Northern Bangkok Under Threat

[jackr]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

There's nothing wrong with pointing out the shortcomings of the Thai government (and there are many in this case), irregardless of where the poster may hail from and any apparent ineptitude of their government. The focus is on Thailand here, no point in looking elsewhere - who cares what's happened in the US. Some of the Thai negativity gets right on my wick, but then so does typically mawkish retorts. It'd be nice to have less of both, but TV thrives on it.

[metisdead]

A post has been removed as a poster had deleted quoted post headers as he had reached the maximum number of nested quotes allowed leading to misunderstanding of who posted what. When replying to certain parts of a post, learn how to use the Insert quotation feature.

[skippybangkok]

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Arm Chair expert.

For those of us who lived and worked through the 1995 floods in down town bangkok, which were far less severe than 2011, its clear they have done alot and it has helped.

I remember 0.5m down Sukhumvit road near Emporium

[siampolee]

I remember 0.5m down Sukhumvit road near Emporium

Remarkable, the Emporium wasn't built or operating then ( 1995 ).

[OzMick]

The Factory Land Industrial Estate in Ayuthaya's Wang Noi district has been flooded with up to a metre and a half of water. This is the fifth industrial estate in Ayuthaya flooded.

Sorry to get on topic and interrupt the Thaksinista's little hug circle - why don't you guys get a room.

[rubl]

The Factory Land Industrial Estate in Ayuthaya's Wang Noi district has been flooded with up to a metre and a half of water. This is the fifth industrial estate in Ayuthaya flooded.

Sorry to get on topic and interrupt the Thaksinista's little hug circle - why don't you guys get a room.

It is reported that the Bang Pa-in Industrial Estate in Ayutthaya province is now 100 percent flooded and the water in the estate is about 1.80 metres deep.

Edited October 16, 2011 by rubl

[CNXTim]

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

As someone who is not only knowledgeable, and assuming you have the best interest of our adopted country at heart, perhaps you would like to share your genius in these matters and quickly outline your flood relief plan?

[cdnvic]

Deleted one off-topic post and one with badly mangled quotes.

[LTGTR]

LOL-comparing a slow moving flood to a major hurrican-surely you should have began you post with,"I'm clueless".

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

[sbk]

the TOPIC is FLOODING. lets keep it that way, i am sick to death of the endless off topic pointless arguments. If you can't dicuss the topic then don't post. Simple as that.

Remember, FLOODS, bear that in mind when deciding what your next post is, thanks. (and yes I made it bold so that it would stick in your brains- discuss the topic at hand.)

[OzMick]

" The scheme was to raise the flood walls to 5.2metres high along the Chaopraya River and form a ring around Bangkok together with major diversion canals and pumping systems." From Estrada

May I suggest that if an area requires flood walls of the magnitude, then it is unsuitable for the purpose intended. It is not only the one-off cost of the walls, but the fact that during flooding of such magnitude, supplies, workers and product will be unable to be moved for lengthy periods of time, and the surrounding infrastructure so badly damaged as to further increase down time.

[w11guy]

I'm from Holland and the Dutch seem to be the experts on water management. The Crown Prince is Holland's top water-manager; however.........after protecting Holland from the powers of the North Sea by building the Delta-works, the country was flooded 2 times over the last 10 years by water from............yes the rivers Rhine and Maas transporting water from Switzerland, France and Germany. The water-defense wasn't working!!

Not quite true. They worked for a while, but were breached. Since the Christmas flooding in 1995/96, they have invested heavily to try to prevent this happening again.

You cannot even compare the Dutch floods with these. The Dutch were prepared, only like in Thailand they let ppl live in the wrong places. The government reacted decisive, people who knew where in place. Not cronies like here in Thailand.

People in the UK are also allowed to build houses in the wrong places. I remember one case where some environmental agency objected to planning permission for houses that were to be built on a flood plain, but planning permission was still given. When the houses were half built they were under a metre of water. But they still finished and sold the houses. It happens all over the UK and probably all over the world. This isn't a just Thai problem, so don't make out that it is. Get out a bit more and take a look what happens in other countries.

[Angelatarangela]

Touche!

I remember 0.5m down Sukhumvit road near Emporium

Remarkable, the Emporium wasn't built or operating then ( 1995 ).

[OzMick]

WARNING - INTENTIONAL SATIRE

A 2 metre wall of water has been observed moving south down the Gulf of Thailand. Tsunami alerts have been triggered in Phuket and Ranong and residents are rushing to higher ground.

