Incident At Massage Parlour

[Darrel]

"Firstly I was repulsed and embarrassed that a child was seeing me naked, secondly, I consider this as child exploitation and thirdly; this could have been a set up or a scam where suddenly the BiB crash in and I become the main item for tomorrow`s Thai visa news clippings section."

And they could have set you up with some hidden drugs, which would have been many times more serious. Both are rather unlikely though.

I think some people worry far too much about what appears to me (and probably would appear to 99% of Thais) to be just a girl doing her job.

[bonobo]

I like massages, and I used to get them regularly before I moved and getting to the massage parlor was more stress than what was relieved from the massage itself. And at my normal parlor, it was full nudity with my regular masseuse while on my stomach, and just a casually placed towel when on my back, but never even a hint of anything extra.

If you have been going to this place for awhile, and there has never been a hint of extra services, I doubt that you were being set up. I think the mother probably thought nothing of it, like the parents of 8-year-olds who help them at the family restaurants. Just a child helping in the family business.

Having written that, though, you acted correctly. You should have stopped the massage as you did. The mother needs to know that even if she thinks this is proper behavior, it is not OK with customers at the very least. And while I hate to pass judgment when I don't think there is ill intent, I don't think it is appropriate for youngsters to be giving massages to naked adults.

[Moonrakers]

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

There's ALWAYS one.

Anyway. Maybe your complaints will make the mother think twice about having her daughter give massages BeetleJuice.

[Ohyesuare]

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

Exactly, I call bullshit. If you want a legit massage keep your underwear on and why was the OP so worried if he has "contacts" in the police.

[thaiman]

I only tried oil massage once and thought it was worthless,

but i have done traditional massage hundreds of times,

and what i would object to is the lack of strength that a 15 year ole possess.

I'm unable to see any sexual stuff in this

I agree. How does the OP know sex was on offer for the exchange of money? Did he ask the girl? We can't assume that because this girl massaged your leg that she wanted to do anything sexual. The OP is jumping to conclusions and so is everybody else. If she touched your private parts, then I'd totally understand and agree with the sexual connotations others are using here.

What the real issue here is weather or not the 15 year old girl is able to work legally as a massage therapist or not. Anyone know the law concerning this?

[Fookhaht]

Kudos to the OP for his moral fiber and willingness to confront in a risky situation! The massage shop owner/manager should be sitting in a prison today.

By posting his experience and reaction here, BeetleJuice encourages every TV reader to be wary, and do the right thing should they find themselves in a similar scenario.

P.S. Ever thought of forwarding your experience to CNN's anti-human trafficking project? It would be so sweet to see them come back to Thailand and "out" this creep.

[SimonD]

I also believe the OP did the right thing. In situations like that always cover your own back. The mistake I believe he made was not establishing who was going to give the massage before it began. After several painful experiences I would ask my masseuse about her training and certificates first. Untrained masseuses/masseurs can do more harm than good. One note of advice from a qualified Thai masseuse friend of mine (married to a farang): if they ever put any pressure on your spine they don't know what they are doing. Leave immediately.

[elliss]

It's a good thing you didn't phone the cops.

it could well be a set up with the local cops ,

if she was massaging your private parts ,

the police conveniently walk in

30,000 BHT. BYE BYE

TIT :jap:

[thaibeachlovers]

Personally I would think twice about a massage parlour that only supplies a towel no larger than a facecloth.

In my experience, Thai massage they give you those funny supersized pyjama things (I mean seriously has there ever been someone big enough to need a 340cm waist?). Oil massage they normally don't give you anything at all (I keep the Reg Grundies on)...

Best massage ever was from a 40 year old across the road from the Hotel in Udon... she was telling me how she had needed to call the police to evict a Swiss customer who got very agressive when no happy ending was forthcoming...

Never had a great masage from a girl under 30...

Cheers,

Darryl...

Hmmmm. This is not a comment on the OP, but in my experience, "straight" massage places always provide those big pyjama pants, and if the place didn't provide them, I'd assume it was at the least open to providing happy endings.

Anyway, yes, get out straight away in a situation like that, but couldn't you ask for an older masseuse, without inviting trouble by refusing to pay?

[thaibeachlovers]

I also believe the OP did the right thing. In situations like that always cover your own back. The mistake I believe he made was not establishing who was going to give the massage before it began. After several painful experiences I would ask my masseuse about her training and certificates first. Untrained masseuses/masseurs can do more harm than good. One note of advice from a qualified Thai masseuse friend of mine (married to a farang): if they ever put any pressure on your spine they don't know what they are doing. Leave immediately.

