Chalerm Vows To Help Get Fugitive Ex-PM Thaksin Pardoned

[MILT]

"Pheu Thai MP Apiwan Wiriyachai said he did not agree with the guilty verdict against Thaksin, adding that since the land deal had been cancelled, it should be the grounds for another judicial review and that the former PM should be acquitted as the deal never took place".

OK!!!! So if a burglar breaks into a house, gets disturbed and escapes from the house only to be caught red-handed with a jemmy and leaving muddy footprints matching his shoes on the living room carpet then he is not guilty of an offence because he didn't steal anything!!!

Thaksin logic epitomised!!!:jap:

What a joker - just like all the red shirts and those red shirt supporters on this forum!!!!!!

I am pounding on my table

[jayboy]

"Those who find Thaksin unacceptable are a minority in my opinion".

Funniest statement I've seen on TV for many a while!!! Ha Ha Ha!!! Thank you for making me laugh!!

I'm sure nobody would begrudge you a laugh.But since parties allied with Thaksin have just cruised to an easy election victory following a mandate from the Thai people, it's not entirely clear what you find so amusing.

[MILT]

Justice Ministry Spokesman Theerachai Wutthitham countered the remarks of Democrat MP for Songkhla Thaworn Senniam on the red-shirt group's signature campaign to seek a royal pardon for ousted former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The first option is, according to Article 259 of Criminal Procedure Act, the convicted submits a request to the Justice Minister himself, as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request.

Everything written after the 2nd comma above, ("as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request"), is pure fabrication.

The Article doesn't say that all.

It states only what was written before the 2nd comma above.

.

So who is right here, a thaivisa member or the Thailand Justice spokesman....

Come on Thai visa member of course. It is just a rand shackled shame that we members aren't ruining I mean running this country. All the experts you will ever need on any topic are right here on Tada Thaivisa

[Pi Sek]

Justice Ministry Spokesman Theerachai Wutthitham countered the remarks of Democrat MP for Songkhla Thaworn Senniam on the red-shirt group's signature campaign to seek a royal pardon for ousted former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The first option is, according to Article 259 of Criminal Procedure Act, the convicted submits a request to the Justice Minister himself, as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request.

Everything written after the 2nd comma above, ("as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request"), is pure fabrication.

The Article doesn't say that all.

It states only what was written before the 2nd comma above.

So who is right here, a thaivisa member or the Thailand Justice spokesman....

Well, the best way to find your answer is to look it up in the Criminal Code, as I'm sure (I hope) you recognise that neither the Thaivisa poster nor the Justice Ministry Spokesman are unbiased. I'm not unbiased either - but I agree with Buchholz after reading Article 259.

My Thai-English version (2009 update) costs 120 Baht and is available at most bookstores, but can be ordered at soutpaisallaw.com.

[Pi Sek]

"Those who find Thaksin unacceptable are a minority in my opinion".

Funniest statement I've seen on TV for many a while!!! Ha Ha Ha!!! Thank you for making me laugh!!

I'm sure nobody would begrudge you a laugh.But since parties allied with Thaksin have just cruised to an easy election victory following a mandate from the Thai people, it's not entirely clear what you find so amusing.

I'm guessing that Sichonsteve lives in Sichon (Nakhon Sri Thammarat). His views very much reflect local opinion there!

A very nice place, by the way, apart from the one-or-two Nakhon city gangster hideouts which are away from the lovely beaches they have down there. Still, I think Khanom is nicer!

[animatic]

If only this were JUST unseemly.

Yes, no doubt he returns, but for how long,

and what he can control is another question entirely.

An old adage is keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

If they are with in reach you can reach out easier....

HOW is yet another question....

[rixalex]

I'm happy to deal with/discuss other possible crimes by Thaksin or by others, on threads pertinent to those matters, of which there are many. The only way in which they would be pertinent to this thread, is if the individuals concerned had fled after being tried and convicted for those alleged crimes. Until that happens, these matters serve no purpose being included in this discussion, besides offering relief to those who find the actual topic too hard to deal with.

I believe this thread is about Chalerm and Thaksin's pardon.I understand why you want to limit discussion but the matters raised (including the potential serious criminal charges against Thaksin's main accusers) are relevant.