The Sultan of Brunei has sent an open message to Thailand's PM, Yingluk Shinawatra pleading "For pity's sake, turn off the boats!"

[Crushdepth]

This whole flood situation is a tough one for the government haters to make any hay out of.

First off, only more death and damage will increase the discontent against the government among the general population, and only the most degenerate among government haters would want to see that happen just to win political points.

On the other hand, if the waters recede without much further loss, the government will have dodged an environmental bullet (as far as BKK is concerned, anyway) and may even gain mild kudos for the existing anti-flood measures working as well as they did (ie not even worse).

Of course, the most entrenched government haters will always find reasons to perpetuate their habit, but they don't make a difference. Those that make the difference are the general population who tend not be fanatical one way or another and whose political opinions are shaped on more than rhetorical bile.

When people's lives are adversely enough effected, they will become more hostile towards the government. That is why the Dems got kicked out, and that will be the reason the PTP will eventually get kicked out.

In the meantime, a natural disaster like this - especially in a country where this kind of thing is not uncommon - is unlikely to garner the kind of discontent government haters dream of unless things get far far worse.

And no-one would want to see that happen, would they?

Whereas "opposition haters" would never seek to score points during a national disaster

[Crushdepth]

Came across a live IP camera showing the water level at Saphan Phut, for those of you who don't live on the river.

[apetley]

I have to admit to being a bit confused over the flooding of these important industrial estates . Many many thousand jobs will be lost , inflicting long term losses even after the water recedes. I used to build houses in Western Alaska, near the mouth of the Yukon river. This area is a massive flood plain, and everyone knew it. So if you built a house, you would research the highest water level for the past 100 years, and build the house on stilts a foot above that mark. So no problems no matter what flood came. .... With these industrial estates, billions of dollars are at stake. I simply cannot believe the developers of these estates, knowing full well they are located in a flood plain, did not build strong walls all around them at a height above the 100 year flood mark. I suspect there will be a lot of Japanese factory managers asking the same questions, as they plan where to move their factory. I think this will be a case of penny wise dollar foolish, saving money by building low walls that were easily breeched.

I would also ask the Japanese factory managers 'did you research if the factory was in a flood prone area and if so did you specify the defences were adequate?'

More than one party can be culpable for a loss such as we are seeing.

[hanuman1]

This whole flood situation is a tough one for the government haters to make any hay out of.

First off, only more death and damage will increase the discontent against the government among the general population, and only the most degenerate among government haters would want to see that happen just to win political points.

On the other hand, if the waters recede without much further loss, the government will have dodged an environmental bullet (as far as BKK is concerned, anyway) and may even gain mild kudos for the existing anti-flood measures working as well as they did (ie not even worse).

Of course, the most entrenched government haters will always find reasons to perpetuate their habit, but they don't make a difference. Those that make the difference are the general population who tend not be fanatical one way or another and whose political opinions are shaped on more than rhetorical bile.

When people's lives are adversely enough effected, they will become more hostile towards the government. That is why the Dems got kicked out, and that will be the reason the PTP will eventually get kicked out.

In the meantime, a natural disaster like this - especially in a country where this kind of thing is not uncommon - is unlikely to garner the kind of discontent government haters dream of unless things get far far worse.

And no-one would want to see that happen, would they?

Whereas "opposition haters" would never seek to score points during a national disaster

Whilst I've seen a lot of government-bashing concerning the flooding, I must confess I haven't been able to find much in the way of 'opposition-bashing'. That said, there has been criticism of previous governments' failure to a get a grip on the annual flooding problems if that's what you mean. Anyway, anyone seeking to gain political points as a result of the increased suffering of others during natural disasters should hang their heads in shame.

[verywierd]

Came across a live IP camera showing the water level at Saphan Phut, for those of you who don't live on the river.

Thanks for the useful info.

[salween]

In the meantime, a natural disaster like this - especially in a country where this kind of thing is not uncommon - is unlikely to garner the kind of discontent government haters dream of unless things get far far worse.

While nature laid the groundwork, let's not forget that much of excess water is largely the result of human error. The dams' emergency spilling was the straw that broke the camel's back. Had those reservoirs been managed for flood management purposes this story would have been much drier. While conspiracy theories seem to abound around here, I doubt the dams' operating regimes have ever been in political playbooks, and the functionaries involved and the polices they've followed transcend shirt color.

