Rubber Trees

[cobbler]

Dear everybody.Except cokerdoodledoo

Happier times are here again. ,PM just announced that yang has a guaranteed price of 100 baht per kilo.Thailand has borrowed many billion baht from IMF.So they allocated 15,000,000 baht to guarantee yang to be 100 baht per kilo.Hope you can all understand this.

My wife says it's not sustainable and Thai will have a very big crash in about 3 years,and the PM don't care because her term will be finnished by then.As for now though we should be thankful and let the white gold flow.

Cheers Cobbler

H'mm is this what it's about?

http://breakingimpor...s-at-week-high/

UMMM Mosha,Can you please give us your english version? of this high tec shit waffle.I understand SFA of that.But thanks for it anyway

Cheers Cobbler

[Mosha]

I just saw that they were buying it to resell, possibly hoping they'll make enough to cover their backsides. Personally, I think pigs will fly 555

[cobbler]

Just had on Thai news,.A high ranking government official .He is from a yang group in the south,so he's a big wig.He said 1 of the reasons for thai yang price to be so low is this.The Thai government has taken 5% from Thai rubber exprters to keep for growing new yang for the future(for whom ,who knows?)The exporters have passed this down to the middle man who passed it on to the farmer.So it has cost the farmer 5 baht in the hundred.

If anybody cares ,I thought I'd pass it on.

Cheers Cobbler

[kolohe]

I understand that.. and that is assuming the latest local knowledge is already perfectly optimized. I think we all know how likely that is. After all, over the years they have revised their recommendations at least once.

Earlier in the thread people were discussing various configurations. I simply want to take a poll on what people are using and see how it is working out for them. Are you planted at 7x3 as well?

-k

Hi Kolohe,

Yes we do on our flat land ,on the mountain its more like 6x3 but only to help hold the soil and prevent erosion.,and after seeing people's trees that have been doing this for 2 or more generations .They have tried and seen many different confurations of trees , fertilizer and when to put it on and how and things we as falang can't even think of trying.We come here and chat on a thread with 4 or 6 other people who have been here for 4 or 10 years and think we know more than locals.Maybe it's different in your area.We generally follow there tried and proven ways.6x3 will be fine but at the other end of the trees growth don't expect they will get as big as trees 7x3.We could all be dead by then so don't worry yourself too much.If you are happy with the kilos per rai then that's all that matters.

Cheers Cobbler

I see. I guess 7x3 is not as standardized as I had thought. What is ground composition in your area? What part of Thailand are you located? Our area has some slope but the composition is mostly dirt or dirt mixed in with broken up rocks. It seems to be packed in quite well. We are planted at 7x3 and so far do not have a problem with erosion.

Good news on the coming price increases if that turns out to be true. The House Commander has some skepticism that we'll see much if any of that price increase by the time it gets to us. I hope something changes soon.. these sub-50 prices are a real kick in the shorts.

[Mosha]

My other half syas Yingluck's nickname in the South means something about stealing rubber.

[thaiguzzi]

Yep... going up. Yesterday's government auction (Udon province) we got 51.0 baht per kilo, wet cup rubber.

Regards,

Mike.

[jamescollister]

Yep... going up. Yesterday's government auction (Udon province) we got 51.0 baht per kilo, wet cup rubber.

Regards,

Mike.

Been banned from posting for a few days, but I'm back.

TG was that 51 Baht DRC per kilo, or 51 Baht wet weight and where in Ubon do you sell, Still trying to get a handle on this crepe rubber buying.

On the 5 Baht export tax, it is 5 Baht per kilo not 5%, so no matter how low the price the Government gets the same money.

Trees spacing, it's the canopy that produces the latex so more tree less canopy space per tree. Hard to know if you will get more latex as no plantation is the same, but if the tree has more sunlight on it's leaves that tree can produce more latex. More trees are not always better and more is more work for the tappers and they may get the same latex output per rai. Planting on a hill may change the numbers as the trees are stepped, That of course depends on the orientation to the sun. Jim

[cobbler]

Good to see you back Jim.you have to be a good boy now

My other half syas Yingluck's nickname in the South means something about stealing rubber.

politics Edited July 18, 2012 by cobbler

[cobbler]

I understand that.. and that is assuming the latest local knowledge is already perfectly optimized. I think we all know how likely that is. After all, over the years they have revised their recommendations at least once.

