Death Toll Reaches 94 On Second Of Seven New Year's Dangerous Days: Thailand

Lite Beer · December 31, 2011

12 killed, 15 hurt in Buri Ram road accident

The Nation on Sunday

A crowded Bangkok-Si Sa Ket tour bus collided with a pick-up truck in Buri Ram's Nang Rong district yesterday morning, killing 12 people and injuring 15. The Road Safety Centre, meanwhile, yesterday reported the casualty toll for the first two days of the seven-day New Year's holiday danger period at 94 deaths and 1,051 injuries in 955 accidents.

Nang Rong police and rescue workers called to the Ban Sing Intersection on Nang Rong-Chamni Road discovered the bus and the wrecked, overturned pick-up truck in a roadside ditch. Inside the truck police found 12 dead bodies and one seriously injured person. A police investigation found that the truck was carrying relatives to assist a funeral in Buri Ram's Nong Hong district, and that the bus carried 50 passengers. Bus driver Somkiat Chutrakul, 34, and 13 bus passengers were injured. Police were investigating the cause of accident.

Land Transport Department chief Somchai Siriwattanachok told members of the media yesterday at the Road Safety Centre that four provinces - Kamphaeng Phet, Chaiyaphum, Trat and Nong Khai - had been free of road accidents as of yesterday.

On December 30, 58 people were killed (up by three from 2010) and 578 injured (down by 92) in 547 accidents (down by 72) nation-wide, he said.

Most accidents involved motorcycles (82.41 per cent). Among the main causes were drunk driving at 34.19 per cent and speeding (21.02 per cent). A total of 705,312 vehicles were stopped at 2,459 checkpoints and 89,715 motorists were found to have broken the traffic law, mostly by not wearing helmets and not carrying driver's licences. The 955 cumulative road accidents were fewer than the same period last year by 57 cases, the injuries down by 44 cases but deaths were up by 15 cases, he said.

Trang had the most cumulative accidents at 37, followed by Nakhon Sawan (36), while Nakhon Pathom and Ayutthaya shared the highest number of deaths at six cases each. Trang and Nakhon Sawan also had the highest cumulative number of injuries at 41 and 37 cases, respectively.

Holiday travellers yesterday continued to head to the provinces. The Northeast gateway province of Nakhon Ratchasima's Mitraparp Highway saw heavy congestion, with 20,000 policemen dispatched to man checkpoints. Bangkok's Mor Chit Bus Terminal was also crowded; Transport Co Ltd said up to 170,000 travellers passed through the terminal to take 7,317 bus trips.

-- The Nation 2012-01-01

Nisa · December 31, 2011

Motorcycles 82 per cent of the accidents? I was surprised it was that high.

I find it hard to believe a lot of the Thai road statistics that I read. Sometimes they seem to be made up.

why? everyone and anyone from ten years old up can ride a motorbike. and there are up to five people on a small bike and ONLY the driver has to have a helmet. no license, no brains, no training and no common sense make the 82% believeable

Actually a passenger on a motorbike does have to wear a helmet too (legally) in Thailand. You may be thinking of seat belts in a car where only the people in the front need to legally buckle up.

But no doubt the lack of helmet use and enforcement are the reasons for the higher number of deaths but also the fact their are more motorcycles on the roads than cars.

Both the seat belt and helmet laws are being enforced much more over the last year or two but still a ways to go.

Edited January 1, 2012 by Nisa

Nisa · January 1, 2012

12 killed, 15 hurt in Buri Ram road accident

The Nation on Sunday

Nang Rong police and rescue workers called to the Ban Sing Intersection on Nang Rong-Chamni Road discovered the bus and the wrecked, overturned pick-up truck in a roadside ditch. Inside the truck police found 12 dead bodies and one seriously injured person. A police investigation found that the truck was carrying relatives to assist a funeral in Buri Ram's Nong Hong district, and that the bus carried 50 passengers.

How very tragic. The surviving family members in Nong Hong must be in utter shock.

whybother · January 1, 2012

About 30+ people die in road accidents on any given day in Thailand. This jump doesn't seem all that out of line with many other countries during the holidays .. though the holidays seems extended in Thailand beyond just the actual day.