[hagler]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Sorry you are incorrect. My friend Kritsada Arunvongse na Ayuthaya was Governor of Bangkok at the time of the 1995 floods. I discussed the plans with him at the time. For all strategic locations where considerable damage could be done in the event of a flood, a 1 in 1,000 year flood level should be considered especially as Bangkok is built on land that was reclaimed from the sea at the mouth of the river Chaophraya. At that time we realised that the 2.5metre flood walls would not prevent flooding in the future. He therefore put forward the schemes that you mentioned. The scheme was to raise the flood walls to 5.2metres high along the Chaopraya River and form a ring around Bangkok together with major diversion canals and pumping systems. This scheme was stopped by Banharn as he was PM at the time and from a different political party (i.e. no benefit seen). The Government scheme that went ahead at only 2.5metres high has not worked, otherwise we would not have seen so many Industrial Estates under water as well as parts of Bangkok already. As long as the flood walls remain at 2.5metres there is a real chance of it being breached at the high tide.

Many of the Industrial Estates have been built on cheap land next to the river with flood walls of only around 2.5metres high, most of these Industrial estates such as Hi-Tech and Bang Pa in (where I have worked), have been flooded. On the other hand, Navanakorn Industrial Estate, thanks to Kritsada's foresight; has a flood defence of 5.2metres. Kritsada died last year, however Nipit Arunvongse Na Ayuthya is now Managing Director of Navanakorn.

Currently they are hastily trying to raise the flood wall around Bangkok above 2.5metres high with sand bags, however Bangkok still runs the risk of floods since the October 30th high tide will be 2.3 metres (highest so far 2.19metres), plus the runoff from the north and from further rain. Whilst they are trying to blame younger politicians such as Yingluck and the Science Minister for being inexperienced, it was the older MPs that are still in Government, such as Banharn, that blocked the construction of the dykes to a height of 5.2metres that should be blamed.

Years ago, Bangkok was well drained as it was criss crossed by many drainage canals which were also the means of transport which was nearly all by boat. Bangkok was then known a "The Venice of the East". The politicians allowed most of the canals such as Sathorn to be filled in on advice from the Americans (who are being blamed by some for causing the floods). After filling the canals in, Bangkok was no longer known as the Venice of the East, but the "Land of Smiles", possibly after much money was made from building roads and erecting skyscrapers on what was drainage land. However little consideration appears to have been taken in mitigating the affect of turning the land, which would have absorbed the rains, to concrete. When the land is turned to concrete, the rains are not absorbed and it all has to flow through the greatly reduced capacity drainage system.

At last someone who has something REAL to say rather than just pontificating and posturing. Thanks Estrada.

[katana]

I have to admit to being a bit confused over the flooding of these important industrial estates . Many many thousand jobs will be lost , inflicting long term losses even after the water recedes. I used to build houses in Western Alaska, near the mouth of the Yukon river. This area is a massive flood plain, and everyone knew it. So if you built a house, you would research the highest water level for the past 100 years, and build the house on stilts a foot above that mark. So no problems no matter what flood came. .... With these industrial estates, billions of dollars are at stake. I simply cannot believe the developers of these estates, knowing full well they are located in a flood plain, did not build strong walls all around them at a height above the 100 year flood mark. I suspect there will be a lot of Japanese factory managers asking the same questions, as they plan where to move their factory. I think this will be a case of penny wise dollar foolish, saving money by building low walls that were easily breeched.

I would also ask the Japanese factory managers 'did you research if the factory was in a flood prone area and if so did you specify the defences were adequate?'

More than one party can be culpable for a loss such as we are seeing.

The same thing happened at the Fukushima nuclear power plant in Japan where the sea wall wasn't high enough.

You have to also wonder, with all the flooding in Thailand this year, with up to a third of the country affected, about the safety of locating nuclear power stations in LOS.

[anterian]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Sorry you are incorrect. My friend Kritsada Arunvongse na Ayuthaya was Governor of Bangkok at the time of the 1995 floods. I discussed the plans with him at the time. For all strategic locations where considerable damage could be done in the event of a flood, a 1 in 1,000 year flood level should be considered especially as Bangkok is built on land that was reclaimed from the sea at the mouth of the river Chaophraya. At that time we realised that the 2.5metre flood walls would not prevent flooding in the future. He therefore put forward the schemes that you mentioned. The scheme was to raise the flood walls to 5.2metres high along the Chaopraya River and form a ring around Bangkok together with major diversion canals and pumping systems. This scheme was stopped by Banharn as he was PM at the time and from a different political party (i.e. no benefit seen). The Government scheme that went ahead at only 2.5metres high has not worked, otherwise we would not have seen so many Industrial Estates under water as well as parts of Bangkok already. As long as the flood walls remain at 2.5metres there is a real chance of it being breached at the high tide.

