Over The Top Homophobia In Iran

[Jingthing]

This would normally be very funny. But public lashings aren't so amusing.

Score a winning goal, feel a teammate's butt, get lashed.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/iranian-soccer-players-could-face-lashing-after-victory-groping/2011/11/02/gIQA334TfM_story.html

As millions watched on television, Nosrati appeared to be trying to push his hand between Rezaei’s buttocks.

...

According to the norms of ultra-conservative Iran, “this action can be considered a violation of public chastity,” Judge Valiollah Hosseini told the news agency. “The punishment of this crime is prison up to two months and 74 lashes.”

...

Iranian soccer stars say the authorities are overreacting to the latest indiscretion. Ali Parvin, a former Persepolis coach and a venerated figure in Iranian soccer, has spoken out against banning Nosrati and Rezaei, saying that officials should offer guidance to the players instead of punishing them.

“Come and execute them if it relieves you,” he said sarcastically.

[Ijustwannateach]

[cdnvic]

I though Imadinajawhatever said there were no gay people in Iran?

[LeCharivari]

I though Imadinajawhatever said there were no gay people in Iran?

Lots of people think that, but what he actually said (after translation) was "we don't have homosexuals in Iran like you have in your country (the USA)". Whether you like it or not or agree with the reasons why they don't have homosexuals as the States do, its obviously true but the second half is usually omitted to change the meaning of what he said.

I'm not defending him or Iran's policies in any way, just correcting a commonly held misconception - there are so many things to criticise about Ahmadinejad and Iran, particularly concerning gays, that I can't understand why people constantly pick on this example and that of Asgari and Marhoni when there are so many better examples to choose from.

[Jingthing]

A more recent clarification from Ahmadinejad.

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2011/10/ahmadinejad_s_assertion_about_gays_in_iran_isn_t_that_crazy_afte.html

At a press event two weeks ago, CNN’s Wolf Blitzer asked Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to elaborate on his notorious assertion from 2007 that there were no homosexuals in Iran. “My position hasn’t changed,” replied the defiant Ahmadinejad. He then acknowledged to Blitzer, begrudgingly, the tiny sliver of a possibility that there could be such monsters living amongst even the Sharia-centric Iranians. “Perhaps there are those who engage in [homosexual] activities … but these are not known elements within Iranian society. Rest assured, this is one of the ugliest behaviors in our society … but as the government, I cannot go out in the street and ask [my people] about their specific orientation.”

I'm not defending him or Iran's policies in any way, just correcting a commonly held misconception - there are so many things to criticise about Ahmadinejad and Iran, particularly concerning gays, that I can't understand why people constantly pick on this example and that of Asgari and Marhoni when there are so many better examples to choose from.

That's a very bizarre point considering this thread didn't mention Asgari and Marhoni until YOU brought them up.

Edited November 4, 2011 by Jingthing

[LeCharivari]

Not quite sure what's so "bizarre" about it - the two most commonly posted examples of Iranian homophobia on this forum are his edited/out of context quote about no gays in Iran and the allegation that Asgari and Mahoni were executed for being gay. Both are equally incorrect.

Your link's quotation of Ahmadinejad's answer is edited (not by you, I should add) and, again, does not reflect what he actually said - his full reply to the question is readily available and simply reflects Iranian Shia Muslim views.

As I said, I'm not defending him or his views, simply pointing out that it isn't necessary to misquote him or to give examples of homophobia in Iran that are incorrect when there are plenty of genuine examples available. If you can't see that and you prefer to go with the fabricated evidence instead, that's up to you.

[Jingthing]

Splitting hairs!

Anyway, the news story in the OP about the reaction to the football goal celebration is indeed a good example of homophobia in Iran.

[caphant]

The middle east by far THE most intollerant and homophobic places in the world, Whilst turkey isnt technically the middle east, it is encouraging to see the increasing number of attendance and support at annual Gay pride Instanbul

I think the LGBT movement is invaluable in leading the way towards overdo social reforms and equity. Wasnt iran the location of the execution of the 2 young boys (under 18) for alledgedly being gay some years back? still to this day that ranks among one of the most barbaric & cold acts ive seen in pictures to this day [ ]

[ludditeman]

I do think that some team sports players touch each other inappropriately in public during the games.

In this world of PC, some might even claim it was sexual harassment in the workplace.

A man certainly wouldn't dare touch a woman like that, when at work and on camera.

Fairs dos, same rules for everyone, regardless of their sexual orientation.

Although, to be fair, some might prefer a public lashing to kangaroo industrial tribuneral followed by summary dismissal and job blacklisting forever.

