Uk National With Dementia

[frankpelagic]

In the condo where I live, there is an old Englishman, with a Thai wife. He is clearly suffering from dementia and considerable confusion. He is alienating himself from everyone because of his insulting attitude, and very few people have any sympathy for him. His wife is a friend of my wife, so I said I would try and get some info. It also seems that this mans daughter in the UK is taking his pension, and only passing on about 20,000 baht per month to the mans wife. Needless to say, they are finding it very difficult to live, and it is becoming worse as his needs increase.

A two part question. Firstly, given that he doesn't know where he is, and lives in a fantasy world, he could not pursue the UK authorities to ensure he receives his full pension, and they will not talk to his wife. Any options? Does anyone think the UK embassy could help?

Secondly, given that his wife now needs to go out to work to make some money to support him, does anyone know of full or part time residential care available in Pattaya or anywhere else in Thailand. He cannot be left alone.

Difficult situation, but any input would be welcome

[cardholder]

He can arrange to have his full pension sent to a Thai bank account. He will, of course, need to instruct the UK DWP to do so.

[theoldgit]

Do you know whether it's a State Pension or Private Pension? a basic State Pension would be in the region of 20,000 Baht per month, maybe a little less.

I doubt very much if the British Embassy would offer him any help or even advice, would really love to be proved wrong on that one.

[Soutpeel]

How is the guys daughter in the UK her hands on his pension and controlling the purse strings, that should be coming to a bank account in Thailand

I guess the only thing you could do if he is on state pension is to contact the UK authorites and tell them what is going on in an email, I wouldnt have thought you would get any help from the BE, they are too busy with their scottish smoked salmon, Pims and champagne cocktails, but maybe send them email as well to make them aware of the situation

I am afraid all you can do is inform relevent parties

[Scott]

If they are legally married, then his wife should have first priority over handling his affairs. If they are not legally married, then his daughter may be next in line.

[Gone]

True what these people are posting. If you yourself could contact the UK DWP and speak to them, tell them that you can bring this guy to a notary here in Pattaya and have him sign and notarize whatever documents the DWP needs to have his money put direct into his Thai account.

I took care of my 80 year old dad here until he recently died at 84. At one point I did actually look for a caregiver nursing home etc and had him in there for 1 month until we realized that they were not taking good care like they said they would but charges quite a bit. That was in Bkk and not sure if I can say the name here but trust me it isn't worth it.

This all depends of course on what his daughter, their lawyer and himself worked out before he came here for instance if she has POA (Power Of Attorney) for medical reasons over him then it might be difficult.

His daughter sounds like a right c$%t and might be the type that even after he dies she will continue to collect his pensions but something does seem a little fishy about his case.

[Soutpeel]

If they are legally married, then his wife should have first priority over handling his affairs. If they are not legally married, then his daughter may be next in line.

Maybe whats happened is that in the past the guy has maintained himself a UK address ie the daughters to get the annual increases which he wouldnt get if in Thailand and its being paid into her account at his request and forwarded on.

[frankpelagic]

Thankyou for the replies so far. I was under the impression that the UK gov. would not pay pensions into a Thai bank, because if the person dies, there is nothing in place to ensure the Thai bank returned any monies paid after the death.

[JohnC]

I was under the impression that the UK gov. would not pay pensions into a Thai bank

As of 2010 UK state pensions can be paid into foreign accounts, I would suggest you visit the new British Vice Consul in Jomtien who just started recently and is the first full time paid British Consul here, appraise her of the situation and ask for her advice/help.

Interfering with family business is fraught with pitfalls so tread carefully, the UK state pension as of last April is £102 per week which equates to 19584 baht per four weeks so 20,000 is correct. However if he has a private or company pension then that might be different but how would you find out? In addition 20,000 per month is only 240,000 per annum insufficient for a marriage or retirement visa. Lots of facts missing here.

[PoorSucker]

He must have more than 20.000 in income or he would not get his extension or is he on overstay?

[JohnC]

I forgot to mention that there is a new residential nursing home opened in Pattaya but the fees start at 50,000 baht for shared facilities so that would be way out of pocket for your friend not sure of anything else available at the moment. Another option would be for the embassy to contact family and state he needs to be returned to UK with an escort! that might stimulate them in parting with more money if he has any!

[NancyL]

I know that here in Chiang Mai, the Honorary British Consul would very much like to know about situations like this in his area of service. I'd suggest following the advice of JohnC, who apparently knows about the consul situation in Pattaya.