To be more accurate, they aren't just potentially serious criminal charges, they are potentially serious criminal charges that haven't even being made yet. Bringing these yet to be brought, speculative charges, into the discussion, is very clearly a crude and blatant diversionary tactic. My responding shows it is working. Congratulations.

[Pi Sek]

Well, the best way to find your answer is to look it up in the Criminal Code, as I'm sure (I hope) you recognise that neither the Thaivisa poster nor the Justice Ministry Spokesman are unbiased. I'm not unbiased either - but I agree with Buchholz after reading Article 259.

My Thai-English version (2009 update) costs 120 Baht and is available at most bookstores, but can be ordered at soutpaisallaw.com.

Actually, to be 100% honest and in the interests of full disclosure, article 259 is probably referred to because it's the first article in Division 7 (Pardon, Commutation and Reduction of Punishment). Article 260 is more relevant, because it shows the process entailed - a pardon must be submitted to the Chief Gaoler or Gaol Governor, before being passed to the Ministry of Justice, who will petition it to the Highest Institution.

That is why fugitives cannot be legally granted a pardon.

The Council of Ministers may also submit a recommendation to the Highest Institution if they see fit (as per the 1974 amendment). This is Article 261-bis.

Either way, legally the pardon cannot be granted to Thaksin as the correct legal procedures have not been taken, regardless of how many Red Shirts signed a petition or regardless of Chalerm's manipulation of a quite clearly written Law. And, according to Thai Law, the only way a pardon can be granted is by Royal Decree.

[rixalex]

"Those who find Thaksin unacceptable are a minority in my opinion".

Funniest statement I've seen on TV for many a while!!! Ha Ha Ha!!! Thank you for making me laugh!!

I'm sure nobody would begrudge you a laugh.But since parties allied with Thaksin have just cruised to an easy election victory following a mandate from the Thai people, it's not entirely clear what you find so amusing.

They won a majority of house seats by around 3%. 3% that they may well not have garnered, had they not run a campaign that included a number of blatant bare-faced lies. Doesn't read to me as being a particularly "easy cruise".

And off we sail on another off-topic subject....

[SICHONSTEVE]

"Those who find Thaksin unacceptable are a minority in my opinion".

Funniest statement I've seen on TV for many a while!!! Ha Ha Ha!!! Thank you for making me laugh!!

I'm sure nobody would begrudge you a laugh.But since parties allied with Thaksin have just cruised to an easy election victory following a mandate from the Thai people, it's not entirely clear what you find so amusing.

What I REALLY will find amusing is when the Thai economy goes belly-up on account of the irresponsibility of Pheu Thai with their unimplementable policies designed to hoodwink the unsuspecting and gullible poor people, solely, it seems apparent now, in getting elected to obtain Thaksin's pardon (which I doubt will happen anyway)!!!

They will surely regret casting their vote for this joke of a government that seems incapable of putting their right foot in front of their left foot. Do you really think that what they have produced in less than a fortnight will make the plight of the poor farmers better???? I bet they DIDN'T vote to get Thaksin back from exile . So much for that lieing Yingluck. Do you remember her repeatedly saying "getting an amnesty for Thaksin is not a major priority for this government" prior to the election?? Just why did she say this - because the Democrats were coming back into the battle because the obtaining of Thaksin's perceived amnesty being their sole reason for getting into power was starting to lose them their support and they quickly back-tracked from this stance.

I can see them imploding at some stage and I hope it is soon!! as getting a Democrat government back running the country instead of a bunch of unworthy moronic imbeciles is what is needed before too much damage is done!!:jap:

[SICHONSTEVE]

"Those who find Thaksin unacceptable are a minority in my opinion".

Funniest statement I've seen on TV for many a while!!! Ha Ha Ha!!! Thank you for making me laugh!!

I'm sure nobody would begrudge you a laugh.But since parties allied with Thaksin have just cruised to an easy election victory following a mandate from the Thai people, it's not entirely clear what you find so amusing.

I'm guessing that Sichonsteve lives in Sichon (Nakhon Sri Thammarat). His views very much reflect local opinion there!

A very nice place, by the way, apart from the one-or-two Nakhon city gangster hideouts which are away from the lovely beaches they have down there. Still, I think Khanom is nicer!

Nice bit of detective work there!!! The reason that local opinion here in sunny Sichon reflect these views is because the education is far superior to that offered up in the North and North East of the country and the people can see what Pheu Thai REALLY stand for!!!!