Hmmmm, I get my wife to walk on my back, to relocate any vertebrae that have become misaligned, so I would dispute that putting pressure on the spine is harmful, unless you mean someting different from what I think you mean.

Agreed that it is necessary to be aware of who is doing what in any female staffed establishment, though that would apply anywhere in this overly PC world, where the man is always guilty.

[thaibeachlovers]

Whether there was sexual intent there or not you will never know OP but you certainly acted properly.

My feeling is if this was an innocent error of judgement from the mother she wouldn't have been haranguing you for the money.

Perhaps she didn't understand what the problem was.

[SimonD]

I also believe the OP did the right thing. In situations like that always cover your own back. The mistake I believe he made was not establishing who was going to give the massage before it began. After several painful experiences I would ask my masseuse about her training and certificates first. Untrained masseuses/masseurs can do more harm than good. One note of advice from a qualified Thai masseuse friend of mine (married to a farang): if they ever put any pressure on your spine they don't know what they are doing. Leave immediately.

Hmmmm, I get my wife to walk on my back, to relocate any vertebrae that have become misaligned, so I would dispute that putting pressure on the spine is harmful, unless you mean someting different from what I think you mean.

Agreed that it is necessary to be aware of who is doing what in any female staffed establishment, though that would apply anywhere in this overly PC world, where the man is always guilty.

Maybe I should have been more specific. She told me that properly trained and qualified masseuses/masseurs do not apply direct pressure to the spinal column or lumbar region (ie pushing down hard on a vertebrae or into the gap) Your wife, trained or not, is not applying direct pressure just by walking on your back as the load is spread across the sole of her foot. I'm not a trained masseur, just passing on very good advice from a professional friend. I haven't a clue what you thought I may have inferred 'differently'.

[MrsMills]

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

Exactly, I call bullshit. If you want a legit massage keep your underwear on and why was the OP so worried if he has "contacts" in the police.

Have to say, I agree.

[Briggsy]

I would bet it was not her daughter. Just another mama san with a young, underage girl to make money off. Very sad and very common particularly in the domestic scene.

Cubicles, nudity, oil and massage parlours will end up in sexual activity of some sort or other.

[Mitker]

Quite responsible behavior in such circumstances. You did the right thing.

[92302]

It is only self delusion that starting a topic online about an event that took place and fabricating the facts will be enough to secure a victory if ever a case was bought forward.

[Fookhaht]

It is only self delusion that starting a topic online about an event that took place and fabricating the facts will be enough to secure a victory if ever a case was bought forward.

Two things about this sad little post:

1) The epitome of cynicism

2) Not one ounce of legal sense. Ultimate naivete.

Speaking to #2: No amount of posting on a public forum under an assumed name is going to win many legal battles, especially in a scenario like this.

Get real.

[MrsMills]

It is only self delusion that starting a topic online about an event that took place and fabricating the facts will be enough to secure a victory if ever a case was bought forward.

Two things about this sad little post:

1) The epitome of cynicism

2) Not one ounce of legal sense. Ultimate naivete.

Speaking to #2: No amount of posting on a public forum under an assumed name is going to win many legal battles, especially in a scenario like this.

Get real.

A very sensible post, very unusual for Thai Visa General Topics.

Usually it's a load of crap.

Edited December 19, 2011 by MrsMills

[Ulysses G.]

Cubicles, nudity, oil and massage parlours will end up in sexual activity of some sort or other.

That is how I see it.

[Shurup]

For a traditional massage you get oversized pants and pajama (sp??) and for the old massage you get naked and covered with a towel, however the towel isn't supposed to come off at any time during the massage. That was always my experience and I never had or wanted a happy ending at the massage. I prefer traditional more than oil just because I don't like walking outside oily.

[philw]

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

Yeah, one would think that a normal person has at least a vague idea who he's going to be naked with.

If only to determine the need for a paper bag...........

[elwood]

Kudos to the OP for his moral fiber and willingness to confront in a risky situation! The massage shop owner/manager should be sitting in a prison today.

By posting his experience and reaction here, BeetleJuice encourages every TV reader to be wary, and do the right thing should they find themselves in a similar scenario.

P.S. Ever thought of forwarding your experience to CNN's anti-human trafficking project? It would be so sweet to see them come back to Thailand and "out" this creep.

"The massage owner should be sitting in a prison ; forward it to CNN reference anti-human trafficking?"

Congratulations , you have won the award for the greatest overreaction comment of the day.

Even the OP didn't know what the intentions were, but you, although not being there, know everything - well done!

[Beetlejuice]

The situation has been dealt with a few hours ago.