Edited December 1, 2011 by ludditeman

[Jingthing]

The middle east by far THE most intollerant and homophobic places in the world, Whilst turkey isnt technically the middle east, it is encouraging to see the increasing number of attendance and support at annual Gay pride Instanbul

I think the LGBT movement is invaluable in leading the way towards overdo social reforms and equity. Wasnt iran the location of the execution of the 2 young boys (under 18) for alledgedly being gay some years back? still to this day that ranks among one of the most barbaric & cold acts ive seen in pictures to this day [ ]

Actually, I think some countries in Africa are worse than the Middle east. I don't think there are any laws in the middle east sending people to jail for not reporting when they know about other people who are homosexuals.

In Iran's interpretation of Islamic sharia law, homosexuality is punishable severely including death. How many Iranian gays have actually suffered this is something we can't really know.

Edited December 1, 2011 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I do think that some team sports players touch each other inappropriately in public during the games.

In this world of PC, some might even claim it was sexual harassment in the workplace.

A man certainly wouldn't dare touch a woman like that, when at work and on camera.

Fairs dos, same rules for everyone, regardless of their sexual orientation.

Although, to be fair, some might prefer a public lashing to kangaroo industrial tribuneral followed by summary dismissal and job blacklisting forever.

You're taking the piss.

Obviously a sports league has the right to make rules and have punishments. But violent public lashings for a playful celebration? Come on.

[ludditeman]

Thats not what I said.

It was clearly a case of sexual harassment in the workplace.

Do you think it's OK to sexually assault someone (of whatever sex) when at work?

[Jingthing]

Thats not what I said.

It was clearly a case of sexual harassment in the workplace.

Do you think it's OK to sexually assault someone (of whatever sex) when at work?

I don't agree it was sexual harassment. I think it was a celebration and I think the players think it was a celebration. So not going to even entertain your fallacious theory that it was sex harassment.

Next ...

[ludditeman]

I feel a poll in the ladies forum coming on.

Dear ladies, if someone while you were working in the office, randomly slid their hand up your inner thigh, would you consider it sexual harassment?

You know, I don't think I need to actually conduct that poll to know what the outcome would be.

[Jingthing]

I feel a poll in the ladies forum coming on.

Dear ladies, if someone while you were working in the office, randomly slid their hand up your inner thigh, would you consider it sexual harassment?

You know, I don't think I need to actually conduct that poll to know what the outcome would be.

Not sure what your agenda is here, but it's whack.

[sbk]

I feel a poll in the ladies forum coming on.

Dear ladies, if someone while you were working in the office, randomly slid their hand up your inner thigh, would you consider it sexual harassment?

You know, I don't think I need to actually conduct that poll to know what the outcome would be.

Suggest you keep your trolling out of the gay forum and the ladies forum, cheers.

[LeCharivari]

..... Wasnt iran the location of the execution of the 2 young boys (under 18) for alledgedly being gay some years back? still to this day that ranks among one of the most barbaric & cold acts ive seen in pictures to this day [ ]

Thanks for demonstrating my point, albeit probably inadvertantly, caphant.

Asgar and Mahoni, the two "young boys (under 18)" were not executed "for allegedly being gay" but for the abduction at knifepoint from a shopping mall and gang rape of a 13 year old boy.

The argument against executions of anyone, especially minors, is a separate issue. Iran, as other countries, executes men and women regardless of gender or sexual preference - and, often, age.

My point is that if anyone wants to bash Iran and other homophobic countries then there's no shortage of examples that are true and people are more likely to believe what you say and act on it if there is at least some truth in what you say - there's no need to distort the truth.

Edited December 6, 2011 by LeCharivari

[Jingthing]

Why the obsession on that one case? The fact remains homosexuality is punishable by death in the Islamic Republic of Iran.

[Jingthing]

I should add it is really unknown how many gays have been officially murdered by the state in Iran (as opposed to those murdered by families in honor killings, vigilante actions, extrajudicial police murders (rape of gays by police is common), etc.). Quick research shows very small numbers over the years of under 10 people to over 5,000. In any case, it's bad enough the death laws are on the books there. That tells the people gays deserve to be killed.

Oh, back to the OP topic, the football players.

The verdict is in. No public lashings. Yippee. Money fines and long suspensions. One of them is shopping his talent abroad, good for him.

http://www.persianfootball.com/live/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3961:nosrati-and-rezaei-punished-severly-by-iff&catid=14:ipl-league-persian-gulf-cup&Itemid=180

Edited December 7, 2011 by Jingthing