Australia has a "Holiday Road Toll Period" which basically goes from Christmas Eve to New Years Day. At the moment it stands at 38 (22 mil population).

kwonitoy · January 1, 2012

After 17 years of accident free driving in Thailand it comes down to this

"Thai police PRETEND to enforce the rules"

"Thai drivers PRETEND to obey them"

Be carefull out there

Edited January 1, 2012 by kwonitoy

Nisa · January 1, 2012

About 30+ people die in road accidents on any given day in Thailand. This jump doesn't seem all that out of line with many other countries during the holidays .. though the holidays seems extended in Thailand beyond just the actual day.

Australia has a "Holiday Road Toll Period" which basically goes from Christmas Eve to New Years Day. At the moment it stands at 38 (22 mil population).

The US probably does too in terms of having a more than average number of accidents/deaths during this week but generally they only report in the news about New Years Eve or the New Years Eve (holidays) week end. Actually it is interesting because there was just a news story out about the myth in the US about New Years being the most dangerous time to drive. More road deaths actually occur in the US on July 4th (Independence Day) than New Years. In fact, New Years ranked 7th for road deaths. Not sure about everywhere else but much more people hit the roads in Thailand to go back home during the New Years and Songkran break. It isn't even typical in the US for people to have the entire week off unless they took these days as personal vacation days.

If they want to cut down on holiday road deaths in Thailand then they should cut down on the number of New Year celebrations. I can think of at least 3 ... Western Calendar New Years, Songkran (3-days), Chinese New Year (2-weeks?).

eddys · January 1, 2012

When you can easily buy a driving licence there has to be problems. Even if you get one "properly" and don't really know how to drive there are problems. Most (no not all) Thias I have seen have no idea of vehicle position on the road or vehicle size, rules are non existant, vehicle dynamics and limitations are unknown to most drivers, It's interesting my Thai family refer as put doiwn to "Asia drivers" when they see the bad Asian drivers in Australia (don't worry plenty of bad Asssie drivers but no where near the same proportion.

The answer better driver training, better driver attitude, better roads, policing and laws have a very limited effect, lots of Thai drivers should not be allowed to drive for lots of different reasons.

Nisa · January 1, 2012

When you can easily buy a driving licence there has to be problems. Even if you get one "properly" and don't really know how to drive there are problems. Most (no not all) Thias I have seen have no idea of vehicle position on the road or vehicle size, rules are non existant, vehicle dynamics and limitations are unknown to most drivers, It's interesting my Thai family refer as put doiwn to "Asia drivers" when they see the bad Asian drivers in Australia (don't worry plenty of bad Asssie drivers but no where near the same proportion.

The answer better driver training, better driver attitude, better roads, policing and laws have a very limited effect, lots of Thai drivers should not be allowed to drive for lots of different reasons.

Agree 100% but then again I would like to see many drivers in the west attempt to drive in Bangkok for a day without an accident. Although there are lots of people having no business being on the road, there are an awful lot of very aware drivers ... at least in Bangkok. My biggest thing with actual bad common driving habits in Thailand is following to close .... I would guess, behind drunk driving, this is one of the top accident causes.

BookMan · January 1, 2012

When you can easily buy a driving licence there has to be problems. Even if you get one "properly" and don't really know how to drive there are problems. Most (no not all) Thias I have seen have no idea of vehicle position on the road or vehicle size, rules are non existant, vehicle dynamics and limitations are unknown to most drivers, It's interesting my Thai family refer as put doiwn to "Asia drivers" when they see the bad Asian drivers in Australia (don't worry plenty of bad Asssie drivers but no where near the same proportion.

The answer better driver training, better driver attitude, better roads, policing and laws have a very limited effect, lots of Thai drivers should not be allowed to drive for lots of different reasons.

Agree 100% but then again I would like to see many drivers in the west attempt to drive in Bangkok for a day without an accident. Although there are lots of people having no business being on the road, there are an awful lot of very aware drivers ... at least in Bangkok. My biggest thing with actual bad common driving habits in Thailand is following to close .... I would guess, behind drunk driving, this is one of the top accident causes.

I agree that many westerners would find driving in bkk difficult. I guess part of that is the conditions are very different and if you drove here regularly you would get used to relatively quickly.

I am surprised at how few rear enders I have seen on bangkok roads for how close people drive to each other. The ever changing lanes in slow moving traffic when there is no gap (pushing in). The crazy u-turns where two lanes u-turn simultaneously and the oncoming traffic seems to stop in time. The lack of road rage in frustratingly snail paced moving traffic.

