6 Wheel 10 Ton Truck

[johnbits]

I have my own business which I run over the internet, I wouldnt need a work permit for that, ?

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

[soundman]

Hauling 10 tonnes up and down a gradient might be a little excessive, even for large format 6 wheel truck (maximum back axle load is 9 tonnes). 10 Wheel truck would be better.

Bottom end large 6 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 500 - 600k Baht.

Bottom end 10 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 600 - 750k Baht,

Good condition 10 wheel with reasonable engine life, working dumper or good condition tray would be somewhere in the 850k - 1.1m region.

[Spoonman]

I have my own business which I run over the internet, I wouldnt need a work permit for that, ?

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

[transam]

I have my own business which I run over the internet, I wouldnt need a work permit for that, ?

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

My understanding was that if you are doing something in LOS to make money you must have a work permit and pay tax, can any one clarify.

[WarpSpeed]

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

My understanding was that if you are doing something in LOS to make money you must have a work permit and pay tax, can any one clarify.

Pretty sure there's threads here in the business forum that address this and not the OP's thread in the motorforum so chalk up another reason that answers your question posed in the other thread.. Look who the primary antagonists and topic-jackers are? Continually.............................................

Edited August 31, 2011 by WarpSpeed

[transam]

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

My understanding was that if you are doing something in LOS to make money you must have a work permit and pay tax, can any one clarify.

Pretty sure there's threads here in the business forum that address this and not the OP's thread in the motorforum so chalk up another reason that answers your question posed in the other thread.. Look who the primary antagonists and topic-jackers are? Continually.............................................

Sorry Warpy. we are having a discussion here that really didn't include you, so please butt out, there's a good chap.

[WarpSpeed]

Oooppss!! Once again the forum equivalent of hooliganism.. But it somehow concerns you does it, his Internet business?? Never knew you worked for the Thai government too ... JFFR ANY topic posted here that I wish to comment on, includes me..

Edited August 31, 2011 by WarpSpeed

[johnbits]

I have my own business which I run over the internet, I wouldnt need a work permit for that, ?

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

Generally speaking the USA IRS does not define trading as working nor any profits as income. One can get it defined that way, but they resist doing that, because it is generlly more favorable it you are defined as a professional trader. Such as losses I might have this year can be used to recover taxes I paid last year on gains. Complicated to track, but those are the rules.

How do you define working? Not a spurious question really. Most investment income is considered passive inome. Trading isn't really passive, but it is difficult to catogrize the difference, and not really relevant.

Same question for living in? I know some expats that have houses in Thailaid, the USA and Japan, where are they really living?

No doubt for many the answers to those questions are obvious, but for a few it isn't well defined. BUT for my purposes, it doesn't matter.

The important aspect to this is that the Thai Gov does not consider trading to be a business they are trying to tax or where you need a work permit. Everything I have read says NO work permit needed. Not sure about your concern about this?

Right now I am living in the USA, I was gonig to either live or spend a lot of time in Thailnad next year. My preference would be to stay in thailnad for 6 months, the USA for 6 months, give or take a few months, but it all depends on how things play out. Sort of avoid winter in the USA, avoid the rainy really hot season in Thailand. I have staying in Thailand during the rainy season in the past, it isn't as bad as it sounds, but the USA is a lot better climate wise during that period of time.

I was also working on a business in Thailand that would need a truck as a part of the business, but it isn't a trucking business. One could always rent, but that doesn't work out well. This business is already running, but it only recently got started. I haven't put any money into it as yet. If I wanted a work permit I could get it through that business, I know about the capital requirements and the 4 Thai employees requirement, but I wasn't sure it is worth it to get a work permit. I saw some info about the costs to the Thai company, I was gonig to get that better defined.

My questions were really just about trucks, not about work permits.

[johnbits]

Hauling 10 tonnes up and down a gradient might be a little excessive, even for large format 6 wheel truck (maximum back axle load is 9 tonnes). 10 Wheel truck would be better.

Bottom end large 6 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 500 - 600k Baht.

Bottom end 10 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 600 - 750k Baht,

Good condition 10 wheel with reasonable engine life, working dumper or good condition tray would be somewhere in the 850k - 1.1m region.

Soundman, thanks, I was thinking a 6 wheel truck would need lower gearing for gradients, that should add about 10,000 baht to put in. I believe you are right, typically they wouldn't be used continiously for lot of mountain roads. Thus the need for lower gearing.

10 tonnes would be the max load.

I was thinking not a dumper, because of the expense and availablilty of cheap labor.

