1,000 Boats To Push Flood Waters From Chao Phraya River

[whybother]

blocking the river with 1000 big boats will hinder the progress of escaping water ,since it cant escape "directly through" a boat it will be forced the sides in a smaller stream

the smaller stream will have to choice but to travel faster / and or rise higher

either way it happens its not good for riverbanks that are only made from a few rows of sandbags

an operation like this could collapse banks and flood areas that might have stayed otherwise dry

Before traveling faster, it will rise higher. I think that is the last thing they need at the moment.

[ratcatcher]

Apparently we will all get to see a demonstration soon enough, or at least glowing reports for local consumption about this national technological triumph..

Tomorrow's the big day.

Plodprasop's Poppycock 2011.

.

No matter what happens on the big day, it WILL be a success. Nothing less can be tolerated.

There is no way they can actually measure the impact of the armada of 100 ships, boats, canoes, bathtubs or whatever vessels show up.

Accolades will be received all round at Don Mueang H.Q. Champagne will be consumed. P.M. Yingluck will beam larger than usual.

Mr Plod Prasop will be a national hero.

Agree. Maybe he'll even be given a Nobel Peace Prize like another unfalsifiable, non-science experimenter of which we are all aware. But there are always those 'Unintended Consequences'. Perhaps one of the consequences will be the placement of a new Minister of S & T. Naaaaaah!

BTW, did you mention something about PM Yingluck's beam being larger than usual - thinking too much about boats lately? OK, I'll give you credit for it. I guess 'will have a broader beam than usual' would have been too obvious. :jap:

Max, sorry for the confusion. Actually the beam I meant was her lovely smile, not a reference to boats. Perhaps if her science minister is correct with his theory he can take a bow and she won't look so stern. OK?

[Buchholz]

A bit of additional reading up on our trailblazing Science Minister and have to regret not referring to him earlier as Dr. Plodprasop, although I'm not sure how much engineering or physics he took for his forestry degree.

It's worth noting he is Deputy Party Leader of the Pheu Thai Party.

Some nice additional quotes of his from the let's-serve-the-animals-at-the-zoo-up-for- dinner days. I wonder as news of his let's-run-boats-to-control-a-river spreads globally, will he recant his boat idea the same as he consequently backed down from his earlier plan to serve giraffe and other exotic meats to zoo-goers after the news of it spread globally following his effort to obtain live animals from Africa. It would require very little modification from his words then.

"I may have jumped the gun and proposed my idea too quickly so I will reconsider what type of meat should be on the menu. I will not do what is considered to be bad for the country."

I have to admit I liked the take of one of his opponents then.

Siri Wangboonkeard, Chairman of the Animal Welfare Protection Group, handed over a letter to Deputy Prime Minister Suwat Liptapanlop at Government House protesting the restaurant.

"The purpose of a zoo is to urge visitors, who are mostly youths, to love and protect animals, not to eat them," he said.

quotes from several AFP and other media articles all on his 2005 blunder:

http://www.ecoterra.net/sites/actions-site-2.htm#19.11.2005

.

Edited October 10, 2011 by Buchholz

[wana]

"I may have jumped the gun and proposed my idea too quickly so I will reconsider what type of meat should be on the menu. I will not do what is considered to be bad for the country."

I have to admit I liked the take of one of his opponents then.

Siri Wangboonkeard, Chairman of the Animal Welfare Protection Group, handed over a letter to Deputy Prime Minister Suwat Liptapanlop at Government House protesting the restaurant.

"The purpose of a zoo is to urge visitors, who are mostly youths, to love and protect animals, not to eat them," he said.

quotes from several AFP and media articles all on his 2005 blunder:

http://www.ecoterra.....htm#19.11.2005

.

you cant blame the man for confusing a zoo with a restaurant ,theyre just so similar in concept that its an easy mistake to make

[steveromagnino]

oh rest assured our science and tech minister is not the one who puts the ferrous oxide in irony. Or the giraffe on the plate for dinner.

Chalerm assisted his son to hide from the law when he was an MP, after his son was a fugitive following alledgedly killing a policeman in a confrontation in Club 20.

After about 6 months, when the witnesses had all disappeared, the son reappears, was charged with a minor offense, went to jail briefly and his brother was placed under house arrest even though it is widely suspected he was out and around town during this period anyhow.

Apparently as an MP helping out a fugitive is ok, hence our 'Doctor of Law' (although how many classes or how much work/study the esteemed member ever attended at R.U. might be possibly lower than could be expected) has found time to be helping another fugitive as fast as he can...if only that hard work could have been put towards flood planning, i dont know, 3 months ago.

