Rangers To Enter Administration, Portsmouth Following Suit... .

[smokie36]

Spot on there with your bletherings.

[Ahinkel1]

I have wondered about this. Does the domination of say a couple of teams destroy more value than it creates in the League. Do you just end up with a bigger piece of a smaller pie.

So if you look at Spain.

Will the inevitability of the the teams dominance eventually destroy the league.

Yes. The Premier League was formed in season 75/76. We went from being a 16 team development league to being a 10 team money hungry league overnight. A few seasons later the Old Firm put through a policy that they kept all the home gate money, hence choking competition even more. It all looked very clever up until satellite tv money arrived and the English and other major European markets soared away. The Old Firm used to be genuine contenders based upon gate money etc now they are both non-entities in the wage market. To make it even worse we smaller teams are suffering from disillusionment. My team is doing great, 3rd in league, but attendances are abysmal. There is no competition in the league, we went on a great run against the other teams and then we took serious hammerings from the Old Firm. The league is a waste of space......now we've got a financial cripple and a team that can be outspent by the english championship, habitualy failing in europe. We are going down in flames. I wish the old firm would eff off and at least make it an even playing field in scotland. You would see the cost base stabilise, and crowds soar as genuine competition returned.

We are all hairless apes!

[Abrak]

I have wondered about this. Does the domination of say a couple of teams destroy more value than it creates in the League. Do you just end up with a bigger piece of a smaller pie.

So if you look at Spain.

Will the inevitability of the the teams dominance eventually destroy the league.

Yes. The Premier League was formed in season 75/76. We went from being a 16 team development league to being a 10 team money hungry league overnight. A few seasons later the Old Firm put through a policy that they kept all the home gate money, hence choking competition even more. It all looked very clever up until satellite tv money arrived and the English and other major European markets soared away. The Old Firm used to be genuine contenders based upon gate money etc now they are both non-entities in the wage market. To make it even worse we smaller teams are suffering from disillusionment. My team is doing great, 3rd in league, but attendances are abysmal. There is no competition in the league, we went on a great run against the other teams and then we took serious hammerings from the Old Firm. The league is a waste of space......now we've got a financial cripple and a team that can be outspent by the english championship, habitualy failing in europe. We are going down in flames. I wish the old firm would eff off and at least make it an even playing field in scotland. You would see the cost base stabilise, and crowds soar as genuine competition returned.

BTW genuine question Blethers.

Are you moving from the Rangers needs to be saved so Celtic has lots of money to Rangers ought to die so we can have a proper league? You have been slightly misleading.

Or I happen to like the second argument more so I am skewing your words that way.

I think if Rangers dies, Celtic slides and the SPL will gradually recover (probably over many years.) Because it turns from a spectacle into a real sport again. I entirely agree that Rangers problems will not reduce Celtics costs but simply their revenues but that will be a good thing.

The capital in sport is the players so as you move income upwards you must destroy value. Excess production and falling demand. It is only when capitalists understand there is no capital in the sport and despite its growth they will only generate losses that it can reverse. In short less money in the SPL is a good thing in the short term that can only regenerate the business and lead to its growth in the future.

And maybe at Motherwell you will see a surprise which is that rather than your revenues declining because of the death of the 'business' they will increase because they now have a sport.

Perhaps I could put it a different way - the Spanish leader/follower model implies that both Barcelona and Real Madrid are acting in their best interests to increase their wealth. However it also implies they are doing this at the expense of destroying value for the Spanish League as a whole. Eventually RM and Barca must destroy more value than they are creating for themselves. At which point you have a dialectic and everything implodes or something like that.

It is a bit like Jackanory - swings and roundabouts.

Edited February 18, 2012 by Abrak

[theblether]

I have wondered about this. Does the domination of say a couple of teams destroy more value than it creates in the League. Do you just end up with a bigger piece of a smaller pie.

So if you look at Spain.

Will the inevitability of the the teams dominance eventually destroy the league.

Yes. The Premier League was formed in season 75/76. We went from being a 16 team development league to being a 10 team money hungry league overnight. A few seasons later the Old Firm put through a policy that they kept all the home gate money, hence choking competition even more. It all looked very clever up until satellite tv money arrived and the English and other major European markets soared away. The Old Firm used to be genuine contenders based upon gate money etc now they are both non-entities in the wage market. To make it even worse we smaller teams are suffering from disillusionment. My team is doing great, 3rd in league, but attendances are abysmal. There is no competition in the league, we went on a great run against the other teams and then we took serious hammerings from the Old Firm. The league is a waste of space......now we've got a financial cripple and a team that can be outspent by the english championship, habitualy failing in europe. We are going down in flames. I wish the old firm would eff off and at least make it an even playing field in scotland. You would see the cost base stabilise, and crowds soar as genuine competition returned.