Many of the Industrial Estates have been built on cheap land next to the river with flood walls of only around 2.5metres high, most of these Industrial estates such as Hi-Tech and Bang Pa in (where I have worked), have been flooded. On the other hand, Navanakorn Industrial Estate, thanks to Kritsada's foresight; has a flood defence of 5.2metres. Kritsada died last year, however Nipit Arunvongse Na Ayuthya is now Managing Director of Navanakorn.

Currently they are hastily trying to raise the flood wall around Bangkok above 2.5metres high with sand bags, however Bangkok still runs the risk of floods since the October 30th high tide will be 2.3 metres (highest so far 2.19metres), plus the runoff from the north and from further rain. Whilst they are trying to blame younger politicians such as Yingluck and the Science Minister for being inexperienced, it was the older MPs that are still in Government, such as Banharn, that blocked the construction of the dykes to a height of 5.2metres that should be blamed.

Years ago, Bangkok was well drained as it was criss crossed by many drainage canals which were also the means of transport which was nearly all by boat. Bangkok was then known a "The Venice of the East". The politicians allowed most of the canals such as Sathorn to be filled in on advice from the Americans (who are being blamed by some for causing the floods). After filling the canals in, Bangkok was no longer known as the Venice of the East, but the "Land of Smiles", possibly after much money was made from building roads and erecting skyscrapers on what was drainage land. However little consideration appears to have been taken in mitigating the affect of turning the land, which would have absorbed the rains, to concrete. When the land is turned to concrete, the rains are not absorbed and it all has to flow through the greatly reduced capacity drainage system.

A nice well expressed post, it explains the facts, the causes and those responsible. A pleasant change from all those people here who try to twist every disaster into an attack on Thaksin. Perhaps, as has been suggested, many of these Yingluck/Thaksin haters are old retired farangs with nothing better to do.... Just for the record, I'm also an old retired farang , but I'm also a scientist ..... we think differently

[whybother]

It's interesting that during most of the time that the north and central areas were flooding, there was very little rain in Bangkok.

Now that all that northern water has reached Bangkok, there has been a number of days of heavy rain in Bangkok.

Bad timing for Bangkok.

[MaxYakov]

WARNING - INTENTIONAL SATIRE

A 2 metre wall of water has been observed moving south down the Gulf of Thailand. Tsunami alerts have been triggered in Phuket and Ranong and residents are rushing to higher ground.

The Sultan of Brunei has sent an open message to Thailand's PM, Yingluk Shinawatra pleading "For pity's sake, turn off the boats!"

Good one, mate! Thanks for the warning that it was 'INTENTIONAL SATIRE'. Most of the satire here appears not to be so.

[hanuman1]

It's interesting that during most of the time that the north and central areas were flooding, there was very little rain in Bangkok.

Now that all that northern water has reached Bangkok, there has been a number of days of heavy rain in Bangkok.

Bad timing for Bangkok.

During the days of flooding in Chiang Mai a couple of weeks ago, there was relatively little rainfall. It's all about the runoff. Unless BKK gets several hours of non-stop torrential rain I don't think it will exacerbate the current problems that much.

[rascalman]

OK you got a handle on this and know exactly what you are talking about. Please fill us all in who live her. Oh I am American but I have interests and have family and live here.

Tell us what has been done and being done.

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

[EyesWideOpen]

I have to admit to being a bit confused over the flooding of these important industrial estates . Many many thousand jobs will be lost , inflicting long term losses even after the water recedes. I used to build houses in Western Alaska, near the mouth of the Yukon river. This area is a massive flood plain, and everyone knew it. So if you built a house, you would research the highest water level for the past 100 years, and build the house on stilts a foot above that mark. So no problems no matter what flood came. .... With these industrial estates, billions of dollars are at stake. I simply cannot believe the developers of these estates, knowing full well they are located in a flood plain, did not build strong walls all around them at a height above the 100 year flood mark. I suspect there will be a lot of Japanese factory managers asking the same questions, as they plan where to move their factory. I think this will be a case of penny wise dollar foolish, saving money by building low walls that were easily breeched.

I would also ask the Japanese factory managers 'did you research if the factory was in a flood prone area and if so did you specify the defences were adequate?'

More than one party can be culpable for a loss such as we are seeing.

