jobseekers.

The compulsory participation interviews will also help make sure DSP recipients are connected to other services and supports they need to overcome barriers to participation, such as drug and alcohol rehabilitation, or accommodation support.

Attendance at Centrelink interviews will be compulsory. If someone does not attend an interview Centrelink will contact them to make another interview time. If they do not attend this interview the usual penalties will apply, though Centrelink will make several attempts to contact the person by phone and by mail before this occurs. Participation in activities will be on a voluntary basis.

In recognition of the very low workforce participation of people with mental illness, the Government is also investing $50 million in the budget for new personal helpers and mentors to support DSP and other income support recipients with a mental illness who are engaging with an employment service.

These new participation requirements will apply to existing and new DSP recipients under 35 years of age who are assessed as having a work capacity of at least eight hours a week.

DSP recipients who are manifestly disabled or have a work capacity of zero to seven hours a week, or who work in an Australian Disability Enterprise or the Supported Wage System, will be excluded from the participation requirements. DSP recipients in open employment will not be required to attend regular interviews while they are in employment.

While many come onto the DSP from employment, very few go back to work. The average length of time that DSP recipients are on income support is almost twelve years.

This important reform builds on steps the Government took in the 2008-09 Budget to make it easier for DSP recipients to access support to get and keep a job, by removing the cap on access to disability employment services with a $1.7 billion investment over the contract period. Previously, people with disability had to wait for up to a year to access these services.

Allowing all DSP recipients to work up to 30 hours a week

From 1 July 2012, the Government will also provide greater incentives to work by allowing all DSP recipients to work up to 30 hours a week without their payment being cancelled or suspended. DSP recipients will also be able to receive a part pension while they work, subject to income testing arrangements.

Currently, DSP recipients granted after 11 May 2005 can only work up to 15 hours a week before their payment is suspended or cancelled. DSP recipients granted before this date were ‘grandfathered’ under the Welfare to Work changes and can work up to 30 hours a week before their DSP is suspended or cancelled.

DSP recipients subject to ‘the 15 hour rule’ can find it difficult to find work limited to only 15 hours a week. Many want to test whether they can work more hours but are worried about losing their eligibility for DSP.

This change will remove the disincentive for DSP recipients to work if they are able and will help to address the low workforce participation rate of people with disability.

It will also improve incentives for DSP recipients to work, or to increase their work hours, as they may receive a part pension in addition to employment income subject to the income test.

It is estimated that this change will cost $7.6 million over the forward estimates and will encourage around 4,000 DSP recipients to take up work, and 3,900 recipients who are already employed to work extra hours.

More accurate and efficient Disability Support Pension assessments

The Government is also fast tracking the start of significant reforms to DSP assessments announced in the 2010-11 Budget. These new rules will now apply from 3 September 2011, rather than 1 January 2012.

The new DSP assessment procedure will help people with disabilities return to the workforce by focusing on their ability, rather than their disability.

These reforms will provide faster, more sustainable support for people with severe disabilities, while referring others with the potential to work to employment services including Job Services Australia and Disability Employment Services.

While eligibility for the DSP will not change, applicants will be required to provide sufficient evidence that they are unable to work independently, even with assistance and support.

To satisfy this requirement, most applicants will have to provide evidence that they have been unable to obtain employment through an open employment service or vocational rehabilitation.

Currently, people can apply for DSP without having to demonstrate that they have investigated alternative employment options.

People with severe disability or illness who are clearly unable to work will be fast-tracked to ensure they receive financial support more quickly.

The new start for these reforms will deliver a saving of $49.7 million in addition to $383.4m over four years from 2010-11 to 2013‑14 from the original measure, which was announced in the 2010-11 Budget.

The Government will also trial a new auditing process for DSP assessments, using medical professionals from the health professional advice unit to review the quality and robustness of DSP assessments. This trial will not affect DSP recipients’ qualification for the DSP.

More support for employers

Many employers would be willing to employ someone with disability but aren’t sure about the assistance they could access or may need some financial help to take the first step. Two new wage subsidy programs for employers of job seekers with disability will be introduced in this Budget.

•$94.6 million investment to provide very long term unemployed job seekers with disability participating in the Disability Employment Services and Job Services Australia programs with a new six month wage subsidy worth around $6000.

•$11.3 million investment to provide new wage subsidies of $3,000 to employers who employ people with disability in jobs for at least 15 hours a week for 26 weeks, and a new Supported Wage System Employer Payment.