BTW genuine question Blethers.

Are you moving from the Rangers needs to be saved so Celtic has lots of money to Rangers ought to die so we can have a proper league? You have been slightly misleading.

Or I happen to like the second argument more so I am skewing your words that way.

I think if Rangers dies, Celtic slides and the SPL will gradually recover (probably over many years.) Because it turns from a spectacle into a real sport again. I entirely agree that Rangers problems will not reduce Celtics costs but simply their revenues but that will be a good thing.

The capital in sport is the players so as you move income upwards you must destroy value. Excess production and falling demand. It is only when capitalists understand there is no capital in the sport and despite its growth they will only generate losses that it can reverse. In short less money in the SPL is a good thing in the short term that can only regenerate the business and lead to its growth in the future.

And maybe at Motherwell you will see a surprise which is that rather than your revenues declining because of the death of the 'business' they will increase because they now have a sport.

Perhaps I could put it a different way - the Spanish leader/follower model implies that both Barcelona and Real Madrid are acting in their best interests to increase their wealth. However it also implies they are doing this at the expense of destroying value for the Spanish League as a whole. Eventually RM and Barca must destroy more value than they are creating for themselves. At which point you have a dialectic and everything implodes or something like that.

It is a bit like Jackanory - swings and roundabouts.

I want the Old Firm out of Scottish football.

I want the pursuit of money out of Scottish football. We have excellent stadiums for such a small country, all new, some brand new, and all seated.

All Scots reading this know that if for example Aberdeen ( 20,000 ) Hearts ( 20,000 ) Hibs ( 20,000 ) Dundee United ( 15,000 ) or Motherwell ( 14,000 ) were battling it out for the league that is the kind of attendances they would be getting, easy.

Motherwell just declared a profit of £540,000 on a turnover of £5.6 million last season. My god, shock development, small clubs making a profit.

We don't need to be chasing an impossible dream ( competing with Man Utd, Barcelona, etc ) leave us alone to have a go at each other, develop young talent, and celebrate the occasional memorable victory.

The sport is called Football, not Cashball........yes professional players need to be paid, but they will be paid within the means of the club. True competition brings excitement and crowds.

[smokie36]

Furthermore without those two parasites and their influence at the SFA we can bring in rules to protect our young players and the clubs which have brought them through. It disgusts me to see good young sides constantly plundered by ........

Fair words escape me here.

[theblether]

From the Daily Record.........

Whyte is facing investigations over how he purchased the club and what happened to £24.4million he received from Ticketus as an advance on season ticket sales.

Administrator David Whitehouse yesterday said the money had been traced.

He said: “The cash (from Ticketus) has not come into Rangers’ bank account. It went through a lawyer’s bank account.

“We now have some visibility of that money. We will clarify it all next week.”

So they have traced the £24.2 Million...........

Edited February 20, 2012 by mrbojangles
Increased font size for you

[Jockstar]

[salty]

Don't mention the war.

[theblether]

I seriously doubt that Rangers will avoid liquidation, they are in bigger trouble than I thought. The tax bill is higher, heading for £15 million for the smaller one, and it is racing ahead at a rate of £1 million a month. The troubles are much worse though......if they lose this EBT Tribunal they will be on the hook for £64 million.

I can see some serious court cases coming up, I can't see Ticketus letting the advance to Craig Whyte disappear easily, and that may force him into a highly complicated court battle re the ownership of the club, and all the time that is going on, no one can invest in the club.

However!! Apparently there has been a serious breach of SFA and SPL Rules. All clubs are obliged to lodge copies of players contracts with both of these bodies. Rangers have been issuing two contracts to their players for the past 10 years, and only notifying the SFA and SPL of the existence of one.

To make it even worse, Campbell Ogilvie was on the Executive Board of the SPL while he was the Executive Officer at Rangers, and Martin Bain filled the same position since 2008, while acting as Chief Executive of Rangers.

Let's get to the point, not only are Rangers accused of concealing these contracts from the governing bodies, they are also accused of doing so while having their own Chief Executives on the SPL Board.

It makes the Corporate governance of the SPL look like a laughing stock, and it makes the SFA look incompetent. UEFA may even have something to say about this contract concealment.

The SPL are doing an initial investigation, it will report in two weeks.........this is looking extraordinarily serious.

[smokie36]

The wee club at the SFA are about to have their ears cleaned out. Let's hope its a thorough scrub.

[CelticBhoy]

^ I don't see anything sad in this at all. They cheated, they have got caught and now it's time to face the penalty.

What a narrow-minded, puerile view !

More evidence of their cheating . . .

RANGERS' under-fire owner Craig Whyte broke cover tonight to tell supporters there's "more pain" to come at the crisis-hit club.