If that isn't productive, then another thought would be if the gentleman has ever served in the British military or is otherwise a member of the Royal British Legion, it might be worth contacting them. They have a welfare officers who are trained to assist in much the same way as social workers. Unlike the American Legion, anyone can be a member of the RBL, not just veterans, so perhaps he is a member even if he hasn't been in the military.

[JohnC]

Royal British Legion, it might be worth contacting them

Good suggestion! Bert of Tropical Berts in Pattaya is the welfare Officer for the Thai Branch of the Royal British Legion contact details: http://www.tropicalberts.com/

[frankpelagic]

JohnC, yes I agree about the 20k being insufficient for a substantive visa, and I don't know how he is getting around it. I have offered to try and give his wife some help with suggestions about their financial matters, but don't want to get into the hole he may be digging for himself regarding his visa. Your suggestion about passing him over to the Hon. UK Consul is a good one. My motto, after years in the health service, is 'a problem moved is a problem solved'.

[lopburi3]

Immigration can make provisions in such cases so this may well be one of them if wife has had contact.

[frankpelagic]

A small postscript, the man's wife is talking about taking him to the UK embassy and leaving him there. Should be interesting.

[colinp]

If that isn't productive, then another thought would be if the gentleman has ever served in the British military or is otherwise a member of the Royal British Legion, it might be worth contacting them. They have a welfare officers who are trained to assist in much the same way as social workers. Unlike the American Legion, anyone can be a member of the RBL, not just veterans, so perhaps he is a member even if he hasn't been in the military.

If you manage to find out that he was in the military previously he may be receiving a veterans pension. Give these guys a call/email http://www.veterans-uk.info/ they were magnificent regarding my Grandad.

[kartman]

A small postscript, the man's wife is talking about taking him to the UK embassy and leaving him there. Should be interesting.

If she does make sure she or you contact the appropriate British /Thai press first to alert them of potential handling by Embassy.

[frankpelagic]

H'mm, the suggestion about previous military service and the Royal British Legion. Unfortunately, he has no idea whether he served in any armed forces. The only paperwork his wife has on him is a job reference from when he was a pharmaceutical salesman in the 70's. He has been telling people for the last year or two he was a famous professional sportsman, but as far as I understand, his family have refuted that as nonsense. . Anyway, in the interim, I have emailed the UK Embassy and the Pensions office. May as well try and get up to date advice from the horses mouth. Will post any replies I get.

I feel very sorry for his wife, who is still sticking by him, (despite the abuse she receives from him), even though he doesn't have a pot to p#*s in, and when he eventually dies, she will be out in the cold, so to speak.

Sad

[NancyL]

I'd really suggest contacting the Royal British Legion in Pattaya before doing something drastic like dumping him at the British Embassy. The RBL has people who are trained to talk with people who are suffering from dementia and other problems and can determine if he's a vet. Even if he's not a vet, they're very familiar with the resources that would be available to a Brit with this condition. For example, they would have contacts within the Embassy and the welfare offices in the UK.

Obviously, this is the first time the man's wife and the OP have encountered someone in this situation. The RBL welfare officers have seen this many, many times.

[billd766]

Royal British Legion, it might be worth contacting them

Good suggestion! Bert of Tropical Berts in Pattaya is the welfare Officer for the Thai Branch of the Royal British Legion contact details: http://www.tropicalberts.com/

Thank you for that information.

I am ex RAF living 400 km from BKK near Khampaeng Phet.

I will contact them later this week.

[cardholder]

If they are legally married, then his wife should have first priority over handling his affairs. If they are not legally married, then his daughter may be next in line.

She could have Power of Attorney or at least third party authority.

[frankpelagic]

They are legally married, with a piece of paper, not just the temple stuff.

[frankpelagic]

I emailed the UK embassy yesterday, along with the pensions people (at his wife's request). Very pleasant response from the embassy, who have passed everything on to the Brit Consul in Jomtien who will make contact with the wife. I think they are really concerned in case they have a 100kg incontinent waif/foundling landing on their doorstep, who, without the benefit of a label, would have no idea where he lived. I did assure them that it was most unlikely that would happen.

[Soutpeel]

I emailed the UK embassy yesterday, along with the pensions people (at his wife's request). Very pleasant response from the embassy, who have passed everything on to the Brit Consul in Jomtien who will make contact with the wife. I think they are really concerned in case they have a 100kg incontinent waif/foundling landing on their doorstep, who, without the benefit of a label, would have no idea where he lived. I did assure them that it was most unlikely that would happen.

Good to see you got a result out of the BE