I Ordered A Delay In The Release Of Water From Dam: Agriculture Minister Theera

[webfact]

FLOOD CRISIS

I ordered a delay in the release of water from dam : Theera

Kanittha Theppajorn,

Wichit Chaitrong

The Nation

Agriculture Minister Theera Wongsamut yesterday acknowledged that the controversial decision to delay the release of water from the country's major dams had been made by the government.

"I admit ordering a delay in the release of water into the plains areas so that farmers could harvest their crops first," he said.

Meanwhile, on the second day of the 2012 budget debate yesterday, the opposition warned the government that people frustrated by its mismanagement of the flood crisis might start rioting. Citing a Facebook statement by Finance Minister Thirachai Phuvanatnaranubala, Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat said the flood crisis would have been less severe if the number of rice harvests had been reduced from three to two this year, and the water released after the second.

Theera said storms had brought a lot of water in late June, with rain levels in the North over 50 per cent higher than usual. Therefore, the government had not wanted to release water, fearing it would cause more problems for farmers.

Within the minimum and maximum water levels allowed at the Bhumibol, Sirikit and Pasak Jolasit dams, specific decisions on when to release water needed to be made on a case-by-case basis, he said.

Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance.

Besides the poor water management, opposition leaders also claimed that the funds allocated for flood recovery were inadequate.

Democrat MP Wittaya Kaewparadai warned the government that people might take the law into their own hands, especially as many believe that politicians and state officials are lining their own pockets with donations.

After the 1995 floods, people in the South burned down the city hall because they believed the provincial governor was keeping donations to himself, he said, adding that he was concerned about the lack of transparency of the Bt120-billion rehabilitation plan.

"The government should review its populist policies such as tax breaks for first car and home-buyers. People are now buying their first boats," Wittaya said.

Satit Wongnongtaey, another Democrat MP, also questioned the Bt355.19 billion that the government has earmarked for flood recovery and flood-prevention measures.

"It seems to be a large amount compared to the total budget of Bt2.38 trillion, but details of the project point the other way," he noted.

He pointed out that the actual spending plan for flood recovery was about Bt200 billion, comprising a central fund of Bt120 billion, provincial fund of Bt10 billion and an emergency fund of Bt68.7 billion.

So far, the floods have affected 3 million families, killed 529 people, submerged 11 million rai of farmland and left about 700,000 workers temporarily jobless due to the inundation of seven industrial parks. He warned that more people would be out of jobs if the floods continued spreading into Bangkok and nearby provinces.

He blamed the government for responding far too slowly to the huge volumes of water that were flowing into three dams to the north of Bangkok since August.

Though the Cabinet discussed long-term flood prevention plans in early September, at a time when the North and Central regions were flooded, the ministers did little to consider solving the issue at hand.

"On October 7, the government promised that Bangkok would not be inundated," Satit said.

-- The Nation 2011-11-11

[ARGUSEYE]

"Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance".

That's how it is, and you better get used to it!

Don't believe the clown at the head of the meteorological department who said recently,that with a new weather radar system he could predict a whole monsoon season!

NONSENSE!!

Edited November 11, 2011 by metisdead
Font size reset to default.

[TheWalkingMan]

"Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance".

That's how it is, and you better get used to it!

Don't believe the clown at the head of the meteorological department who said recently,that with a new weather radar system he could predict a whole monsoon season!

NONSENSE!!

:lol: wait...

No matter what we have heard before, another official will top it. Amazing.

[whybother]

Doesn't the Nation have any journalists that can write a coherent article? It seems like the two journalists in this case wrote every second paragraph with out knowing what the previous paragraph said.

The key questions that weren't asked (or weren't reported): When did he order it? Did he make the decision on his own? I assume he was the one that said "I will take responsibility".

As far as the the meteorological department only being able to forecast a week in advance, even I had a pretty good idea 2 weeks before hand that the tropical storms were going to cause a lot of rain in the North and North East. There are websites that track and predict tropical storms and it was quite clear that these ones could affect Thailand as soon as they started forming near the Philippines. Even with a weeks notice they could have started releasing some water before the storms actually hit Thailand.

