Thai Students Intelligence Quotient (IQ) Below Global Average

[JohnAllan]

Meaningless twaddle. No mention of sample sizes or standard errors on the figures. And no authority has an IQ of 130 being at genius level. Hollingworth, for example, uses an IQ of 180 and above for genius.

As for not more than 2% having IQs of less than 70, also wrong. IQ is defined as having a standard deviation of 15 (or 16 in some versions of the test). 70 is two standard deviations away from 100, so approximately 2.5% of subjects will have an IQ of less than 70 (and 2.5% have an IQ above 130).

Of Course you are correct and 180+ is Genius for foreigners however that does also explain why 130 is genius for the locals, indeed there would be so few genuinely at that level they probably should lower it a bit more !! 55555

140 is supposedly genius level . . .

[evanson]

Thai children's average intelligence quotient (IQ) is just 98.59,

[unquote]

I would suggest 'Thai children's IQ' be substituted for broccoli.

Edited July 8, 2011 by evanson

[Steely Dan]

I stand squarely behind my assertion that any factor that prevents rational questioning or debate is not going to be helpful in developing people's minds. This may not be a problem if the sacred cow in question is a peripheral part of the culture not stymying scientific research or literary expression. If however total unquestioning submission to a religion or doctrine is going to hold people back, of course it is! Yes you will get scientists who have faith, but they are a minority according to sundry sources I could cross reference from Dawkins' book the God delusion.

As for my comments being subjective, well put it this way, as a bellweather of achievement look at nobel prizes and their distribution amongst religions/nationalities and draw your own conclusions. Alas, sacred cows are protected by law so that reason doesn't even get past first base in discussing them.

Edited July 8, 2011 by Scott
religious material edited out

[Thaddeus]

It's not that Thai's are stupid, it's that they are not educated. IQ measures what you know, not what your innate intelligence is. This just shows how terrible the Thai education system is..

IQ is not a measure of knowledge. It tests your ability for logic and problem solving.

You can get a Doctorate regurgitating the knowledge of others, and still be as dim as a brothel lamp.

[Deeral]

Anyone who knows anything about IQ will tell you that tests are simply a waste of time - in essence you can't measure IQ because firstly you need to define it - and that can't be done.

[Crushdepth]

All it means is the education system sucks more in some places. Is this news? It's got nothing to do with intelligence.

(You stupid boneheads).

[Scott]

Numerous posts with references to religion have been removed and a number of others have been edited.

The discussion is about IQ. Unnecessarily negative remarks about religion are off-topic.

Please stick to the topic of the OP.

[sunanta]

This stuff gets recycled every few years by the Thai media, and previous posters have highlighted the sort of nonsense it is and the kinds of questions one must ask about e.g. test administration and conditions.

The national mean score of about 99 is well within the normal range for a country that does not suffer exceptional poverty, poor health and social distress (e.g. war, violence). If scores are lower in regions that do have these features that is quite understandable. 88.07 does seem rather low, but Narathiwat has multiple problems. Likewise average scores a bit higher than 100 may be acceptable in prosperous areas. However, to me - no expert - a mean score of 108 (Nonthaburi) does seem rather high. The sample population may have been skewed.

Narathiwat has the lowest scores because they have killed all of the teachers...nobody will go down there to work..its there bed now let them lay in it..

[atyclb]

....

As for not more than 2% having IQs of less than 70, also wrong. IQ is defined as having a standard deviation of 15 (or 16 in some versions of the test). 70 is two standard deviations away from 100, so approximately 2.5% of subjects will have an IQ of less than 70 (and 2.5% have an IQ above 130).

No, you are wrong.

While it is theoretically true that, if IQ scores were normally distributed, there would be just over 2% of the population with scores of 70 or less on a test with a mean =100 and a standard deviation of 15, in reality there is always a hump in the lower end of the IQ frequency distribution leading to a greater than expected number of individuals with IQs less than 70. The reason for this is the multitude of genetic, congenital and environmental factors which impair cognitive functioning.

DNPB0...my..hat..is...off...to...you....(space..bar...on..keyboard..not..working..sorry...for..dots)..nice..to...see..high..level...thinking..here...I'm...sure...many...will....be....happy...knowing..there...will...always....be...a...hump.....in...the....lower...iQ...(LOL)

[geriatrickid]

That new princess is from South Africa... if the Thais paid more attention, maybe they could stop asking me how it is possible to be from South Africa if I am white , it drives me insane.