You are correct. Perhaps there were some assumptions going on here......I am pretty sure if you buy a house in America in a flood plain, that must be revealed to the buyer. But that may not hold true here..... :-)

[Scott]

I was traveling from Ramkamheng and turning on Suwintawong (Highway 304). There were a number of vehicles with red lights flashing and official gov't crests on the side. They were followed by Channel 7 and by Radio Thailand cars. Not in a terrible, terrible, hurry, but did jump the queue at the junction.

They were headed in the general direction of Chachaengsao. Any idea what's happening out that way?

Some big machines appear to be building a barrier around the Nong Chok junction and 304 as well. This just started late last night.

[Arkady]

I believe people who write a post like this should be required to begin with, I am from *name of country* Clearly, you can not be an American and hold this view. In Hurricane Katrina 1,836 people died, and property losses exceeded $81 billion. Lets not even talk about the oil disaster in the Gulf. Perhaps the UK? OMG...where to begin?

The question is, "Who are you to judge?" By the way, Thailand began planning for this in the 1990's, developed some clever plans, implemented them...and frankly...they are working! Really, you have no idea what you are talking about. Instead of pointing the finger, why not instead "lift it" to help someone today?

The way Thailand has dealt with and dealing with this is a joke, No preparation, Politicians and beauarcrats who are not up to the their jobs, a country where image is everything, substance non exsistent

Sorry you are incorrect. My friend Kritsada Arunvongse na Ayuthaya was Governor of Bangkok at the time of the 1995 floods. I discussed the plans with him at the time. For all strategic locations where considerable damage could be done in the event of a flood, a 1 in 1,000 year flood level should be considered especially as Bangkok is built on land that was reclaimed from the sea at the mouth of the river Chaophraya. At that time we realised that the 2.5metre flood walls would not prevent flooding in the future. He therefore put forward the schemes that you mentioned. The scheme was to raise the flood walls to 5.2metres high along the Chaopraya River and form a ring around Bangkok together with major diversion canals and pumping systems. This scheme was stopped by Banharn as he was PM at the time and from a different political party (i.e. no benefit seen). The Government scheme that went ahead at only 2.5metres high has not worked, otherwise we would not have seen so many Industrial Estates under water as well as parts of Bangkok already. As long as the flood walls remain at 2.5metres there is a real chance of it being breached at the high tide.

Many of the Industrial Estates have been built on cheap land next to the river with flood walls of only around 2.5metres high, most of these Industrial estates such as Hi-Tech and Bang Pa in (where I have worked), have been flooded. On the other hand, Navanakorn Industrial Estate, thanks to Kritsada's foresight; has a flood defence of 5.2metres. Kritsada died last year, however Nipit Arunvongse Na Ayuthya is now Managing Director of Navanakorn.

Currently they are hastily trying to raise the flood wall around Bangkok above 2.5metres high with sand bags, however Bangkok still runs the risk of floods since the October 30th high tide will be 2.3 metres (highest so far 2.19metres), plus the runoff from the north and from further rain. Whilst they are trying to blame younger politicians such as Yingluck and the Science Minister for being inexperienced, it was the older MPs that are still in Government, such as Banharn, that blocked the construction of the dykes to a height of 5.2metres that should be blamed.

Years ago, Bangkok was well drained as it was criss crossed by many drainage canals which were also the means of transport which was nearly all by boat. Bangkok was then known a "The Venice of the East". The politicians allowed most of the canals such as Sathorn to be filled in on advice from the Americans (who are being blamed by some for causing the floods). After filling the canals in, Bangkok was no longer known as the Venice of the East, but the "Land of Smiles", possibly after much money was made from building roads and erecting skyscrapers on what was drainage land. However little consideration appears to have been taken in mitigating the affect of turning the land, which would have absorbed the rains, to concrete. When the land is turned to concrete, the rains are not absorbed and it all has to flow through the greatly reduced capacity drainage system.

A nice well expressed post, it explains the facts, the causes and those responsible. A pleasant change from all those people here who try to twist every disaster into an attack on Thaksin. Perhaps, as has been suggested, many of these Yingluck/Thaksin haters are old retired farangs with nothing better to do.... Just for the record, I'm also an old retired farang , but I'm also a scientist ..... we think differently

Very interesting about the 5.2 metre dykes rejected by Banharn, the old crook. I hope this will come out more in the media. I think people are mainly blaming Yingluck and her administration for being late in realising this was a calamity that needed immediate attention and for being bumbling and inept in dealing with it once the calamity became an undisputed fact. They aren't being blamed for causing the situation. Thaksin doesn't seem to be taking any blame. He was in power with a strong majority for five years and perhaps could have addressed the problem and reversed Banharn's decision but what matters is what is done from now on.