I also think a lot of the thais show better reverse parking skills. A lot of Australian drivers i have seen would struggle to do some of the reverse parks i have seen here.

Nisa · January 1, 2012

I also think a lot of the thais show better reverse parking skills. A lot of Australian drivers i have seen would struggle to do some of the reverse parks i have seen here.

Have you noticed that everyone backs into their parking space in the parking garages? I don't comprehend this. It is much easier to back out of a space, into a wide open lane, than to back into one between two parked cars.

Thaifever · January 1, 2012

Guaranteed the bus was driving too fast. As does everyone in Thailand. And guaranteed the pick up truck driver barely checked oncoming traffic, if at all, before pulling out. Everyone needs to slow down. Full size buses should be traveling no more than 80 to 100 kph. They don't pay the drivers well and you end up with unqualified people who really have nothing to lose. What can you expect when you pay 150 baht for a ticket?

I won't take the mini vans anymore if at all possible, and even though I take the big buses, the drivers still drive too fast and change 2 or three lanes in one quick move. Back home buses are a nice way to relax and read a book or sleep. Here, depending on the driver, you wonder if you're going to make it in one piece. If you want to be safe driving in Thailand, drive a sherman tank.

South · January 1, 2012

Every year we have the same forum discussion, nothing changes.

Indeed!

In perspective we all 'know' that the traffic laws are way too lax, hence all the accidents/injuries/deaths etc etc ..... BUT, in reality, those same lax laws are one of many reasons why so many westerners/farangs etc like this nation. It's just an escape from your home country's laws/regulations, is it not? I'm sure that when most of you go to/visit your homeland and one of the things you 'brag' about to your friends IS the lax traffic laws.

Having said that, all these injuries/deaths are not nice to hear/read about but they do happen and we, as 'allowed visitors' will never be able to make a difference to the ingenious way of thinking. If you think you can change things, I wish you the very best of luck.

Edited January 1, 2012 by South

BookMan · January 1, 2012

I also think a lot of the thais show better reverse parking skills. A lot of Australian drivers i have seen would struggle to do some of the reverse parks i have seen here.

Have you noticed that everyone backs into their parking space in the parking garages? I don't comprehend this. It is much easier to back out of a space, into a wide open lane, than to back into one between two parked cars.

Now u mention it i can see that. Why do u think that is? I have noticed there is often someone at the shopping centre car park or condo car park to guide you as u back in.

Slightly off topic..My personal favourite in car parks is when another driver parks perpendicular to the end/front of your car which is parked in a space. the driver kindly leaves the car in neutral and you then have to roll the car away from yours to exit.

The first time I experienced this and we were blocked in, my GF at the time got at the back of the car to push it and asked me to help her. I thought she was joking until an old bloke came and joined her to push it away.

Nisa · January 1, 2012

I also think a lot of the thais show better reverse parking skills. A lot of Australian drivers i have seen would struggle to do some of the reverse parks i have seen here.

Have you noticed that everyone backs into their parking space in the parking garages? I don't comprehend this. It is much easier to back out of a space, into a wide open lane, than to back into one between two parked cars.

Now u mention it i can see that. Why do u think that is? I have noticed there is often someone at the shopping centre car park or condo car park to guide you as u back in.

Slightly off topic..My personal favourite in car parks is when another driver parks perpendicular to the end/front of your car which is parked in a space. the driver kindly leaves the car in neutral and you then have to roll the car away from yours to exit.

The first time I experienced this and we were blocked in, my GF at the time got at the back of the car to push it and asked me to help her. I thought she was joking until an old bloke came and joined her to push it away.

LMAO ... same thing happened with my wife (girlfriend at the time). Not only was I shocked when she started to push the other car because of her very respectfulness towards others as well as her size but also because I thought she lost her mind and believed somehow she could push a parked car out of our way. In this case the person did not leave the car in neutral (it was at a park and the guy just parked to close for us to get out) and I was just in shock as she kept trying to push the car baffled why it would not move and looked at me wondering why I wasn't helping. Then she tried to explain to me the person should have kept the car in neutral but I still thought she was going nuts until we moved to a condo where this was common to do.