Earlier in the thread people were discussing various configurations. I simply want to take a poll on what people are using and see how it is working out for them. Are you planted at 7x3 as well?

-k

Hi Kolohe,

Yes we do on our flat land ,on the mountain its more like 6x3 but only to help hold the soil and prevent erosion.,and after seeing people's trees that have been doing this for 2 or more generations .They have tried and seen many different confurations of trees , fertilizer and when to put it on and how and things we as falang can't even think of trying.We come here and chat on a thread with 4 or 6 other people who have been here for 4 or 10 years and think we know more than locals.Maybe it's different in your area.We generally follow there tried and proven ways.6x3 will be fine but at the other end of the trees growth don't expect they will get as big as trees 7x3.We could all be dead by then so don't worry yourself too much.If you are happy with the kilos per rai then that's all that matters.

Cheers Cobbler

I see. I guess 7x3 is not as standardized as I had thought. What is ground composition in your area? What part of Thailand are you located? Our area has some slope but the composition is mostly dirt or dirt mixed in with broken up rocks. It seems to be packed in quite well. We are planted at 7x3 and so far do not have a problem with erosion.

Good news on the coming price increases if that turns out to be true. The House Commander has some skepticism that we'll see much if any of that price increase by the time it gets to us. I hope something changes soon.. these sub-50 prices are a real kick in the shorts.

Sorry about that I forgot to mention ,when I said mountain ,I meant 40 degree angleOr is tat 140 degree .Up to 30 degree shouldn't be a problem.Our soil mix is almost like a roadbase. redsoil and gravel mix.So very good drainage.Down side of that is ,it drys out very quickly.We are in southern Prachuap Kirikan.Town is Bangsaphan.So not as wet as at Mosha's area but not bad..

Hope your yang flows down your road and straight into your wallet.

Cheers Cobbler

Edited July 18, 2012 by cobbler

[jamescollister]

Hi all, can someone do me a favor and watch this vid. My signal is just to slow and the net drops out ever few minutes. Even this I have to type in notes and just keep trying to post.

It's a tapping knife and if it looks good I will go to town and watch the vid tomorrow. Thanks Jim

[thaiguzzi]

Jim,

price was for wet cup rubber. Bring it in the day before the auction, left overnight, weighed and paid out the next day. And it's Udon, not Ubon.

Regards,

Mike.

[jamescollister]

Jim,

price was for wet cup rubber. Bring it in the day before the auction, left overnight, weighed and paid out the next day. And it's Udon, not Ubon.

Regards,

Mike.

Thanks for that, seems prices for wet cup are all over the place, it may have to do with how close a crepe factory is, but I am not sure. Last time we sold dripping wet cup got 47 Baht a kilo, but the Gov buyers were paying 53 Baht for dry cup. Much more than 12% water content in the wet cup. More to learn, but it's hard to get true answers around here. Jim

[kolohe]

Jim,

It's a disposable blade setup. They say it lasts 20 days as opposed to 10 days that a regular knife does. It is sharp on both ends allowing you to cut in either direction.

Can't tell you if it's good or not.. It's a promotional video so they're going to try to make it look good. It looks similar to one I saw locally earlier in the year. The one I saw was selling for around 300 baht.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Thaivisa Connect App

Edited July 18, 2012 by kolohe

[jamescollister]

Jim,

It's a disposable blade setup. They say it lasts 20 days as opposed to 10 days that a regular knife does. It is sharp on both ends allowing you to cut in either direction.