That family are probably quite adept in the kitchen as well; Mr happy toilet himself, not only has a good knowledge of the water systems in Thailand via his consultancy in sanitation, but one also suspects for serving up a menu alongside our science Minister, a 'pistol butt' sandwich and lashings of smelling the cheese as a side dish from the portly fellow are enough to make any diner delighted with the Club 21 menu.

Why club 21?

Because it's 1 better than a 20.

Edited October 10, 2011 by steveromagnino

[warfie]

Why don't we hire all the forest-fire-fighting aircraft in the world and simply airlift the water to somewhere it's needed?

(joking, for those short on a sense of humour)

Edited October 10, 2011 by warfie

[Scott]

I suggest staying on the topic.

[MaxYakov]

4) Increased wave height - If the boats are tethered/moored at shore, then the waves would have to be from the prop wash only. We need a prop wash model for this, but from aerial snapshots I've seen of boats on the Phraya, they are very small compared to the hull wakes.

As to the remainder of the post ... If I were you, I'd, Arrgh, cut back on the 'Pirates of the Caribbean' a wee bit, Matey.

Ye speaks the truth, blister me barnacles!

Ok land lubber, I think for looking at the wash of the props, you need to not look at a moving boat (or any of the little planing hull craft or barges), but look at a big tug or trading ship with some serious sized props which will probably be thrashing at mid power; they put out a reasonable wake on their own. As the boat is parked in the middle of the river, it is essentially travelling against the flow at around 8-10 knots (estimated flow) which will send up a wake of about .1-.3 of a meter depending on the boat size. Especially since the boat he is going to use will probably be big inefficient cargo boats and tugs and the like.

Caught me in a Truth, huh? That's a rarity, with me.

Agree. But I didn't think they were going to do this midstream because Newton's 3rd would cancel the downstream-directed prop wash. But don't the Minister of S & C this. He may try it.

I for one will be ROTFLOL and any other number of acronyms OMG if this guy's idea results in some unintended consequence hopefully involving a banana skin, his foot, and some cream pies flying in the air which he happens to be carrying.

While not entirely flood or scheme related, the thought of such an incident always seems appealing. more appealing than thinking of how much tax I pay each year...to pay for this plan.

Speaking of the potential for (slightly less slapsticky) UCs resulting from this, check this Virginia Institute of Marine Science Study; Propeller turbulance may affect marine food webs

Aye, Aye on the tax issue. Don't you think, though, that the Ministry of S & C is going to find a way for this to be a voluntary and uncompensated effort by the boat owner/operators given the Emergency Flood Status ... or somesuch? If I were one of the 'volunteers', I'd be requiring advance payment for everything or there would be a mysterious occurrence of an unsolvable engine problem.

Thanks for the comments and be sure to practice Safe Piracy!

[MaxYakov]

Tomorrow's the big day.

Plodprasop's Poppycock 2011.

.

No matter what happens on the big day, it WILL be a success. Nothing less can be tolerated.

There is no way they can actually measure the impact of the armada of 100 ships, boats, canoes, bathtubs or whatever vessels show up.

Accolades will be received all round at Don Mueang H.Q. Champagne will be consumed. P.M. Yingluck will beam larger than usual.

Mr Plod Prasop will be a national hero.

Agree. Maybe he'll even be given a Nobel Peace Prize like another unfalsifiable, non-science experimenter of which we are all aware. But there are always those 'Unintended Consequences'. Perhaps one of the consequences will be the placement of a new Minister of S & T. Naaaaaah!

BTW, did you mention something about PM Yingluck's beam being larger than usual - thinking too much about boats lately? OK, I'll give you credit for it. I guess 'will have a broader beam than usual' would have been too obvious. :jap:

Max, sorry for the confusion. Actually the beam I meant was her lovely smile, not a reference to boats. Perhaps if her science minister is correct with his theory he can take a bow and she won't look so stern. OK?

OK, if you insist, I'm taking my credit back for what I took to be a double entendre/Freudian slip (not boat slip) by you. I wouldn't elevate his (if it his) scheme to that of a 'theory'. It looks like a half-baked hypothesis to me. But, since it's not easily falsifiable (a nice thing about a hypothesis), it will be deemed 'correct', as you put it.

He might want more than a bow, though. He might want to walk her flanks or shiver her limbers or raise her mainsails ... I'd better stop there.