I never noticed the backing in thing until we went to the mall and she asked me why I parked the wrong way ... sure enough I took a look around and every single car on that parking deck was backed into the space. I tried to explain it made no sense but she was (and still is) convinced I am the one with the parking issue.

Probably the other thing that baffles me a bit is how pedestrians not only don't have the right of way but that drivers seem to go out of their way to remind pedestrians of this. I'd be curious to know the pedestrian vs. car rate accidents in Thailand compared to other countries.

fred110 · January 1, 2012

Just yesterday I renewed my Thai driver's license in Chiang Mai for another 5 years. Unlike the last time I renewed, I had to re-do the traffic light colour recognition test, as well as the accelerator & then brake pedal reaction test.

I was amazed at how many Thai people in my test group actually failed the brake reaction test & really had no idea!

I was then made to sit through a 1 hour English language video presentation on Thai road safety & road rules, before they'd issue me with my renewed drivers license. I remember clearly watching this video and dreaming of what a pleasant place Thai roads would be to use, if they only enforced all these road rules & regulations and actually practiced what they preached in this road safety video!

All very sad - tragic actually, that so many lives are lost and lives destroyed as a result of road mayhem - especially over the New Year & Songkran holiday periods.....

Small steps. Education is a key part.

Education? About driving. Now thats a joke. Thai's can hardly teach children to read or write.

Now try to teach them not to drive on the wrong side of the road, no matter how inconvienent that next u-turn is. Or they really need to have the lights on when driving after it is dark, and a 30 baht flash light is not an alterative. Maybe try an educate them how to use a turn signal, good luck with that one. I believe the highest speed limit is 120kph on some motorways, I am sure if you ask any Thai, their answer will be as fast as I like anywhere, or as slow as I like anywhere for that matter, in any travel lane.

Teaching Thai's to drive is like trying to to them common sence. It just cant be done.

Enforcement is a key, and I doubt that will happen either.

Enforcement would be nice, but the cops break all the laws too. Probably don't even know the laws themselves.

BookMan · January 1, 2012

Probably the other thing that baffles me a bit is how pedestrians not only don't have the right of way but that drivers seem to go out of their way to remind pedestrians of this. I'd be curious to know the pedestrian vs. car rate accidents in Thailand compared to other countries.

Very true. Not many drivers will stop for you, even if u find yourself stuck in the middle of a road or lane.

whybother · January 1, 2012

3rd day of 7 danger days for road accidents see 164 deaths and 1,818 injuries/TAN_Network

165 deaths, 1,782 injuries in 1,605 road accidents reported in the first 3 days of 7-day travel period of New Year holiday: Road Safety Centre

/MCOT

I wonder who compiles the figures.

Langsuan Man · January 1, 2012

Darwinism at work during the holidays

But really this thread should be closed due to Rule 8

8) Not to post extremely negative views of Thailand or derogatory comments directed towards all Thais.

Nisa · January 1, 2012

3rd day of 7 danger days for road accidents see 164 deaths and 1,818 injuries/TAN_Network

165 deaths, 1,782 injuries in 1,605 road accidents reported in the first 3 days of 7-day travel period of New Year holiday: Road Safety Centre

/MCOT

I wonder who compiles the figures.

I'd guess this is reports from hospitals, in part because, the injury numbers are higher than the total accident numbers. Not to mention there is simply no way, given their technology, that the police can be compiling this information that quickly. My guess is that all the hospitals are required to call in daily and report the number of accident victims to one central location. I would be fairly confident that the accident number isn't total accidents but total accidents resulting in injury severe enough to go the hospital ... I doubt the majority of clinics would even be reporting.

Rainmon · January 1, 2012

Just yesterday I renewed my Thai driver's license in Chiang Mai for another 5 years. Unlike the last time I renewed, I had to re-do the traffic light colour recognition test, as well as the accelerator & then brake pedal reaction test.

I was amazed at how many Thai people in my test group actually failed the brake reaction test & really had no idea!

I was then made to sit through a 1 hour English language video presentation on Thai road safety & road rules, before they'd issue me with my renewed drivers license. I remember clearly watching this video and dreaming of what a pleasant place Thai roads would be to use, if they only enforced all these road rules & regulations and actually practiced what they preached in this road safety video!

All very sad - tragic actually, that so many lives are lost and lives destroyed as a result of road mayhem - especially over the New Year & Songkran holiday periods.....

i wonder how many Thai motor bike drivers even have a license?