I was thinking 100 Hp and up. Maybe a 6 wheel non-dumber would range between bottom of 250,000 baht to 500,000 baht? Were your numbers for a dumber or a non-dumber.

[WarpSpeed]

Yeah, you do need a work permit for that as well.

Spoon, I am a day trader in the markets, and manage some longer term personal investments. It is not really defined as a business.

Are you working ?

Are you living in Thailand?

Generally speaking the USA IRS does not define trading as working nor any profits as income. One can get it defined that way, but they resist doing that, because it is generlly more favorable it you are defined as a professional trader. Such as losses I might have this year can be used to recover taxes I paid last year on gains. Complicated to track, but those are the rules.

How do you define working? Not a spurious question really. Most investment income is considered passive inome. Trading isn't really passive, but it is difficult to catogrize the difference, and not really relevant.

Same question for living in? I know some expats that have houses in Thailaid, the USA and Japan, where are they really living?

No doubt for many the answers to those questions are obvious, but for a few it isn't well defined. BUT for my purposes, it doesn't matter.

The important aspect to this is that the Thai Gov does not consider trading to be a business they are trying to tax or where you need a work permit. Everything I have read says NO work permit needed. Not sure about your concern about this?

Right now I am living in the USA, I was gonig to either live or spend a lot of time in Thailnad next year. My preference would be to stay in thailnad for 6 months, the USA for 6 months, give or take a few months, but it all depends on how things play out. Sort of avoid winter in the USA, avoid the rainy really hot season in Thailand. I have staying in Thailand during the rainy season in the past, it isn't as bad as it sounds, but the USA is a lot better climate wise during that period of time.

I was also working on a business in Thailand that would need a truck as a part of the business, but it isn't a trucking business. One could always rent, but that doesn't work out well. This business is already running, but it only recently got started. I haven't put any money into it as yet. If I wanted a work permit I could get it through that business, I know about the capital requirements and the 4 Thai employees requirement, but I wasn't sure it is worth it to get a work permit. I saw some info about the costs to the Thai company, I was gonig to get that better defined.

My questions were really just about trucks, not about work permits.

Being American you can apply under the Treaty of Amity, check it out, it offers many priviledges other options don't such as 100% percent ownership without a Thai partner and most considerations a Thai business enjoys..

[johnbits]

btw, Likely the reason trading desn't need a work permit is that trading is taxed in the country where your account is registered. If I were to trade the thai market, regardless of where I live, a report would go to the US IRS about every trade I did. And i would have to file something about it. Not that I trade the Thai market, only time I wanted to tale a long position in the Thai market was duriing the red shirt protests, I thought it likely to not have a medium term impact on the Thai economy. Long term for me is greater than 3 years, and I just don't need to attempt to predict that far ahead.

Note that in the past options were not tracked, though they were required to be reported by the individual, they depended on the honesty of the individal and audits they can do if they want to. Though with modern computer technology, even options are going to be reported on a trade by trade basis to the Gov, depending again on where your account is domiciled.

But this doesn;'t have a lot to do with the motor forum.

[johnbits]

Being American you can apply under the Treaty of Amity, check it out, it offers many priviledges other options don't such as 100% percent ownership without a Thai partner and most considerations a Thai business enjoys..

Ok, I had thought that the Treaty of Amity was never actually used in practice. But when the time comes, I will check into it.

[soundman]

Hauling 10 tonnes up and down a gradient might be a little excessive, even for large format 6 wheel truck (maximum back axle load is 9 tonnes). 10 Wheel truck would be better.

Bottom end large 6 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 500 - 600k Baht.

Bottom end 10 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 600 - 750k Baht,

Good condition 10 wheel with reasonable engine life, working dumper or good condition tray would be somewhere in the 850k - 1.1m region.

Soundman, thanks, I was thinking a 6 wheel truck would need lower gearing for gradients, that should add about 10,000 baht to put in. I believe you are right, typically they wouldn't be used continiously for lot of mountain roads. Thus the need for lower gearing.

10 tonnes would be the max load.

I was thinking not a dumper, because of the expense and availablilty of cheap labor.

I was thinking 100 Hp and up. Maybe a 6 wheel non-dumber would range between bottom of 250,000 baht to 500,000 baht? Were your numbers for a dumber or a non-dumber.

15 - 20 year old 6 wheel mid size (5 tonner - 130HP) with 12 - 14 foot tray can be had in good working order for about 300 - 400k Baht. Anything less than 300k will be a craps shoot, however, bear in mind that parts for hino's and izuzus are readily available and quite cheap.

Gearing in these models would not really be an issue. First three gears are quite low.