The subsidies will be available through Disability Employment Services providers and will help employers cover the costs of recruiting and training and will encourage more employers to give people with disability a go.

From 1 July 2012, a new Supported Wage System Employer Payment will also be available to employers who employ people whose work productivity is reduced as a result of their disability.

The $2,000 incentive payment will be available to eligible employers after they have employed a person under the Supported Wage System for a minimum of 15 hours a week, for a period of 26 weeks.

The Supported Wage System Employer Payment is an incentive for employers who employ people with disability who have reduced work productivity and are not registered with an Australian Government employment service provider.

In addition, in 2012-13 the Government will inject $1 million into targeted Disability Employment Broker projects to create new jobs for unemployed people with disability.

The Disability Employment Broker projects will increase awareness of the incentives that are available to employers and build employer confidence in working with people with disability.

People with a disability and their employers deserve access to the best possible employment services. This Government has greatly increased funding to expand and improve disability employment programs. In addition, we will continue to enlist the services of existing expert providers under the Disability Employment Services Employment Support Service that are performing at the highest 4 and 5 Star levels. They will be assured of continued funding through to 2015.

Those that are only performing at average or lower levels will be invited to demonstrate their capacity through a procurement process that will be open to other providers. To support providers in preparing for this transition, the existing contract for providers will be extended by 8 months to conclude in March 2013

The Government is also investing $2.4 million to better support employers and front line employment service staff so they are better equipped to help people with disability, including those with mental illness into employment.

New rules for overseas travel for people with severe disability

The Government also recognises that the DSP is an essential safety net for those who cannot work.

New, more generous rules from 1 July 2012, will allow people receiving DSP who have a permanent disability and no future work capacity, to travel overseas for more than 13 weeks while retaining access to their pension.

In addition, DSP recipients who are severely disabled and are required to accompany a family member who has been posted overseas by their Australian employer will be entitled to continue to receive their pension for the period of the family member’s posting. These pensioners will not be eligible for add-on payments such as the Pension Supplement or Rent Assistance while they are overseas. These changes deliver a net saving of $19.0 million over four years.

Existing portability rules will continue to apply to DSP recipients who may have some ability to work. Other working age payments will not be affected by these changes to portability arrangements.

[Sing_Sling]

It appears this topic is misnamed and totally inaccurate.

Pretty much like everything terrychris posts, it seems.

Thanks, harrry

[Beetlejuice]

If some people no matter which country they decide to Immigrate or move to, have to rely on Government handouts in order to sustain themselves abroad, then they should remain in their home country`s where they can be evaluated at regular periods and insure that these claimants are receiving the appropriate care for the purposes of maintaining good health care and a complete recovery. Also to keep them under supervision in case of any fraudulent claims of benefits.

Why should these people have the advantage of enjoying a chosen lifestyle abroad at the taxpayer’s expense?

If they are assumed to have medical or mental problems then they either should have adequate funds for medical care in the countries they decide to reside in or must remain in the jurisdiction of the authority that provides their welfare payments.

As the wise man says; beggars cant be choosers, especially when someone else is footing the bill.

[Godolphin]

"Why should these people have the advantage of enjoying a chosen lifestyle abroad at the taxpayer’s expense?"

Because the overwhelming majority of them have paid taxes and have contributed to their society and are entitled to their pensions/benefits.

If they want to live overseas that's their business.

Why not just round them up and put them in camps, the lazy spongers, eh?

[KeyserSoze01]

^ I thought that's how Australia came to be in the first place.

[bunple]

Why not just round them up and put them in camps, the lazy spongers, eh?

..yeah, that works for me.

[EvilDrSomkid]

^ I thought that's how Australia came to be in the first place.

touche

[MAJIC]

Well that isnot good news for a few Aussie I think. Do you think there is any hope that Britain make do the same? We can only hope.

They have already started (last year) doing new Medicals for those on Long Term Disability Benefit,I don't know if that includes ExPats or not?

Edited May 11, 2011 by MAJIC

[Beetlejuice]

"Why should these people have the advantage of enjoying a chosen lifestyle abroad at the taxpayer's expense?"

Because the overwhelming majority of them have paid taxes and have contributed to their society and are entitled to their pensions/benefits.

If they want to live overseas that's their business.