Colin Yai · January 1, 2012

Darwinism at work during the holidays

But really this thread should be closed due to Rule 8

8) Not to post extremely negative views of Thailand or derogatory comments directed towards all Thais.

Are you trying to say that writing the truth is somehow an insult?, maybe this is whats wrong with this Country, people are unable to speak the truth unless someone is "offended" by it , and thus insane driving and carnage day in day out on Thailand,s roads will continue year in year out forever.

Rainmon · January 1, 2012

agree strongly on this point! if ur walking watch out for the bike or car, it aint giving an inch...

9" said:

Probably the other thing that baffles me a bit is how pedestrians not only don't have the right of way but that drivers seem to go out of their way to remind pedestrians of this. I'd be curious to know the pedestrian vs. car rate accidents in Thailand compared to other countries.

Rainmon · January 1, 2012

Just yesterday I renewed my Thai driver's license in Chiang Mai for another 5 years. Unlike the last time I renewed, I had to re-do the traffic light colour recognition test, as well as the accelerator & then brake pedal reaction test.

I was amazed at how many Thai people in my test group actually failed the brake reaction test & really had no idea!

I was then made to sit through a 1 hour English language video presentation on Thai road safety & road rules, before they'd issue me with my renewed drivers license. I remember clearly watching this video and dreaming of what a pleasant place Thai roads would be to use, if they only enforced all these road rules & regulations and actually practiced what they preached in this road safety video!

All very sad - tragic actually, that so many lives are lost and lives destroyed as a result of road mayhem - especially over the New Year & Songkran holiday periods.....

Small steps. Education is a key part.

Education? About driving. Now thats a joke. Thai's can hardly teach children to read or write.

Now try to teach them not to drive on the wrong side of the road, no matter how inconvienent that next u-turn is. Or they really need to have the lights on when driving after it is dark, and a 30 baht flash light is not an alterative. Maybe try an educate them how to use a turn signal, good luck with that one. I believe the highest speed limit is 120kph on some motorways, I am sure if you ask any Thai, their answer will be as fast as I like anywhere, or as slow as I like anywhere for that matter, in any travel lane.

Teaching Thai's to drive is like trying to to them common sence. It just cant be done.

Enforcement is a key, and I doubt that will happen either.

well said dcutman, best comment so far...

chrisinth · January 1, 2012

Overall, the most deaths were reported in Bangkok with five casualties, while the highest number of the injured was seen in Prachinburi at 24.

With 94 deaths over the 2 days, the above statement makes no sense. What about some decent reporting, listing the fatalities by location?

Exactly---- "What about some decent reporting, listing the fatalities by location?"

I can't understand your thinking on this. A death is a death no matter where it happens. Why do people need to know where it is happening? I hear this all the time; during the holiday periods (high risk accident periods), that people seem proud that their province had the highest death toll.

And it is Always the falangs that are fasinated with the figures!

Nisa · January 1, 2012

Darwinism at work during the holidays

Sadly, unless this is a myth, it isn't the drunk that is usually killed in these accidents but the innocent people they hit.

Lite Beer · January 1, 2012

165 deaths reported in first three days of "seven high risk travel days"

BANGKOK, Jan 1 – Seventy one persons were killed in road accidents across Thailand on New Year’s Eve, raising the cumulative number of fatalities for the first three days of the “seven high risk travel days” during the New Year holiday season to 165, according to the Road Safety Centre.

The Department of Disaster Prevention and Mitigation's Road Safety Centre, at a daily press briefing chaired by Department of Probation deputy director general Chalong Atikanit, reported that 650 driving accidents occurred on New Year’s Eve, leaving 731 persons injured.

Compared to last year, fatalities have fallen 1.39 percent from 72 to 71, and the number of injuries increased from 716 to 731 or 2.09 percent while the total number of accidents has dropped by 4.97 percent, from 684 to 650.

Over three days, 1,605 accidents were recorded with 165 casualties and 1,782 injuries.

The main causes of accidents were drunken driving at 44 percent, followed by excessive speeding, at 21.85 percent. Most accidents, or 81.39 percent, involved motorcycles, and the most active period occurred at night between 4-8 pm, or 26.62 percent.