...................................

Everybody else - back on topic please. WP issues can be discussed in another topic, or in the jobs business or visa/wp's forum.

[johnbits]

15 - 20 year old 6 wheel mid size (5 tonner - 130HP) with 12 - 14 foot tray can be had in good working order for about 300 - 400k Baht. Anything less than 300k will be a craps shoot, however, bear in mind that parts for hino's and izuzus are readily available and quite cheap.

Gearing in these models would not really be an issue. First three gears are quite low.

...................................

Everybody else - back on topic please. WP issues can be discussed in another topic, or in the jobs business or visa/wp's forum.

Soundman, sounds like you know trucking. My reasons for a 6 wheel was that the truck would be used off road in steeper dirt roads, and the hauling distance wouldn't be all that far, about 60 Km.

A 10 wheel might be OK, this was being investigated. I believe the reason for the added lower gear and added springs was to enable the truck to carry at least 10 tons.

I am not sure about the current rate for renting a truck, I was told 60B per ton but that seemed too cheap, so I was going to check. The real problem with renting is not the cost, it is availablity.

In your experience, is the trucking business seasonal? Meaning farmers tend to all want to ship around the same time, so I was assuming in a rural area trucking was seasonal.

thanks

[johnbits]

Hauling 10 tonnes up and down a gradient might be a little excessive, even for large format 6 wheel truck (maximum back axle load is 9 tonnes). 10 Wheel truck would be better.

Bottom end large 6 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 500 - 600k Baht.

Bottom end 10 wheel truck in reasonable running order - around 600 - 750k Baht,

Good condition 10 wheel with reasonable engine life, working dumper or good condition tray would be somewhere in the 850k - 1.1m region.

soundman, I was looking at a FM17 Hino, which is a 10 wheel dumper. Do you know much about that model?

It seems to run between 490,000 - 650,000 which is less than your 600K bottom end price, perhaps it is older than what you are considering.

From what I can tell, a 10 wheel truck that is less than 10 years old is likely to be dump truck, they didn't make many in that size that weren't. Is that what you think? If one wanted to buy a 10 wheel truck without a dump feature, it would likley be 20 years old.

So what is "reasonable engine life". something like 100K miles? How do I tell how much life is left, and what happens to the engine, does it get rebuilt? Rebuild engine, cost maybe 100,000 baht, I have no idea, just a guess.

1 million baht, getting to what I think of as real money.

[WarpSpeed]

A properly cared for diesel will have a lot more life then just a 100k that's just about break in mileage for them. Rebuild here is probably not the first best option though it depends, but there is such a glut of good used diesels available when the time comes a nice replacement would be easily enough had for reasonable prices.

[wandrinstar]

A properly cared for diesel will have a lot more life then just a 100k that's just about break in mileage for them. Rebuild here is probably not the first best option though it depends, but there is such a glut of good used diesels available when the time comes a nice replacement would be easily enough had for reasonable prices.

Try Insuring one as a Ferang Owner Driver. Dont listen to the " My Mate done it Lot ", thats all cobblers .Phone youreself , nice n clean , no Thais or Fiddles involved the answers is NO.

[Flatouthruthefog]

Being American you can apply under the Treaty of Amity, check it out, it offers many priviledges other options don't such as 100% percent ownership without a Thai partner and most considerations a Thai business enjoys..

Ok, I had thought that the Treaty of Amity was never actually used in practice. But when the time comes, I will check into it.

Seldom have I seen a thread which went so far 'out around the outer ring road' to avoid your original question. Which (look back folks) was all about cost.

The way to get the best value truck of any kind, 2, 3 axle or more, is to come to Chiang Mai, get onto the Superhighway at the Fincome crossroads heading south, and onto the service road (some odd people call it 'frontage road') near Lanna Hospital.

There you will see some truck cabs facing the road. They are but the icing on the cake. Their narrow entry takes you to a whole world of truck parts, so many of which can be assembled to your own spec. There is a warehouse the size of 1.5 tennis courts occupied only with diesel engines, all of which have the correct number plates attached, really. It's a Thai truckers' Aladdins Cave.

Happy hunting!

To drive occasionally yourself (especially when empty) should be no problem at all. Just don't use the loaded word 'volunteer'.

[transam]

Being American you can apply under the Treaty of Amity, check it out, it offers many priviledges other options don't such as 100% percent ownership without a Thai partner and most considerations a Thai business enjoys..

Ok, I had thought that the Treaty of Amity was never actually used in practice. But when the time comes, I will check into it.