I would disagree with your take that Khanom is nicer than Sichon (I may be biased of course) and it is unfortunate that, as you point out, there are many hitmen in this province, for some inexplicable reason.

I'm guessing that you live in the North or North East and support Thaksin because your wife's family does - understandable I suppose (I could be wrong of course and maybe you are just a misguided individual). However, I AM surprised that YOU have been taken in by all of the false-hoods surrounding Yingluck and Pheu Thai and hope that you recover from this unfortunate attack of "lack of common sense" and hope you get better soon!! My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round to realising common sense soon!!!!.

Edited September 9, 2011 by SICHONSTEVE

[rubl]

Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung yesterday vowed to rectify the conviction of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, though he said he was not quite what action he would take.

So it's only clear to him a conviction needs to be rectified, but still studying how.

"This is a big issue and I need time to think things through," he said.

I forgot how many times Pheu Thai people have said 'it's not urgent, not a priority'. Still wondering when the next step will be, 'big issue', 'need time to think'. K. Chalerm must be a busy man, many policies still not completely detailed, to be implemented one-of-these-days,months,years.

Chalerm explained that Thaksin had not been found guilty of corruption and that the Supreme Court's verdict was about the violation of constitutional edicts.

So if the sentencing is about violation of constitutional edicts, why would the conviction need to be rectified? Is two years not enough in k. Chalerm's eyes?

However, he did not clarify how he deduced that the verdict was related to constitution-related offences when the judicial decision was based on conflict-of-interest provisions prescribed by the anti-graft law.

In due time, too early, wait a bit, still trying to come with better sounding excuses.

In 2008, Thaksin was sentenced to two years in jail in relation to the Ratchadaphisek land deal involving his now ex-wife Pojaman na Pombejra, he said.

At least one thing we agree upon.

The Civil Court later cancelled this deal, hence Thaksin's guilty verdict in connection with the deal deserved a new judicial review, he said. However, Chalerm admitted that he was uncertain if the high court would allow a fresh inquiry.

Faulty logic. As a RESULT of the court's conviction of k. thaksin sentencing him to two years jail the land deal was cancelled. Both go together, no need for a review because of that.

Reacting to Democrat MP Thaworn Senneam's fight against Thaksin being pardoned, he said he still believed a fugitive was entitled to clemency without having to serve time in jail.

True, shoot on sight is a no-no.

Even though a classified report compiled by the Interior Ministry under Thaksin's rule said a fugitive could not be granted pardon, Chalerm insisted that this was not applicable to the former premier.

A latin phrase comes to mind 'primus inter pares', or in plain English 'some pigs are more equal than others'

Past reviews on pardon and amnesty should be viewed on a case-by-case basis because no blanket standard can be applicable to every case, he said.

A framework law which indicates the bounderies and base conditions, like 'time in jail', 'remorse', 'severity level', etc., etc.

He reiterated that the 2007 and 2010 decrees on pardon did not specify that clemency was limited only to inmates, and blamed the previous Democrat-led government for putting the pardon petition on hold. He said the red-shirt movement had submitted a petition seeking Thaksin's pardon three years ago, but nothing had been done about it.

The previous government may not have treated the pardon request with the same level of 'non-importance' as the current government, but checkng more than 3 million signatures takes time. Just finished I read with about 2 million found acceptable. The next step is being taken. How could the previous government do anything with the signature checking still in progress?

He reminded the Democrats that this government had not initiated the pardon review, but insisted that it would ensure that all legal principles are complied with when deciding its next move on the Thaksin case.

All legal principles applied, don't know how yet and which, but we will find a way.

Chalerm also dismissed allegations that the government was following Thaksin's instructions to bring about his pardon.

Of course not, only anti-Thaksinista would think so

Edited September 9, 2011 by rubl

[rixalex]

I'm guessing that Sichonsteve lives in Sichon (Nakhon Sri Thammarat). His views very much reflect local opinion there!

A very nice place, by the way, apart from the one-or-two Nakhon city gangster hideouts which are away from the lovely beaches they have down there. Still, I think Khanom is nicer!

Nice bit of detective work there!!! The reason that local opinion here in sunny Sichon reflect these views is because the education is far superior to that offered up in the North and North East of the country and the people can see what Pheu Thai REALLY stand for!!!!

I would disagree with your take that Khanom is nicer than Sichon (I may be biased of course) and it is unfortunate that, as you point out, there are many hitmen in this province, for some inexplicable reason.