Why not just round them up and put them in camps, the lazy spongers, eh?

This has nothing to do with pensions, State or otherwise.

I cannot see how you equate pensions with welfare and sickness benefits?

Pensions are paid for by working and paying in contributions from our wages, by working (as you rightly say), sickness and welfare are paid for by the taxpayer for people that are unable to work for whatever reasons and then become completely supported by the State, meaning us, the taxpayers.

No one is suggesting that someone who is genuinely in need of medical attention and sickness benefits is a lazy sponger.

My point is that those who are living abroad and claiming benefits, not pensions, from the State in their own countries, leaves the system open to abuse and fraudulent claims. Therefore the claimants should be available for regular evaluations and to review their situations.

After all the purpose of these sickness benefits is for the claimants to receive the most appropriate health care under professional supervision regarding they're medical problems and for a quick recovery. It`s meant to be in their best interests. Not for reasons of dragging out their illnesses as long as possible in order so as they can continue a life style living abroad.

Edited May 11, 2011 by Beetlejuice

[Sing_Sling]

My point is that those who are living abroad and claiming benefits, not pensions, from the State in their own countries, leaves the system open to abuse and fraudulent claims. Therefore the claimants should be available for regular evaluations and to review their situations.

After all the purpose of these sickness benefits is for the claimants to receive the most appropriate health care under professional supervision regarding they're medical problems and for a quick recovery. It`s meant to be in their best interests. Not for reasons of dragging out their illnesses as long as possible in order so as they can continue a life style living abroad.

That makes a lot of sense, shame there isn't a repo system on this forum

[chiang mai]

I don't recall the source but I have read somewhere in the past two weeks that the UK is also now ready to stop these payments to overseas residents.

[Penkoprod]

I don't recall the source but I have read somewhere in the past two weeks that the UK is also now ready to stop these payments to overseas residents.

Did the British government EVER paid this kind of payment when people went abroad?

As far as i know, as soon as you set foot outside the UK, (or pretty soon after) your entitlement to befefits of this nature stops

Penkoprod

Edited May 12, 2011 by Penkoprod

[dumball]

chiang mai' timestamp='1305166232' post='4417843']

I don't recall the source but I have read somewhere in the past two weeks that the UK is also now ready to stop these payments to overseas residents.

Did the British government EVER paid this kind of payment when people went abroad?

As far as i know, as soon as you set foot outside the UK, (or pretty soon after) your entitlement to befefits of this nature stops

Penkoprod

I helped a Brit on health disability benefits some 4 years ago , his daughter in law caused a problem with the local council concerning his subsidised apartment , when we went to an ATM to draw his allowance , it was refused , on looking into this , he had been out of the country for quite some time but had failed to notify local council of his where-abouts before he left . On disability a person is allowed to go on vacation for up to 6 weeks maximum but must inform council of their where abouts for that period , failure to do so is automatic stoppage of benefits , e-mails to the appropriate authority did nothing to rescind this decision .

I have read of Brits assisted by a parent who were caught out and they were required to repay the over drawn amounts , just watch it you other reprobates .

[Penkoprod]

I helped a Brit on health disability benefits some 4 years ago , his daughter in law caused a problem with the local council concerning his subsidised apartment , when we went to an ATM to draw his allowance , it was refused , on looking into this , he had been out of the country for quite some time but had failed to notify local council of his where-abouts before he left . On disability a person is allowed to go on vacation for up to 6 weeks maximum but must inform council of their where abouts for that period , failure to do so is automatic stoppage of benefits , e-mails to the appropriate authority did nothing to rescind this decision .

I have read of Brits assisted by a parent who were caught out and they were required to repay the over drawn amounts , just watch it you other reprobates .

Really????

As short a time as six weeks, huh?

That suprises me, TBH

But, on thinking about it, there seems to be different "qualifying" periods for different payments

Six weeks!!!! Jeez !!!!!

Penkoprod

[harrry]

I think people are uncertain about the Australian Pension System. The Constitution gave the requirement for the Federal Government to pay Age and Disability pensions. These were pensions for living for aged people and people unable to work because of long term illness or disability. THe states were responsible for short term payments.

Age and Disability pensions were paid from a special paymnt which was kept in a seperate fund to pay these two benifits. The states at that time collected income tax which the Federal Government was unable to. During the 1939_45 war the federal government as a temporary measure got the states to allow them to collect the income tax as a temporary measure. Having gained possession of hte ball they have consistently refused to give it back.