The government launched its “seven high risk travel days” campaign from December 29 - January 4 in a bid to reduce road accidents over the long holiday. The campaign is aimed at cutting casualties among New Year revellers. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2012-01-01

Felt 35 · January 1, 2012

It’s just terrible and tragic. Sometimes I wonder what the Government in this Country is made of when it has the conscience to see their fellow citizens in the eye and say Happy New Year.

anterian · January 1, 2012

Every year we have the same forum discussion, nothing changes.

Indeed!

In perspective we all 'know' that the traffic laws are way too lax, hence all the accidents/injuries/deaths etc etc ..... BUT, in reality, those same lax laws are one of many reasons why so many westerners/farangs etc like this nation. It's just an escape from your home country's laws/regulations, is it not? I'm sure that when most of you go to/visit your homeland and one of the things you 'brag' about to your friends IS the lax traffic laws.

Having said that, all these injuries/deaths are not nice to hear/read about but they do happen and we, as 'allowed visitors' will never be able to make a difference to the ingenious way of thinking. If you think you can change things, I wish you the very best of luck.

I think the average western driver has a pro rata higher survival rate, not just because we are better drivers but because we instinctively drive defensively.

DLock · January 1, 2012

If this many people were dying because of a disease, you can bet the Government would do everything it could to look for a cure.

Instead, it's just dumb, drunk people riding motorbikes up country.

No big deal.

Just1Voice · January 1, 2012

About 30+ people die in road accidents on any given day in Thailand. This jump doesn't seem all that out of line with many other countries during the holidays .. though the holidays seems extended in Thailand beyond just the actual day.

Thailand no doubt needs to continue to improve areas around road safety, enforcement and education but the number of deaths is not as bad as people may think comparably considering more than 60% of vehicles on the road in Thailand are motorcycles.

Road Deaths in Thailand per 100,000 people ... 19.6

Road Deaths in Thailand per 100,000 vehicles ... 118.8

Road Deaths in World per 100,000 people ... 20.8

Road Deaths in World per 100,000 vehicles ... 93.3

The total number of fatalities in Thailand per year has also seemed to be trending down, at least from 1997 though mid 2006, even with more vehicles on the road (more 7 million more registered vehicles from 97 compared to 06).

Total Road Deaths in Thailand 1997 ... 13,836 (7.83 per 10,000 vehicles)

Total Road Deaths in Thailand 2006 ... 12,069 (4.87 per 10,000 vehicles)

http://en.wikipedia....ated_death_rate

http://www.grsproads...an/Thailand.pdf

Edit: found this additional stat

Total Road Deaths in Thailand 2006 ... 11,048 (4.10 per 10,000 vehicles)

http://www.unescap.o...21.Thailand.pdf

The only thing wrong with this is that the numbers used for Thailand are only those which are actually reported by the police and government, which is notorously known for "downplaying" figures. Also, they do NOT count those who died on the way to the hospital, or after arriving at the hospital in the death stats, and ONLY count those who are dead at the scene. I know this for a FACT, as the husband of my wife's cousin is a Senior Sgt with the Royal Thai Police, and he has told me how they come up with their numbers.

The first step in cutting down on the traffic situation in Thailand has to start with the police, forcing THEM to actually enforce the rules that are already in existance. Here's something to consider.

We all know about the little "tea money" check points they have, and the money they collect from them. But what if they actually get off their collectives asses and actually enforced ALL the rules, all the time, and instead of collecting "fines" on the spot, issued tickets that required the driver to go to court to pay a pre-set fine for whatever the offense was. The revenue that could be, and would be, generated from this could actually raise the income of the police in general if properly applied. And while it would take a while to "sink in", the general population would eventually come to understand they have to start obeying the rules.

Another would be to send a squad of police to just about any school. As school ends, stop every bike and check for helmets, license, and legal age. Don't have? Park the bike, call the parents and tell them they have to come get a ticket and go to court and pay it before they can get the bike back. First offense, 1,000 baht. Second, 5,000 and bike is confiscated for a week. If there's a 3rd, 10,000 fine and confiscation of the bike for a month. All the names could easily be entered in a computer program such as Excel for quick reference. Every day pick a different school, with no advanced warning, and see what happens. That would put an end to kids too young to legally drive taking their motorbikes to school, and for all of them not wearing helmets or proper license.

Of course, this is all just a pipe dream as TIT, and we all know that nothing even close to this will ever happen.

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