They learn nothing about the world?

Is she a Zulu princess or a Xhosa princess? What skjin whitening cream do you use to get white? One of my friends who is an accounting manager uses the stuff and between you and me, it doesn't work, although he spends a small fortune on these potions.

Now some may say my comments are ignorant, perhaps indicative of a low IQ, but if one considers that the comments are made in relation to known activities or existing realities, they really are not so ignorant. IQs are also a relative measure.

[VictorOne]

Like all other stats generated in the realm several web sites would suggest that the figures quoted in this thread are way off the mark.

Thai's are shown to have an average IQ of 91.

I am surprised from my daily encounters that they are over 50

[atyclb]

I would like to see the IQ of foreigners residing and visiting in Thailand measured.

I suspect it would make for an interesting comparison.

Ridicule is usually a sign of low intelligence.

I agree with this... it is also a marker of low self esteem.

The need to voice it can be due to insecurity, but awareness is not.

[atyclb]

Cannot believe that this discredited IQ stuff is being trotted out again. Ever since Eysenck, the cultural bias of these so called tests has been well established. For example, native americans, australian aboriginals and the san people all end up classified as moderaterly retarded. Having dealt with two of these groups, be assured they are at least as intelligent as the git quoted in the article. Rural people are dumber than city, black than white, etc etc. What rubbish.

And how about his recommendation ... give them love, etc. and increase their IQ. Does this mean that if youlove your intellectually disabled child more they will improve or that they are disabled because you did not love them enough. What a twit!

We can see who the cretin is here - another idiot Thai academic. Gawd they're hopeless!

LOVE is not a bad start

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Nolan_%28author%29

Nolan's life story and works have been referenced to in several musical works. Rock band U2, whose members attended school with Nolan, wrote their song "Miracle Drug" (from How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb) about him.^[11]

Bono said of Nolan:

“ We all went to the same school and just as we were leaving, a fellow called Christopher Nolan arrived. He had been deprived of oxygen for two hours when he was born, so he was paraplegic. But his mother believed he could understand what was going on and used to teach him at home. Eventually, they discovered a drug that allowed him to move one muscle in his neck. So they attached this unicorn device to his forehead and he learned to type. And out of him came all these poems that he'd been storing up in his head. Then he put out a collection called Dam-Burst of Dreams, which won a load of awards and he went off to university and became a genius. All because of a mother's love and a medical breakthrough.

Nolan’s autobiography Under the Eye of the Clock (published 1987), won the Whitbread Award and was named Book of the Year. Although it’s an autobiography it is narrated by a fictional character named Joseph Meehan who details Nolan’s life as a third-person biography. The book reveals the deep relationship between Nolan and his mother, whom he calls Nora. Under the Eye of the Clock shows how Nolan’s parents engaged him in conversation and outdoor activities like hiking and horseback riding. Under the Eye of the Clock was a best seller in Britain and the United States. Nolan’s writing style is often compared to James Joyce, and Dylan Thomas. Critics also point out Nolan’s distinct writing style omits articles and uses participle construction other than relative clauses.^[6]

[Bagwan]

Is cunning taken into consideration? I have seen many cunning stunts since I arrived here many years ago.

And I've seen many queer old deans late at night along Beach Road.

[roamer]

Is cunning taken into consideration? I have seen many cunning stunts since I arrived here many years ago.

When I read the bit about cunning stunts I thought the mods were not doing their jobs allowing such language, then I remembered I'm dyslexic

[Xangsamhua]

The quality level of Thai education should not be a factor in determining IQ, unless children are not exercising their literacy, numeracy, discriminatory and predictive abilities at all. Thais have a very high rate of literacy, so if the test is a valid one, the mean should be close to 100 (as it is nationally) and the score range following a bell curve. Significant factors such as poor nutrition, general health, social and personal distress will impact on results, as will, perhaps, some general cultural dissonance with the IQ testing process and expectations (e.g. memorization and repetition, a feature of Po Noh schooling in Narathiwat, is not tested).