[maidu]

Thailand is basically a mono-crop culture. So much reliance on rice has its problems, and this flood only highlights one aspect of its problems. 16 months ago it was claimed by Thai gurus to be "The Worst Drought in 20 Years!". .....also problematic for rice.

Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat said the flood crisis would have been less severe if the number of rice harvests had been reduced from three to two this year, and the water released after the second.

Three crops per year on the same parcel?!?!? Even two crops per year is dicey. Soil need to be replenished, rejuvenated. Thais know nothing about composting and very little about mulching. Each year, many rice farmers burn most parts of the rice plant left over after harvesting. . Just as important, there are a slew of crops that are as well, or better suited to Thailand's climate/soil conditions. I've listed them before, so I'll just make a web page, rather than list them all again. Try Brazil Noi treesfor a reasonable alternative. Hemp is better crop than rice for a dozen reasons. Both have many times more value in baht/kilo and in nutrition.

If anyone asks you; "What's Wrong with Trying to Grow so much Rice in Thailand?" You can tell them the info above, and you can add that the rice in Thai food bowls is basically starch, nearly devoid of nutrients. It's like a filler or something to make paper mache glue. Such a nutrition-poor staple also affects the thinking ability of Thais - particularly children.

[jackdawson]

The truth, or at least some version of it, comes out.

[zydeco]

He should do the honorable thing and retire himself--permanently.

[jybkk]

Thailand is basically a mono-crop culture. So much reliance on rice has its problems, and this flood only highlights one aspect of its problems. 16 months ago it was claimed by Thai gurus to be "The Worst Drought in 20 Years!". .....also problematic for rice.

Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat said the flood crisis would have been less severe if the number of rice harvests had been reduced from three to two this year, and the water released after the second.

Three crops per year on the same parcel?!?!? Even two crops per year is dicey. Soil need to be replenished, rejuvenated. Thais know nothing about composting and very little about mulching. Each year, many rice farmers burn most parts of the rice plant left over after harvesting. . Just as important, there are a slew of crops that are as well, or better suited to Thailand's climate/soil conditions. I've listed them before, so I'll just make a web page, rather than list them all again. Try Brazil Noi treesfor a reasonable alternative. Hemp is better crop than rice for a dozen reasons. Both have many times more value in baht/kilo and in nutrition.

If anyone asks you; "What's Wrong with Trying to Grow so much Rice in Thailand?" You can tell them the info above, and you can add that the rice in Thai food bowls is basically starch, nearly devoid of nutrients. It's like a filler or something to make paper mache glue. Such a nutrition-poor staple also affects the thinking ability of Thais - particularly children.

Even from my "city-guy" perspective, Thailand's agriculture looks extremely conservative and narrow-minded.

I have the impression that they are obsessed with a few kind of crops and won't even try to consider if there are alternatives that can actually generate more revenue.

I had an interesting discussion with my in-laws, some of whom are farmers and land-owners upcountry. They laughed at me when I asked why they didn't try to get a loan to invest in machines who could help them take care of their rice crops. I was even ready to participate. I had an answer sounding like: "This farang is so funny, he clearly doesn't know anything about anything. Everyone knows you can't use no machine for harvesting rice".

It took me a minute on my mobile to find pictures of such machine as they are used in Japan or Korea.

At first, they were stunned... but they recovered quickly: "Oh, but that's in Japan! Here is Thailand, it's not the same. In Thailand, you cannot". End of discussion.

My guess is that there are a LOT of people who benefit from this ignorance from the farmers. And it includes those who pretend being their political voice.

[marquess]

He should do the honorable thing and retire himself--permanently.

Yeah he should straight to jail, for criminal negligence!

[Soutpeel]

Stop the press'....A Thai official actually being accountable and admitting it was his desicion......a few more like him and there is hope for Thailand....very impressed..

[lannarebirth]

The truth, or at least some version of it, comes out.

Well, what is emerging is "the story". It may bear some likeness to "the truth", but if it does that would be merely coincidental. Other stories will emerge, most likely contradicting this one and everyone will pick the one they like best; or perhaps they will become so disgusted by the web of lies they give up on their search fpr "the truth" altogether.

[maidu]

Why be so harsh in judgement. If he had let water release from dams - and it turned out to be a dry latter part of the monsoon, then he would be blamed not storing enough water for the 2nd or 3rd rice crop.