[EyesWideOpen]

It would appear that the world media has picked up this story, and has more or less made a laughing stock out of Mr Plod Prasop. Since Thailand seems to be obsessed with face and the saving of it, I have to admit to a certain fascination with what is going to happen from this point forward. Either admit it was a bad idea, and cancel the exercise. Or stay the course, run the whole exercise, and have to deal with thousands of people on the riverbank watching as nothing happens..... Hmmmmmmm tough choice.

I myself strongly advocate the the government use it's resources, time, and money to help the endless people who are suffering from the floods. These weird ideas to give the appearance of doing something are truly counterproductive.

[janverbeem]

It would appear that the world media has picked up this story, and has more or less made a laughing stock out of Mr Plod Prasop. Since Thailand seems to be obsessed with face and the saving of it, I have to admit to a certain fascination with what is going to happen from this point forward. Either admit it was a bad idea, and cancel the exercise. Or stay the course, run the whole exercise, and have to deal with thousands of people on the riverbank watching as nothing happens..... Hmmmmmmm tough choice.

I myself strongly advocate the the government use it's resources, time, and money to help the endless people who are suffering from the floods. These weird ideas to give the appearance of doing something are truly counterproductive.

That's exactly the point with all that face thing,even if nothing has happened it still will have happened because those big wigs say it has.

Edited October 10, 2011 by metisdead
Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes.

[wintermute]

On further consideration I don't think this scheme was that dumb. From a practical point of view it's totally incompetent but not if your whole plan is to siphon funds off of the fuel fund or some other corrupt hijinks.

The science sounds "plausible" if you present it to a public that lacks critical thinking skills or a decent education in science. Then you can cover up your economic misdeeds as good intentions even when it fails all the while saving face for yourself, your cronies, and the government.

I guess the question is how much money might be getting laundered out from the fuel credits?

Perhaps some of those boats will be unaccounted for but the government will be sent a bill for phantom fuel expenditures.

Yes, indeed. Not dumb at all.

[TAWP]

I have a boat. And my girlfriend has a boat too.

To whom do I present the bill?

[BuckarooBanzai]

I have a boat. And my girlfriend has a boat too.

To whom do I present the bill?

Just present your individual photos pointing at the boats and present it to the local money managers!

[MaxYakov]

I have a boat. And my girlfriend has a boat too.

To whom do I present the bill?

Just present your individual photos pointing at the boats and present it to the local money managers!

You might try 'offering' those to the Water Goddess if BB's recommendation doesn't 'payoff'.

[MaxYakov]

It would appear that the world media has picked up this story, and has more or less made a laughing stock out of Mr Plod Prasop. Since Thailand seems to be obsessed with face and the saving of it, I have to admit to a certain fascination with what is going to happen from this point forward. Either admit it was a bad idea, and cancel the exercise. Or stay the course, run the whole exercise, and have to deal with thousands of people on the riverbank watching as nothing happens..... Hmmmmmmm tough choice.

I myself strongly advocate the the government use it's resources, time, and money to help the endless people who are suffering from the floods. These weird ideas to give the appearance of doing something are truly counterproductive.

Google doesn't bring up anything outside of Thailand on this for me. Someone should give it to the Daily Mall (as was the CM school Sports Parade), I guess. What did you find that indicated that 'world media' was running with it?

He doesn't have a choice, really, but to go through with it. The 'thousands of people on the riverbank watching' will be seeing a lot of prop wash (not to mention a lot more watching especially if/as it's televised). However, its success cannot be determined by anyone, except maybe the Water Goddess, without some very exacting metrics being gathered and its being conducted under a Parallel Group Design - both of which are impossible. If he isn't smart enough to understand that, then maybe one of his minions has clued him in.

As to your second paragraph, I don't think you'd get an argument from anyone ... anyone in the private sector, that is.

Edited October 10, 2011 by MaxYakov

[FOODLOVER]

I still don't get it - begin from Ko Kret, end at the estuary?

They tether all the boats to one bridge for some time, then to the next one downstream? Or a few boats at every suitable bridge?

I believe no one really knows what is planned; I am in conversation with one of the captains of a boat supposed to be part of this exercise...he doesn't know how exactly or what exactly he is supposed to do; he thought it was dredging the Bangkok Bar somehow!

Ah well you cannot be an expert of Sy-en and Teck-no-lo-yee as well as anything relating to the sea; as my gut tells me, there is no C in technology. Or in science.

Well, ok, you probably say there is. And I ask you, where did you find that out? A Dictionary?