I'm sorry? A high rate of literacy? Where did you get that gem from? If, by literacy, you mean reading ability, the majority of Thais read way under the global average number of books annually - less than one a year, I believe, but could be mistaken - but do read a very high number of comics.

http://www.unicef.org/infobycountry/Thailand_statistics.html#77

Literacy rates for Thailand (ages 15-24) - 98% for both males and females.You're talking about reading habits, not literacy.

Here are some statistics about US reading habits:

1/3 of high school graduates never read another book for the rest of their lives.

42 percent of college graduates never read another book after college.

80 percent of U.S. families did not buy or read a book last year.

70 percent of U.S. adults have not been in a bookstore in the last five years.

http://www.humorwriters.org/startlingstats.html

Most Westerners I know seem to read only escapist fiction unless they're doing formal study.

[hellodolly]

It's common knowledge that the Thai education system is messed up. Parents and teachers lose face if students fail. Students who are aware that they can't fail don't try. Thai teachers are paid a pittance so they work accordingly and the best brains go elsewhere. Parents pay fees and it's a done deal. Schools have deals with Universities to supply them with 'x' number of students each year and they give them the required grades to go there. Everyone's happy as students are ushered the education system. The whole system needs reform. Will it happen? Do the current government want a population who can reason, read media IN ENGLISH, make informed decisions, and question their policies? Sadly, the answer is no.

Maybe if they would take the pressure of having to learn English off of the kids they could learn better. What possible use is it to speak English when you are spending your whole life working in the fields. Like it or not we need the people to do that.

A friend of mine married a Gal who had a little boy being raised by his grand parents in a village in Issan.

Now that the mother is married the boy has come to live with her and her husband. The kid is about 6. My friend has a hard time getting him to go to school he is used to making up his own mind if he wants to go to school. Needles to say he is a little behind the students here in Chiang Mai and my friend is working very hard to get him to go to school and help him to catch up. Not that he is that far behind them here.

Can you imagine the score he would have in 7 years.

[Scott]

The statistics on books is interesting, but may not be representative of much. I know a great many people who read for professional growth. Trade journals etc.

Regarding reading habits between Westerners and people in Asia, I usually see Westerners with a book while riding on buses and at the beach. I seldom see a local doing that.

I'm not sure that what adults do or read is related to students' IQs.

[Macmundi]

Smart kids are rare in Thailand because parents of smart Thais have already left Thailand one generation ago. Modern nations have offered citizenship to skilled migrants long ago so that these people will help develop their country. Thailand had none of these migration policies before. Those who are eligible for citizenship is focused solely on wealth.

But don't be discouraged because Thailand is still bountiful in her good looking citizens. 'Maybe a bit on the slow side', but you don't need to retread tires if you have the looks.

[Richb2004v2]

The statistics on books is interesting, but may not be representative of much. I know a great many people who read for professional growth. Trade journals etc.

Regarding reading habits between Westerners and people in Asia, I usually see Westerners with a book while riding on buses and at the beach. I seldom see a local doing that.

I'm not sure that what adults do or read is related to students' IQs.

That's not true. I saw a Thai reading a book only last week. An actual book, I think.

[khaowong1]

i think that the only thing that this research has proved is that in thailand the educatio system is awful, particulary in the rural areas of the country, i am really sorry for those poor thai kids

I think this pretty much says it all. The Thai education system sucks. But is the govt. going to blame it on teachers or the education system, of course not. Let's blame it on something else. Maybe nutrition, that's it. It's lack of proper nutrition.

[ronz28]

Low IQs are in many cases caused by high childhood fevers, etc. from parasitic diseases. If you want to improve a population's IQ take immediate action to educate parents and provide support to keep childhood fevers below an acceptable level by preventing and improving recovery from parasitic diseases.

Bill and Melinda Gates foundation and Norway are spending billions in Africa and South Asia to provide education, mosquito nets, vaccinations etc. to children in countries where they operate. They are also pouring money into research to find an effective vaccine for Dengue fever.

http://flowingdata.c...-annual-letter/

http://www.docstoc.c...II-dengue-fever

http://www.finfacts....chive=2&num=244

http://rspb.royalsoc...14-8fbe9130c975

Edited July 8, 2011 by ronz28

[TAWP]

It's not that Thai's are stupid, it's that they are not educated. IQ measures what you know, not what your innate intelligence is. This just shows how terrible the Thai education system is..

No, it doesn't. Your post shows us how terrible your general knowledge of the subject is however...