I'm guessing that you live in the North or North East and support Thaksin because your wife's family does - understandable I suppose (I could be wrong of course and maybe you are just a misguided individual). However, I AM surprised that YOU have been taken in by all of the false-hoods surrounding Yingluck and Pheu Thai and hope that you recover from this unfortunate attack of "lack of common sense" and hope you get better soon!! My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round to realising common sense soon!!!!.

You really should get to know someone's opinion before you attack it. You are way way off the mark regarding Pi Sek.

[Pi Sek]

I'm guessing that Sichonsteve lives in Sichon (Nakhon Sri Thammarat). His views very much reflect local opinion there!

A very nice place, by the way, apart from the one-or-two Nakhon city gangster hideouts which are away from the lovely beaches they have down there. Still, I think Khanom is nicer!

Nice bit of detective work there!!! The reason that local opinion here in sunny Sichon reflect these views is because the education is far superior to that offered up in the North and North East of the country and the people can see what Pheu Thai REALLY stand for!!!!

I would disagree with your take that Khanom is nicer than Sichon (I may be biased of course) and it is unfortunate that, as you point out, there are many hitmen in this province, for some inexplicable reason.

I'm guessing that you live in the North or North East and support Thaksin because your wife's family does - understandable I suppose (I could be wrong of course and maybe you are just a misguided individual). However, I AM surprised that YOU have been taken in by all of the false-hoods surrounding Yingluck and Pheu Thai and hope that you recover from this unfortunate attack of "lack of common sense" and hope you get better soon!! My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round soon!!!!.

You could not have got it more wrong, my friend! I am Surat through and through, but I don't mind Nakhon Sri

And, as stated above, I am...

someone vehemently opposed to Thaksin (and has publicly acted on it), and who has been left literally scarred for life from last year's "struggle for democracy" when I and several others tried to voice our minority opinion in the spirit of democracy.

What I don't agree with is that this is amusing at all, and that's why I've put myself in harm's way in the past in the interests of civic duty and piety. And taken in by Yinglak's falsehoods, I absolutely have not been! Although I do hope they have put in the necessary economic controls to make sure their recent oil subsidies work, because that was basically a good policy.

I do think that you put your views too strongly. You can't convince anyone of anything by trying to shout them down, which is the one sympathy I have with the Red Shirt movement's cause (which I do not consider to be a cause of either Peua Thai or the UDD faction of the Red Shirt movement). For example, comments like "My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round soon" do not facilitate national reconciliation, regardless of whether or not you have a point

[SICHONSTEVE]

I'm guessing that Sichonsteve lives in Sichon (Nakhon Sri Thammarat). His views very much reflect local opinion there!

A very nice place, by the way, apart from the one-or-two Nakhon city gangster hideouts which are away from the lovely beaches they have down there. Still, I think Khanom is nicer!

Nice bit of detective work there!!! The reason that local opinion here in sunny Sichon reflect these views is because the education is far superior to that offered up in the North and North East of the country and the people can see what Pheu Thai REALLY stand for!!!!

I would disagree with your take that Khanom is nicer than Sichon (I may be biased of course) and it is unfortunate that, as you point out, there are many hitmen in this province, for some inexplicable reason.

I'm guessing that you live in the North or North East and support Thaksin because your wife's family does - understandable I suppose (I could be wrong of course and maybe you are just a misguided individual). However, I AM surprised that YOU have been taken in by all of the false-hoods surrounding Yingluck and Pheu Thai and hope that you recover from this unfortunate attack of "lack of common sense" and hope you get better soon!! My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round to realising common sense soon!!!!.

You really should get to know someone's opinion before you attack it. You are way way off the mark regarding Pi Sek.

OK, I accept your comments!!! I wrote this too hastily and can see that he was not criticising me whatsoever on re-reading his posting and I have almost certainly got "the wrong end of the stick" regards his character and opinions (no doubt) from what you are implying being the case.

I withdraw my comments about Pi sek without reservation and apologise for my unwarranted and unnecesary attack on him :jap: .

I still think that Sichon is nicer than Khanom though!!!!

NB: I have just seen your retort to my posting and I must say that I am extremely impressed with your qualified reply to my unfair attack on you. Maybe I'll meet you in 'Crossroads one day, the next time that I come to your 'neck of the woods' and I'll buy you a pint of beer or 2 in apology!!!