Well that's where you went wrong. You should have asked your gut. And my gut says...no Cs.

Our esteemed member of the house is also another chap who likes to think using his gut. As anyone who has seen him eat will tell you.

He eats. And that food most likely goes into his gut. Where it goes from there, no one can be sure, but at least some might believe that it comes out in policy decisions such as these, in a magnificent metamorphasis; where somehow:

the colour of the bowel....

gives way to the nuance of the vowel....

The paper of two ply....

lends inspiration for ideas to fly....

the fountain and the stool....

using horsepower as a tool....

playing battleships alone....

a vision to hone.....

giving birth to a brown snake....

leads to how to drain this lake.....

A river of yellow in front...

a hundred fold boat stunt....

That's some eloquent shit.

[MaxYakov]

On further consideration I don't think this scheme was that dumb. From a practical point of view it's totally incompetent but not if your whole plan is to siphon funds off of the fuel fund or some other corrupt hijinks.

The science sounds "plausible" if you present it to a public that lacks critical thinking skills or a decent education in science. Then you can cover up your economic misdeeds as good intentions even when it fails all the while saving face for yourself, your cronies, and the government.

I guess the question is how much money might be getting laundered out from the fuel credits?

Perhaps some of those boats will be unaccounted for but the government will be sent a bill for phantom fuel expenditures.

Yes, indeed. Not dumb at all.

Yes indeedy. Ran across this The Nation Article dated August 15, 2011 where Minister Plodprasop allegedly makes some big verbal commitments regarding 'flood prevention efforts' and has this closing paragraph:

Plodprasop said he would ask Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra at today's Cabinet meeting to approve a budget equivalent to the country's gross domestic product (GDP) for government researchanddevelopment [sic] works.

I guess he didn't get approval of his modest budget. Or maybe he did and then decided to lavish a chunk of it on the subject of this topic.

Edited October 10, 2011 by MaxYakov

[GentlemanJim]

so what time does this all happen today then? Can't wait!

[Payboy]

The science sounds "plausible" if you present it to a public that lacks critical thinking skills or a decent education in science. Then you can cover up your economic misdeeds as good intentions even when it fails all the while saving face for yourself, your cronies, and the government.

To be seen to be doing something is more important than doing anything. And the possibility of skimming is just icing on the cake.

Edited October 11, 2011 by Payboy

[rametindallas]

All boats displace (sit down into) the water. If enough boats are tied to stationary objects (bridges) and their propellers are not running full speed, the boats are actually slowing down the river. At best the effect is minimal as most boats (for economical reasons) have only enough power to move themselves upstream at a slow pace. With the amount of water (epic) flowing down, this amounts to a 'fart in a whirlwind' and is a terrific waste of money and fuel and the possible damage to the boats' engines and risk to human health and safty is not worth it.

Edited October 11, 2011 by rametindallas

[TAWP]

Google doesn't bring up anything outside of Thailand on this for me.

It is reported in the biggest morning-paper (non-tabloid) in my home-country.

[MaxYakov]

A few shots to give a feel for this, perhaps. This appears to be a 175 meter/575 foot (approx. - Google satellite scale) container vessel rounding a bend in the Chao Phraya going downstream near Thai Royal Naval Academy. I see three, distinct wakes: Hull, prop, rudder. Sorry, since I've never worked for the CIA, I can give you neither river nor vessel velocity. I haven't seen such a pronounced prop wake looking at other, smaller vessels on the Phraya. Maybe it's running high in the water? Anyway, FWIW.

Edited October 11, 2011 by MaxYakov

[MaxYakov]

Google doesn't bring up anything outside of Thailand on this for me.

It is reported in the biggest morning-paper (non-tabloid) in my home-country.

OK, Thanks. Maybe my search string (ministry prop wash phraya unscientific GDP budget water goddess) needs to be tweaked a bit.

[steveromagnino]

That's some eloquent shit.

Aiiight, well Snoop Doggy Poo just contacted me, he wants to do a remix....

Prop wash prop wash

Just look and you'll see it

But don't f&*k around

It'll give you diorhea

prop wash prop wash

I don't know what to do

Motoring my boats

With my whole Bloods crew

Now here's a little rap

tellin' not like any other

My mad skills defying physics

are a word to yo' motha

I suggested in 2-0-5

That we eat the animals in the zoo

Now in 20 - 11 I back

for straight up turboing flushing poo

I gonna use the boats

I gonna use the seamen

Push the current against gravity

I get the flood waters steamin'

Prop wash prop wash

Just look and you'll see it

But don't f&*k around

It'll give you diorhea

Newton says I can't do it luey

Einstein relativelity woi!