[ResX]

"Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance".

That's how it is, and you better get used to it!

Don't believe the clown at the head of the meteorological department who said recently,that with a new weather radar system he could predict a whole monsoon season!

NONSENSE!!

I'll be with you with this one. The longer the forecast lead time the less its reliability and accuracy. The problem is flood control operation for dams has to have lead time at least 6 months owing to huge amount of water in the dams and constraint on the amount of water can be released in a day.

[rogerw]

And Manslaughter

He should do the honorable thing and retire himself--permanently.

Yeah he should straight to jail, for criminal negligence!

[IsaanAussie]

Three crops per year on the same parcel?!?!? Even two crops per year is dicey. Soil need to be replenished, rejuvenated. Thais know nothing about composting and very little about mulching. Each year, many rice farmers burn most parts of the rice plant left over after harvesting. . Just as important, there are a slew of crops that are as well, or better suited to Thailand's climate/soil conditions. I've listed them before, so I'll just make a web page, rather than list them all again.

Maidu,

Bring these opinions over to the Farming Forum. It will cause a long discussion. I compost manures and I grow rice but the two do not necessary work together. The issue is the health of the soil but inundation with water kills most of the microbes and fills the air pockets that compost creates. IMHO it is not quite that easy. Having lived in the central provinces and seen 3 crops consistently produced I believe it is better planned than you give credit. Rice depletes the soil, obviously. Silica being one of the trace elements that is lost. Burning the stubble does put some of that back. The fertiliser used in the central is carefully applied based on both experience and analysis.

No it is not ideal to plant 3 times a year, and there are alternatives such as the Kings 30-30-30-10 plans for land usage. But if you can ever get rural Thai people to move away from rice as the staple for every meal I will be the first to congratulate you.

On the Ag Minister admission, I add my congratualtions as well, accepting responsible is part of his job which on balance I think he is doing well. I have known of others who have made public admissions of guilt on behalf of others, often falling on a golden sword, but this is Thailand!

Isaan Aussie.

[Squigy]

Thailand is basically a mono-crop culture. So much reliance on rice has its problems, and this flood only highlights one aspect of its problems. 16 months ago it was claimed by Thai gurus to be "The Worst Drought in 20 Years!". .....also problematic for rice.

Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat said the flood crisis would have been less severe if the number of rice harvests had been reduced from three to two this year, and the water released after the second.

Three crops per year on the same parcel?!?!? Even two crops per year is dicey. Soil need to be replenished, rejuvenated. Thais know nothing about composting and very little about mulching. Each year, many rice farmers burn most parts of the rice plant left over after harvesting. . Just as important, there are a slew of crops that are as well, or better suited to Thailand's climate/soil conditions. I've listed them before, so I'll just make a web page, rather than list them all again. Try Brazil Noi treesfor a reasonable alternative. Hemp is better crop than rice for a dozen reasons. Both have many times more value in baht/kilo and in nutrition.

If anyone asks you; "What's Wrong with Trying to Grow so much Rice in Thailand?" You can tell them the info above, and you can add that the rice in Thai food bowls is basically starch, nearly devoid of nutrients. It's like a filler or something to make paper mache glue. Such a nutrition-poor staple also affects the thinking ability of Thais - particularly children.

Even from my "city-guy" perspective, Thailand's agriculture looks extremely conservative and narrow-minded.

I have the impression that they are obsessed with a few kind of crops and won't even try to consider if there are alternatives that can actually generate more revenue.

I had an interesting discussion with my in-laws, some of whom are farmers and land-owners upcountry. They laughed at me when I asked why they didn't try to get a loan to invest in machines who could help them take care of their rice crops. I was even ready to participate. I had an answer sounding like: "This farang is so funny, he clearly doesn't know anything about anything. Everyone knows you can't use no machine for harvesting rice".

It took me a minute on my mobile to find pictures of such machine as they are used in Japan or Korea.

At first, they were stunned... but they recovered quickly: "Oh, but that's in Japan! Here is Thailand, it's not the same. In Thailand, you cannot". End of discussion.

My guess is that there are a LOT of people who benefit from this ignorance from the farmers. And it includes those who pretend being their political voice.