Seldom have I seen a thread which went so far 'out around the outer ring road' to avoid your original question. Which (look back folks) was all about cost.

The way to get the best value truck of any kind, 2, 3 axle or more, is to come to Chiang Mai, get onto the Superhighway at the Fincome crossroads heading south, and onto the service road (some odd people call it 'frontage road') near Lanna Hospital.

There you will see some truck cabs facing the road. They are but the icing on the cake. Their narrow entry takes you to a whole world of truck parts, so many of which can be assembled to your own spec. There is a warehouse the size of 1.5 tennis courts occupied only with diesel engines, all of which have the correct number plates attached, really. It's a Thai truckers' Aladdins Cave.

Happy hunting!

To drive occasionally yourself (especially when empty) should be no problem at all. Just don't use the loaded word 'volunteer'.

Good post and very helpful.

[keith101]

ts true you cant drive but i paid 590.000 for one a year ago,in my wifes name and driven by the sisters husband.doesnt make much money but keeps the family happy and no i dont take any money from it just doesnt make enough.

[Big Gary]

if its got small plates (Tabien Leck), 2 letters first, green on white, plates for private use, farang can drive it

if its got large plates, starting with numbers, for commercial use, farang can not drive it and workpermit can not be issued for this work

But can a foreigner actually get a license to drive it regardless of what plates are on it ?

Some DLT say foreigner, only bike and car/van/pickup

Some grant foreigners every DL class

One example would be a camper/mobile home. 6 wheeler/7 ton, Tabien Leck, usually blue on white as seats 10

Yep, l think the OP was asking about a 6 wheeler for business purposes so he could drive it. Think you will agree the answer is no. Might upset Warps but NOBODY buys a 6 wheeler for family days out.

I am in Australia for a few months and doing a trip around the coast in a Camper Van (Winnebago). For a few years now myself and wife have thought about if we could buy an old Bus(eg Little Green Bus) and convert it to a Camper. That is not a problem but can I drive it?????. I have got Thai Drivers Licence,Tabian Barn and Retirement Visa. I hold a Road Train licence here(multi trailers) Can anyone help.

[transam]

Think your OK for Non money making driving. Katabeachbum will give you the correct info.

Think the vehicle will have to be re-registered for different use.

Have fun.

[WarpSpeed]

Shouldn't be a problem, I actually saw a foreign family driving a small older model Winne down in Phuket a few years ago on the by pass road and I just had to make U turn and catch up with them it was so novel to see.. Iv'e also seen an older American model Airstream travel trailer recently about 30' parked on the side in a lot off 7 just south of Srinigarinda heading towards the airport several months ago..

[johnbits]

ts true you cant drive but i paid 590.000 for one a year ago,in my wifes name and driven by the sisters husband.doesnt make much money but keeps the family happy and no i dont take any money from it just doesnt make enough.

what sort of truck did you buy for 590,000 baht? 10 wheel dumber, how old and what model? Wanted to compare prices, maybe a newer / new 6 wheel truck?

[katabeachbum]

I am in Australia for a few months and doing a trip around the coast in a Camper Van (Winnebago). For a few years now myself and wife have thought about if we could buy an old Bus(eg Little Green Bus) and convert it to a Camper. That is not a problem but can I drive it?????. I have got Thai Drivers Licence,Tabian Barn and Retirement Visa. I hold a Road Train licence here(multi trailers) Can anyone help.

Your local DLT can provide you more exact info, but I believe the limit for car licence is 4 wheels, any size, so in reality max 5 ton

[melvinmelvin]

if its got small plates (Tabien Leck), 2 letters first, green on white, plates for private use, farang can drive it

if its got large plates, starting with numbers, for commercial use, farang can not drive it and workpermit can not be issued for this work

But can a foreigner actually get a license to drive it regardless of what plates are on it ?

Some DLT say foreigner, only bike and car/van/pickup

Some grant foreigners every DL class

One example would be a camper/mobile home. 6 wheeler/7 ton, Tabien Leck, usually blue on white as seats 10

Would you know of some concrete DLTs that grant 6/10-wheel license to foreigners?

(both my national and my international license covers such vehicles)

I did some enquiries last July or so. DLT in Udon and in Pattaya said roughly the same.

Initially they said foreigner can get bike and car, thats it. Giving license for >4 wheels would be against the law.

Digging further the following surfaced:

Yes, can give such license to foreigner, but:

Must be able to speak, read and write Thai.

Must first pass a written test without any assistance from translator/interpreter.

If passing the written test: Then a short/quick oral test and following that; a practical driving test.

Does this match the experience others have with such licenses?