Fluid dynamics presenting in the raw

Pushing water in my 4000 ton panamax sixty four

I promised 1000 in the fleet

I delivered 100

who you lookin' at, what you doin'

I ain't your cousin

I am standing on an inflatable

I'll eat your face like Hannibal

My plan is so hateable

But it's ok I'm insatiable

I'll flood your canal and moat

I'll kick you like a goat

Sleep with all your women

If that's what floats your boat

prop wash prop wash

I don't know what to do

Motoring my boats

With my whole Bloods crew

Apparently this is the new press release planned after their idea collapses in flames.

[steveromagnino]

A few shots to give a feel for this, perhaps. This appears to be a 175 meter/575 foot (approx. - Google satellite scale) container vessel rounding a bend in the Chao Phraya going downstream near Thai Royal Naval Academy. I see three, distinct wakes: Hull, prop, rudder. Sorry, since I've never worked for the CIA, I can give you neither river nor vessel velocity. I haven't seen such a pronounced prop wake looking at other, smaller vessels on the Phraya. Maybe it's running high in the water? Anyway, FWIW.

Nice pic. Basically that same wake you see there (boat is probably doing around over ground speed of around 12-14 knots, and current is probably 6-8 knots, so net speed through water of around 5-7 knots) is the same wake that will be coming off each boat as they fight the current upstream.

While good for surfer girls, it isn't so great to the great toilet flush of 2011 by the esteemed minister.

He will, however, schedule for doing this before 2pm as then he will claim the tide benefit is actually due to his boat scheme, and will also ensure that he pays off all his mates in the shipping industry as well. And anyone who happens to sell diesel and fuel oil.

When the water comes in; quickly scoop it is an old Thai saying (wa-lah nam kuen, reep dtuk); in this case he seems to be applying modern technology to the issue of fighting against that old (and therefore stupid) idea of gravity. Or basic understanding of water flow in a pipe.

[Tokay]

I always look for SATIRE when I read incredibly dumb crap like this, but today I don't see it. So that can only mean, someone is trying to out-dumb the current dumbest person in Thailand.

I wish him luck in the competition. There are a lot of fierce competitors, including the 60+ year old falang who tried to rob the bank in Chiang Mai.

On a serious note, could all the flooding be due to Khmer black magic?

[steveromagnino]

I always look for SATIRE when I read incredibly dumb crap like this, but today I don't see it. So that can only mean, someone is trying to out-dumb the current dumbest person in Thailand.

I wish him luck in the competition. There are a lot of fierce competitors, including the 60+ year old falang who tried to rob the bank in Chiang Mai.

On a serious note, could all the flooding be due to Khmer black magic?

You see dumb.

But people told Galileo he was wrong when he said the earth was round.

people laughed at Steve Jobs when he came out with the iPod.

Maybe our science minister will have the last laugh when he proves that 300 years of theories based on the concept of gravity are in fact wrong.

Plus also, he can do that dance, you know, the one that the baby does and slowly circles around; that's some straight up mid 90s sharing semi spam internet shizzle!

[FOODLOVER]

That's some eloquent shit.

"Aiiight, well Snoop Doggy Poo just contacted me, he wants to do a remix...."

"Apparently this is the new press release planned after their idea collapses in flames."

Kicking it old school i see, word.

Edited October 11, 2011 by FOODLOVER

[Tokay]

I always look for SATIRE when I read incredibly dumb crap like this, but today I don't see it. So that can only mean, someone is trying to out-dumb the current dumbest person in Thailand.

I wish him luck in the competition. There are a lot of fierce competitors, including the 60+ year old falang who tried to rob the bank in Chiang Mai.

On a serious note, could all the flooding be due to Khmer black magic?

You see dumb.

But people told Galileo he was wrong when he said the earth was round.

people laughed at Steve Jobs when he came out with the iPod.

Maybe our science minister will have the last laugh when he proves that 300 years of theories based on the concept of gravity are in fact wrong.

Plus also, he can do that dance, you know, the one that the baby does and slowly circles around; that's some straight up mid 90s sharing semi spam internet shizzle!

I can not argue that. So I'm going to raise my glass to this guy and hope he can disprove 300 years of scientific theory, thus winning every international award there is to win.

But if he doesn't, he's still going down as one of the dumbest to every walk the face of the earth.