We had a visit from the Thai/German Organic Rice Co-operative here yesterday. About 8 guys and a translator. They where doing there annual inspection of the rice farms to see if they meet all the requirements of being "organic" and setting a price for this years crop.

The father-in-law has no idea about organic farming and was only interested in the price he might get later on in the year.

I asked the German guy who seemed to be in charge of this outfit if the figure's stacked up and he told me that they where "so so", meaning that he understood that these where all b/s figures and started to question the father-in-law who was lost in finding answers to his questions.

I know for a fact that this crop and many before it are not at all Organic, nor is the neighbours, however they have been sold this idea so that they will sell the rice to that mill who will then go and market the crop as 'Organic" and fetch a higher price that the farmer will not see.

I also mentioned to the father-in-law about using machinery to harvest the crop, but all he could was laugh and tell me what would a falang know about these things!!!

Bring on a decent education system for the kids of Isaan simpletons!

Edited November 11, 2011 by Squigy

[geriatrickid]

And what if the water had been released, the rice crop destroyed and the following weeks, the rain had stopped? I know what the sentiment would be. the same calls for the minister's suicide and jailing. Grow up.

Edited November 11, 2011 by sbk
baiting comment removed

[ResX]

Why be so harsh in judgement. If he had let water release from dams - and it turned out to be a dry latter part of the monsoon, then he would be blamed not storing enough water for the 2nd or 3rd rice crop.

You can expect this kind of uncertainty. It is very real. You have all the right to say so. It is actually a good sign to prove that dams operations in Thailand lacks of clear objectives. This is one of the root causes that contributed to the recent floods.

To be honest, it is unfair to put all the blames on this guy. There are many underlying problems to be rectified. It is fair to blame him as the person who made the 7th mistake that triggered a tragic consequences of event. This does not make him liable for the other six.

Random operations of dams are more dangerous than natural floods themselves.

Edited November 11, 2011 by ResX

[AleG]

And what if the water had been released, the rice crop destroyed and the following weeks, the rain had stopped? I know what the sentiment would be. the same calls for the minister's suicide and jailing. Grow up.

Then perhaps hundreds of lives would had been saved and billions of Baht in infrastructure damages wouldn't had been avoided and mayor industries wouldn't have collapsed. All to protect a money sucking crop, I think it would had been a fair compromise.

[jackal71]

Satit Wongnongtaey, another Democrat MP, also questioned the Bt355.19 billion that the government has earmarked for flood recovery and flood-prevention measures.

"It seems to be a large amount compared to the total budget of Bt2.38 trillion, but details of the project point the other way," he noted.

He pointed out that the actual spending plan for flood recovery was about Bt200 billion, comprising a central fund of Bt120 billion, provincial fund of Bt10 billion and an emergency fund of Bt68.7 billion.

What is the additional Bt155.19 for ?? Is it for prevention measures such as providing linings to protect assets ... such as the pockets of the politicians???

[Just1Voice]

"Oh, but that's in Japan! Here is Thailand, it's not the same. In Thailand, you cannot". End of discussion.

That is SOOOO TYPICALY Thai that sometimes I don't know whether or laugh or cry at their stupidity/arrogance/lack of common sense. I can't even count the number of times I've heard that. But two of my all time favorites are:

Transportation Minister to visiting counterpart: "Thai have different brain that other people. We are perfectly capable of talking and sending text messages while driving cars and motorbikes."

Same guy, later on: "It's really not necessary for Thai to wear helmets when driving motorbikes, as Thai have thicker skulls to protect them, unlike other people"

I actually agreed with the "thicker skull" comment, but NOT for the reasons he stated.

[metisdead]

A nonsense post and replies have been deleted.

[atulmangalmurti]

at last they found the scapegote for cooling down the pressure on PM. good move.

[msg362]

Thailand is basically a mono-crop culture. So much reliance on rice has its problems, and this flood only highlights one aspect of its problems. 16 months ago it was claimed by Thai gurus to be "The Worst Drought in 20 Years!". .....also problematic for rice.

Democrat MP Nipit Intarasombat said the flood crisis would have been less severe if the number of rice harvests had been reduced from three to two this year, and the water released after the second.