For legal reasons I am unable to elaborate all the details, but the owner has been given a warning and cautioned by the police that if any more reports are filed regarding under the legal age workers on her business premises, then she will be charged within the criminal law and her business closed down.

So if this was all done in innocence, at least the owner was not treated too harshly and for the time being the kids are out of harms way. Yes, there was more than one. Also the premises will be watched for the time being.

Have no wish to take this any further and consider the outcome as a result. I believe a good thing has been achieved here. I have no wish to destroy a long running family business, all I was interested in, is the welfare of the children and that no unsuspecting tourists or expats get caught up in this. It has been discretely nipped in the bud.

Thank you for all your support, which has made me believe that this has all been worthwhile. But in future there will be no more oil massages for me.

[Chonburiram]

1324273922[/url]' post='4922080']

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

+1

[richard_smith237]

1324273922[/url]' post='4922080']

Sorry ,I just can't believe someone would go for a massage,be naked in a room ( apart from a small towel ) and not even look at the person before the massage is started.

+1

Your call. But it happens and its quite normal. Why would I look at the person giving me a massage? Does it matter what they look like?

That said, I now have to play devils advocate with myself and point out that I wouldn't want a massage from a fella... I don't really know why, but its not going to happen.

So... My 'oil / aroma' massages have always been with the dodgy netting panties which I hate so I take a spare pair of boxers, but we don't always plan for when we want a massage. So, a towel is sometimes fine, it never comes off though. Places like healthland are only ever legitimate massages.

Regarding the OP: That's exactly the way we should all play a suspicious situation in any country. Kudos.

[terrychris]

I dont think you will regret this post, in fact I believe thanks should go to you for raising this issue or at least bringing some further awareness to this problem. Legally and morally you acted correctly.

I too had a situation where on a non boom boom massage for a back problem the girl seemed very young so i checked her ID first even though it was a legitimate therapeutic massage business.

Cant be too careful on this issue guys... Australian Federal police as with other countries have staff over here tracking down pedophiles and while non of the behaviours as per the OP's post or my comments above have anything to do with pedophilia you know that as older males we are deemed guilty first.

Last two massages for a locking back issue that i have had have been with a big ole mamasan... far safer and generally allot better as well.

Your right........................and you'll never be able to pick them.

[MrsMills]

Thank you for all your support, which has made me believe that this has all been worthwhile. But in future there will be no more oil massages for me.

And this Thai family that you have put in the spotlight, they know that its you do they ?

Edited December 19, 2011 by MrsMills

[richard_smith237]

Thank you for all your support, which has made me believe that this has all been worthwhile. But in future there will be no more oil massages for me.

And this Thai family that you have put in the spotlight, they know that its you do they ?

I suspect so. Who else has made a song and dance and walked out refusing to pay up for a morally disgraceful situation.

Which part of this families actions could anyone attempt to defend? Putting a 15 year old daughter to work massaging a naked male is only understandable for the morally reprehensible.

There is nothing ‘right’ about this. It’s either greed combined with innocent ignorance in its simplest form, or its something more wrong on a whole other level.

I might have a better understanding of how anyone could possibly attribute any criticism to the OP only if they think there is nothing morally wrong with the situation. In that case I would bring the person questioning the OP into greater question.

[Moonrakers]

Thank you for all your support, which has made me believe that this has all been worthwhile. But in future there will be no more oil massages for me.

And this Thai family that you have put in the spotlight, they know that its you do they ?

I suspect so. Who else has made a song and dance and walked out refusing to pay up for a morally disgraceful situation.

Which part of this families actions could anyone attempt to defend? Putting a 15 year old daughter to work massaging a naked male is only understandable for the morally reprehensible.

There is nothing 'right' about this. It's either greed combined with innocent ignorance in its simplest form, or its something more wrong on a whole other level.

I might have a better understanding of how anyone could possibly attribute any criticism to the OP only if they think there is nothing morally wrong with the situation. In that case I would bring the person questioning the OP into greater question.

You need to bear in mind you are addressing Mrs Mills.

In his/her eyes, Thais are never wrong. Never. Must have been the fault of the OP.

[wamberal]

Whenever I read yet another newspaper article beating up on Westerners chasing under-age sex in places like Thailand, I think back to my days working on an Australian aid project which involved working with a large Thai public corporation. Every night out with my Thai colleagues ended up in, or near, a massage parlour, and on more than one occasion I was offered a clearly under-age girl - particularly when I was in Chiang Mai.

The sexual exploitation of children is abhorrent but, guess what, the vast majority of perpetrators, and especially facilitators, of this evil are not westerners.

Edited December 20, 2011 by wamberal