Subbsequently the Federal Government wanted to gain access to the funds held in the special Pensions account. THey managed to do so but under conditions which required them to maintain the age and disability pensions.

Sickness benifits and short term payments were originally paid by states but eventually most payments become Federal with most services still being provided by the states.

In the last 20 years or so it has been considered that some of the people who received Disability Pensions may be able to enter the workforce given the advantages of technology, accessible buildings and training. It was always recognised that most of the people who are on Pensions will not be able to work as short term invalidity is covered by sickness benifits. There has been a concentrtion on getting younger people the training and rehabilitation that will enable them to work.

Australia is a country settled by migrants, initially from the UK but since the war europe and in recent years asia and africa. It has always recognised that many of these people will when no longer able to be in the Australian workforce may like to return to their original countries and see their extended families and this has been facilitated by the Portability arrangments where the Pensions (not short term benifits) were able to be recieved overseas.

Limitations to this in regard to the Disability Payment were introduced in 2004 where Disability payments were reduced to 24 weeks and later further reduced. People who had left before 2004 were however allowed to remain overseas permanantly.

It appears that the limitation to 13 weeks is to be relaxed in the circumstances and especially older disabled people with severe disabilities are to be allowed to leave for longer.

As the Pensions are considered in Australia to be a right gained by originally the payment opf a levy and now by taxes the Government introduced a requirement of living in Australia for two years before or after recieving pensions for portability. This has caused difficulties to early retirees who come to Thailand and wish to return to Australia just to gain the pension. This part seems unfair although living in Australia for a certain period of their working life wold seem to be reasonable as it is in truth a paid for scheme by people through their lifetimes.

Fortunately the thread is misnamed and false as the changes made are only of beniffit to most of the people on DSP who whave made their lives here and have permanent severe disabilities.

[Sing_Sling]

harrry, a bit off topic but as you seem to be a fountain of knowledge on this sibject; how long must one have worked IN Australia, or paid Tax IN Australia to be eligible for an age-pension?

I'm not yet 50, but just wondering as I have been working overseas for pretty much my entire working life.

Cheers

[samran]

harrry, a bit off topic but as you seem to be a fountain of knowledge on this sibject; how long must one have worked IN Australia, or paid Tax IN Australia to be eligible for an age-pension?

I'm not yet 50, but just wondering as I have been working overseas for pretty much my entire working life.

Cheers

I stand to be corrected, but it has nothing to do with working time in Australia, nor tax paid. It simply comes down to 'time served' ..ie, how long you've been physically resident in Australia.

[Thongkorn]

Well that isnot good news for a few Aussie I think. Do you think there is any hope that Britain make do the same? We can only hope.

A BIG yes , they are starting on the scammers now. most will be called in and given a new medical by independent doctors , Good news for us people who are genuine, but blame the system as much because its to easy to buck.

Edited May 12, 2011 by Thongkorn

[Sing_Sling]

harrry, a bit off topic but as you seem to be a fountain of knowledge on this sibject; how long must one have worked IN Australia, or paid Tax IN Australia to be eligible for an age-pension?

I'm not yet 50, but just wondering as I have been working overseas for pretty much my entire working life.

Cheers

I stand to be corrected, but it has nothing to do with working time in Australia, nor tax paid. It simply comes down to 'time served' ..ie, how long you've been physically resident in Australia.

Oh dear. Umm, any idea what that number would be? My parents traveled for a living and I spent maybe ten years altogether in Oz, from childhood.

[samran]

harrry, a bit off topic but as you seem to be a fountain of knowledge on this sibject; how long must one have worked IN Australia, or paid Tax IN Australia to be eligible for an age-pension?

I'm not yet 50, but just wondering as I have been working overseas for pretty much my entire working life.

Cheers

I stand to be corrected, but it has nothing to do with working time in Australia, nor tax paid. It simply comes down to 'time served' ..ie, how long you've been physically resident in Australia.

Oh dear. Umm, any idea what that number would be? My parents traveled for a living and I spent maybe ten years altogether in Oz, from childhood.

here you go

http://www.centrelink.gov.au/internet/internet.nsf/payments/age_residence.htm

[seriouseats]

There's a bright side for this.. A lot of guys that should not be here(and that we don't want here) are going to be off to aussie or in jail for being drug mules.