Edited September 9, 2011 by SICHONSTEVE

[lungmi]

Nice bit of detective work there!!! The reason that local opinion here in sunny Sichon reflect these views is because the education is far superior to that offered up in the North and North East of the country and the people can see what Pheu Thai REALLY stand for!!!!

I would disagree with your take that Khanom is nicer than Sichon (I may be biased of course) and it is unfortunate that, as you point out, there are many hitmen in this province, for some inexplicable reason.

I'm guessing that you live in the North or North East and support Thaksin because your wife's family does - understandable I suppose (I could be wrong of course and maybe you are just a misguided individual). However, I AM surprised that YOU have been taken in by all of the false-hoods surrounding Yingluck and Pheu Thai and hope that you recover from this unfortunate attack of "lack of common sense" and hope you get better soon!! My condolences on your poorly condition and severe affliction and hope you come round to realising common sense soon!!!!.

I live in the North, Mae Hong Son, Tak and down to the Burmese Border are Dem strongholds. Why ? People with literacy vote Dem. Most of the other part of the population (Hill Tribes, refugees) have no civil rights to vote. (No discrimination from my side, I work with Hill Tribes for literacy)

[mca]

I think I am right in saying that "the king does not have to grant a pardon to anyone he deems unworthy of receiving one". As Thaksin clearly falls into this category then any recommendations as to this ludicrous pardon to a cowardly convict should be deposited in the garbage bin and discarded for his life-time!!!:jap:.

He should never be allowed back into the Kingdom as he is an undesirable and should be banished forever!!!

If anyone on TV thinks that I dislike Thaksin and EVERYTHING he stands for, intensely, then they are ABSOLUTELY right about this!!!

Really? Reading your posts you come across as a complete moderate. I'm genuinely shocked.

Edited September 9, 2011 by mca

[SICHONSTEVE]

I live in the North, Mae Hong Son, Tak and down to the Burmese Border are Dem strongholds. Why ? People with literacy vote Dem. Most of the other part of the population (Hill Tribes, refugees) have no civil rights to vote. (No discrimination from my side, I work with Hill Tribes for literacy)

Oh dear!!! It seems that I am upsetting people by my careless comments. However, at least you do back me up on the education aspect!!!

Well done for your worthy teaching of hill tribe people, you are clearly a caring person :jap:. I read an article once that the village leaders of a hill tribe (I think) up North were taken to task as they compelled their village to 'carte blanch' boycott voting in a general election, which is an illegal action by all accounts. They had pleaded to have an electricity supply for many years because the next village had had this privilege for quite a while and they were denied one for no apparent reason despite living just down the road to them - they decided to protest by not partaking in an election, to no avail, and this just illustrates the injustices that can befall people without a voice!!!

[Buchholz]

Justice Ministry Spokesman Theerachai Wutthitham countered the remarks of Democrat MP for Songkhla Thaworn Senniam on the red-shirt group's signature campaign to seek a royal pardon for ousted former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The first option is, according to Article 259 of Criminal Procedure Act, the convicted submits a request to the Justice Minister himself, as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request.

Everything written after the 2nd comma above, ("as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request"), is pure fabrication.

The Article doesn't say that all.

It states only what was written before the 2nd comma above.

.

So who is right here, a thaivisa member or the Thailand Justice spokesman....

Look it up yourself, or read the post after mine... then you tell me who is right.

[SICHONSTEVE]

I think I am right in saying that "the king does not have to grant a pardon to anyone he deems unworthy of receiving one". As Thaksin clearly falls into this category then any recommendations as to this ludicrous pardon to a cowardly convict should be deposited in the garbage bin and discarded for his life-time!!!:jap:.

He should never be allowed back into the Kingdom as he is an undesirable and should be banished forever!!!

If anyone on TV thinks that I dislike Thaksin and EVERYTHING he stands for, intensely, then they are ABSOLUTELY right about this!!!

Really? Reading your posts you come across as a complete moderate. I'm genuinely shocked.

If there is such a thing as a "rabid, "no holds barred" radical moderate" then I guess that's me .

Edited September 9, 2011 by SICHONSTEVE

[Buchholz]

Justice Ministry Spokesman Theerachai Wutthitham countered the remarks of Democrat MP for Songkhla Thaworn Senniam on the red-shirt group's signature campaign to seek a royal pardon for ousted former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The first option is, according to Article 259 of Criminal Procedure Act, the convicted submits a request to the Justice Minister himself, as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request.