Can't tell you if it's good or not.. It's a promotional video so they're going to try to make it look good. It looks similar to one I saw locally earlier in the year. The one I saw was selling for around 300 baht.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Thaivisa Connect App

Thanks for that, will go have a look tomorrow. Tappers spend a lot of time sharpening their knives. most have 2 for a nights tapping. saw that supertab knife, but never got a response from them. Always thought if they can produce razor blades so cheap way not tapping blades the same. Anyway will look into it. Thanks again Jim

[glennb6]

When my rookie tapper couple finished their govt tappers course I bouht them Supertab knives, 300b ea. Looked logical on the utube videos and tried at a local rubber fair. They looked confused and a week later asked that I buy them the standard knives. As they are rookies and wouldn't know the difference it was just another case of 'do what everyone else is' TIT.

DRC kee. Just my 2 cents but this is what I've found so far from buying and selling pickup truck loads of cup to the local factory and knowing the weight we buy at, the weight we bring to the factory, and the net percentage of DRC the factory states the cup rubber contains. Most fresh cup rubber is about 55% drc plus or minus maybe 2%. Say buy 100kg wet, we let it sit for 1-2 days and it looses 10-12% of the water, so now weighs 89kg. Hump that over to the factory and we typically get 62% drc therefore 55kg. Factory pays their quoted price on that number.

Work it backwards of forwards, same same. Work on the weight or the price, same same.

Would seem that the 'auctions' tell farmers to bring their bags in the day before. Bags sit, closed, but water still drains to the bottom of the bag. Proly 8-9% water loss vs 11% sitting opened up for a day. I guess that's partly how they seem to pay more than just cutting the bags open and weighing immediately. Would not surprise me if the scales were, eh, not 100% accurate either, but who knows.

Will know more on crepe I hope within a weeks time.

[chang35baht]

Hi all, can someone do me a favor and watch this vid. My signal is just to slow and the net drops out ever few minutes. Even this I have to type in notes and just keep trying to post.

It's a tapping knife and if it looks good I will go to town and watch the vid tomorrow. Thanks Jim

Hi Jim.

Watched the video. The main premise of this knife is that it cuts a thinner layer when tapping. So as to enable one inch of vertical bark to be tapped 20 times as opposed to say an average of 10 times, but still cutting the latex vessels enough to release the latex. Thus prolonging the tapping life of the section you are cutting.

Will it take off? the "Supertab" looked like it was gonna be the next best thing but it has disappeared into the wilderness as far as I know.

My brother in law ordered one a long time ago and is still waiting.

You still have to have the required skill not to cut too deep into the tree. There was no mention of a limiter, if you like, that prevented that. Which was the basic premise of the Supertab knife as far as I am aware.

There was also no mention of how often you have to renew the blade, what the lifespan of the blade was, etc.

Watch this space.

P.S. there was also mention that this is a 2010 video I think, so if it was gonna be that popular, it would be in all the rubber paraphernalia shops already.

Anyone else had experience of this knife.

Stuart.

[thaiguzzi]

At our wet cup rubber auction, there are anywhere up to 9 buyers bidding (sealed envelopes opened at 2.00pm). they've told me that they always try to work out the price at max 55% of what sheet is going for on the previous day, ie if 1 kg sheet fetches 100 baht, then they'll put a bid in at a max of 55 baht per kg.

Correct, bags are left overnight, and a good amount of water is lost overnight, this sorts out the punters who really stick the old formic levels right up. Sell on the gate; weighed and paid immediately, but the buyers are not daft hence prices are as much as 10 baht down. Who wants to buy water?

The auction weighing is done in full view of the punters, the scales are zeroed and checked regularly, i've even checked them myself, i weigh the same as on my bathroom scales !

Glenn are you saying it's no difference selling dry or wet cup ? I still have not had time to check this new factory out locally yet, that buy all forms inc dry DRC cup. Will report back once i've visited.

Regards,

Mike.

[jamescollister]

Thanks all for the reports on the Vid, managed to get to go watch it, Don't know why I bother. Asked the wife about it, blades, cost too much. How much do they cost, answer don't know. Well if you don't know, how do you know they cost too much, answer, everyone know they cost too much.

It never ends, last year the tappers were complaining that they had to wait their turn to get on the mixing tables and then on to the kneading machine. They were right topped the 3000 kilos one month. This year I bought a 2nd kneading machine and wood etc for 2 more mixing tables. The new machine, slightly bigger then the old one still sits were I put it and the wood for the tables just lays there. It will lay there until I go and organize them to do the work. Yet it is no skin off my teeth if they have to wait 1 or 2 hours for their turn. Logic defeats me. Jim

[kolohe]

Jim,

I feel your pain... I truly do.