He claimed the administrators will clear him of any wrongdoing. But his bleating came as the Ibrox club were fined £50,000 by the PLUS Stock Exchange for failing to disclose Whyte had been previously disqualified as a director.

[mrbojangles]

Let's get to the point, not only are Rangers accused of concealing these contracts from the governing bodies,

I'd be extremely surprised if it were only Rangers carrying out this practise.

[salty]

You have to wonder how much more manure will hit the fan in the coming days/weeks.

[spongeman]

Other than all of the above everything is ok.

[smokie36]

Other than all of the above everything is ok.

They got beat again at the weekend. Half the players are getting the sack this week. Perhaps they will double the ticket prices as well?

Icing on the cake...

[spongeman]

Pay deal has been rejected just now. 2 players want to leave ( so far ).

I wonder how long Rangers have left.......

[salty]

BBC Sport: Rangers director Dave King fears liquidation is 'inevitable'

Rangers director Dave King fears the club will not exit administration and that liquidation is "inevitable".

In a statement, King said the club's owner Craig Whyte has "abused the loyalty of fans" by mortgaging future sales of tickets to Ticketus.

King also claims that Sir David Murray had no knowledge that proof of funds supplied by Whyte to purchase the club was secured by season ticket sales.

The South Africa-based businessman said the club's plight "grieved him".

King, who remains a non-executive director of the troubled Scottish Premier League club, met administrators Duff and Phelps two weeks ago to discuss the Ibrox side's current financial situation.

He was previously involved in takeover talks with the club, who were forced into administration following action from Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs over a £9m tax bill.

Along with fellow-director Paul Murray, King also made a late bid for the club in 2011 to prevent the eventual successful takeover by Whyte.

King invested £20m in the club in 2000 and is the second-largest shareholder, but has also been hit with a £250m bill after losing a 10-year battle with the taxman in South Africa.

In his statement, King said that he intended to continue his involvement with the Glasgow club in conjunction with Paul Murray and had approached the Scottish Football Association to approve him as a "fit and proper person" to be in a position of control at Ibrox.

"I intend to remain involved with the club, at least on my present basis, post-reconstruction if that is at all possible under the new ownership structure," said King.

"I am however alert to the raw sentiment around the need for Rangers to have 'fit and proper' persons at its helm.

"In view of my own well-publicised and acrimonious legal disputes with the authorities in South Africa I have taken it upon myself to approach the SFA in that regard in advance of considering an increased role in the club going forward. I will be guided by the SFA's response in that regard."

In the statement, King also said:

• Craig Whyte confirmed to him that Ticketus has no recourse to the football club with regards to the money provided for future sales of season tickets.
  
• The club was not debt free as claimed by the Murray Group and Craig Whyte at the time of its sale, and "was in a much worse economic position than before and had no chance of survival even if we had progressed in Europe".
  
• Rangers will not meet its financial requirements before the Uefa deadline of 31 March and will consequently not participate in European football next year. King also asserts that "liquidation might extend that by another two years".
  
• He remains confident that Rangers will not be stripped of any historical titles or trophies should any current inquiries underway by the SFA and SPL find the club guilty of wrong-doing in previous seasons.
  
• A legal claim of £20m will be made by King on the basis of non-disclosure of former Rangers chairman David Murray regarding the club's true financial position as far back as 2000.
  

The statement also makes references in support of former Rangers former chief executive Martin Bain and directors John McClelland.

King also specifically stated that he hoped former player, manager and non-executive director John Grieg would "be able to resume his rightful iconic place in the director's box" soon.

Not a very reassuring scenario for Rangers. Phoenix from the ashes perhaps in 3rd Division. Are you watching Montrose?

[spongeman]

Apparently the Sky deal is dependant on them being able to show 4 old firm games.............No Sky money and the whole thing could go tits up ?

[mrbojangles]

Where's Blether? I really enjoyed his well thought out and balanced posts.

[salty]

Quite possible. I find it hard to believe that they would be liquidated, and expect that the club will survive in a temporarily reduced state.

[smokie36]

You'd rather have 'em on their knees than their head chopped off? How magnanimous salty old son!

[smokie36]

Where is the most esteemed moderator?

Surely he is gonna give us his opinion?

[smokie36]

SuperGers is a bit quiet an all.

Bwahahahahaha!

Resistance is futile....

[CelticBhoy]

Quite possible. I find it hard to believe that they would be liquidated, and expect that the club will survive in a temporarily reduced state.

Aye. Reduced to the third division!

"Let's All Laugh At Rangers."

[CelticBhoy]

From today's Record:

RANGERS' administrators are seeking a swift sale of the club after failing to agree cost-cutting measures with the playing staff, Duff and Phelps announced today.

Discussions over how to make savings have ended without a resolution which would devalue the playing staff "on terms that will preserve the value in the business", joint administrator David Whitehouse said.