[anterian]

I live in Nonthaburi, if these kids are the most intelligent the God help the rest of the country.

[NanaFoods]

I would like to see the IQ of foreigners residing and visiting in Thailand measured.

I suspect it would make for an interesting comparison.

The IQ of foreigners residing in Thailand is irrelevant. The op is about the youth of Thailand, the future workers and lifeblood of the nation who are sadly being failed by what appears to be an incompetant leadership.

I believe it is. I find it disturbing that some people of limited intelligence see fit to comment on Thai's intellectual capabilities. However, it goes beyond that. How pray tell can someone who has never taken a statistics course and has no understanding of a data distribution comment on the results with self appointed authority? There havebeen a few perceptive comments made on the actual subject at hand. Concepts such as standard deviations and the distribution of the IQs themselves have eluded some commentators, while others have identified the key aspects in respect to to accomodating the IQs within the educational system. Some people were quite right to inquire on the methodology. What if the test over emphasized visual tests? In a nation where there is a serious problem with the diagnosis and treatment of vision defects in the young population, there could have been an impact. One study does not give a definitive answer. Once there are a few studies using alternative reliable tests that show a similar result, then more specific conclusions can be drawn. All that one has here is one study. My concern is that a study of this kind which can be taken out of context creates more problems.

In respect to your comment about the future workers, do you really think that a greater number of higher IQs really makes a difference? Does the typical Thai banking clerk need more than an IQ of 95 to function effectively? What's the difference if that bank clerk scores 102 on the IQ test? Do you think that this will somehow magically translate into improved service or better account management? What of the majority of the work force found in the agricultural sector? What good would an IQ of 130 be for a field hand or the person cleaning shrimp? The question thsat should have been asked is if the "super achievers" found at the far end of the distribution were actually achieving. A large part of the population in a general IQ population study has attained a level of success if one measures it in terms of self sufficiency, happiness and integrated functioning. In any population analysis of this kind, one must determine what the base value is to reach the ability to function in the society. The relationship between IQ and functioning in the society is not addressed.

One cannot assume normal distribution without having the full data set. Assuming a normal bell curve distribution is fallacy. We do not know kurtosis, skewness, incidence of "outliers", whether the data has bi-modal distribution, etc,

geriatrickid is, in a roundabout way, referring to the chi-square (significance) of the data set, as well as the validity of the test. Indeed, some IQ tests may show skewed results if certain questions are posed in a cultural context that is not matched to the culture of a population being tested. If this is a standard UN test, that could be a factor.

However, if I understand the OP correctly, the test was administered to students only, which normally one would think should represent a subset of the higher-end of the curve

[Berkshire]

Since this thread is about IQ's, I was a little curious to find out what countries had the highest average score. I think you'd be surprised to know who's number one:

http://www.iq-tests-...by_country.html

So where does your country rank?

[Berkshire]

Since this thread is about IQ's, I was a little curious to find out what countries had the highest average score. I think you'd be surprised to know who's number one:

http://www.iq-tests-...by_country.html

So where does your country rank?

Hmmm, yet another list. This one contradicts the other by a large margin. Different matrices, perhaps. I'm going to be sorry I brought this up...

http://www.eutimes.n.../iq-by-country/

[ronz28]

Since this thread is about IQ's, I was a little curious to find out what countries had the highest average score. I think you'd be surprised to know who's number one:

http://www.iq-tests-...by_country.html

So where does your country rank?

Yes, I don't buy that. The chart here is more believable:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations

[Berkshire]

Since this thread is about IQ's, I was a little curious to find out what countries had the highest average score. I think you'd be surprised to know who's number one:

http://www.iq-tests-...by_country.html

So where does your country rank?

Hmmm, yet another list. This one contradicts the other by a large margin. Different matrices, perhaps. I'm going to be sorry I brought this up...

http://www.eutimes.n.../iq-by-country/

And yet another....http://www.photius.com/rankings/national_iq_scores_country_ranks.html

The only consistency appears to be Equatorial Guinea at dead last. Make up your own minds.

[HakimKlunker]

In my life I met lots of agreeable persons with 'low' IQ.

And I have seen 'intelligent' bastards, too.

As my neighbour I would prefer the kind and friendly idiot.

(Well: that's what my neighbour says... )