[glennb6]

Mike, no, not saying no dif between wet and dry. Wife is taking peoples reasonably freshly cut wet cup rubber in bags and paying right away, but at a lower price than the 'auction' which sits the bags at least over night. Probably nets out almost the same water weight vs price.

glenn

[glennb6]

ps, mike, post or email me the contact info on the new factory and any relevant pricing.

glenn

[Mosha]

Thanks all for the reports on the Vid, managed to get to go watch it, Don't know why I bother. Asked the wife about it, blades, cost too much. How much do they cost, answer don't know. Well if you don't know, how do you know they cost too much, answer, everyone know they cost too much.

It never ends, last year the tappers were complaining that they had to wait their turn to get on the mixing tables and then on to the kneading machine. They were right topped the 3000 kilos one month. This year I bought a 2nd kneading machine and wood etc for 2 more mixing tables. The new machine, slightly bigger then the old one still sits were I put it and the wood for the tables just lays there. It will lay there until I go and organize them to do the work. Yet it is no skin off my teeth if they have to wait 1 or 2 hours for their turn. Logic defeats me. Jim

Erm, is it ok to say This is Thailand at this point. Sorry Jim, I know the head banging wall is calling.

[thaiguzzi]

Glenn,

roger, will do. I am interested if it is worth selling dry rather than wet cup. Not interested in sheet/mat for another coupla years yet.

regards,

Mike.

[jamescollister]

Thanks all for the reports on the Vid, managed to get to go watch it, Don't know why I bother. Asked the wife about it, blades, cost too much. How much do they cost, answer don't know. Well if you don't know, how do you know they cost too much, answer, everyone know they cost too much.

It never ends, last year the tappers were complaining that they had to wait their turn to get on the mixing tables and then on to the kneading machine. They were right topped the 3000 kilos one month. This year I bought a 2nd kneading machine and wood etc for 2 more mixing tables. The new machine, slightly bigger then the old one still sits were I put it and the wood for the tables just lays there. It will lay there until I go and organize them to do the work. Yet it is no skin off my teeth if they have to wait 1 or 2 hours for their turn. Logic defeats me. Jim

Erm, is it ok to say This is Thailand at this point. Sorry Jim, I know the head banging wall is calling.

There are a many a tree that have my head imprinted in them.Jim Edited July 19, 2012 by jamescollister

[David006]

Thanks all for the reports on the Vid, managed to get to go watch it, Don't know why I bother. Asked the wife about it, blades, cost too much. How much do they cost, answer don't know. Well if you don't know, how do you know they cost too much, answer, everyone know they cost too much.

It never ends, last year the tappers were complaining that they had to wait their turn to get on the mixing tables and then on to the kneading machine. They were right topped the 3000 kilos one month. This year I bought a 2nd kneading machine and wood etc for 2 more mixing tables. The new machine, slightly bigger then the old one still sits were I put it and the wood for the tables just lays there. It will lay there until I go and organize them to do the work. Yet it is no skin off my teeth if they have to wait 1 or 2 hours for their turn. Logic defeats me. Jim

Erm, is it ok to say This is Thailand at this point. Sorry Jim, I know the head banging wall is calling.

There are a many a tree that have my head imprinted in them.Jim

oh dear...glad you all have the same issues...there is certainly a feeling among our wives and GFs that we are actually as stupid as we look....lol

What is with this comforting statement... " everybody have same problem and do same" whenever there is an issue........bugger everybody else this is our farm! " "how to do ....dear... go drink beer ....you get mad too much..." Thank goodness for beer and fags I say.........

Back to knives...seems we are forever buying new knives "these better steel from truck chassis"...whatever...wifey has hers sharpened every day after one use on the approx 650 trees she cuts, think our cutters do the same on the rest of the farm....guess that is why the cutting edges get thin and snap at the ends?

I also inquired about those new knives by email...no response.

Another rainy day in paradise.....