Three crops per year on the same parcel?!?!? Even two crops per year is dicey. Soil need to be replenished, rejuvenated. Thais know nothing about composting and very little about mulching. Each year, many rice farmers burn most parts of the rice plant left over after harvesting. . Just as important, there are a slew of crops that are as well, or better suited to Thailand's climate/soil conditions. I've listed them before, so I'll just make a web page, rather than list them all again. Try Brazil Noi treesfor a reasonable alternative. Hemp is better crop than rice for a dozen reasons. Both have many times more value in baht/kilo and in nutrition.

If anyone asks you; "What's Wrong with Trying to Grow so much Rice in Thailand?" You can tell them the info above, and you can add that the rice in Thai food bowls is basically starch, nearly devoid of nutrients. It's like a filler or something to make paper mache glue. Such a nutrition-poor staple also affects the thinking ability of Thais - particularly children.

Even from my "city-guy" perspective, Thailand's agriculture looks extremely conservative and narrow-minded.

I have the impression that they are obsessed with a few kind of crops and won't even try to consider if there are alternatives that can actually generate more revenue.

I had an interesting discussion with my in-laws, some of whom are farmers and land-owners upcountry. They laughed at me when I asked why they didn't try to get a loan to invest in machines who could help them take care of their rice crops. I was even ready to participate. I had an answer sounding like: "This farang is so funny, he clearly doesn't know anything about anything. Everyone knows you can't use no machine for harvesting rice".

It took me a minute on my mobile to find pictures of such machine as they are used in Japan or Korea.

At first, they were stunned... but they recovered quickly: "Oh, but that's in Japan! Here is Thailand, it's not the same. In Thailand, you cannot". End of discussion.

My guess is that there are a LOT of people who benefit from this ignorance from the farmers. And it includes those who pretend being their political voice.

What?

I've just filmed combine harvesters harvesting rice paddy here in Sankamphaeng ( Chiang Mai). Very fast. I'm told it's cheaper than employing ten people for 3-4 days. I have been trying to find the 'traditional' way of harvesting to film - backbreaking work- and had some difficulty. Five years go here it was all manual labour, now most is by machine.

[Xonax]

"The government should review its populist policies such as tax breaks for first car and home-buyers. People are now buying their first boats," Wittaya said.

Well said. I like this guy.

[beano2274]

I commented a long time ago, that some of the rice fields that would have been affected belonged to a certain Mr Thaksin, as I heard it from some Thai friends, seems pressure was put on this Minister to wait so Mr. Thaksin and his friends could get their crops harvested.

[robblok]

And what if the water had been released, the rice crop destroyed and the following weeks, the rain had stopped? I know what the sentiment would be. the same calls for the minister's suicide and jailing. Grow up.

Its a big mistake and with huge consequence. The whole government should step down, or the guy should be held personal responsible.

They are paid good (or steal good) so if they make mistakes they should pay for it too. The is a reason that people like that earn more money. That is because they have more responsibility. This is like saying sorry but i wont quit or feel responsible.

Must be tough to see your beloved reds the cause of this whole mess. They could no longer deny it. Yingluck with her blaming the previous government

[hellodolly]

And what if the water had been released, the rice crop destroyed and the following weeks, the rain had stopped? I know what the sentiment would be. the same calls for the minister's suicide and jailing. Grow up.

Then perhaps hundreds of lives would had been saved and billions of Baht in infrastructure damages wouldn't had been avoided and mayor industries wouldn't have collapsed. All to protect a money sucking crop, I think it would had been a fair compromise.

Duh

If the rains had stopped no one would have died no matter what they had done the week before.

[OzMick]

Stop the press'....A Thai official actually being accountable and admitting it was his desicion......a few more like him and there is hope for Thailand....very impressed..

right, accountable idiots is the answer.

[Buchholz]

I commented a long time ago, that some of the rice fields that would have been affected belonged to a certain Mr Thaksin, as I heard it from some Thai friends, seems pressure was put on this Minister to wait so Mr. Thaksin and his friends could get their crops harvested.

I have heard of this as well from Thais. It was said to be a super hybrid of rice commanding a very high price and thus an extremely valuable crop... as long as the lands growing it weren't flooded.