Whitehouse said in a statement: "We are announcing today we are accelerating the sale of Rangers Football Club.

"The club is in a perilous financial situation and that should not be under-estimated.

"Regrettably, we have been unable to agree cost-cutting measures with the playing staff on terms that will preserve value in the business.

Anyone got a pound? ha ha ha

[salty]

SuperGers is a bit quiet an all.

Bwahahahahaha!

Resistance is futile....

Maybe he is one of the administrators.

[smokie36]

SuperGers is a bit quiet an all.

Bwahahahahaha!

Resistance is futile....

Maybe he is one of the administrators.

Poetic justice...I like it!!

[CelticBhoy]

From the Record again:

THE Scottish Football Association has stated that Rangers owner Craig Whyte "is not considered to be a fit and proper person to hold a position within association football" following an independent inquiry into the stricken club.

SFA chief executive Stewart Regan also confirmed that Rangers face a charge of bringing the game into disrepute.

The findings of the independent inquiry were heard at a Special Board Meeting at Hampden Park today and will now be referred to the Judicial Panel.

[salty]

Is there a psychaitrist in the house?

[Jockstar]

Looks like the Blue Knights consortium will be making a bid for the club.

Rangers: Paul Murray's Blue Knights finalise offer to buy club

Former Rangers director Paul Murray has confirmed that his "Blue Knights" consortium is finalising an offer to buy the club.

Ticketus, who advanced money to Rangers in return for several seasons' worth of ticket sales, are part of the consortium along with fans' groups.

Murray feels his party "are able to deliver an attractive solution".

The group says "new and experienced" board members could be appointed in the event of a successful purchase.

Businessman Murray left the Rangers board shortly after Craig Whyte's takeover of the club last May.

Continue reading the main story

“

We believe working alongside the Blue Knights and fans' representatives offers the best chance of the club surviving and becoming a viable business

”

Ticketus

He had previously been linked with a purchase of the club from Sir David Murray, who had owned the club since 1988.

The Blue Knights comprises Paul Murray, the Rangers Supporters Assembly, the Rangers Supporters Association, the Rangers Supporters Trust and Ticketus.

Since Rangers' went into administration on 14 February, Paul Murray's name has been consistently linked with a fresh takeover bid .

He said: "I believe that the Blue Knights, working in collaboration with the fans and Ticketus, are able to deliver an attractive solution that will see the club emerge from administration with a clear plan for the future that will bring the financial stability that the club needs.

"We firmly believe that a CVA [creditors voluntary arrangement] is the best way forwards and we are working hard to offer a solution that will enable this to happen.

"As the administrators have stated, the alternative route of putting the club into liquidation is much less attractive for creditors, supporters and players, with its capacity to destroy value.

"Under current UEFA rules, a football club is banned from European competition for three years in the event of liquidation. Taking this route would have a significant impact on Rangers' future revenues and the overall financial viability of the club, so it is something we want to avoid."

Rangers' administrators, Duff and Phelps, have already ruled out the possibility of the club playing in European competition next season as audited accounts are unlikely to be signed off by the 31 March deadline.

A deadline of 16 March has been set by Duff and Phelps for parties interested in buying Rangers to come forward.

Ticketus, whose advanced funds were used as part of Whyte's takeover , stated: "We believe that the Blue Knights understand very clearly what needs to be done to stabilise the club, and represent the most attractive long-term solution to Rangers' financial situation.

"We are therefore backing their bid and will be an active partner, contributing to a successful outcome.

"We believe working alongside the Blue Knights and fans' representatives offers the best chance of the club surviving and becoming a viable business."

Earlier, Ticketus had indicated they would be confident of winning any case relating to recovering the money they forwarded as part of Whyte's takeover.

The firm has taken legal advice after Duff and Phelps pursued the release of £3.6m from an account belonging to Whyte.

A High Court judge ordered a trial date to decide who owns the money with Ticketus, HM Revenue and Customs, Merchants Turnaround and the pension fund Gerome contesting ownership of the funds.

HMRC want £2.8m, Merchants Turnaround is seeking £1m and Gerome is claiming £2.9m.

Rangers' joint administrator David Whitehouse emerged from the High Court in London on Thursday pleased that the judge had ordered a further hearing on the club's claim on £3.6m for 30 March.

Whitehouse argued that the money, frozen in his firm's lawyer's account, belongs to Rangers and should be released to ease the club's plight.

Lawyers for the club's administrator told the High Court in London they had expected to find £9.5m in the account.

But they said there was only £3.6m in it and several parties are claiming ownership of the money.

Meanwhile, Rangers' players and management have agreed to temporary wage cuts which will minimise redundancies of the non-playing staff and ensure the club can fulfil its remaining fixtures this season.