Everything written after the 2nd comma above, ("as he or she may or may not be serving the sentence at the time of the request"), is pure fabrication.

The Article doesn't say that all.

It states only what was written before the 2nd comma above.

.

So who is right here, a thaivisa member or the Thailand Justice spokesman....

Come on Thai visa member of course. It is just a rand shackled shame that we members aren't ruining I mean running this country. All the experts you will ever need on any topic are right here on Tada Thaivisa

One need not be an "expert" to be able to read a simple sentence in the Criminal Code.

Try it sometime.

.

[lannarebirth]

If he comes back a free man, mark my words, Thailand will not have free and fair elections again.

Why should Thaksin have a problem with free and fair elections since the parties he's associated with are able to win them so comfortably?

Historically, people who go to the lengths Thaksin has gone through to obtain power never seem to keep hold of it legitimately. It's not as if "being legitimate" is something this man prides himself on so far.

And to many Thais the man is utterly unacceptable.

I'm not sure that makes much sense.If one can win power legitimately why should one want it illegitimately? It's more of an issue for Thaksin's opponents with their coups, judicial interventions and failure to win popular support.

We know that many Thais find Thaksin unacceptable but that doesn't give them a veto power.In essence that's what the political struggle is about.

I don't think there's any doubt heholds power at present, and I don't think there's any doubt that he holds it illegitimately. You seem to think an electoral mandate overrides everything including the rule of law, but that just isn't the case. Why you wish this outlaw personality cult on Thailand I just can't fathom.

[brianb1944]

Birds of a feather..... and Chalerm wont have to wait for his reward in Heaven

[Buchholz]

Chalerm is in charge of most things it seems... now he's going to spearhead a new Drug War...

[Buchholz]

Chalerm to call meeting over drug suppression on September 11

BANGKOK, 9 September 2011 (NNT) – Deputy Prime Minister Police Captain Chalerm Yubamrung is scheduled to meet with authorities related to the narcotic suppression policy of the Government on 11 September.

Pol Capt Chalerm stated that he would like to see the police become more involved in the effort to stamp out drug problems, which would go hand in hand with the eradication of crimes and websites with inappropriate references to the monarchy.

Therefore, the deputy premier announced that related officials from 20 departments under the supervision of six ministries would be invited to a meeting at Government House on 11 September to formulate guidelines for the anti-drug mission.

Progress will be reported to Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra for acknowledgement every three months.

-- NNT 2009-09-09

[Crushdepth]

Chalerm is kind of like the Suthep of PTP.

[Insight]

According to the Bangkok Post Charlem has now done a bit of a U-turn on this whole pardon nonsense...?

[Buchholz]

According to the Bangkok Post Charlem has now done a bit of a U-turn on this whole pardon nonsense...?

Perhaps he's upset the pardon review committee didn't immediately back up his claims regarding the law.

Amnesty Panel Inconclusive on Thaksin Serving Jail Term

The probe panel to study a royal pardon request for ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra held its first meeting today, but no conclusion has been made whether Thaksin would have to serve jail time before the petition can be filed.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Buchholz

[Crushdepth]

If he comes back a free man, mark my words, Thailand will not have free and fair elections again.

Why should Thaksin have a problem with free and fair elections since the parties he's associated with are able to win them so comfortably?

Historically, people who go to the lengths Thaksin has gone through to obtain power never seem to keep hold of it legitimately. It's not as if "being legitimate" is something this man prides himself on so far.

And to many Thais the man is utterly unacceptable.

I'm not sure that makes much sense.If one can win power legitimately why should one want it illegitimately? It's more of an issue for Thaksin's opponents with their coups, judicial interventions and failure to win popular support.

We know that many Thais find Thaksin unacceptable but that doesn't give them a veto power.In essence that's what the political struggle is about.

This is something I've always wondered - why cheat in elections when you can win them legitimately? Why put your brother in law in charge of the police, when you could just stop committing crimes? Too hard?

This is going to end in tears, for sure.

[mrtoad]

According to the Bangkok Post Charlem has now done a bit of a U-turn on this whole pardon nonsense...?

He needs to get Mr Happy Toilet to flush this all away.