[jamescollister]

Thanks all for the reports on the Vid, managed to get to go watch it, Don't know why I bother. Asked the wife about it, blades, cost too much. How much do they cost, answer don't know. Well if you don't know, how do you know they cost too much, answer, everyone know they cost too much.

It never ends, last year the tappers were complaining that they had to wait their turn to get on the mixing tables and then on to the kneading machine. They were right topped the 3000 kilos one month. This year I bought a 2nd kneading machine and wood etc for 2 more mixing tables. The new machine, slightly bigger then the old one still sits were I put it and the wood for the tables just lays there. It will lay there until I go and organize them to do the work. Yet it is no skin off my teeth if they have to wait 1 or 2 hours for their turn. Logic defeats me. Jim

Erm, is it ok to say This is Thailand at this point. Sorry Jim, I know the head banging wall is calling.

There are a many a tree that have my head imprinted in them.Jim

On the tapping knife front, showed the foreman the Vid. Smart guy, speaks English, 2 years at Uni. Tells me it's not very good. He then goes into his room and brings one out, still in the packet, never opened. I ask if it's still in the packet how do you know it's no good. Well it can't be any good as no one uses them. Back to the headbutting tree. Jim

[Mosha]

^ 555

[jamescollister]

Here's another wierd Thai way, have a family living at the rubber factory. Cute, smart girl and a good tapper to boot, her husband and brother, all tappers. Her father lives there as well ,as the alleged caretaker, 3,000 Baht a month. Now I have said to the wife that I am not happy, as the father does FA. His best effort was to burn off some grass killing a few coconui trees that I had planted. Anyway wife has let it go, but about 10 mins ago I say what's planned for tomorrow. She says we are going to the factory to fire those workers, why I say, father's a lazy SOB, but the others are good tappers. Told them to get wood and cut the grass yesterday, they haven't, so their out. More to it than I am being told of course, not theft, but some face thing. Now I will be looking for more tappers, but we may not have to look hard as the other family from the south is still looking at returning home. Nothing is ever as it seems here. Jim

[cobbler]

Here's another wierd Thai way, have a family living at the rubber factory. Cute, smart girl and a good tapper to boot, her husband and brother, all tappers. Her father lives there as well ,as the alleged caretaker, 3,000 Baht a month. Now I have said to the wife that I am not happy, as the father does FA. His best effort was to burn off some grass killing a few coconui trees that I had planted. Anyway wife has let it go, but about 10 mins ago I say what's planned for tomorrow. She says we are going to the factory to fire those workers, why I say, father's a lazy SOB, but the others are good tappers. Told them to get wood and cut the grass yesterday, they haven't, so their out. More to it than I am being told of course, not theft, but some face thing. Now I will be looking for more tappers, but we may not have to look hard as the other family from the south is still looking at returning home. Nothing is ever as it seems here. Jim

Hi Jim,Are you saying ''the workers that just arrived last month,are already going to go back down south.Not staying with you.

[jamescollister]

Here's another wierd Thai way, have a family living at the rubber factory. Cute, smart girl and a good tapper to boot, her husband and brother, all tappers. Her father lives there as well ,as the alleged caretaker, 3,000 Baht a month. Now I have said to the wife that I am not happy, as the father does FA. His best effort was to burn off some grass killing a few coconui trees that I had planted. Anyway wife has let it go, but about 10 mins ago I say what's planned for tomorrow. She says we are going to the factory to fire those workers, why I say, father's a lazy SOB, but the others are good tappers. Told them to get wood and cut the grass yesterday, they haven't, so their out. More to it than I am being told of course, not theft, but some face thing. Now I will be looking for more tappers, but we may not have to look hard as the other family from the south is still looking at returning home. Nothing is ever as it seems here. Jim

Hi Jim,Are you saying ''the workers that just arrived last month,are already going to go back down south.Not staying with you.

No theses have been here for over a year now. I will be told the truth when the reason no longer matters. It will have something to do with the girl, very cute and smart, maybe just tried to be a little too smart. Wife is the boss and the help is supposed to do as told. New family is waiting for the phone call to start. Jim